Windows 8 'Save as not responding' issue

[Marcus48]

I'm not sure if this might be a Windows system error or registery error possible? Maybe relating to file exploer? Nonetheless I shall explain my issue as best I can.

I have been having the issue for a while, which seems to be ongoing, in saving anything on my laptop for an application, be it a word document, a picture online, an excel spreadsheet, a snapshot or snippet from something on my desktop, a notepad document...you get the idea. It seems to be an issue where anything I save almost doesn't save the first time, sometmes even the second time; For example, I attempt to save say a word document and it appears to hang with the 'save as not responding' message, showing the save dialog box and a blank space. The cursor just goes round and round and then I click the dialog box again and it says save not responding, and nor will it when I allow it time to try. So I have to close the program and lose the data and restart the program and do it again and then attempt to save it. So now, what I usually have done, is start a word document, save it first, and usually thereafter it will save; but when I start a new laptop session, it tends to repeat the issue not saving the first (or second time). I still haven't been able to fix that problem

I attach a snapshot showing what happens, which was a snippet of something on Calibre I wanted to show someone. I hope I have explained the issue well enough.

I would appreciate any advice or solution(s)/workaround(s) for this problem. I want to endeavour to explore and exhaust all options before considering attempting a (full) clean re-install of my OS and rebuilidng from scratch with reinstalling my programs and putting all backed up documents back onto it, excluding backups of profiles for Google chrome and firefox. I would hope that last resort won't be necessary. I have worked on checking that my laptop is clean from any infection with another forum, and it is clean of any. I have the premium Avast and Malwarebytes anti malware programs as well as MBAE and the excellent WinPatrol suite, which is my combo protecting my laptop.

Also although there is a reimage repair as one workaroud, I am reluctant to use that at my own risk, whcih has no guarentee of working cleaning after attempting to fix specific window system problems. It's not foolproof and I don't feel comfortable with that workaround. There was one other workaround which suggests disconnecting my network drive, but I have none showing to disconnect.

Again I would greatly appreciate any assistance.

Thank you.

 

[Ian]

I can't see the snapshot (edit: it's appearing ok now), but I think there's plenty of info there to get started anyway .

Are you saving to a local drive? I'd be interested to see if you get the same problem when disconnected from your network/internet, as I've seen this happen many times when the dialog box searches for external shares that are slow to respond.

Another thing I'd try is to run Process Monitor (https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/processmonitor.aspx) and capture data when you experience the problem. It may show some permission errors or show unexpected location access that could pin down the problem.

 

[Ian]

It looks like the screenshot is appearing now and I notice that you've got Dropbox installed too. Could you also try disabling the integration and see if that helps?

 

[Marcus48]

Hi Ian,

When you say try disabling the integration, I'm not sure I follow. Sorry for not replying earlier. I was still researching solutions.

And yes, I am saving it to a local drive. I'm running process monitor now. You say capture the data when I experience the problem and that it may show some permission errors or show unexpecte location access that could in down the problem. So, what am I looking for and where on there in order to do so?

 

[Ian]

I don't use the Dropbox desktop application, but it appears from the image showing a list of folders that you've got an entry named "Dropbox" on there. It may be that this is causing the delay, it's certainly worth checking at least . You may need to temporarily uninstall Dropbox to remove the drive integration and see if that helps.

Process Monitor is basically a list of every process on your PC and it'll show you what they're trying to access and if they have any problems accessing a file. If you're selective at capturing data (i.e. only when about to save) then it may show you some unexpected processes trying to do something, or a permission error (under the result column). To be honest, I'd try seeing if disconnecting from your network (either disconnect from wifi or pull the ethernet cord) or disabling Dropbox solves the problem first, as they're easy first steps at troubleshooting.

 

[Marcus48]

Well I had the problem before I installed the dropbox desktop application anyway and I have a paid dropbox account. Unless, considering I had the 'Save as not responding' problem before then, you really believe I should uninstall it temporarily I will otherwise leave that for now.

I understand what your saying about the process monitor and I did realise it did that having used it before but not for a long time. Its showing so many events I'm not sure which one to look at at the moment I attempted to save it as there were loads of events within the same moment I did so. I looked at the results section but it seems to be like a maze trying to identify it.

I can try with disconnecting from my wifi first, and then attempt to save a document as before with it disconnected, which is what I assume your asking.

 

[Ian]

Well I had the problem before I installed the dropbox desktop application anyway and I have a paid dropbox account. Unless, considering I had the 'Save as not responding' problem before then, you really believe I should uninstall it temporarily I will otherwise leave that for now.

In that case I think you're safe there then .

I understand what your saying about the process monitor and I did realise it did that having used it before but not for a long time. Its showing so many events I'm not sure which one to look at at the moment I attempted to save it as there were loads of events within the same moment I did so. I looked at the results section but it seems to be like a maze trying to identify it.

If you can zip it and attach it, restricted to starting/stopping around the time of the save, I'm happy to have a look for you and see if I can spot anything unusual.

I can try with disconnecting from my wifi first, and then attempt to save a document as before with it disconnected, which is what I assume your asking.

Yep, that's right - it's a good starting point, as it'll eliminate any network issues (which seems to be the cause of many issues of this type).

Do you have more than one drive in your laptop? It's unusual, but possible, so thought I should check. Sometimes a drive can spin-down to save power and that would cause a problem like this.

One more thing that may be worth a try is to disable expansion of the currently selected folder in Explorer: http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials/11474-navigation-pane-expand-current-folder-off.html - it would also be worth disabling showing libraries etc... This has apparently helped other users with this problem. If that helps, we can find out why .

 

[Marcus48]

Hi Ian,

I had to log in and reply on my other laptop for the moment, as I found myself dealing with a problem on my primary laptop. As I was updating itunes while online going through other forums, itunes suddenly popped up with a message at around 88% of the progress bar stating something like it could not continue and that it should be re-attempted by try to update again by restarting itunes. I pressed cancel and all the while I suddenly found my laptop slowing right down. The cpu was running at a normal level, and so was the memory, but my disk was running at 99%, as if something had locked it up and it was struggling to processed. I noticed also a windows host process (Rundl32) at the top. I close firefox and any any other programs and it was some 20 minutes and it was still at 99% so I disconnected from the internet and it came down to more or less a normal level where is should be, near the 1% mark. I then reconnected to the internet and my hard disk just seemed to spike up again. I decided to do a system resore to this morning, and it took ages for the restore to complete. After logging back on my hard disk is still running at 99%. I'm not sure what is causing it or what to do! As I write now my hard disk is now at 4% but only after 20 minutes from when I logged back on, and with the internet disconnected

 

[Marcus48]

At the time of this reply, my hard disk seems to have stabilised and remained at normal levels and continued to do so even when I reconnected to the internet. I don't know what had caused my drive to almost slow to a complete crawl at almost 100% and for that length of time, unless the cancelling of the update to iTunes was caught in a loop with Windows trying to complete the task even after it was cancelled, or something along those lines? I am hoping it is not the WinPatrol plus suite - which is WinPatrol, WinAntiransom and WinPrivacy, not having an influence? I've had the WinPatrol a while but only recently actually purchased the WinAntiransom and WinPrivacy ones only yesterday. It was said to both be light on resouces and with no conflict to either Avast or Malwarebytes AntiMalware or AntiExploits. But I thought I'd mention this anyway, to try and understand what might have caused my hard disk to run almost full capacity like that. I am running a malwarebytes scan now, although i can't think that I had got anything as I scanned my PC with both Avast and Malwarebytes this morning, and had only finished checking my PC over with a technician on a forum.

 

[Ian]

I've never liked iTunes, as it's a terrible resource hog - so of all the apps I wouldn't worry too much about that doing something unusual like this. It's one of the reasons I uninstalled it long ago!

It does sound like you have a lot of Anti-Malware protection installed, which will certainly contribute to higher than normal resource usage. I'm not familiar with WinPatrol though, so can't comment on that one.

If you get high resource usage again, you could try using Resource Monitor ("resmon" from the run box - Windows Key + R). That will show you particularly disk or CPU intensive applications from the respective tabs.

I notice that you're using Windows 8.1, had you considered upgrading to Windows 10 (it's free, even after the deadline if you do some Googling). It's a drastic solution, but it's far superior to Windows 8.1 IMO.

 

[Marcus48]

Hi Ian,

I've decided not to re-update iTunes and will probably uninstall it, but for now my hard disk is not spiking again. My CPU and memory remain as they have done, at normal levels, but i will run resource monitor to check.

I know it does seem like a lot of antimalware protection, though WinPatrol is a different type, as well as with protection against ransomwhere, where as the WinPrivacy is mostly protection against allowing programs to connect to the internet that should, as a layer against exploit attacks. I had done lengthy reseach on WInPatrol and it is a good suite and was recommened alongside Malwarebytes antimalware as well as Avast; not because I want top heavy Antimalware that I don't need and isn't necessary, but for the different features that both apply to.

I decided to stick with Windows 8.1, even after allowing for a year for Microsoft not only to fix their bugs, but also because even at the last stage, what they stated was being sent out back to Microsoft and the way their privacy settings was configured (and this applies to after going through each one) was so obscure and vague that I couldn't trust it with a barge pole. And I would certainly never use it with a microsoft account, even if I did use set it up with a new email account, there are still issues with using it that time and space won't permit here to discuss. I know it's superior to WIndows 8.1 otherwise; that's the sad part, but I was just not prepared to compromise a superior OS with that of security and privacy issues. If and when microsoft do rectify that enough that there is transparency to know that such security and privacy concerns are no longer an overriding factor, I would be quite happy to pay for the privalege of it, but not before.

I will continue tomorrow after work with trying to find out what is causing the 'save as not responding issue' but also to ensure no other issues with my laptop first. I'm wondering whether their is any mileage in changing the User shell folder in the registry "HKWY_CURRENT-USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\User Shell Folders" and doing one of two things; changing the data value for 'My Pictures' so that it corresponds to the folder I want (saving snippet problem first), modifying and entering the value for Value data and place the folder path to my folder full of pictures for the current user i.e. C;\Users\<username.\AppData, and then restart the PC. Or alternatively, just delete the User Shell folder and restart anyway. And that hopefully that might correct the save as when saving with the snipping tool and perhaps correct the save as for all other applications since the save operation resides within the explorer shell of the current user and it will properly save the word doc, excel doc, and so on without problems, in theory.

 

[Marcus48]

I know I had intended to leave doing anymore until tomorrow, but it seems I have found out what is causing an issue with the save as, mostly with the snipping tool or the word or excel programs. I have trusteer report installed, as an extra layer of protection when doing online banking and it appears to interfere with those to prevent capture of screen images and exploiting security vulnerabilities in both word and excel for the same reason. Thankfully I saw that before even considering changing the registry, even if I did a system restore and saved the original registry key first in any case. It appeared I had to disable trusteer in order to use the snipping tool or to save word or excel without problems or intereference, then enable it when it was needed.

At some point tomorrow after work I will check the running of this again and see if there are no further issues with my hard disk, because after running sfc scannow it said 'windows resource protection' found corrupted files and did not give me the option to fix them. I would need someone to go through my cbs log and make sense of it.

 

[Marcus48]

A quick update. Unfortunately it was not the trusteer report interfering with the save as; I had hoped that was the case but testing my laptop at work quickly it appears it isn't. For the record I log in on a standard user account for everyday use, and not the admin account or one with admin privaleges for security reasosn. So I think maybe testing whether the save issue is the same or not on an admin account might be a next step.

 

[Ian]

Thanks for reporting back - I look forward to seeing how your testing goes . I've got my fingers crossed.

 

[Marcus48]

Hi Ian, very quickly, as I am at work; an update on testing the 'save as' on the local user account I created with administrator rights. I tested the snipping tool and it saved first time everytime when I captured something from my desktop and saved it as a snippet. It also saved first time everytime when using a word or excel document or a notepad document. So I'm curious as to what workaround could help fix the problem on a local standard user account. Or is it that not having administrator right is preventing the tools saving properly not being elevated? It does however brings up an interesting question as far as the standard local account is concerned.

With the different programs I have protecting against both malware and ransomware attacks, I would have thought thinking about it now, that it is suppose to prevent against data capture, assuming it protects against screen capture (as adverse to protecting against keylogging unless a suite specifically has that feature). Thus it should be preventing the snipping tool from capturing at all, unless it is excluded or whitelisted, in the event of protecting against a drive by exploit dropping a payload for a malicious file to capture data and be sent back to the source if inadvertently activated that a hacker can interpret the data. The fact that after a number of times of trying (on the local standard user acc) I can eventually capture and save, makes me wonder why it allows it to, unless as i said, I permit my security suite permission to do so. Security is more important than convenience I've always said, although it's annoying when you need that convenience and want a workaround to still be able to use it, and yet remain safe and prevent it becoming a security vulnerability. I don't know the answer Ian to be honest lol. Or maybe I am overthinking it. Thoughts?

 

[Ian]

I think you'd need to ask the anti-malware software support that question, as I wasn't aware that there was software that claims to prevent screen capture tools (at least of this type) . No security software is going to be foolproof, but they'll do a good job at preventing popular attack vectors.

 

[Marcus48]

I think you are right Ian. I was thinking perhaps that might be a question for anti-malware support. No security software is going to be foolproof of course, and I've had enough experience with older machines and ridding them of infections where I've followed step by step assistance from technicians in scanning, logging, then re-scanning and cleaning, quarantining and deleting infected files with numerous tools. Even my current machine's security suite failed to stop a malware file slipping through, but it did stop it being allowed to be activated. They do a good job as you said,of preventing popular attack vectors, but we all know we have to follow sensible surfing practices and update our security programs on a regular baiss as well as other software to prevent them being exploited, but even then there are new attacks that updated database engines haven't caught up with yet.

My laptop is performing reasonably ok now even though I intend to upgrade soon,while I also need to tweak my system to optimise performance better when time permits to sit down and do so. Anyway, any advice is always welcome, but I shall post in the malware section as well. Cheers