Networking XP computers w Vista Computers

[Richard Urban]

Are both of your computers (all of your computers) assigned the same
workgroup name? Do you have a secure account on each of the computers (one
with a password)? Do you have a shared folder on each computer so the other
computer can detect, and see, that folder? Any files you want to be shared
must go there. What are your permissions on this shared folder? Are they set
for everyone to do everything?

It's not really so hard.

--


Regards,

Richard Urban
Microsoft MVP Windows Shell/User
(For email, remove the obvious from my address)

Quote from George Ankner:
If you knew as much as you think you know,
You would realize that you don't know what you thought you knew!

where else exactly could the problem lie?? All you have to do is read the
posts to conclude the obvious, it's not just me or anyone else ... whether
the problem lies in XP or Vista or both, Microsoft should have realized
the
problem and solved it before release, it's a simple thing really!!! They
can
fix both programs with their incessant updates whenever they want, they
could
have solved it without all this hullaballoo!!

Let's be logical ... I could plug in a new XP computer to another and
voila!, there it is, we're set to go ... now I do that and I can't even
get
it to work after hours of frustration, endless online chats and rooms,
phone
support from MS and HP, both of whom acknowledge that "there is a known
issue
..." ... DUH!! FIX IT!!!

I have searched high and low, talked to people who [should] know, and
have
yet to hear someone explain how it is that MicroSoft, in all of its
glory,
could launch such a major marketing campaign to get us to all sign on
to
the
new OS ... they never thought to think that maybe, just maybe ...
someone
somewhere just might want to have an XP computer exist in peace and
harmony
with a Vista computer?????

I'm guessing -- purely a guess -- that this is not a Vista problem. My
Vista
computer connects to a network that has an XP computer on it.
You're right to be pissed that it doesn't work. So far all your venom is
aimed at MS. But what if the problem lies elsewhere?

 

[Greg]

You're a hundred percent correct, Vista networking is pure crap and
Microsoft care not a fig for their customers because they are the world's
biggest monopoly and BS artists. They know we have little choice but to buy
their faulty products no matter how well they work or how unfinished they
are when they release them. The response of pro-MS posters that there is
nothing difficult about networking with Vista is laughable. No it's not
rocket science - rocket science is simple by comparison and works more
often! There are many many posts by people who have tried absolutely
everything suggested and still been unable to make Vista do the simplest
networking tasks. Some of these people even work in the IT industry and
still can't make Vista network XP and Vista machines and share printers, USB
devices and other peripherals properly. These are facts that Microsoft
cannot deny by blaming the victim and labelling its customers as morons who
simply do stupid things.

I have just switched to a brand new Vista computer as the primary computer
on
my network. I even got Ultimate to have the best. Now I can't see the
other
computer on the network because it has been determined to be a "has been",
what with only having XP on it.

I have searched high and low, talked to people who [should] know, and have
yet to hear someone explain how it is that MicroSoft, in all of its glory,
could launch such a major marketing campaign to get us to all sign on to
the
new OS ... they never thought to think that maybe, just maybe ... someone
somewhere just might want to have an XP computer exist in peace and
harmony
with a Vista computer?????

Now you're saying that I should call tech support ... fabulous idea, in
fact
I did that very thing ... started with HP cuz it's their computer but
"That's
a Microsoft problem, you gotta call them" ... okie dokie, call Microsoft
but
damned if "HP is supposed to troubleshoot it cuz it came on their
computer"
... what fun, so call back HP, get a bit pissy, he tries to help, tells me
to
d/l a patch from Microsoft.com, which I do ... the excitement is building,
we're gonna resolve the problem with a patch, yeah!!! ... re-boot
everything
and .... and ... nothing, nada, nyet. Then he tells me I can pay $69.99
to
talk to their networking dudes who may or may not be able to help me. So,
here we are now ........

I mean, come on now ... let's THINK PEOPLE!!!!!! There needs to be a fix
to
this NOW to let these computers do what they are supposed to do!!! This
is a
step backwards!! This should have been anticipated and worked out PRIOR
to
letting the world buy it and screw up their small network connectivity. I
doubt if I am the only one that doesn't have the cash to just run out and
update all my computers and/or operating systems every time MicroSoft
decided
to lauch a new version of Windows!

Undoubtedly, someone will offer apologies, and ineffectual explanations
...
bottom line is that this isn't an uncommon thing and I can't think of any
[rational] argument to convince me that it should not have been taken care
of
before the launch. It doesn't matter if it's a cable problem, OS problem,
security problem, whatever ... We don't care why it isn't working, just
get
it fixed so it does work!!!!!! You had time to spend moving all the
buttons
around so we get to play hide and seek finding them, the least you could
do
is retain the previous networking functionality!!

Anyone out there that can shed some light on this ... and more
importantly,
how to overcome this problem ... all in language that us
non-brilliant-tecchies can understand?????

 

[Charlie Tame]

I have just switched to a brand new Vista computer as the primary computer on
my network. I even got Ultimate to have the best. Now I can't see the other
computer on the network because it has been determined to be a "has been",
what with only having XP on it.

I have searched high and low, talked to people who [should] know, and have
yet to hear someone explain how it is that MicroSoft, in all of its glory,
could launch such a major marketing campaign to get us to all sign on to the
new OS ... they never thought to think that maybe, just maybe ... someone
somewhere just might want to have an XP computer exist in peace and harmony
with a Vista computer?????

Now you're saying that I should call tech support ... fabulous idea, in fact
I did that very thing ... started with HP cuz it's their computer but "That's
a Microsoft problem, you gotta call them" ... okie dokie, call Microsoft but
damned if "HP is supposed to troubleshoot it cuz it came on their computer"
... what fun, so call back HP, get a bit pissy, he tries to help, tells me to
d/l a patch from Microsoft.com, which I do ... the excitement is building,
we're gonna resolve the problem with a patch, yeah!!! ... re-boot everything
and .... and ... nothing, nada, nyet. Then he tells me I can pay $69.99 to
talk to their networking dudes who may or may not be able to help me. So,
here we are now ........

I mean, come on now ... let's THINK PEOPLE!!!!!! There needs to be a fix to
this NOW to let these computers do what they are supposed to do!!! This is a
step backwards!! This should have been anticipated and worked out PRIOR to
letting the world buy it and screw up their small network connectivity. I
doubt if I am the only one that doesn't have the cash to just run out and
update all my computers and/or operating systems every time MicroSoft decided
to lauch a new version of Windows!

Undoubtedly, someone will offer apologies, and ineffectual explanations ...
bottom line is that this isn't an uncommon thing and I can't think of any
[rational] argument to convince me that it should not have been taken care of
before the launch. It doesn't matter if it's a cable problem, OS problem,
security problem, whatever ... We don't care why it isn't working, just get
it fixed so it does work!!!!!! You had time to spend moving all the buttons
around so we get to play hide and seek finding them, the least you could do
is retain the previous networking functionality!!

Anyone out there that can shed some light on this ... and more importantly,
how to overcome this problem ... all in language that us
non-brilliant-tecchies can understand?????

All I did was connect everything to the router and it worked, great for
me you say, but there's a caveat or two.

All the machines were running as administrator and all were set to have
the same ID and Password. To get 64 bit Vista to work at all with
wireless I had to buy new cards because drivers were not working,
despite the fact that the original cards said Vista compatible. I've
basically abandoned wireless anyway due to it's unreliability over more
than a few tens of feet in this environment.

All the machines were in the same workgroup, the XP default I think is
MSHOME and that is what I used.

Also I had shared at least one folder on all machines before I started.

I can only suggest if this doesn't work then the problem is either a
simple setting (Which is usually easy to miss) or else something with
the firmware on the machine.

 

[cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user)]

On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 11:20:01 -0700, Dave B

(summarised as "Vista won't network with XP")

Changes may be at two levels:

1) Raw networking

Vista's built for tomorrow's IPv6, which is in turn required to
enlarge the address space and perhaps add or facilitate some
safety'secirity refinements not possible in current IPv4.

In this respect, it's like getting Win95 and wondering why we need all
thus PnP rubbish, what's wrong with just setting jumpers for each
device? Well, try scaling that manual port, IRQ and address
management to the way we buy and use devices today.

Some folks have had joy by disabling IPv6 in Vista, which Vista will
use in preference to IPv4.

There have also been issues with the way some routers are designed,
and MS has a diagnostics page where you can test your router to see
how well it will work with Vista PCs. See details there.

2) Discoverability

The way in which PCs "discover" each other on the LAN can be a point
of failure. Suspect this if explicit addressing such typing
\\PC1\Fred into the address bar works, while the browsable view
doesn't "show" what you are looking for.

3) Authentication

There are two points of contention you may see here, depending on how
you expect things to work. Both are caused by needed changes, IMO.

Firstly, if you are used to waltzing into other PCs via hidden network
shares that let anything drop malware anywhere, including runpoints
such as StartUp, then the party is hopefly (at last!) OVER.

Secondly, the weak LM hashes that were supported in XP (but advised
against as bad practice) are not there, unless you force Vista to use
them. If your XP systems rely on these, Vista "let you in".


Look out for posts from Chuck, Bill Castner and other networking gurus
(or search for thier sites), but don't expect serious attention ftrom
them if you're just going to emotionally complain that things are not
the way you'd want them to be, with no technical details.

This has nothing to do with them "loving Microsoft", and everything to
do with the frustration of looking for some technical content to quote
and expand on. I gave up and summarized your post instead, and came
quite close to not answering it at all.

--------------- ----- ---- --- -- - - -

To one who has never seen a hammer,
nothing looks like a nail

 

[Guest]

I also have Network Magic and love it, but even it couldn't 'install" one of
my printers (connected to an XP desktop) until I downloaded the Vista drivers
for that printer to the laptop computer with Vista.

#1 thing to check in Vista is if you have "File Sharing" turned on?

#2 Are all your computers and printers, etc. showing up on the computer with
Vista? Open the "Network" from the Start menu, then click on the folder for
each of the computers to check whether Vista is seeing all the devices on
your network. If not you may need to "add a device".

#3 Even without using Network Magic, if you start to print something on a
networked printer, Windows Vista will show if that the device needs updated
drivers. If the drivers are availble, then Vista can "install" that device
at that screen. But if the drivers are nowhere to be found (as with one of
my printers), then you may get the error message that there is "insufficient
memory" [it ain't so...] which is really not the correct reason things were
not working.

So in my limited experience, my 2 desktops with XP and my new laptop with
Vista and all 5 of my printers are now playing together nicely. So don't
give up on Vista so quickly. Even my "old" software programs are working
fine if I right-click on the desktop shortcut and check the box to "run as
administrator". And Vista computers can communicate with XP computers - that
I know.

Since I fixed my problem (today), now I am going to have to apologize for
the e-mail I sent to Network Magic. It wasn't NM's fault - it was just
giving me the "Windows" message". I needed the Vista drivers for the one
printer that would not install.

Janice

Their website description looks promising ... thanks!! Is there anyone else
with experience, good or bad, with the network magic software (or a
comparable third party software)??

I find it absolutely amazing that someone else could come up with a way to
connect XP to Vista before Microsoft could do it??? Heya Bill ... R&D means
Research and Development, the implication being that you use that time and
all the geniuses around the table to actually research the obvious, staring
you in the your face problems!!

Then again, this could just be a way to get us to all run out and buy Vista,
what with all of Microsoft's financial woes of late ... can't you just
imagine them sitting around the table talking about it and some marketing
genius says "well, ah, Boss ... if don't let them talk to each other, then
everyone will just have to go out and buy more Vista ... we'll tell them
we're improving their experience and making them more secure and they'll just
do it out of frustration in trying to get us to stop the doublespeak and fix
it like we shouldda before we released it. I mean, c'mon boss, it's not our
fault if they can't get the right software on all their computers, eh??

On Sat, 21 Jul 2007 11:20:01 -0700, Dave B <Dave

I have just switched to a brand new Vista computer as the primary computer on
my network. I even got Ultimate to have the best. Now I can't see the other
computer on the network because it has been determined to be a "has been",
what with only having XP on it.

I have searched high and low, talked to people who [should] know, and have
yet to hear someone explain how it is that MicroSoft, in all of its glory,
could launch such a major marketing campaign to get us to all sign on to the
new OS ... they never thought to think that maybe, just maybe ... someone
somewhere just might want to have an XP computer exist in peace and harmony
with a Vista computer?????

Now you're saying that I should call tech support ... fabulous idea, in fact
I did that very thing ... started with HP cuz it's their computer but "That's
a Microsoft problem, you gotta call them" ... okie dokie, call Microsoft but
damned if "HP is supposed to troubleshoot it cuz it came on their computer"
... what fun, so call back HP, get a bit pissy, he tries to help, tells me to
d/l a patch from Microsoft.com, which I do ... the excitement is building,
we're gonna resolve the problem with a patch, yeah!!! ... re-boot everything
and .... and ... nothing, nada, nyet. Then he tells me I can pay $69.99 to
talk to their networking dudes who may or may not be able to help me. So,
here we are now ........

I mean, come on now ... let's THINK PEOPLE!!!!!! There needs to be a fix to
this NOW to let these computers do what they are supposed to do!!! This is a
step backwards!! This should have been anticipated and worked out PRIOR to
letting the world buy it and screw up their small network connectivity. I
doubt if I am the only one that doesn't have the cash to just run out and
update all my computers and/or operating systems every time MicroSoft decided
to lauch a new version of Windows!

Undoubtedly, someone will offer apologies, and ineffectual explanations ...
bottom line is that this isn't an uncommon thing and I can't think of any
[rational] argument to convince me that it should not have been taken care of
before the launch. It doesn't matter if it's a cable problem, OS problem,
security problem, whatever ... We don't care why it isn't working, just get
it fixed so it does work!!!!!! You had time to spend moving all the buttons
around so we get to play hide and seek finding them, the least you could do
is retain the previous networking functionality!!

Anyone out there that can shed some light on this ... and more importantly,
how to overcome this problem ... all in language that us
non-brilliant-tecchies can understand?????

I use network magic to network xp and vista.. no problems.. during
install, it takes a couple of reboots that setup forgets to tell you
about.. works great though..
Chuck (in SC)