How Move OS XP from Old to New HD?

[Wayne S. Mery]

On Sat, 03 Jan 2004 09:15:07 GMT

You don't, once you copy it you make the new drive "C". Trying to move
the OS from one drive letter to another is an exercise in futility--you
_can_ do it but by the time you've found all the various places where
you have to change the drive letter you'll find that you might as
well just have reinstalled from scratch.

Not really (though if you have a simple PC setup - sure, reinstall OS
and MS-Office).

I have upwards of 30 programs installed and had no interest in
starting from scratch. used a program called COA2 - "Change of
Address". Changed the registry. Then I still had to clean up some
things on disk - but it all worked in the end. Though it certainly
won't work in all cases, it sure worked for me.

________________________________________________________________________
Wayne S. Mery | Systems Programmer, Lehigh University 610-758-3983
(e-mail address removed) | http://www.lehigh.edu/~wsm0
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[I'm Dan]

Nope. And fdisk /mbr doesnt have
any effect on the identifier anyway.

In fact, it does. The seemingly similar "fixmbr" from the XP recovery
console has no effect, but "fdisk /mbr" from DOS/Win9x does. The Disk ID
sits in the MBR at offset 443-446 (decimal). XP's "fixmbr" replaces the
first 442 bytes of the MBR, while Win9x's "fdisk /mbr" replaces 446 bytes
(270 bytes of executable code, 78 bytes in error messages, and 98 bytes
filled with zeroes). The NT/2000/XP "fixmbr" command replaces the MBR boot
code but stops short of overwriting the four bytes of the Disk ID that sits
between the boot code and the partition table. The DOS/Win9x "fdisk /mbr"
command will replace the boot code and zero the Disk ID (albeit,
unintentionally). Thus, the "fdisk /mbr" command can be used to advantage to
force XP to regenerate a new Disk ID and reassign drive letters.

 

[tomcas]

Did you follow steps 1 thru 6 on pg 23 and 24?
http://maxtor.com/en/documentation/installation_guides/ata_installation_guide.pdf

- Nehmo -
- tomcas -

It will ask you.

- Nehmo -
It didn't. I already described what happened in another post in this
thread, but everybody doesn't read every post, and I really want to get
this question answered, so here it is again:

I shut down > unplugged the ribbon (IDE interface cable) from the old
drive > restarted > after the usual box that appeared that lists some
things about the computer (what is this box called, incidentally?) a
message appeared: No Operating System Found. (I'm not sure if that was
the exact wording.)

- Nehmo -
- tomcas -

I'd use the maxblast. Read and print the readme file if you need to. Avoid
using thier formater and overlay if possible.

- Nehmo -
There's no readme file, but after you choose a model number, it prepares
detailed.htm , titled MaxBlast 3 Custom Installation Manual [1]. This
doesn't cover my problem. There is also the help file. And in there is
this:

"When copying from partition to partition, if the destination partition
is a primary partition, Drive-To-Drive copy will make the partition
bootable. This allows you to migrate your operating system to a new
drive even if the drive was not partitioned using MaxBlast 3."
I didn't need to use the formatter or overlay. Actually, I didn't see
those option. Anyway I erlier used the "quick format" form XP's Computer
Management when I installed the new drive.

[1] I noticed that one of the image files detailed.htm uses is a 468 KB
bitmap, newdrive.bmp . This easily could have been a jpg or a gif, using
much less space.

 

[jetstar88]

I'm much less knowledgeable techwise than most of the posters to this
thread, but I have moved/copied my XP Pro installation form one disk
to another several times (using Drive Image and/or Partition Magic)
both successfully and unsuccessfully. Just sharing my experience in
case it might help anyone.

I have noticed that the copy is more frequently successful when
copying from a higher numbered disk to a lower one. What I mean is
that I have 3 Hard Drives in my system and when I attempt to copy XP
from Disk 0 to Disk 1 or 2, it usually will not boot afterward. Yet
going the other direction (copying XP from Disk 3 to Disk 2 or 1)
usually does work.

I can't explain it, but that's what I've noticed.

Larry

 

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

- tomcas -

Did you follow steps 1 thru 6 on pg 23 and 24?

http://maxtor.com/en/documentation/installation_guides/ata_installation_guide.pdf

- Nehmo -
I copied it below. [My comments in brackets.]

Page 23, Formatting the Hard Drive

Installing an Additional Storage Drive or Replacement Boot Drive
(Windows 98, Me, 2000, XP)
This section provides instructions for installing the hard drive in an
existing system as additional storage or as a replacement for a
currently
functioning boot drive. Depending on your preference, you can use the
Windows or DOS version of MaxBlast.

1. Choose one of the following options:
..
From the Windows desktop, insert the MaxBlast 3 CD
in the CD-ROM drive, and choose to install the Max-
Blast software for Windows.
..
Boot your system from the MaxBlast CD and choose
Setup Your Hard Disk.
You may need to change your
BIOS settings to boot from the CD. See page 19 for details.

[I would choose working form Windows rather than working form DOS
because I'm familiar with that environment.]

2. When the MaxBlast 3 program starts, follow the on-screen
prompts to step through the installation process. Choose
whether to install the drive as additional storage or as a new
boot drive.

3. Depending on your selection, do one of the following:

a.
Additional storage install: After the drive has been set up
as additional storage, double-click the My Computer
icon.
A new drive letter and icon should appear.

3 This new drive is now ready to use, and you do not need to
complete any further steps.

[I'm at this point already. But naturally, I want the new (and faster)
drive to house the OS.]

b.
Boot drive install: When MaxBlast is finished copying
data to your new boot drive, remove any CDs or
floppies, and perform a normal shutdown.
Continue to
the next step.

[I believe the copy process I already did places me here.]

4. Unplug the ATA cable from both the new and old drives.
Plug the black connector (master) on the ATA cable into
the new boot drive. Plug the grey connector (slave) into the
old drive.

5. Unless you are using the cable select jumper setting on both
drives, you will need to change the jumper settings on both
drives.
The new boot drive should be configured as master, and the
old drive should be configured as slave.

[So now I need to either change both HDs to Cable Select or New=Masere &
Old=Slave by using the jumper configurations. And I need to switch the
connections on the ATA cable to
Black {end} connector to New HD
Grey {middle} connector to Old HD
I have the connectors the opposite way now.]

6. Power the system on. At the Windows desktop, doubleclick
the My Computer icon.
The newly installed boot drive
will appear as drive letter C. The old hard drive can now be used for
additional storage.

Side Note: Switching the hard drives may
require changing the jumper settings
before reattaching the cables. To look
up the jumper settings for Maxtor
hard drives, see Figure 6 on page 9.
For other manufacturers' hard drives,
use the Hard Disk Information feature
of the MaxBlast software or visit the
manufacturer's web site.

[The old HD is a 15 GB Seagate. It's been spinning flawlessly and almost
continuously for years now. The slave jumper setting appears to be no
jumper, just as it is for Maxtor.]

Okay, I'm going to try it.

 

[Alexander Grigoriev]

Use Partition Magic 8. Select "Copy Partition" and expand it to the whole
disk. It will be done in one run. Then you just boot from the new disk and
everything works.

 

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

- tomcas -http://maxtor.com/en/documentation/installation_guides/ata_installation_guide.pdf

- Nehmo -

Okay, I'm going to try it.

- Nehmo -
Didn't work.
I assumed the copy from old HD to new HD I had previously done with
MaxBlast was the same as the copy it would do if I ran the program
again, so I just proceeded with the remaining steps.
I moved the jumpers to make the new drive master
I removed the jumper to make the old drive slave

I switched positions of the drives on the ATA cable to
Black {end} connector to New HD
Grey {middle} connector to Old HD

I first started without the old drive connected.
Windows XP began to start but stopped short and produced the Windows
Product Activation box saying there was a problem with WPA, error code
0x80090006 .

Just to make sure the disconnection of the old drive had nothing to do
with it, I tried again this time with both drives connected as described
above. The same error developed.

So I returned things back the way they were: jumpers old=master,
new=slave ; ATA cable, black end to old , grey middle to new. Now things
work as before: the OS is still on the old HD.

My understanding of Win XP WPA is from http://aumha.org/win5/a/wpa.htm .
When I installed XP (up form ME) on this machine, I had already added a
NIC and some RAM. Now I'm trying to add a HD. So the only change in
hardware categories is the HD. That shouldn't be enough to trigger WPA
error.

I'll have to call Maxtor and maybe Microsoft tomorrow. It frustrates me
that these companies with global scope should have such narrow tech
support hours. The weekends and after-normal-business-hours should not
be dead time.

It's sure taking a long time just to get a new drive in.

 

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

- Nehmo -
- I'm Dan -

"Operating System Not Found" often means the partition was not set as
"active". Do you know if the new partition has been marked active in its
partition table?

- Nehmo -
In XP's Computer Management > Disk Management > Top right window >
Status Column > the E drive, the new drive, is listed as Healthy
(Active) and the C drive, the old drive, is listed as Healthy (System).
In MaxBlast 3 there's no way, that I can see, of looking at a partition
to see whether it's active or not, but you can run the program to *set
up* the new drive up as a boot drive. I'm going to try running MaxBlast
again - but this time I'm going to run it using the set up operation
rather than the copy operation that I used last time.

- I'm Dan -

Check if MaxBlast has that as a menu option. If it
doesn't, download the freeware MbrWork from
http://www.bootitng.com/utilities.html. Boot from a floppy disk, run
mbrwork.exe and use its "Set a partition active" option.

BTW, MaxBlast doesn't remove C: from the old drive, it merely duplicates it
on the new drive. The old drive will still think it's C: if you boot from
it, so your last comment is normal.

- Nehmo -
I tried running MbrWork, but just after its DOS window appeared, an
alert labeled
MS-DOS Sub system said,
An application has attempted to access the hard drive, which can't be
supported. This may cause the application to function incorrectly. To
close the application press Close. There was also an Ignore button, but
it had the same effect as the Close button, closing MbrWork.

If running the MaxBlast setup operation doesn't work, I going to get a
copy of.
Ghost http://www.ghost-norton.com/
Drive Image http://www.powerquest.com/driveimage/
Or XXCLONE http://www.xxclone.com/

I haven't decided which one yet.

 

[Rod Speed]

If running the MaxBlast setup operation
doesn't work, I going to get a copy of.
Ghost http://www.ghost-norton.com/
Drive Image http://www.powerquest.com/driveimage/
Or XXCLONE http://www.xxclone.com/

I haven't decided which one yet.

xxclone is free so it makes a lot of sense to try that.

The choice between ghost and drive image is a bit tricky currently
and they are both owned by symantec now, and it isnt clear what
symantec plans to do, unlikely that both will continue forever.

ghost is amazingly cheap as part of systemworks
pro 2003 when bought from ebay etc. Has quite
decent support for external hard drives, but is rather
primitive in that everything is done at the dos level.

Drive Image is rather more powerful in that many of the
operations are done at the Win level, which means that
whatever is working currently with external drives at the
win level is available for image files. But you still cant
image the boot partition at the win level, so that can
be a big problem with external drives, because it doesnt
prove any dos driver for those. And its relatively expensive
basically because ghost is so cheap currently.

 

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

- Nehmo -
- Rod Speed -

xxclone is free so it makes a lot of sense to try that.

- Nehmo -
Using MaxBlast again, following the instructions exactly, again changing
the jumpers and connections, the effort failed again.

I'm waiting for XXCLONE to send me a return email with the directions to
download. Meanwhile, I'm getting Ghost v 8.0 , eMule link:
ed2k://|file|Symantec.Ghost.v8.0.Corporate-SOS.ShareReactor.rar|73337216
|C723067A2BFF7BC3B67357DAD04FDF85|/

I called Maxtor tech support, 800 262 9867, and one guy said I should
put one drive on one ATA cable and the other on another. He explained
the drives were less likely to interfere with each other that way. He
also suggested getting Ghost or Drive Image. Then we got disconnected.
The next guy said one cable was fine, and I should boot with my Win XP
CD, go into the BIOS, and repair. In alternative, he suggested Ghost or
Drive Image.

Maxtor probably does the lion's share of its business with OEMs. I
gather people like me are a nuisance more than anything else. I only
paid hundred for the drive. (Maxtor couldn't have made too much off me.)
And the setup would have been easy if all I wanted was additional
storage. I think that's probably what most people use additional HDs
for.

- Rod Speed -

 

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

- Nehmo -

Using MaxBlast again, following the instructions exactly, again changing
the jumpers and connections, the effort failed again.

I'm waiting for XXCLONE to send me a return email with the directions to
download. Meanwhile, I'm getting Ghost v 8.0 , eMule link:
ed2k://|file|Symantec.Ghost.v8.0.Corporate-SOS.ShareReactor.rar|73337216
|C723067A2BFF7BC3B67357DAD04FDF85|/

- Nehmo -
That was the wrong version of Ghost. It says it won't run on XP Home.
I'm downloading a different file. XXCLONE hasn't sent me an email back
yet.

 

[Rod Speed]

- Nehmo -

- Rod Speed -

- Nehmo -
Using MaxBlast again, following the instructions exactly, again
changing the jumpers and connections, the effort failed again.

No surprises there, cant see that the use of cable
select has any relevance at all to that problem.

I'm waiting for XXCLONE to send me a return email with the directions
to download. Meanwhile, I'm getting Ghost v 8.0 , eMule link:
ed2k://|file|Symantec.Ghost.v8.0.Corporate-SOS.ShareReactor.rar
|73337216|C723067A2BFF7BC3B67357DAD04FDF85|/

I called Maxtor tech support, 800 262 9867, and one guy said I
should put one drive on one ATA cable and the other on another.

Thats completely mad. That config does certainly ensure that
the clone is done as quickly as possible but it has absolutely
nothing to do with the reason why the clone isnt bootable.

He explained the drives were less likely to interfere with each other that way.

Yes, but that only affects the speed of
the cloning. Not the quality of the result.

He also suggested getting Ghost or Drive Image.

Which presumably means they have seen quite a few
complaints that MaxBlast doesnt work properly with XP.

Then we got disconnected.

I'd have hung up on him myself, tried again
to see if I would get a less clueless monkey.

The next guy said one cable was fine, and I should
boot with my Win XP CD, go into the BIOS, and repair.

That will work, but can be a problem with activation with XP Home.

In alternative, he suggested Ghost or Drive Image.

Looks like they realise that MaxBlast has a problem with XP.

Maxtor probably does the lion's share of its business with OEMs.
I gather people like me are a nuisance more than anything else.

They clearly have gone to the trouble of producing
MaxBlast and the FAQs for people like you tho.

They have never been exactly what you might call rock solid with MaxBlast.

I only paid hundred for the drive. (Maxtor
couldn't have made too much off me.)

Sure, they arent likely to make any profit from you at all.
But its all about swings and roundabouts in that business.

And the setup would have been easy
if all I wanted was additional storage.

Yeah, cloning a boot drive isnt effortless
with XP or any of the NT/2K/XP family.

I think that's probably what most people use additional HDs for.

Yeah, but its not really a very good way to do things
because the new drive will normally be noticeably faster
than the original drive and should be used for the boot drive.

The hard drive manufacturers should have got their act
into gear on cloning the boot drive by now. Its clearly
possible because ghost and drive image can do it.

And the drive manufacturer's ute should be completely
unambiguous about unplugging the original drive for
the first boot after the clone has been done with XP
too. No rocket science required and one hell of an
inditement that it hasnt been completely fixed by now.

 

[Rod Speed]

- Nehmo -

- Nehmo -
That was the wrong version of Ghost. It says it won't run on XP Home.
I'm downloading a different file.

SystemWorks Pro 2003 works fine. Must be Pro,
SystemWorks 2003 doesnt have ghost included.

XXCLONE hasn't sent me an email back

Maybe the holiday season effect. Ken may still be
sleeping off the drunken newyears eve celebrations |-)

 

[I'm Dan]

In XP's Computer Management > Disk Management > Top
right window > Status Column > the E drive, the new drive,
is listed as Healthy (Active) and the C drive, the old drive,
is listed as Healthy (System). In MaxBlast 3 there's no way,
that I can see, of looking at a partition to see whether it's
active or not, but you can run the program to *set up* the
new drive up as a boot drive. I'm going to try running
MaxBlast again - but this time I'm going to run it using the
set up operation rather than the copy operation that I used
last time.

Okay, well I see an eventual problem (new drive having a drive letter
already), but that's not the source of your "op sys not found" error.

Checking in Comp Mgmt won't tell you anything because when you're booting
the old drive, the old drive is the active one. What we want to know is
what is happening when you boot the new drive. I was hoping MaxBlast might
tell you that, but I guess not. MbrWork will.

I tried running MbrWork, but just after its DOS window
appeared, an alert labeled MS-DOS Sub system said,
An application has attempted to access the hard drive,
which can't be supported. This may cause the application
to function incorrectly. To close the application press
Close. There was also an Ignore button, but it had the
same effect as the Close button, closing MbrWork.

Obviously, you're trying to run MbrWork while booted from the old drive.
You cannot run MbrWork from within XP -- that's one of XP's ... er,
"improvements" -- it blocks programs from accessing the hardware. As I
said, you need to boot from a floppy, such as a Win98 boot disk, and run
MbrWork from there. You also should remove the new disk so you don't
confuse yourself as to which hard disk MbrWork is working on. You obviously
have the new disk still installed.

 

[J.Clarke]

- Nehmo -

- Rod Speed -

- Nehmo -
Using MaxBlast again, following the instructions exactly, again
changing the jumpers and connections, the effort failed again.

I'm waiting for XXCLONE to send me a return email with the directions
to download. Meanwhile, I'm getting Ghost v 8.0 , eMule link:
ed2k://|file|Symantec.Ghost.v8.0.Corporate-SOS.ShareReactor.rar|73337
216|C723067A2BFF7BC3B67357DAD04FDF85|/

I called Maxtor tech support, 800 262 9867, and one guy said I should
put one drive on one ATA cable and the other on another. He explained
the drives were less likely to interfere with each other that way. He
also suggested getting Ghost or Drive Image. Then we got disconnected.
The next guy said one cable was fine, and I should boot with my Win XP
CD, go into the BIOS, and repair. In alternative, he suggested Ghost
or Drive Image.

Maxtor probably does the lion's share of its business with OEMs. I
gather people like me are a nuisance more than anything else. I only
paid hundred for the drive. (Maxtor couldn't have made too much off
me.) And the setup would have been easy if all I wanted was additional
storage. I think that's probably what most people use additional HDs
for.

- Rod Speed -

FWIW, I had occasion to upgrade my XP box today--downloaded the latest
Drive Image, installed it, hooked up the new drive, told it to copy, was
surprised that it copied the whole boot drive right over and that after
I pulled the old drive the new one came right up. Haven't tried
_imaging_ the boot drive, but copying worked fine.

 

[Robert Marshall]

Ghost is rock solid and darn nearly bullet-proof. Go with that if you
have the choice.

Robert

 

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

- Nehmo -
I used XXCLONE, and it apparently worked. But the system keeps shutting
down by itself. It runns for about five minutes. I can't start system
restore. It says application encountered a problem and needs to close -
this even before it opens. Word starts funny too. I'm sending now before
it crashses again.

 

[Rod Speed]

- Nehmo -
I used XXCLONE, and it apparently worked. But the system
keeps shutting down by itself. It runns for about five minutes.
I can't start system restore. It says application encountered
a problem and needs to close - this even before it opens.
Word starts funny too. I'm sending now before it crashses again.

What does the event log say about what the problem is ?

 

[Jim Walker]

Drive Image is rather more powerful in that many of the
operations are done at the Win level, which means that
whatever is working currently with external drives at the
win level is available for image files. But you still cant
image the boot partition at the win level, so that can
be a big problem with external drives, because it doesnt
prove any dos driver for those. And its relatively expensive
basically because ghost is so cheap currently.

Rod
I have a question related to your statement. I am going to clone to an
external USB HD. I have Drive Image 2002 (same as Drive Image 6) and I
can't do a copy to the USB drive. The info on Drive Image 7 says that USB
is supported. It is unclear if all of that can be done in Windows or DOS.
The new Ghost also states that USB is supported. I will buy one or the
other. Any thoughts?
[/QUOTE]

 

[tomcas]

Yeah, cloning a boot drive isnt effortless
with XP or any of the NT/2K/XP family.

I recently cloned an IBM drive under 2K using the IBM utility Disk Manager
2000. It was relatively effortless. Not quick, but effortless.