pricelessware Infighting

[R. L.]

"R. L." wrote:

I've never seen a bio of Scott. But I feel like I knew him
from his active particpation in Prox-list. I really wish I
knew more details..This is such an incredible shock...and I
still am not over it. I always got the impression he was
young. And I don't know what his real job was...he did
Proxomitron on the side.

I hope someone who actually know him would write some short
biograph of him of some sort, so we can remember him not just
only by Proxo, but also by him as a person. Perhaps one day
this will surface....




--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[Ben Cooper]

the Priceless List

So, now we have you Susan agreeing with Garrett that the Pricelessware
pages are full of errors, and as you say because you had your hissy
fit and stopped work on them. Now Garrett is trying to get them back
on line.

Well, no. Susan *has* been working on the Pricelessware site. It's now
located at www.pricelesswarehome.org .
Garrett is making his own site, which, apparently, will not be a mirror
of www.pricelesswarehome.org.

I think I'm missing something. We (the participants of ACF) vote for
freeware to go on a web site. It's our list that goes to the the web,
so there should only be one list, irespective of how many sites carry
it, and they should all be the same in every respect.

Yes, I would imagine any site that lists Pricelessware *should* list an
accurate account of the voting results. The difference would be in the
execution of the site.

(If I'm not right so far, then the nnext bit is pointless) Why then is
there all this argument about Garrett not removing Ben from
Pricelessware.org.com when he is still on the two mirrors?

Regardless of how many sites list the Pricelessware results, individuals
should be able to disassociate themselves with any given site. I don't
want to be associated with the pricelessware.org site.

Garrett has posted many times that he is under no obligation to make
immediate changes to his site.
In the time it's taken for him to post those diatribes he could have
deleted those few lines from the page and uploaded a revision. Plus, he
has "plonked" me and there is no other way to contact him other than
posts to this group.

Apparently, I'm forced to be affiliated with a site which I *don't* wish
to be affiliated with until it's convenient for him to respect my
wishes.

If you were in the same situation, wouldn't you feel the same way?

 

[jo]

Yes, I would imagine any site that lists Pricelessware *should* list an
accurate account of the voting results

One has to wonder how Garrett is going to count the votes of those in
his kill file.

It will be a real achievement if this years voting process is anything
other than a flame fest. I see Susan doing loads of work and then
Garrett stepping in from on high to ratify the results for the
'official' site.

 

[Ben Cooper]

One has to wonder how Garrett is going to count the votes of those in
his kill file.

It's obvious *my* vote won't matter to Garrett. I can't even get him to
remove a few lines of text from his pricelessware.org site.

It will be a real achievement if this years voting process is anything
other than a flame fest. I see Susan doing loads of work and then
Garrett stepping in from on high to ratify the results for the
'official' site.

Yes, the voting this year will be interesting.

 

[ranrad]

One has to wonder how Garrett is going to count the votes of those in
his kill file.

It will be a real achievement if this years voting process is anything
other than a flame fest. I see Susan doing loads of work and then
Garrett stepping in from on high to ratify the results for the
'official' site.

I thought everybody on ACF was going to work together on the PL list again.
I seem to recall that several members took parts and verified links etc.,
in the past Therefore Garrett does not have to be activly involved in the
vote counting.

 

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Omar=A9?=]

Well "hissy fits" my butt, Susan is no longer the web master of
pricelessware.org
so therefore she is not responsible for the site but instead she's been
working
on *Pricelesswarehome.org* which is the new site according to the vote.
Remember majority in the vote and all of that!!!!

Well, no. Susan *has* been working on the Pricelessware site. It's now
located at www.pricelesswarehome.org .
Garrett is making his own site, which, apparently, will not be a mirror
of www.pricelesswarehome.org.

Yes you are missing something, the VOTE was to move the site by the
participants
of ACF so the the list now goes to *Pricelesswarehome.org*.

Yes, I would imagine any site that lists Pricelessware *should* list an
accurate account of the voting results. The difference would be in the
execution of the site.

It is not Ben's removal the only one, I have asked politely to be removed
and I was ignored what's my choice legal council????????
Do not want to reach that level but if I must!!!!!!!!

Regardless of how many sites list the Pricelessware results, individuals
should be able to disassociate themselves with any given site. I don't
want to be associated with the pricelessware.org site.

Garrett has posted many times that he is under no obligation to make
immediate changes to his site.

To be decided by a higher authority.

In the time it's taken for him to post those diatribes he could have
deleted those few lines from the page and uploaded a revision. Plus, he
has "plonked" me and there is no other way to contact him other than
posts to this group.

Apparently, I'm forced to be affiliated with a site which I *don't* wish
to be affiliated with until it's convenient for him to respect my
wishes.

If you were in the same situation, wouldn't you feel the same way?

--
"When I am right, No one remembers
When I am wrong, No one forgets"

The Home of Pricelessware 2004
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Omar=A9?=]

One has to wonder how Garrett is going to count the votes of those in
his kill file.

It will be a real achievement if this years voting process is anything
other than a flame fest. I see Susan doing loads of work and then
Garrett stepping in from on high to ratify the results for the
'official' site.

Official site according to whom???????
Did I see a vote?????
Nawwww I must have asleep.

Omar


--
"When I am right, No one remembers
When I am wrong, No one forgets"

The Home of Pricelessware 2004
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Omar=A9?=]

I thought everybody on ACF was going to work together on the PL list again.
I seem to recall that several members took parts and verified links etc.,
in the past Therefore Garrett does not have to be activly involved in the
vote counting.

So what good is he for, just wondering nothing serious.

Omar
--
"When I am right, No one remembers
When I am wrong, No one forgets"

The Home of Pricelessware 2004
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[R. L.]

Yes you are missing something, the VOTE was to move the
site by the participants
of ACF so the the list now goes to *Pricelesswarehome.org*.

Just a reminder, it was a POLL, not exactly THE vote. In
addition, the number of the participants who participed in the
poll may not even be enough to represent all the participants
here, (those who are actually involved or subscribed to this
group). Just a figure, the several times I post something new
stuff about my freeware on my site, I checked the stat. of my
site within the next 12 hours, I got about 90-100
downloads/visits just by announcing it here. And I remember
reading some stat on this group about a year ago on an MS
site, not in the summer, but before June, it was about 500-
1000 different posters around during a regular month. Hence,
that "vote" in question can at most be considered a poll, how
can we say we are deciding for all the potiential 100/500 or
perhaps 1000 people? (btw, the stat I am talking about was
reported and discussed in this group, in the Google archieve.
In addition, regarding the issue of "voting", I think at one
point this group also had a very extensive discussion on that,
too).

I myself really appreciate everyone's effort. I think a
sensible thing to do is to try to encourage Garratt and Susan,
even not to work together per se, to develop more friendly
encounters, help mirroring each other, and help promoting
freeware. This would be best for all the participants and the
group. Coming out like a "supporter" of one vs. the other
could only make the situation worst. You know, we are not in
high school anymore. Adults see adult conficts, would usually
try to resolve and mederate them as a sensible thing to do; on
the other hand, high school kids would take side, form gangs,
enjoy the ride, and help abusing each other - something like:
"I don't like B because I am on C's side and C doesn't like B
so I should think B is bad [even though I may not even know B
very well]; Or I don't like B because I think B is D's friend
whom I don't get along with. I am sure we are no kids and
could all do better than that.

Instead of insisting on "his site", "her site", or "our site"
or whoever sites one is, we should focus more on the good part
that there are a group of participants who help to put up a
site, whoever she or he is. I am sure everyone would be
gladed to have different sites to visit or to check things out
and won't mind to donate if one can effort to. Yet, IMO, both
sites should be treated equally. On the other hand, if one
can't do that, they are free to donate to/like/visit/ one site
more (often) than the other, but they have no right to decide
for, or force others who think otherwise with an opinion poll.
I really hope that we won't argue anymore and enjoy this
group.





--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[R. L.]

So what good is he for, just wondering nothing serious.

Well, he is at least good for not being your slave.



--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[R. L.]

Well, he is at least good for not being your slave.

sorry, forget this

;-) [I was joking]

) sometimes written communication is never as good as the
face to face one



--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Omar=A9?=]

Yes you are missing something, the VOTE was to move the
site by the participants
of ACF so the the list now goes to *Pricelesswarehome.org*.

Just a reminder, it was a POLL, not exactly THE vote. In
addition, the number of the participants who participed in the
poll may not even be enough to represent all the participants
here, (those who are actually involved or subscribed to this
group). Just a figure, the several times I post something new
stuff about my freeware on my site, I checked the stat. of my
site within the next 12 hours, I got about 90-100
downloads/visits just by announcing it here. And I remember
reading some stat on this group about a year ago on an MS
site, not in the summer, but before June, it was about 500-
1000 different posters around during a regular month. Hence,
that "vote" in question can at most be considered a poll, how
can we say we are deciding for all the potiential 100/500 or
perhaps 1000 people? (btw, the stat I am talking about was
reported and discussed in this group, in the Google archieve.
In addition, regarding the issue of "voting", I think at one
point this group also had a very extensive discussion on that,
too).

I myself really appreciate everyone's effort. I think a
sensible thing to do is to try to encourage Garratt and Susan,
even not to work together per se, to develop more friendly
encounters, help mirroring each other, and help promoting
freeware. This would be best for all the participants and the
group. Coming out like a "supporter" of one vs. the other
could only make the situation worst. You know, we are not in
high school anymore. Adults see adult conficts, would usually
try to resolve and mederate them as a sensible thing to do; on
the other hand, high school kids would take side, form gangs,
enjoy the ride, and help abusing each other - something like:
"I don't like B because I am on C's side and C doesn't like B
so I should think B is bad [even though I may not even know B
very well]; Or I don't like B because I think B is D's friend
whom I don't get along with. I am sure we are no kids and
could all do better than that.

Instead of insisting on "his site", "her site", or "our site"
or whoever sites one is, we should focus more on the good part
that there are a group of participants who help to put up a
site, whoever she or he is. I am sure everyone would be
gladed to have different sites to visit or to check things out
and won't mind to donate if one can effort to. Yet, IMO, both
sites should be treated equally. On the other hand, if one
can't do that, they are free to donate to/like/visit/ one site
more (often) than the other, but they have no right to decide
for, or force others who think otherwise with an opinion poll.
I really hope that we won't argue anymore and enjoy this
group.

As I said in my previous post to you that you ignored:
Your *BIAS IS SHOWING
which part of "is was voted to move it"
you do not understand????????????
There was NO POLL it was a VOTE do you grasp the concept???
I really did not think so.
HOPE THIS HELPS
Insofar as arguing, you are the one that'sd blind to the facts.



Omar

--
"When I am right, No one remembers
When I am wrong, No one forgets"

The Home of Pricelessware 2004
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Omar=A9?=]

Well, he is at least good for not being your slave.

And that takes the cake, slave?????????? with a self appointed
dictator????????
We get up one morning and here we are a new *webmaster without a vote*
Real democracy I see. Wake up and smell the coffee.
I think by now everybody sees your bias and this statement nails it.
Please DO NOT INSULT MY INTELLIGENCE any longer and see if you can get the
*slave*
to remove my name from a webpage that I no longer wish to be associated
with.
Nothing nasty, nothing vulgar, no cursing just
END OF DISCUSSION

Mr. Omar

-
"When I am right, No one remembers
When I am wrong, No one forgets"

The Home of Pricelessware 2004
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[Stan Weiss]

Yes you are missing something, the VOTE was to move the
site by the participants
of ACF so the the list now goes to *Pricelesswarehome.org*.

Just a reminder, it was a POLL, not exactly THE vote. In
addition, the number of the participants who participed in the
poll may not even be enough to represent all the participants
here, (those who are actually involved or subscribed to this
group). Just a figure, the several times I post something new
stuff about my freeware on my site, I checked the stat. of my
site within the next 12 hours, I got about 90-100
downloads/visits just by announcing it here. And I remember
reading some stat on this group about a year ago on an MS
site, not in the summer, but before June, it was about 500-
1000 different posters around during a regular month. Hence,
that "vote" in question can at most be considered a poll, how
can we say we are deciding for all the potiential 100/500 or
perhaps 1000 people? (btw, the stat I am talking about was
reported and discussed in this group, in the Google archieve.
In addition, regarding the issue of "voting", I think at one
point this group also had a very extensive discussion on that,
too).

I myself really appreciate everyone's effort. I think a
sensible thing to do is to try to encourage Garratt and Susan,
even not to work together per se, to develop more friendly
encounters, help mirroring each other, and help promoting
freeware. This would be best for all the participants and the
group. Coming out like a "supporter" of one vs. the other
could only make the situation worst. You know, we are not in
high school anymore. Adults see adult conficts, would usually
try to resolve and mederate them as a sensible thing to do; on
the other hand, high school kids would take side, form gangs,
enjoy the ride, and help abusing each other - something like:
"I don't like B because I am on C's side and C doesn't like B
so I should think B is bad [even though I may not even know B
very well]; Or I don't like B because I think B is D's friend
whom I don't get along with. I am sure we are no kids and
could all do better than that.

Instead of insisting on "his site", "her site", or "our site"
or whoever sites one is, we should focus more on the good part
that there are a group of participants who help to put up a
site, whoever she or he is. I am sure everyone would be
gladed to have different sites to visit or to check things out
and won't mind to donate if one can effort to. Yet, IMO, both
sites should be treated equally. On the other hand, if one
can't do that, they are free to donate to/like/visit/ one site
more (often) than the other, but they have no right to decide
for, or force others who think otherwise with an opinion poll.
I really hope that we won't argue anymore and enjoy this
group.

--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

What is lost in this web site is better or that web site is better is
the list itself. The list does not belong to either web site or side but
to the whole group. It should be voted on here and results posted here
and then anyone can make a web site.

 

[R. L.]

As I said in my previous post to you that you ignored:
Your *BIAS IS SHOWING
which part of "is was voted to move it"
you do not understand????????????

But a proper binding vote would need to have at least certain
percentage of the whole group to participe, vote for motion,
move to discussions, and then the vote and also a lot of clear
details, and you know for a fact that we didn't have any of
those ever in this group. We do vote to express our opinion,
though. Years ago Gena wanted to put up a site and contribute
to the participants here so she asked for opinions by
conducting a poll or a vote, fair enough; So did Susan,
although she had every right to just not ask us, this is a
fact, right? Just like all the wonderful contributors who are
contrubuting to the PL-home site now, we all appricate the
efforts and they have choosen to contribute, they don't need
to have anyone's approval or to vote for them, either; they
can just start contrubuting anytime anyway they like to (but
if they want to ask for opinions from this group I am guessing
that it would also be welcomed).

There was NO POLL it was a VOTE do you grasp the concept???
I really did not think so.
HOPE THIS HELPS

hmmm.... not really...to help...you will really need to answer
my question as to who has the power or right to say that it
represents *all* the participants here and have a binding
power. I really don't understand why you think that way. But
anyhow, we can totally argue to disagree. You know, I have no
right to change your mind and I really like you fine. So,
let's don't bother with it anymore.

Insofar as arguing, you are the one that'sd blind to the
facts.

wow wow wow... Omar, let's just talk about freeware
instead...ok??????? (boy, I just love your millions of
question marks ;-P )

Let's have fun... you know, I though we were just discussing,
not arguing, if you think I am arguing with you, I rather
not...let's talk about freeware freeware freeware....




--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[R. L.]

And that takes the cake, slave?????????? with a self
appointed dictator????????
We get up one morning and here we are a new *webmaster
without a vote* Real democracy I see. Wake up and smell the
coffee.

No, he is not OUR webmaster, no one is. Why do you even think
so? He just happens to run a site that help to host the
Pricelessware list (as is Susan and others). And the list is
just a set of voting results anyway, it doesn't belong to
anyone per se here. We don't own it, it is out in the public.

I think by now everybody sees your bias and this
statement nails it. Please DO NOT INSULT MY INTELLIGENCE
any longer and see if you can get the *slave*
to remove my name from a webpage that I no longer wish to
be associated with.

I am sorry, I don't really mean to offend you that way. I was
just thinking that your previous post was not really nice so I
was just trying to get to you. Why do you assume that Garrett
would NEVER remove your name from that site? I really don't
understand. Please give him a chance (I mean it). Even if I
might be "bias", I think giving people benifit of the doubt is
always a good kind of bias. It is not like I like Garrett
more than Susan, I appriciate them both, sincerely.

Nothing nasty, nothing vulgar, no cursing just
END OF DISCUSSION

Ok, let's talk about freeware. Btw, I like your signature.
We should always remember people's good instead of people's
bad. So, please remember my good (if any), instead of my bad
And I would do the same, too.




--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[Mister Charlie]

Just a reflection, apropos of nothing (as most of my deep thoughts
are)...but it's consistently amazing to me just how much one person can
set into motion by a word or an action.

 

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Omar=A9?=]

No, he is not OUR webmaster, no one is. Why do you even think
so? He just happens to run a site that help to host the
Pricelessware list (as is Susan and others). And the list is
just a set of voting results anyway, it doesn't belong to
anyone per se here. We don't own it, it is out in the public.

If that's the case why is my name still there as a volunteer????
Voting results DO NOT NEED volunteer burners.

I am sorry, I don't really mean to offend you that way. I was
just thinking that your previous post was not really nice so I
was just trying to get to you. Why do you assume that Garrett
would NEVER remove your name from that site? I really don't
understand. Please give him a chance (I mean it). Even if I
might be "bias", I think giving people benifit of the doubt is
always a good kind of bias. It is not like I like Garrett
more than Susan, I appriciate them both, sincerely.

Well you really did, I have never imply or say that Garrett or any
webmaster was
*my slave* so I do not know where that comes from. The old adage about
"those who live in glass houses should not trow stones" apply.

Ok, let's talk about freeware. Btw, I like your signature.
We should always remember people's good instead of people's
bad. So, please remember my good (if any), instead of my bad
And I would do the same, too.

I have a lot of good (old age you know) and have no doubt that you try
but.... there is always a but!!!
If you want to talk about freeware let's but that does not negate the
snide remarks about Susan's website prowess or lock of.
If I see a wrong I will speak up regardless of the consequences (which by
the way can be substantial)

Peace

Omar

 

[R. L.]

If that's the case why is my name still there as a
volunteer???? Voting results DO NOT NEED volunteer burners.

I know, I cannot speak for Garrett of course, but I can also
fully understand that he *could* really be busy and haven't
really gotten to it, yet. You know, reading between the lines
I have an impression that he might be working really hard on
other aspects on the site and have not yet to be able to get
to the requests yet. I was just thinking if it were any other
people who happened to own or run the site were a bit slow on
this, we would certain give him or her a change and be more
patient. So, I think let's wait until Garrett put his work
out and I am sort of sure that by that time the requests would
be taken care of (of course, I could be wrong, but it is still
too early to draw the conclusion, though). I can image if I
were in his situation, just took on something new, would take
myself sometime to dig through it, you know how that could be.

Well you really did, I have never imply or say that Garrett
or any webmaster was
*my slave* so I do not know where that comes from. The old
adage about "those who live in glass houses should not trow
stones" apply.

Sorry Let's don't say anyone is up to no good or no use,
ok Let's treat both Susan and Garrett nicely.

I have a lot of good (old age you know) and have no doubt
that you try but.... there is always a but!!!

Well, I did try. But anyhow, bad or good, I am basically a
happy person. I just don't want people to argue, but of
course, I sometimes think that I care too much, afterall it is
just a newsgroup. And we all know we don't actually know each
other in this digital world...anyone may just one day vanish
from the net and be unmentioned ever after. So, I sometimes
think I care too much.

If you want to talk about freeware let's but that does not
negate the snide remarks about Susan's website prowess or
lock of. If I see a wrong I will speak up regardless of the
consequences (which by the way can be substantial)

Yes, I know that was not really appropiate. But you know, we
all post bad sometimes without thinking much (see what I
unintentionally did to you); In the mean time, let's cherish
what you said in your sig, forget the bad or wrong, remember
the right and good That counts for all the inappropiate
remarks from anyone.

All I hope for is that we have two equally nice sites to
visit, you know, they could be both good.

Peace

Peace :->




--
RL
Unofficial Adaware Updater (+other goodies)
http://home.earthlink.net/~ringomei/page2.html
********************************
Pricelessware voting annual results and information:
http://www.pricelessware.org,
http://www.pricelesswarehome.org,
http://www.earths-ocular.com/mirror/www.pricelesswarehome.org/

 

[Garrett]

Omar© wrote:

[snip]

It is not Ben's removal the only one, I have asked politely to be
removed and I was ignored what's my choice legal council????????
Do not want to reach that level but if I must!!!!!!!

Please correct yourself... you were not ignored. I replied to you
aswell as Ben Cooper stating that your request was noted and will be
verified when I get to it.

If you wish to seek legal actions against me for this, then I guess I
can't stop you.

Best regards,
-Garrett