Ping Anna re: Casper

B

Bill in Co.

Anna, I just looked at the PDF file on Casper before getting ready to
install it (or at least seriously considering doing so), but if I read this
right, it cannot backup a partition, but only the entire drive - is that
correct? The Casper PDF file shows only two options for the program -
copy entire disk, or copy a specific drive. And if that's the case, I can't
use it, since I have only one internal HD with four partitions on it (C, D,
E, F), and I *only* want to backup the C: partition (to a USB external hard
drive enclosure - for just the C: partition)
 
P

PD43

Anna, I just looked at the PDF file on Casper before getting ready to
install it (or at least seriously considering doing so), but if I read this
right, it cannot backup a partition, but only the entire drive - is that
correct?     The Casper PDF file shows only two options for the program -
copy entire disk, or copy a specific drive.  And if that's the case, I can't
use it, since I have only one internal HD with four partitions on it (C, D,
E, F), and I *only* want to backup the C: partition (to a USB external hard
drive enclosure - for just the C: partition)

I thought it was clearly established LONG ago that Casper was a
CLONING tool.

Cloning is for entire disks, not for partitions.
 
T

Timothy Daniels

PD43 said:
I thought it was clearly established LONG ago that Casper was a
CLONING tool.

Cloning is for entire disks, not for partitions.

That may be true for Acronis' True Image, but not for other
cloners such as Casper or Ghost. The latter 2 cloning utilities
can clone individual partitions - and any installed OS on them
can be booted if the original could be.

*TimDaiels*
 
P

Pegasus \(MVP\)

Timothy Daniels said:
That may be true for Acronis' True Image, but not for other
cloners such as Casper or Ghost. The latter 2 cloning utilities
can clone individual partitions - and any installed OS on them
can be booted if the original could be.

*TimDaiels*

Acronis TrueImage/Disk Director can clone partitions.
 
T

Timothy Daniels

Bill in Co. said:
Anna, I just looked at the PDF file on Casper before getting ready to install
it (or at least seriously considering doing so), but if I read this right, it
cannot backup a partition, but only the entire drive - is that correct?
The Casper PDF file shows only two options for the
program - copy entire disk, or copy a specific drive. And if that's
the case, I can't use it, since I have only one internal HD with four
partitions on it (C, D, E, F), and I *only* want to backup the C:
partition (to a USB external hard drive enclosure - for just the C:
partition)

See page 23 of the User Guide.

"hard disk" in the User Guide means the "hard drive".
"drive" means what MyComputer calls a Local Disk, i.e
a partition such as "C:", "D:", "F:", "G:", etc.

The GUI gives the user the option of copying the "entire hard disk"
or "a specific drive".

IOW, Casper can clone all the partitions plus the MBR or just a
single partition.

*TimDaniels*
 
P

PD43

Timothy Daniels said:
That may be true for Acronis' True Image, but not for other
cloners such as Casper or Ghost. The latter 2 cloning utilities
can clone individual partitions - and any installed OS on them
can be booted if the original could be.

Not according to what I read on the Casper site.
 
P

PD43

Pegasus \(MVP\) said:
Acronis TrueImage/Disk Director can clone partitions.

Yeah... all of them at the same time, i.e., the whole disk to another
whole disk.
 
P

PD43

Timothy Daniels said:
See page 23 of the User Guide.

"hard disk" in the User Guide means the "hard drive".
"drive" means what MyComputer calls a Local Disk, i.e
a partition such as "C:", "D:", "F:", "G:", etc.

ENTIRE drive. All partitions.

Note also that the ENTIRE destination drive is used.
 
P

PD43

IOW, Casper can clone all the partitions plus the MBR or just a
single partition.

I just read the entire user manual, and it DOES look as if it can do
partitions, so I was wrong (I think).

Page 5 (and others): selecting either the entire disk or a "drive".

HOWEVER, the ONLY examples it shows in that manual are full-disk
clones.

I wonder why?
 
P

PD43

Pegasus \(MVP\) said:
Nope, one partition to another partition.

I've been using TI since version 7 and am now using 11.

I've never seen that option.

Tell me where to look.
 
P

PD43

PD43 said:
I've been using TI since version 7 and am now using 11.

I've never seen that option.

Tell me where to look.

You can't. I think you are confusing BACKUP (image) with CLONE.

It can BACKUP (image) a partition, but it can't clone a partition.
 
P

Pegasus \(MVP\)

PD43 said:
You can't. I think you are confusing BACKUP (image) with CLONE.

It can BACKUP (image) a partition, but it can't clone a partition.

My newsreader refused to attach the relevant screen image -
have a look at the EMail I am sending you.
 
P

PD43

Pegasus \(MVP\) said:
My newsreader refused to attach the relevant screen image -
have a look at the EMail I am sending you.

Taken from Disk Director.

I was talking about True Image... we were talking about two different
products.
 
P

Pegasus \(MVP\)

PD43 said:
Taken from Disk Director.

I was talking about True Image... we were talking about two different
products.

I quote from an earlier note in this thread:
========================
Acronis TrueImage/Disk Director can clone partitions.

Yeah... all of them at the same time, i.e., the whole disk to another
whole disk.
========================
With True Image you can do it by creating an image file
of a partition, then restoring it.
 
P

PD43

Pegasus \(MVP\) said:
With True Image you can do it by creating an image file
of a partition, then restoring it.

I know that... and said that ;-)

Now all we need to do is get back on topic and find out if Casper can
clone partition to partition.
 
A

Anna

Bill in Co. said:
Anna, I just looked at the PDF file on Casper before getting ready to
install it (or at least seriously considering doing so), but if I read
this right, it cannot backup a partition, but only the entire drive - is
that correct? The Casper PDF file shows only two options for the
program - copy entire disk, or copy a specific drive. And if that's the
case, I can't use it, since I have only one internal HD with four
partitions on it (C, D, E, F), and I *only* want to backup the C:
partition (to a USB external hard drive enclosure - for just the C:
partition)


Bill:
As Tim Daniels has pointed out, Casper 4 does have the capability of cloning
on a partition-to-partition basis.

Here are the basic steps for partition-to-partition cloning...

Using XP's Disk Management utility, set up desired partitions on the
"destination hard drive", i.e., the recipient of the source drive's cloned
contents.

1. Access the Casper program and click on the "Copy Drive" icon.

2. Following the "Welcome to the Casper..." screen, select the option "Copy
a specific drive". Click Next.

3. On the "Select Drive" window that opens, select (highlight) the source
hard drive containing the specific partition you want to copy. Click Next.

4. On the "Select Copy Destination" window that opens, select the option
"Copy to an existing drive" and click Next.

5. On the "Select Destination Drive" window that opens, select (highlight)
the destination hard drive containing the partition that will be the
recipient of the clone. Ensure that you've selected the correct destination
drive and partition. Click Next.

6. On the next screen, click Next to confirm that you want to overwrite the
data on the destination drive.

7. On the next screen, select the option "Perform the copy now" and click
Next and then Next again to start the cloning process.

As an example let's say a user desires to clone the contents of his/her
present single-partitioned HDD to a newly-purchased larger HDD but desires
to create multiple partitions on the new HDD...

1. Let's say he/she wants to clone the contents of their old 40 GB HDD to a
newly-purchased 200 GB HDD (roughly 170 GB in binary terms).

2. The user plans to set up his/her 200 GB HDD with three partitions - one
of 50 GB, one of 55 GB, and the third of 65 GB.

3. He/she could install the 200 GB HDD as a secondary drive in their current
system, boot to the 40 GB HDD, and using the XP Disk Management utility
create the three partitions. Then, using the above steps, clone the contents
of the 40 GB HDD to the first partition.

4. Shut down the system, disconnect the old 40 GB HDD, and if not already so
connected, connect the 200 GB HDD as Primary Master if it's a PATA HDD, or
to the first SATA connector on the motherboard if the disk is a SATA drive.
Boot with only the new 200 GB HDD connected to assure that the drive boots &
functions without problems.

5. Reconnect the 40 GB HDD if the user plans to continue to use that disk as
a secondary drive in their system.

In your particular case, using the above-described procedure, you would
simply clone the contents of your C: partition (the first partition on your
source HDD) to your USBEHD. So that the single-partitioned external HDD
would then contain the contents of your C: partition. The (potential)
problem here is that if *later* you decide to clone one or more of the
*other* partitions on your source HDD to the same USBEHD you could not do so
as things now stand because your USBEHD has a single partition. (I'm
presuming you would want to retain the C: partition clone already contained
on the USBEHD).

Of course, you could subsequently get around this by using a third-party
disk management utility, e.g., Partition Magic, to manipulate the USBEHD by
shrinking the existing single partition and creating whatever additional
partitions you desire. Or, if at the outset - prior to the initial cloning
of the C: partition to the USBEHD - you believe it's reasonable to assume
that at some later date you will be cloning one or more of the other three
partitions (besides the C: partition) to the USBEHD, then initially
multi-partition your external HDD along the lines you think reasonable.

To my knowledge the Acronis True Image program (at least with respect to
versions prior to its present version 11) did not have the capability of
*cloning* individual partitions. Insofar as its disk-cloning capability was
concerned it was an "all or nothing" proposition. However, it was true that
one could use its "disk imaging" capability to achieve cloning of contents
on a partition-to-partition basis. AFAIK, I do not think the present version
of ATI has direct partition-to-partition cloning capability but I'm not
positive about that. And I have had no experience with the Acronis Disk
Director program so perhaps Acronis now has that capability as Pegasus
points out in his response to your query.

In any event, in my view (as I have repeatedly stated) the Casper 4 program
is a superior disk-cloning program both from a disk-to-disk and
partition-to-partition point of view. Its simplicity of use, straightforward
operation, overall effectiveness together with its substantial disk-cloning
speed when used as a routine backup system make it the best disk-cloning
program we have ever used. We highly recommend this program for users
seeking a comprehensive backup system that is simple to use, effective in
its outcome, and reasonably quick in undertaking routine backup operations.

BTW, you may be interested in a recent (4/6) post of mine to the
microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support newsgroup (Re: How to clone boot
drive to larger disc with less partitions ?") that is relative to this
subject.
Anna
 
T

Timothy Daniels

Pegasus (MVP) said:
Yeah... all of them at the same time, i.e., the whole disk to another
whole disk.
========================
With True Image you can do it by creating an image file
of a partition, then restoring it.


C'mon, Peg, that's a kludge and an extra step. If you want
to re-define "to clone", OK. But not Acronis nor anyone else
calls that "cloning". That's "imaging and then restoring".

*TimDaniels*
 
T

Timothy Daniels

Anna said:
...in my view (as I have repeatedly stated) the Casper 4 program is a
superior disk-cloning program both from a disk-to-disk and
partition-to-partition point of view.


Anna - Have you read this about Vista's partition boundaries:
http://www.multibooters.co.uk/partitions.html ? According to
the author, Vista creates partitions on 2048-sector (that's about
1MByte) boundaries. That means a partition will begin and end
on such a boundary. The old Windows OSes (XP and previous)
created them on 64-sector (cylinder) boundaries. According to
the author, problems arise when the old and new partitions are mixed.
Symptoms are "disappearing" partitions.

I've emailed Future Systems Solutions about this, but so far,
they've side-stepped the question. Have you been able to see
how Casper 4.0 positions its partition boundaries when working
with a HD that contains Vista?

*TimDaniels*
 
T

Timothy Daniels

Anna -

As you have pointed out, the latest Casper (version 4.0)
does NOT require that the clone not see its "parent" OS when
started for its very first run - which means that the step of
disconnecting the "parent's" HD before starting up the clone for
its first run no longer has to be done. That is a great convenience.
I've asked Future Systems Solutions whether that new feature
includes clones on the same hard drive as the "parent", and the
reply was "yes" - a great help in creating dual-booting of the same
Windows OS on the same HD. For cloning, Casper 4.0 seems
to hold the top position.

*TimDaniels*
 

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