Windows Updates on a CD!

[Roger Hunt]

I'd like to chime in too. Has anyone installed the security updates
from M$ and do they allow you to ignore the things you don't want to
install?

I'm using ME and have the update, but from reading the install screens
it sounds as if the CD will install every "update." I want to keep
Internet explorer and Windows Media Player from installing (they are
on the disk).

Paranoid about the DRM MS is pushing. Beware trojans bearing gifts.

I have W98SE and foolishly used this suspicious offering ....
... but, go to Add/remove progs - WMP9 can be rolled back to WMP6.4,
and IE6 to 5.5 (on my system).
Goodness knows what the other Qxxxxxx updates are, I haven't checked
through the .inf files or looked at the relevant KB pages.

 

[Trey Hunner]

NoNaMe said the following on 4/21/2004 8:57 PM:

I received my 2 cd,s from Microsoft Sydney aust__ no big deal and were
delivered within 3 weeks __there is no charge and even posted to you
free_____the updates are for your own O/Sys it picks it out automaticaly
With kind regards From WillofAustralia Victoria.

I ordered my CD in February and finally got it a couple days ago. They
included two full CDs! One is some free trial for a firewall and the
other contains 459mb of updates. Microsoft has gone a little crazy with
their massive amounts of 'updates' (a.k.a. bugs).

 

[default]

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:18:19 -0400, default wrote...


Just tried it out on two machines at work today - one Win98SE, the other
WinME.

Went to the Windows update site first and was told that 17 critical
updates were required for the 98SE box and 20 for the ME.

After using the CD, went back to Windows update and found that 3 updates
were still needed for both machines. Three 'biggies' as well totalling
nearly 10MB. From memory there was one specific to IE, one for OE and the
other was a Java Virtual Machine patch.
snip
The first thing the CD did was to install IE6 (latest) and Media Player
9. I didn't get a choice as to whether I wanted them or not.

The above was all as a result of letting the CD autorun itself. I will
try on another work machine soon to bypass the autorun to see if updates
can be run directly.

Thank you Thank you Thank you

The last thing I want is IE or MP >7 (and seven is scary)

I know this is OT, but . . . I run Netscape 4.7 for text and email
(no scripts or images) and K-Meleon for the rest (10%) (shopping - web
mail) Haven't had a bit (smidgen, zilch, nada, nothing zug) of
spyware, trojans, keyloggers, spam etc.)

Is that typical? I had all kinds of hyjacks and even keyloggers
before I stopped using IE. now nothing (that Adaware, Spybot, or
Spysweeper can see . . .)

Take care
bob

 

[John Corliss]

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:18:19 -0400, default wrote...




Just tried it out on two machines at work today - one Win98SE, the other
WinME.

Went to the Windows update site first and was told that 17 critical
updates were required for the 98SE box and 20 for the ME.

After using the CD, went back to Windows update and found that 3 updates
were still needed for both machines. Three 'biggies' as well totalling
nearly 10MB. From memory there was one specific to IE, one for OE and the
other was a Java Virtual Machine patch.




The first thing the CD did was to install IE6 (latest) and Media Player
9. I didn't get a choice as to whether I wanted them or not.

Whoops. That sucks. Hope you can use system restore to uninstall it.
Otherwise, DRM comes with WMP9 and that's that.

The above was all as a result of letting the CD autorun itself. I will
try on another work machine soon to bypass the autorun to see if updates
can be run directly.

I'm glad I simply downloaded all the ME updates and saved them to one
big honking file. I can pick and choose if I ever need one of them.

 

[default]

NoNaMe said the following on 4/21/2004 8:57 PM:

I ordered my CD in February and finally got it a couple days ago. They
included two full CDs! One is some free trial for a firewall and the
other contains 459mb of updates. Microsoft has gone a little crazy with
their massive amounts of 'updates' (a.k.a. bugs).

OK throw out the firewall, what is left?

MS is the company that was trying to see what we were using online in
1990 before anyone thought of looking at what THEY were looking at.

I think it is great that M$ is (finally (supposedly) doing something
about their, hole ridden software - but I don't trust them.

They have this DRM, TCA/TCP (trusted computer alliance/platform) that
I have no control over and am expected to use? no.

If it comes to that, I learned DOS I can learn Linux . . . I can
disconnect,

I'm not castigating or disrespecting (being PC here) you. MS is
bearing gifts? Look a gift horse in the mouth . . . Trojans bearing
gifts.

Even when M$ does capitulate to "higher authority" They give away
Windows to countries and schools that don't have it? That is their
restitution ? Their punishment and fine? Spare me. That hurts M$?

Download the "security update" after its been vetted - by people who
have fooled with it.

 

[Trey Hunner]

default said the following on 4/22/2004 5:10 PM:
....

If it comes to that, I learned DOS I can learn Linux . . . I can
disconnect,

Linux is actually not all command-line based like people think. Windows
is actually built similarly in that the graphical user interface uses
DOS to function. I've tried more Linux distros than many and they
aren't quite ready for your average Joe support-wise but they are
extremely functional systems.

....

Download the "security update" after its been vetted - by people who
have fooled with it.

This would work in theory but not in reality. The updates are not
open-source and so any fooling would be very difficult (not to mention
illegal).

Microsoft is definitely losing any reputation they have left very
quickly. I still can't make any good guesses as to when they will start
rapidly losing customers though.

 

[REM]

I'd be curious to know whether or not those updates forceably install
digital rights management (DRM) on your system.

I ran the CD on ME and XP. The behavior was totally different. ME started
installing, rebooting as necessary, and installed everything with a click to
start it.

XP gave a menu, and created restore points for each install. Windows Media
Player had an option here. It was not forced. There were several newer updates
that I had to download, including the MHTML vulnerability that came out on the
13th (I got infected on the 10th) I highly recommend getting this particular
update!

 

[Achim Nolcken Lohse]

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 22:37:58 GMT, Trey Hunner

....

I ordered my CD in February and finally got it a couple days ago.

Doing much better than me. I've tried several times over the past few
months to place an order, and never got further than a nonsense
progress bar that never moves.

They
included two full CDs! One is some free trial for a firewall and the
other contains 459mb of updates. Microsoft has gone a little crazy with
their massive amounts of 'updates' (a.k.a. bugs).

Have to wonder why they don't make these disks available for download
as ISO images, which would save them scads of money.




Achim



axethetax

 

[Paul Blarmy]

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 19:38:08 +0100, Paul Blarmy wrote...

Just tried it out on two machines at work today - one Win98SE, the other
WinME.

Went to the Windows update site first and was told that 17 critical
updates were required for the 98SE box and 20 for the ME.

After using the CD, went back to Windows update and found that 3 updates
were still needed for both machines. Three 'biggies' as well totalling
nearly 10MB. From memory there was one specific to IE, one for OE and the
other was a Java Virtual Machine patch.

Sorry to follow up my own post, but this is to follow on from what I said
above.

The first update that hadn't been installed was the MS Virtual Machine.
The second two were both updates to the updates that the MS Security CD
had installed!! After installing these and checking on the Windows update
site again, there was a further patch to download which patched the patch
of a patch - er, if that makes sense!

 

[Paul Blarmy]

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 19:01:15 -0400, default wrote...

The last thing I want is IE or MP >7 (and seven is scary)

I had a look at the CD without it autorunning and you can see separate
directories for patches, IE and WMP. Perhaps there is therefore a way to
only install what you want to install.

BTW - there was an entry in 'Add/Remove' to uninstall WMP9.

 

[Haggard the Horrendous]

The first thing the CD did was to install IE6 (latest) and Media Player
9. I didn't get a choice as to whether I wanted them or not.

A question. Did the EULA pop up at any time during the WMP9 install
warning you that you were agreeing to have DRM installed on your
computer? If so, did you have the option of refusing?

It *sounds* like nothing like that happened but I'd like to make sure.

Thanks.

 

[Paul Blarmy]

On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 00:19:04 GMT, Haggard the Horrendous wrote...

A question. Did the EULA pop up at any time during the WMP9 install
warning you that you were agreeing to have DRM installed on your
computer? If so, did you have the option of refusing?

There was an EULA right at the start with the option to either accept or
refuse. A refusal meant that the CD went no further. To be honest, I
didn't read the entire agreement but will be installing on another
machine on Monday so I will take a very careful look then.

 

[Phred]

On Thu, 22 Apr 2004 22:37:58 GMT, Trey Hunner


Doing much better than me. I've tried several times over the past few
months to place an order, and never got further than a nonsense
progress bar that never moves.


Have to wonder why they don't make these disks available for download
as ISO images, which would save them scads of money.

Presumably, they're doing it as a service to customers. Many of us
have monthly download limits on our access plans and excess volume is
pretty expensive (typically 15c/MB).

I was *very* pleased to hear of the update CD, and had no trouble
getting it here in Oz. Arrived pretty quickly too.

All that said, it certainly is possible to get these updates by direct
download from MS, so why would you want the ISO image too?


Cheers, Phred.

 

[Haggard the Horrendous]

On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 00:19:04 GMT, Haggard the Horrendous wrote...


There was an EULA right at the start with the option to either accept or
refuse. A refusal meant that the CD went no further. To be honest, I
didn't read the entire agreement but will be installing on another
machine on Monday so I will take a very careful look then.

Thanks. I'd appreciate it. I've been puzzled as to *why* M$ is doing
this. They aren't famous for their generosity in the past. Forcing DRM
on people would explain a lot.

 

[Paul Blarmy]

On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 16:42:48 GMT, Haggard the Horrendous wrote...

Thanks. I'd appreciate it. I've been puzzled as to *why* M$ is doing
this. They aren't famous for their generosity in the past. Forcing DRM
on people would explain a lot.

Right, the EULA which opens up at the start of the MS Security Update CD
is available as a PDF at:
http://spionfox.clawz.com/eula.pdf

 

[Daze N. Knights]

Right, the EULA which opens up at the start of the MS Security Update CD
is available as a PDF at:
http://spionfox.clawz.com/eula.pdf

Don't see anything there pertaining to DRM.
Daze

 

[Haggard the Horrendous]

Don't see anything there pertaining to DRM.
Daze

Exactly my concern. WMP 7+ *does* contain DRM to control the playing
of protected content in WMP.This is their right, as long as the user
is informed. The DRM also includes:

http://www.techimo.com/newsapp/index.pl?photo=1109

Without presenting this in the EULA, Billie and company have decided
that they now have the right to install anything they wish on your (or
my) computer without asking permission. Same as the Trojan they
installed with the M$ Multimedia Keyboard on my computer.

 

[Vic Dura]

Exactly my concern. WMP 7+ *does* contain DRM to control the playing
of protected content in WMP.This is their right, as long as the user
is informed.

Does the DRM also control content that is played with non-MS media
palyer software?

 

[Haggard the Horrendous]

Does the DRM also control content that is played with non-MS media
palyer software?

Yes. The content is 'protected' in such a way that you need the codecs
to play it. M$ wants to be the only source for these codecs. In order
to install the codecs you have to agree to M$'s DRM (assuming you
haven't found a source for the hacked codecs).

There will be a lot of non-protected media coming out in WMP9 format.
In order to play non-protected media you'll have to have the DRM
installed.

Theoretically, with a company that doesn't have the reputation that M$
has for shady deals, if you stick to all legal protected media or
non-protected media you shouldn't notice a damn bit of difference in
what you want to do. It *should* be seamless except maybe having to
download a new codec or permission. Theoretically.

So, what it basically boils down to is: do you trust Microsoft? I
don't. So, as is my option, I refuse to use any WMP above 6.4. I
refuse to use W2K. I refuse to use XP. I'll continue to use W98SE
until 'the change'. I refuse to use Internet Exploder or Outhouse. I
refuse to use M$'s Office products. I refuse to use *any* M$ software.
After that M$ Multimedia Keyboard and the Trojan I refuse to use any
of their hardware. YMMV.

'The change' refers to having already downloaded and tried the Susie
Live CD (and the Mandrake one). They work. Initially they'll give me
the basics. I'm planning on building a new PC and I'll install W98SE
on it (I have two legal copies), Once it's working I'll delete W98SE
from this one and install Susie Linux on it. Once I have everything
working on it properly then I'll do the same to the new one.

 

[Phred]

After that M$ Multimedia Keyboard and the Trojan I refuse to use any
of their hardware. YMMV.

[...]

Clearly something I've missed. What's it all about?


Cheers, Phred.