Repost of prediction

J

John Corliss

A long time ago in alt.comp.freeware, I warned that those who seek to
make a profit by disguising non-freeware as freeware would come into
this group and promote that kind of garbage. They would also attempt to
corrupt the definition of freeware by twisting it to mean something that
would serve their purposes.
There are also those *who don't care* that they're promoting
non-freeware in this group and who add to the problem. This can be due
to sheer laziness, a desire to be disruptive, or the person being a
commercial software shill.

Since off topic posting has been happening with increasing frequency
in ACF, I will again repost this edited version of one of my previous
messages.

Think of it as a wakeup call to the group and as an expression of *my
opinion*.

_You are free to disagree, but I will not answer replies to this post_.

***************************************
In my mind, Freeware is very clearly defined as being full-featured
software which is meant to be completely free to use -no strings
attached, monetary or otherwise, for as long as the user likes.
How do I define strings? They're any requirement (again, monetary or
otherwise) placed on you, the user, which are not related to the actual
functioning of the software and which must be complied with in order to
use the software.

This doesn't mean that certain types of non-freeware shouldn't be
recommended as solutions in this group, it's just that common sense
should tell you which types these are. For example:

Careware
Donationware
Liteware
Postcardware

are often discussed in this group. Still:

*Adware* is not freeware.
*Betaware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*Careware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here, but there
isn't a lot of it)
*CDware* is not freeware (unless it is freeware that's available on the
internet.)
*Commercial software* is not freeware.
*Crippleware* is not freeware.
*Demoware* is not freeware.
*Donationware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*"Free to download"* may or may not be freeware, but usually isn't.
*Fonts* are not freeware, they are data files.
*Free services* are not freeware, although the software required to use
such services (browsers for instance) may or may not be freeware.
*Liteware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*Nagware* is not freeware.
*Orphanware* is only freeware if the author specifically says that it is
when he/she drops support of the software.
*Pirated software* is not freeware.
*Postcardware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*Porno sites* are not freeware.
*PROmotionware is not freeware.
*Shareware* is not freeware.
*Spyware* is not freeware.
*Text and other data files* are not freeware.
*Time-limited software* is not freeware.
*Trialware* is not freeware.
*Trojans* are not freeware.
*Viruses and virus authoring* software are not freeware.
*Warez* is not freeware.

Not only that, but if a program is "sort of" any of these types, then it
definitely ISN'T freeware.

Here's a "little" prediction that will let you in on why I am so
vociferous about this issue:

**************************
Some day, your software BE IT COMMERCIAL or ANY OTHER VARIETY, will be
as overly saturated with commercials as U.S. network broadcast
television. Your time will be wasted wading through or simply being
forced to endure, endless and worthless static and animated messages
that squander your life force. You won't be able to type a document into
a word processor without wasting portions of your life viewing
commercials about products which are of absolutely NO interest to you.
(Men- consider how much you enjoy looking at women's hygiene and
cosmetic products during the evening news hour; women- how much you
enjoy watching beer commercials and ads for football games.

You buy a video movie and the first 10 minutes of it are "previews", or
commercials for other movies. Soon, there will be one commercial break
in the middle of the movie, then there will be two. Those breaks will
grow longer and then there will be three, etc. Now you can usually fast
forward through them, but this option is rapidly disappearing with the
advent of new media distribution types (DVDs force you to watch
copyright notices for instance). This also, is not speculation; it is
inevitable.

Software is NO DIFFERENT. You are sitting in front of an information
display, just like a television, and your undivided attention is being
given. According to the thinking of the villainous advertising
community, this opportunity MUST be exploited as closely as possible.
And right up to the point where you are repulsed by the act of surfing
the internet or running software. Then, as you become inured to the
level of the assault, it will be increased again.

Sooner or later, the villains of this world will insidiously infest and
cram commercial content into everything you view. In fact they have
already begun to do so, and the speed and thoroughness at which they
will perform this villainy will increase at a logarithmic rate.

This is not just a possibility, it's in fact what the future holds for
us. It's one of the reasons why there's such a big push to put all
software online; so that the makers of such software can control it with
immediacy; so that they will be able to alter the commercials that will
be contained in the software as well as monitor our behavior while online.

IMO Bill Gates and Microsoft want a future where you WILL be online
whenever you use your computer. Period.

We are all subject to the whims of those in the world who can't control
their own greed (such as Gates and Microsoft) and such people will never
go away. In fact, as our population increases uncontrollably towards our
own massive extinction in the not too distant future, the ratio of those
who employ unethical methods to survive to those who don't will only
increase.
As we continue to usurp the carrying capacity of other species and
cause their extinction, we increasingly prey upon ourselves.
We are all victims.

******************************

Sounds pretty far fetched? It's already happening. I continually get
email messages from friends and relatives with little advertisements at
the bottom of the message. Microsoft continually plugs their services
and other software from *within their commercial software!* Adware has
reared its ugly head and is being promoted by many in this group as
being true freeware. You click for the first time on any link in certain
pages (or anywhere on the page for that matter) and a miserable popup
appears.

This is what I dread, and am fighting tooth and claw. I also dread:

* the eventual future where Microsoft controls who can and who cannot
write any software.
* a future where Microsoft has effectively and completely taken over the
software market.
* a future where your activities are monitored all the time as the
natural outcome of "Orwellian creep"

The freeware movement can produce tools to fight against this
oppression. That's why it's so important to protect the definition of
freeware.

We are all adherents of the third law of thermodynamics, i.e. "any
system which uses energy will devote a portion of that energy to
degrading the ability of the system to use energy. Ultimately, the
system will be unable to use energy and will fail."
Human society is a system which uses energy. In this case, entropy
leads to decadence, and rampant commercialism is the worst kind of such
lowering of the quality of life.

Entropy is hard at work in this newsgroup as well, when I see people
attempting to water down the meaning of the term "freeware" due to
laziness, a resentment of "being told what to do" or so as to profit
monetarily.
Perhaps it's inevitable that this newsgroup should someday be consumed
by spammers, trolls and off-topic discussions of non-freeware.
I would like to see that day put off as long as possible.
 
J

JS

John Corliss said:
A long time ago in alt.comp.freeware, I warned that those who seek to

Troll O Meter


0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
___________________________________________________
| | | | | | | | | | |
 
E

El Gee

John Corliss said:
are often discussed in this group. Still:

*Adware* is not freeware.
*Betaware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*Careware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here, but
there isn't a lot of it)
*CDware* is not freeware (unless it is freeware that's available on
the internet.)
*Commercial software* is not freeware.
*Crippleware* is not freeware.
*Demoware* is not freeware.
*Donationware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*"Free to download"* may or may not be freeware, but usually isn't.
*Fonts* are not freeware, they are data files.
*Free services* are not freeware, although the software required to
use such services (browsers for instance) may or may not be freeware.
*Liteware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*Nagware* is not freeware.
*Orphanware* is only freeware if the author specifically says that it
is when he/she drops support of the software.
*Pirated software* is not freeware.
*Postcardware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)
*Porno sites* are not freeware.
*PROmotionware is not freeware.
*Shareware* is not freeware.
*Spyware* is not freeware.
*Text and other data files* are not freeware.
*Time-limited software* is not freeware.
*Trialware* is not freeware.
*Trojans* are not freeware.
*Viruses and virus authoring* software are not freeware.
*Warez* is not freeware.

-SNIP-

@ Why did you post this *TWICE* (with 2 seperate subjects)?
@ I am sure most of us agree with a big part of your post but in the
end, it is just troll fodder. Why bother? It is just a newsgroup.
@ Ithink you missed "registerware".

Be very careful of what you preach, Mr. Corliss. You may end up
recommending something that does not fit your own definition and you
will be labeled a hypocrite. Caveat Emptor.

--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
El Gee // www.mistergeek.com <><
Know Christ, Know Peace - No Christ, No Peace
Remove .yourhat to reply
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
 
A

Al Klein

*Betaware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)

But the beta version of a freeware program is still freeware. Even
freeware benefits from being banged on.
*Postcardware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)

Software that asks for a postcard in the installation, but otherwise
leaves you alone, is pretty much freeware. Software that asks for one
every time you load it is nagware, at best.
IMO Bill Gates and Microsoft want a future where you WILL be online
whenever you use your computer. Period.

In Gates' opinion too, if you read between the lines.
 
C

Caesar Romano

A long time ago in alt.comp.freeware, I warned that those who seek to
make a profit by disguising non-freeware as freeware would come into
this group and promote that kind of garbage. They would also attempt to
corrupt the definition of freeware by twisting it to mean something that
would serve their purposes.
*Adware* is not freeware.

If it's free, it's freeware.

Note: Free = you don't pay money for it. Otherwise, nothing is free.
*Betaware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Careware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here, but there
isn't a lot of it)

If it's free, it's freeware.
*CDware* is not freeware (unless it is freeware that's available on the
internet.)

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Commercial software* is not freeware.
True

*Crippleware* is not freeware.

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Demoware* is not freeware.

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Donationware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)

If it's free, it's freeware.
*"Free to download"* may or may not be freeware, but usually isn't.
True

*Fonts* are not freeware, they are data files.

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Free services* are not freeware, although the software required to use
such services (browsers for instance) may or may not be freeware.
True

*Liteware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Nagware* is not freeware.

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Orphanware* is only freeware if the author specifically says that it is
when he/she drops support of the software.
True

*Pirated software* is not freeware.
True

*Postcardware* is not freeware (although sometimes discussed here)

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Porno sites* are not freeware.
True

*PROmotionware is not freeware.
True

*Shareware* is not freeware.
True

*Spyware* is not freeware.
True

*Text and other data files* are not freeware.

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Time-limited software* is not freeware.

If it's free, it's freeware.
*Trialware* is not freeware.
True

*Trojans* are not freeware.

I think I'll stop here. You're getting silly and this is a very lame
troll anyway.
 
C

Craig

»Q« said:
Why do you not consider these two to be freeware? They meet your
criteria above.

Rhetorical question, right Q?

On the off-chance it ain't, John's definition for freeware assumes, /a
priori/, legal and unencumbered. If you'd like to know how I know,
google for John and pirateware.

-Craig
 
R

ranrad

A long time ago in alt.comp.freeware, I warned that those who seek to
make a profit by disguising non-freeware as freeware would come into
this group and promote that kind of garbage. They would also attempt to
corrupt the definition of freeware by twisting it to mean something that
would serve their purposes.
There are also those *who don't care* that they're promoting
non-freeware in this group and who add to the problem. This can be due
to sheer laziness, a desire to be disruptive, or the person being a
commercial software shill.

Since off topic posting has been happening with increasing frequency
in ACF, I will again repost this edited version of one of my previous
messages.

Think of it as a wakeup call to the group and as an expression of *my
opinion*.

_You are free to disagree, but I will not answer replies to this post_.

***************************************

One good thing about your post John is that it gives me plenty of trolls to
put in my kill file.
I wonder how they will feel when your predictions come true (and it ain't
that far off)
 
?

=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=BBQ=AB?=

»Q« wrote:

Rhetorical question, right Q?

Pretty much, yeah.
On the off-chance it ain't, John's definition for freeware
assumes, /a priori/, legal and unencumbered. If you'd like to
know how I know, google for John and pirateware.

Yeah, but Ceasar seemed to have thrown John's out in favor of much more
simplistic criteria.
 
J

JS

John Corliss said:
A long time ago in alt.comp.freeware, I warned that those who seek to


Based on the number of responses received, the troll o meter has been
recalibrated.


Troll O Meter


0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
___________________________________________________
| | | | | | | | | | |
 
J

John Corliss

John said:
A long time ago in alt.comp.freeware, I warned that those who seek to
make a profit by disguising non-freeware as freeware would come into
this group and promote that kind of garbage. They would also attempt to
corrupt the definition of freeware by twisting it to mean something that
would serve their purposes. (clipped)

I forgot to mention that I will continue to repost this message every
time I feel that the number and nature of off-topic posts in this group
reach a certain unacceptable (IMO) level.
 
C

Condon

John Corliss said:
I forgot to mention that I will continue to repost this message every time
I feel that the number and nature of off-topic posts in this group reach a
certain unacceptable (IMO) level.
Yeah, THAT oughta straighten the place right out.
 
B

Bill Day

Yeah, THAT oughta straighten the place right out.
It may not 'straighten the place out', but if no one says anything
about careless (or intentional) abuse of categories and group
definitions, it will only get worse. I frequent a folk music forum,
and we have a similar problem there as people decide that 'folk' is
anything THEY wish to ask about or comment on. Sorry, but Bob Dylan
ain't 'folk', and 'payware' ain't freeware. If a word doesn't have a
relatively clear meaning, it begins to mean nothing as people
interpret it any way they wish.

Commenting now & then, as John Corliss does, will not, in an
un-moderated group, stop those who simply don't care or who just won't
think....but it may remind those who DO care to be careful.

Although I don't post much, I guess this puts me on the list for
flames and sarcasm. *shrug*


"I don't know what you mean by 'glory,'" Alice said.
Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. "Of course you don't - till
I tell you. I meant 'there's a nice knock-down argument for you!'"
"But 'glory' doesn't mean 'a nice knock-down argument,'" Alice
objected. "When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said in rather a
scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean - neither more
nor less." "The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make
words mean so many different things." "The question is," said
Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master - that's all."
 
P

Peter Seiler

John Corliss - 31.01.2006 12:49 :
I forgot to mention that I will continue to repost this message every
time I feel that the number and nature of off-topic posts in this group
reach a certain unacceptable (IMO) level.

every time in such a full length of ~ 190(!) lines?
 
C

Craig

Bill said:
Commenting now & then, as John Corliss does, will not, in an
un-moderated group, stop those who simply don't care or who just won't
think....but it may remind those who DO care to be careful.
Agreed.

-Craig
 
C

Condon

Craig said:
Frankly I am pleasantly amazed at the lack of the usual vicious trolling
that occurs when such a pronouncement is made, especially when made by Mr.
Corliss. So I shall certainly refrain from doing saying anything further.

I do find it odd to make announcements such as these but if it does any good
then I'm all for it, and it seems that some here think it does just that.
 
R

Rodney Reason

Frankly I am pleasantly amazed at the lack of the usual vicious trolling
that occurs when such a pronouncement is made, especially when made by Mr.
Corliss. So I shall certainly refrain from doing saying anything further.

I think the trolling started with Corliss's pronouncement(s). He may
not be vicious, but he sure was annoying.

RR
 
W

Whirled Peas

Entropy is hard at work in this newsgroup as well, when I see people
attempting to water down the meaning of the term "freeware" due to
laziness, a resentment of "being told what to do" or so as to profit
monetarily.
Perhaps it's inevitable that this newsgroup should someday be consumed
by spammers, trolls and off-topic discussions of non-freeware.
I would like to see that day put off as long as possible.

I am sure that somewhere there exists a study of the life-cycle of a
newsgroup. I've lurked here for a few years, posting on the odd occassion.
I've seen the number of trolls, spam and general crap posts increase.

I've seen the same sort of activity happen in several groups. Most
newsgroups seem to be comprised of a care-group of regular posters who
really care about the group and its charter (if it has one) or purpose.
These contribute perhaps 75% of the posts in the group. Then there are the
lurkers who contribute another 15% or so. The rest of the posts are from
newbies who just found the group or spammers or whathaveyou.

Over time, core members move on, lose interest, get into flame wars with
some other core member and leave. The rate of depreciation seems to be
greater than the rate of gaining new core members. When the number of
"charter members" or "old farts" depending on which term you prefer falls
past a certain point, the group falls prey to the inevitable that John
mentions.

Some groups I used to read in the mid to late 1980's are no longer active.
When I stop by to look, they are filled with nothing but spam, the regulars
having given up a long time ago.

Personally, I applaud posts like John's prediction. While a newsgroup is
not a proprietary thing unless it is moderated, it is only as 'alive' as
the sense of ownership that the core group has. A group with a large,
active base of posters should be able to continue to thrive even under the
increase of trolls and spam.

Now that I re-read this, I am not quite sure I actually SAID anything :)
However, that won't prevent me from posting it.
 

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