Anti Spyware Apps

[PaulZ]

Obivously running multiple anti virus programs simulatenously is not
recommended , but what about anti spyware apps ?
If you are running Windows Defender , and a security suite such as Norton ,
Macafee or Zone Alarm that contains real time anti spyware monitoring , does
that create a conflict ?
If so , which component, Defender or the 3rd party app should be disabled ?

TIA

 

[nass]

Obivously running multiple anti virus programs simulatenously is not
recommended , but what about anti spyware apps ?
If you are running Windows Defender , and a security suite such as Norton ,
Macafee or Zone Alarm that contains real time anti spyware monitoring , does
that create a conflict ?
If so , which component, Defender or the 3rd party app should be disabled ?

TIA

Always leave the "Internet Security Suite" which AV and Firewall running in
Realt Time Protection to protect your system from attacks.
Don't run both as they will shout and bite <G> about which should and
shouldn't have access or run in the background or on the web!.
If you running schedules scan then select different timing for both to run
at different time of the day/night.
Did you know about who's the Alpha male, it is among software too!.
HTH.
nass

 

[PaulZ]

Always leave the "Internet Security Suite" which AV and Firewall running
in
Realt Time Protection to protect your system from attacks.
Don't run both as they will shout and bite <G> about which should and
shouldn't have access or run in the background or on the web!.
If you running schedules scan then select different timing for both to run
at different time of the day/night.
Did you know about who's the Alpha male, it is among software too!.
HTH.
nass

Thanks...makes perfect sense, of course. Just wanted to check !

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Unlike antivirus software, running more than one antispyware app is usually
OK. Some people do it because they believe (probably true) that no one
antispyware app catches everything. Running Windows Defender in addition to
other suites should not be a problem.

 

[Curt Christianson]

Ok Nass,

Who *is* the Alpha male?

--
HTH,

Curt

http://dundats.mvps.org/
http://www.aumha.org/

 

[philo]

Obivously running multiple anti virus programs simulatenously is not
recommended , but what about anti spyware apps ?
If you are running Windows Defender , and a security suite such as Norton ,
Macafee or Zone Alarm that contains real time anti spyware monitoring , does
that create a conflict ?
If so , which component, Defender or the 3rd party app should be disabled ?

TIA

I would definitely not recommend either Norton or McAffee...
they do not actually work that well at protection...
but they do hog a lot of resources.

I have setup a lot of machines that have remained totally trouble free for
years.

As an anti-virus program I'd recommend either the *free* version of AVG
or the free virus checker, Avast.

Firewall? I use Zone Alarm and find that it's "good enough"
It's better than the Windows built-in firewall...but others may have some
better suggestions..

About the only other thing I do is scan my system occasionally using
SpyBot Search and destroy...

Plus an occasional scan with Lavasoft Adaware.


Other than an occasional defrag...that's about all the maintenance I need.


Of course the best way to keep your machine trouble free is good old common
sense.

That seems to be fairly rare now days...
and I don't know offhand where you can download it <G>

 

[PaulZ]

I would definitely not recommend either Norton or McAffee...
they do not actually work that well at protection...
but they do hog a lot of resources.

I have setup a lot of machines that have remained totally trouble free for
years.

As an anti-virus program I'd recommend either the *free* version of AVG
or the free virus checker, Avast.

Firewall? I use Zone Alarm and find that it's "good enough"
It's better than the Windows built-in firewall...but others may have some
better suggestions..

About the only other thing I do is scan my system occasionally using
SpyBot Search and destroy...

Plus an occasional scan with Lavasoft Adaware.


Other than an occasional defrag...that's about all the maintenance I need.


Of course the best way to keep your machine trouble free is good old
common
sense.

That seems to be fairly rare now days...
and I don't know offhand where you can download it <G>

I agree...I don't use Norton or Mcafee either...in fact I was using Zone
Alarm Security Suite, but I was interested in trying the free Comodo apps,
including their BoClean Anti Spyware.
So far, so good ??

 

[antioch]

I agree...I don't use Norton or Mcafee either...in fact I was using Zone
Alarm Security Suite, but I was interested in trying the free Comodo
apps, including their BoClean Anti Spyware.
So far, so good ??

Paul
Check in the windows.update group - there have recently been issues between
Comodo and updates - I don't know the details but remember seeing two or
three.

Antioch

 

[PaulZ]

Paul
Check in the windows.update group - there have recently been issues
between Comodo and updates - I don't know the details but remember seeing
two or three.

Antioch
I beleive that might have been on Vista ? So far , updates are all working

 

[antioch]

Antioch
I beleive that might have been on Vista ? So far , updates are all working

Paul
You may well be correct - I cannot confirm that - threads re Vista are not
applicable to me so get ignored. Thought it worth a mention
But with headers like 'cant update' or 'error code' I need to open them just
in case.
If only all posters would put the KB number in the header when applicable.

Antioch

 

[VanguardLH]

Obivously running multiple anti virus programs simulatenously is not
recommended , but what about anti spyware apps ?
If you are running Windows Defender , and a security suite such as
Norton , Macafee or Zone Alarm that contains real time anti spyware
monitoring , does that create a conflict ?
If so , which component, Defender or the 3rd party app should be
disabled ?

Every additional process you have running has an impact on the
responsiveness of your host. Decide which, if any, anti-malware
program to run in addition to your anti-virus software and just run
that one. You can install multiple security products but they don't
need to all be running and instead can just be used as on-demand
scanners.

I have Windows Defender but its detection rate is poor. I do not use
it to detect pests that manage to get onto my host. I use it to
monitor changes in the configuration of my OS and applications. Even
"good" applications will attempt to make those changes but I want to
be notified and have say over whether they get retained or not.
Windows Defender does not hinder any of those changes. It polls for
the changes and will tell you about them - but it will tell you LATE
(i.e., *after* the change has been made). Other IPS programs, like
PrevX, will pend the change. They do not permit the change unless you
authorize it. They don't undo the changes but instead prevent them
from ever happening. Windows Defender notices the changes *after*
they have been made and why it cannot tell you what process made the
change (because that process isn't around anymore) and will offer to
UNDO those changes. Undoing a change is not the same as barring it.
So the change got made, Defender noticed it afterward, and offers to
undo the change. WinPatrol works the same way. PrevX used to have a
"research" (beta) version that was free but not anymore. Of course,
the more security software you have running, the more you get prompted
and the more likely a wrong choice (by you or the software).

The anti-spyware applications are not a market that cooperates with
each other and ensures that they have no overlapping functions;
otherwise, you would have to buy dozens of anti-malware programs where
each just covered a tiny spectrum of pest control. Since they attempt
to monitor, prevent, or repair the same areas, they obviously have the
potential of interferring with each other. Also, just how many
prompts regarding the same change or pest do you really want to
answer? A dozen security applications noticing the same change and
prompting you a dozen times about the same change can become quite
tedious - and will very likely result in you picking the fastest way
to click out of all those prompts.

Fact is, I run just an anti-virus program and a firewall (that
includes HIPS). The coverage for ALL anti-malware applications is so
sloppy that not one of them is very effective at detecting all the
pests. They often get in my way and slow my host. The software is
still handy for on-demand scanning but the number one infection vector
into a host is the user, and the user can obviate all that security
depending on their choices.

 

[Twayne]

I would definitely not recommend either Norton or McAffee...
they do not actually work that well at protection...
but they do hog a lot of resources.

That's completely bogus, IMO. Please cite something, anything, to
verify your contention that they "do not actually work that well at
protection". They also don't "hog resoureces" on a properly installed,
clean running machine with no Event log errors.

I have setup a lot of machines that have remained totally trouble
free for years.

As an anti-virus program I'd recommend either the *free* version of
AVG
or the free virus checker, Avast.

Those are decent in my experience, and since they're free, that's even
better.

Firewall? I use Zone Alarm and find that it's "good enough"
It's better than the Windows built-in firewall...but others may have
some better suggestions..

ZA is good, especiall if it sits behind a NAT router.

 

[Twayne]

Very well written; KUDOS.

in message news:[email protected]...


Every additional process you have running has an impact on the
responsiveness of your host. Decide which, if any, anti-malware
program to run in addition to your anti-virus software and just run
that one. You can install multiple security products but they don't
need to all be running and instead can just be used as on-demand
scanners.

I have Windows Defender but its detection rate is poor. I do not use
it to detect pests that manage to get onto my host. I use it to
monitor changes in the configuration of my OS and applications. Even
"good" applications will attempt to make those changes but I want to
be notified and have say over whether they get retained or not.
Windows Defender does not hinder any of those changes. It polls for
the changes and will tell you about them - but it will tell you LATE
(i.e., *after* the change has been made). Other IPS programs, like
PrevX, will pend the change. They do not permit the change unless you
authorize it. They don't undo the changes but instead prevent them
from ever happening. Windows Defender notices the changes *after*
they have been made and why it cannot tell you what process made the
change (because that process isn't around anymore) and will offer to
UNDO those changes. Undoing a change is not the same as barring it.
So the change got made, Defender noticed it afterward, and offers to
undo the change. WinPatrol works the same way. PrevX used to have a
"research" (beta) version that was free but not anymore. Of course,
the more security software you have running, the more you get prompted
and the more likely a wrong choice (by you or the software).

The anti-spyware applications are not a market that cooperates with
each other and ensures that they have no overlapping functions;
otherwise, you would have to buy dozens of anti-malware programs where
each just covered a tiny spectrum of pest control. Since they attempt
to monitor, prevent, or repair the same areas, they obviously have the
potential of interferring with each other. Also, just how many
prompts regarding the same change or pest do you really want to
answer? A dozen security applications noticing the same change and
prompting you a dozen times about the same change can become quite
tedious - and will very likely result in you picking the fastest way
to click out of all those prompts.

Fact is, I run just an anti-virus program and a firewall (that
includes HIPS). The coverage for ALL anti-malware applications is so
sloppy that not one of them is very effective at detecting all the
pests. They often get in my way and slow my host. The software is
still handy for on-demand scanning but the number one infection vector
into a host is the user, and the user can obviate all that security
depending on their choices.

 

[Gary Brandenburg]

That's completely bogus, IMO. Please cite something, anything, to verify your
contention that they "do not actually work that well at protection". They also
don't "hog resoureces" on a properly installed, clean running machine with no Event
log errors.

Twayne-You must be new to this NG because anybody that's been here for any time,
knows that the general concensus is that the statement is *not* bogus. (Of course you
are entitled to your opinion)
See below:

~Gary


*In my opinion you are better off without NIS, or any of the Norton home security
products. There are better, less resource intensive alternatives that are much less
problematic.
--
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]


*If the Repair Install doesn't work, you'll need to flatten the system and start over
with a Clean Install. Do not install anything Norton. Norton and McAfee are the worst
choices for security software you could make. Recommended antiviruses are NOD32,
Kaspersky, and Avast if you need a free one. Use the XP SP2 Windows Firewall unless
you want a more complex firewall, then look at third-party ones.

Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User


*To clarify what some have said here, in general you can have two AV programs
installed at the same time. Just make sure only one is set for active (on access)
scanning. The other can be used for on demand scanning.That said getting rid of
McAfee is a good thing. McAfee and Norton both are problematic. So first uninstall
McAfee, then install AVG. Another good free AV program is Avast.
--
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]

*That's a new one even for Symantec, adding memory forces the user reinstall the
software. NIS is a non-stop pain to deal with, You'll never have a stable/fast
computer while NIS is installed.If NIS works for you count your lucky stars, not
everybody is so fortunate. One thing you'll never realize is how fast the PC can
runif it's 100% Norton Home product free.I second R. McCarty's suggestion about
getting rid of NIS. There are other, less resource intensive, and less problematic
programs that do the same job, and some are even free.
--
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]


*Symantec is the barnacle of commercial software and even these tools may be
insufficient. After running every tool you can think of to try, browse the registry
for residual entries "Symantec" and "Norton."
Getting rid of Norton is similar to having a tattoo removed: You can't quite
get it all and it hurts. For years.


*Also you might want to look at some of the specific applications that you have open
and running, as there are some which are well known as"computer killers" because of
the drag they put on overall performance
and/or the high demands they place on system resources and functions."King of the
hill" in this category would be anything from Norton/Symantec. These are enough to
drag most computers to their knees by themselves and when you add them to a large
number of other
open applications it is a recipe for slow performance if not outright disaster.
There are alternaitve products that do not place anywhere near the same degree of
load on the computer.

Good luck

Ron Martell Duncan B.C. Canada
--
Microsoft MVP (1997 - 2008)
On-Line Help Computer Service


*The usual suspect - Norton Internet Security. I'm going to make the guess that if
you un-installed NIS and replaced it with a (much) better product (there are many,
but I use F-Secure), your issue would go away.


*Norton Internet Security willl not help system perfomance. You can get a similar
service using freeware without such a resource hog.


*You've provided no details of the problem, so it's very hard to help, but just as a
general comment, in my view, and that of many of us here, Norton Anti-Virus is the
single worst anti-virus on the market. If it were my PC, I would install it ASAP.
--
Ken Blake - Microsoft MVP Windows: Shell/User
Please reply to the newsgroup


*I feel your pain! I don't know what your Norton alternative product is, but it too
could be a resource hog, just like Norton.
I have had NO - that's ZERO - instances of any documented intrusions into machines
which are running AVG Ant-Virus along with the ZoneAlarm firewall. BOTH of these
products are FREE downloads and I have no unrealistic start-up slowness - neither
program is a resource hog, like Norton.


*You could not pay me to put Norton Antivirus on a computer I actually used. I don't
know about the current edition, but the early-2005 edition was a resource pig and
many people reported it was a real bear to uninstall.


*I use AVG free from http://free.grisoft.com and Avast from http://www.avast.com and
ClamWin from http://www.clamwin.com Each has it's ins & outs, but all 3 work and are
free.And none of them mess up your computer like Norton.


*Anything Norton is probably the worst of all possible choices. I recommend either
the freeware Avast! (my personal choice) or AVG.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User


*Many options to Norton exist.Most of them use less resources and do the same job as
effectively - if not
more so.
--
Shenan Stanley
MS-MVP


*You may want to try some of Symantec uninstallers, and then afterwards,use a better
anti-virus program.


*I use Norton which seems to work very well in protecting my system except it seems
to slow down my processing and web browsing.
Thanks
--
jj


*Many* people have been using AVG anti-virus for many years (its antispyware is much
newer). It's highly regarded by many people whose opinion I respect. I've tried it,
but have very little experience with
it recently. My personal preference is Avast!, which is also freeware.Either is far
better than Norton.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User


*norton is not always the best choice for some systems.and if you try to uninstall it
it will likely won't uninstall without taking some of your o.s. with it. something to
keep in mind is that you may not have the opportunity to try new antivirals as long
as norton is installed.


*The retail version of Norton can play havoc with your pc.


*In fact, I don't say that Norton is bad at detecting and removing viruses, etc. What
I say is that their consumer offerings consistently trash Windows systems.
--
Gary S. Terhune
MS-MVP Shell/User


*When you do decide to remove Norton, be advised in advance that Norton is the
barnacle of the software world. You'll probably need the sooper-sekret Norton removal
tool available from the Symantec web site.
After which, it is prudent to search the registry for any residual mentions
of "Norton" "Symantec" and associated detritus.


*I am running XP Pro & have always used Norton Anti-Virus. Recently it started
"acting up", wanting to do a full system scan, which I did. But it was constantly
trying to do this & there was always an error message on my task bat saying I needed
to do this. When I did do it, it took over 4 hours as it did my main drive, a spare
internal drive & my external.I removed it with the intent of re-installing. But after
it was gone, I couldn't believe how much faster everything was running without
Norton.


*If that solves the issue, uninstall all Norton products since they are bloated,
invasive, and not very good anyway. Recommended antivirus programs are NOD32,
Kaspersky, or Avast if you want a free one


*Getting rid of Norton Internet Security is a good move. It's probably the worst
possible choice.
--
Ken Blake - Microsoft MVP Windows: Shell/User
Please reply to the newsgroup


*Norton products are well known for injecting "Quirks" and performance issues on
computers. There are other choices for Security software that do not exhibit these
problems.


*Norton isn't always 100% problematic. What it is globally- is a "Ball-&-Chain" on
performance. Most Norton users become blinded to how much of a drain on a PC the
products inflict.
I've worked on literally hundreds of PCs with Norton problems.Enough empirical data
to convince me the programs themselves are not a good choice. Just yesterday I had to
rework a PC with the
new Norton 360. Luckily, the customer was within the period of time he could return
the product for a refund. We got his machine setup with a "Free" solution that works
fine and saved him $150.


*One of the troubles out of many with Norton is that it does not show it's face right
away. For me Norton is a Virus by itself. Remove Norton . It is the best thing that
you can do for your system. It creates problems like you have at present. I have been
removing Norton for my clients and many times just by removing it their issues get
rectified.

*To remove Norton you will need their removal tool which is available at the Symantec
site.
Norton is extremely hard to remove from any system. It is what I call bloatware.


*You also have to scour the registry of stuff even the sooper-dooper removal tool
won't get.
Even then, you can't be sure.
Purging a system of Norton is worse than removing a tattoo.


*Normally you do not need to install NIS more than once. It handles the entire
Windows installation, not just individual user accounts. As to why you are having
difficulties, I can say. Norton products are pretty
dreadful and so having problems with them is nothing new. Either remove NIS and
replace with a better antivirus (NOD32, Kaspersky, Avast) and use the XP SP2 Windows
Firewall or contact Symantec tech support.

Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User


*The first suggestion I would make is to remove any Norton product(s). To
properlyremovevisit;http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/sharedtech.nsf/docid/2005092709200113?Open&sc=symsug_us(follow
the instructions for removal)

Once you have removed the Norton get yourself a good AV program.
--
Sir_George


*As other posters suggested get rid of Norton first . then check for other possible
causes if applicable after
--
Peter


*Download Avast from www.avast.com, but don't install.
Download this
utility:http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/tsgeninfo.nsf/docid/2005033108162039
but don't run it yet.Disconnect from the Internet.Uninstall Norton.Run the utility
from Symantec.Install Avast.
Connect to the Internet and update Avast.
--
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM


*Are you using an efficient AV program (not Norton)? AV Suites tend to put way too
many items running all the time.


*Norton is the termite colony of the software world


*Good advice. Norton is famous for screwing up computers.


*Uninstall Norton as per their uninstall tool available from the Symantec site. Then
install either AVG or Avast which will do just as a good job if not better


*Do not have two AV programs actively running at the same time. IMHO, get rid of
Norton, and either use AVG, or Avast. Norton is /not/ OE friendly.
--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express
Imperial Beach, CA


*Unfortunately, anything Norton is probably the worst possible choice.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
Please Reply to the Newsgroup


*McAfee and Norton slow down Windows noticeably, and the more recent the Windows
version the more they slow it down. If someone insists on McAfee or Norton then they
can't be my customer; that's how strongly I feel about it.
--
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM


*In addition to what the other's have suggested, I would highly reccomend that you
get rid of Norton. It's a resource hog and causes nothing but problems. I had Norton
on my system and many people suggested removing it for the same reasons. I finally
did and I haven't had a problem since.


*A number of experts agree that the retail AV version of McAfee, Norton andTrend
Micro has become cumbersome and bloated for the average user.The retail version of
Norton can play havoc with your pc. Uninstall it using Norton's own uninstall tool
and get a refund


*Norton is a disaster and causes more problems that it prevents. If you use your head
while using
your computer neither Norton or McAfee is needed and should NOT be installed..


*I have been helping with OE for more than 10 years. McAfee has consistently caused
more problems with OE than any other program. Both McAfee and Norton are known to
sometimes destroy the whole message store.


*Norton and McAfee programs are notorious for screwing up OE. I wouldn't have any of
them on a machine of mine.
--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express


*As long as you stay away from Norton and Mcafee
you'll be fine.


*I use Norton AV as part of System Works, and have for about 6 years now.
That said:
It does - no question in my mind - slow down you machine, especially boot. It has a
few useful features other than the AV, and a number of "bloatware" features, too. I
am currently studying up on Avast - if I
feel I can trust it to the extent I can Norton, I may well go to that, soon.
As for McAfee, I have to agree - putting up with McAfee's way of doing things is
almost not worth being safe from virus - almost. I would advise avoiding McAfee too.
I used it for several years, and got
disgusted with it's ever-bloating approach in successive versions. Wife still uses
it - and hates it - she is going to get something else, too.

Tony


*I used to be a Norton evangelist in the early 2000s until I found out just how
terribly the system performed with alternatives. I have not looked back since.
Symantec used to be good when they just made an
Antivirus product. It's garbage now.


*I use AVG Free, and it seems fine (better than Norton or McAfee, IMHO) as long as
you remember to update it manually.


*I'm surprised their computers ran fast enough to catch a virus using Norton. Maybe
a cold.


*I would NOT recommend AVG Anti-Virus to anyone, nor would I recommend any Norton or
McAfee application.


*I use AVG 7.5 Anti-Virus (Free) but there are a number of others to choose from.
Stay away from Norton and McAfee.


*McAfee and Norton have been known to cause problems with Outlook Express since OE
came out.
--
Frank Saunders MS-MVP IE,OE/WM


*It is known that Norton products aren't the best ones to use. I had the same issue
as you with NIS2007. My advice is to get rid of NIS2008 and either buy a better
solution -


*A number of experts agree that the retail AV version of McAfee, Norton and Trend
Micro has become cumbersome and bloated for the average user.The retail version of
Norton can play havoc with your pc. Uninstall it using Norton's own uninstall tool
and get a refund


*About McAfee and Norton, my IT guy has never recommended McAfee and stopped
recommending Norton years ago.


* I would still stay away from McAfee antway for various reasons.I use Avast myself.
--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express
Imperial Beach, CA


*If it was my computer I'd dump McAfee and download Avast for my AV software.


*But, finding out that Norton & McAfee can cause problems with OE is something that
this NG will stress more.--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express


*I found a reference to this memory problem, or something very similar, on the MS
website. They attributed it to McAfee and offered deinstallation of McAfee as a
solution


*Now be smart and uninstall anything else from McAfee or Norton.
Avast! is free for home users: www.avast.com
--
Frank Saunders MS-MVP IE,OE/WM


*If indeed Norton is about to expire you might be advised to uninstall it, and
install another security solution - Norton gives many people problems and is a
resource hog


* I use to have Norton and glad I got rid of it, it caused nothing but problems and
is a resource hog.


*I have SOLVED my System Restore item; it stems from Norton Anti-virus...all I need
is to deactivate it...then run System Restore...then it works.
Thanks,
FLKulchar


*Old news, Mcafee is just as useless as Norton.


*McAfee has been going downhill over the last year regarding its coverage of pests.
Visit www.av-comparatives.org to see some on-demand scanning results. AVG's
detection was higher than McAfee's. Then review the older comparatives to see how
they compared in previous testing. You'll see AVG has improved while McAfee has
degraded.


*I like AVG and will probably never use McAfee or Norton since they have proved over
many years to be unnecessary resource hogs..


*What happens if you COMPLETELY uninstall anything Norton/Symantec?
Installing SP-2 is a good thing, installing anything Norton is often bad.
--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]


*Shutdown issues are generally caused by a program and/or process that is refusing to
exit gracefully. The program and/or process can be from malware or can be legitimate
(such as an invasive antivirus like Norton or McAfee). If you are using a Norton or
McAfee product, uninstall it and replace with a better program such as NOD32,
Kasperksy, or Avast (free).


*I also might add this time DO NOT install that McAfee junkware. I think sometimes
McAfee and
Symantec is having a contest between the two to see how many systems they can screw
up.


*Norton installs its own drivers and the problem occurred directly after installing
this program, uninstall Norton and see if that solves the issue. If it does, your
choice is to either contact Symantec tech support to figure out what is happening and
how to work around it or to leave Norton uninstalled and replace with a better, less
invasive antivirus. Recommended programs are NOD32, Kaspersky, and Avast (free).


*While I'm not a computer expert I do know that Norton sucks and wouldn't recommend
anyone installing that on their computer. It's a resource hog and causes nothing but
problems.
Robert


*Remove all parts of McAfee. You may need to search the registry for more turds.
Hmmm, some years ago McAfee cleaned up nicely after an uninstall but today it's
behaving more and more like Norton.


*The mere mention of Norton raises a question mark in my mind as its a resource hog
and causes nothing but problems. I use to have it and it would not let me do a system
restore. Since removing it from my computer its been fine.


*Norton products are pretty dreadful as far as being invasive.
At the least, I'd uninstall the Norton antivirus and put on something less bloated;
recommended programs are NOD32, Avast (free), and Kaspersky.


*I would definitely not recommend either Norton or McAffee...they do not actually
work that well at protection...but they do hog a lot of resources.

 

[Daave]

That's completely bogus, IMO. Please cite something, anything, to
verify your contention that they "do not actually work that well at
protection". They also don't "hog resoureces" on a properly
installed, clean running machine with no Event log errors.

It all depends.

Certain Norton products used on decent systems by people who know what
they are doing won't yield as many unpleasant experiences as other
Norton products used on systems with relatively slow CPUs and only 256MB
of RAM by people who don't know what they are doing. And since market
share is up there, there will always be a fair amount of bashing.

There's a decent thread -- more balanced than what you'll see in this NG
-- you may want to read:

"Norton / Symantec Internet Security and AV - bum rap for resource
usage?"
http://www.wilderssecurity.com/archive/index.php/t-116783.html

I would imagine people with lower-end systems would notice improved
performance if they switched from Norton to something that doesn't
require as much memory, especially if they multitask. I don't have
stats, however, so I will not make any absolute claims. But the
anecdotal evidence I have come across so far has been convincing to me.
But I am always open to hard evidence.

 

[nass]

Hi Curt,
I think you will find, it is the OP here! ;-)
HTH.
nass

 

[Twayne]

That's completely bogus, IMO. Please cite something, anything, to
verify your contention that they "do not actually work that well at
protection". They also don't "hog resoureces" on a properly
installed, clean running machine with no Event log errors.

Twayne-You must be new to this NG because anybody that's been here
for any time, knows that the general concensus is that the statement
is *not* bogus. (Of course you are entitled to your opinion)
See below:

~Gary


*In my opinion you are better off without NIS, or any of the Norton
home security products. There are better, less resource intensive
alternatives that are much less problematic.
--
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]


*If the Repair Install doesn't work, you'll need to flatten the
system and start over with a Clean Install. Do not install anything
Norton. Norton and McAfee are the worst choices for security software
you could make. Recommended antiviruses are NOD32, Kaspersky, and
Avast if you need a free one. Use the XP SP2 Windows Firewall unless
you want a more complex firewall, then look at third-party ones.
Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User


*To clarify what some have said here, in general you can have two AV
programs installed at the same time. Just make sure only one is set
for active (on access) scanning. The other can be used for on demand
scanning.That said getting rid of McAfee is a good thing. McAfee and
Norton both are problematic. So first uninstall McAfee, then install
AVG. Another good free AV program is Avast. --
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]

*That's a new one even for Symantec, adding memory forces the user
reinstall the software. NIS is a non-stop pain to deal with, You'll
never have a stable/fast computer while NIS is installed.If NIS works
for you count your lucky stars, not everybody is so fortunate. One
thing you'll never realize is how fast the PC can runif it's 100%
Norton Home product free.I second R. McCarty's suggestion about
getting rid of NIS. There are other, less resource intensive, and
less problematic programs that do the same job, and some are even
free. --
Rock [MS-MVP User/Shell]


*Symantec is the barnacle of commercial software and even these tools
may be insufficient. After running every tool you can think of to
try, browse the registry for residual entries "Symantec" and "Norton."
Getting rid of Norton is similar to having a tattoo removed: You
can't quite get it all and it hurts. For years.


*Also you might want to look at some of the specific applications
that you have open and running, as there are some which are well
known as"computer killers" because of the drag they put on overall
performance and/or the high demands they place on system resources and
functions."King of the hill" in this category would be anything from
Norton/Symantec. These are enough to drag most computers to their
knees by themselves and when you add them to a large number of other
open applications it is a recipe for slow performance if not outright
disaster. There are alternaitve products that do not place anywhere
near the same degree of load on the computer.

Good luck

Ron Martell Duncan B.C. Canada
--
Microsoft MVP (1997 - 2008)
On-Line Help Computer Service


*The usual suspect - Norton Internet Security. I'm going to make the
guess that if you un-installed NIS and replaced it with a (much)
better product (there are many, but I use F-Secure), your issue
would go away.

*Norton Internet Security willl not help system perfomance. You can
get a similar service using freeware without such a resource hog.


*You've provided no details of the problem, so it's very hard to
help, but just as a general comment, in my view, and that of many of
us here, Norton Anti-Virus is the single worst anti-virus on the
market. If it were my PC, I would install it ASAP. --
Ken Blake - Microsoft MVP Windows: Shell/User
Please reply to the newsgroup


*I feel your pain! I don't know what your Norton alternative product
is, but it too could be a resource hog, just like Norton.
I have had NO - that's ZERO - instances of any documented intrusions
into machines which are running AVG Ant-Virus along with the
ZoneAlarm firewall. BOTH of these products are FREE downloads and I
have no unrealistic start-up slowness - neither program is a resource
hog, like Norton.

*You could not pay me to put Norton Antivirus on a computer I
actually used. I don't know about the current edition, but the
early-2005 edition was a resource pig and many people reported it was
a real bear to uninstall.

*I use AVG free from http://free.grisoft.com and Avast from
http://www.avast.com and ClamWin from http://www.clamwin.com Each has
it's ins & outs, but all 3 work and are free.And none of them mess up
your computer like Norton.

*Anything Norton is probably the worst of all possible choices. I
recommend either the freeware Avast! (my personal choice) or AVG.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User


*Many options to Norton exist.Most of them use less resources and do
the same job as effectively - if not
more so.
--
Shenan Stanley
MS-MVP


*You may want to try some of Symantec uninstallers, and then
afterwards,use a better anti-virus program.


*I use Norton which seems to work very well in protecting my system
except it seems to slow down my processing and web browsing.
Thanks
--
jj


*Many* people have been using AVG anti-virus for many years (its
antispyware is much newer). It's highly regarded by many people whose
opinion I respect. I've tried it, but have very little experience with
it recently. My personal preference is Avast!, which is also
freeware.Either is far better than Norton.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User


*norton is not always the best choice for some systems.and if you try
to uninstall it it will likely won't uninstall without taking some of
your o.s. with it. something to keep in mind is that you may not have
the opportunity to try new antivirals as long as norton is installed.


*The retail version of Norton can play havoc with your pc.


*In fact, I don't say that Norton is bad at detecting and removing
viruses, etc. What I say is that their consumer offerings
consistently trash Windows systems. --
Gary S. Terhune
MS-MVP Shell/User


*When you do decide to remove Norton, be advised in advance that
Norton is the barnacle of the software world. You'll probably need
the sooper-sekret Norton removal tool available from the Symantec web
site. After which, it is prudent to search the registry for any
residual
mentions of "Norton" "Symantec" and associated detritus.


*I am running XP Pro & have always used Norton Anti-Virus. Recently
it started "acting up", wanting to do a full system scan, which I
did. But it was constantly trying to do this & there was always an
error message on my task bat saying I needed to do this. When I did
do it, it took over 4 hours as it did my main drive, a spare internal
drive & my external.I removed it with the intent of re-installing.
But after it was gone, I couldn't believe how much faster everything
was running without Norton.

*If that solves the issue, uninstall all Norton products since they
are bloated, invasive, and not very good anyway. Recommended
antivirus programs are NOD32, Kaspersky, or Avast if you want a free
one

*Getting rid of Norton Internet Security is a good move. It's
probably the worst possible choice.
--
Ken Blake - Microsoft MVP Windows: Shell/User
Please reply to the newsgroup


*Norton products are well known for injecting "Quirks" and
performance issues on computers. There are other choices for Security
software that do not exhibit these problems.


*Norton isn't always 100% problematic. What it is globally- is a
"Ball-&-Chain" on performance. Most Norton users become blinded to
how much of a drain on a PC the products inflict.
I've worked on literally hundreds of PCs with Norton problems.Enough
empirical data to convince me the programs themselves are not a good
choice. Just yesterday I had to rework a PC with the
new Norton 360. Luckily, the customer was within the period of time
he could return the product for a refund. We got his machine setup
with a "Free" solution that works fine and saved him $150.


*One of the troubles out of many with Norton is that it does not show
it's face right away. For me Norton is a Virus by itself. Remove
Norton . It is the best thing that you can do for your system. It
creates problems like you have at present. I have been removing
Norton for my clients and many times just by removing it their issues
get rectified.
*To remove Norton you will need their removal tool which is available
at the Symantec site.
Norton is extremely hard to remove from any system. It is what I call
bloatware.

*You also have to scour the registry of stuff even the sooper-dooper
removal tool won't get.
Even then, you can't be sure.
Purging a system of Norton is worse than removing a tattoo.


*Normally you do not need to install NIS more than once. It handles
the entire Windows installation, not just individual user accounts.
As to why you are having difficulties, I can say. Norton products are
pretty dreadful and so having problems with them is nothing new.
Either
remove NIS and replace with a better antivirus (NOD32, Kaspersky,
Avast) and use the XP SP2 Windows Firewall or contact Symantec tech
support.
Malke
--
Elephant Boy Computers
www.elephantboycomputers.com
"Don't Panic!"
MS-MVP Windows - Shell/User


*The first suggestion I would make is to remove any Norton
product(s). To
properlyremovevisit;http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/sharedtech.nsf/docid/2005092709200113?Open&sc=symsug_us(follow
the instructions for removal)
Once you have removed the Norton get yourself a good AV program.
--
Sir_George


*As other posters suggested get rid of Norton first . then check for
other possible causes if applicable after
--
Peter


*Download Avast from www.avast.com, but don't install.
Download this
utility:http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/tsgeninfo.nsf/docid/2005033108162039
but don't run it yet.Disconnect from the Internet.Uninstall
Norton.Run the utility from Symantec.Install Avast.
Connect to the Internet and update Avast.
--
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM


*Are you using an efficient AV program (not Norton)? AV Suites tend
to put way too many items running all the time.


*Norton is the termite colony of the software world


*Good advice. Norton is famous for screwing up computers.


*Uninstall Norton as per their uninstall tool available from the
Symantec site. Then install either AVG or Avast which will do just as
a good job if not better

*Do not have two AV programs actively running at the same time. IMHO,
get rid of Norton, and either use AVG, or Avast. Norton is /not/ OE
friendly. --
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express
Imperial Beach, CA


*Unfortunately, anything Norton is probably the worst possible choice.
--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP Windows - Shell/User
Please Reply to the Newsgroup


*McAfee and Norton slow down Windows noticeably, and the more recent
the Windows version the more they slow it down. If someone insists
on McAfee or Norton then they can't be my customer; that's how
strongly I feel about it. --
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM


*In addition to what the other's have suggested, I would highly
reccomend that you get rid of Norton. It's a resource hog and causes
nothing but problems. I had Norton on my system and many people
suggested removing it for the same reasons. I finally did and I
haven't had a problem since.

*A number of experts agree that the retail AV version of McAfee,
Norton andTrend Micro has become cumbersome and bloated for the
average user.The retail version of Norton can play havoc with your
pc. Uninstall it using Norton's own uninstall tool and get a refund


*Norton is a disaster and causes more problems that it prevents. If
you use your head while using
your computer neither Norton or McAfee is needed and should NOT be
installed..

*I have been helping with OE for more than 10 years. McAfee has
consistently caused more problems with OE than any other program. Both
McAfee and Norton are known to sometimes destroy the whole
message store.

*Norton and McAfee programs are notorious for screwing up OE. I
wouldn't have any of them on a machine of mine.
--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express


*As long as you stay away from Norton and Mcafee
you'll be fine.


*I use Norton AV as part of System Works, and have for about 6 years
now. That said:
It does - no question in my mind - slow down you machine, especially
boot. It has a few useful features other than the AV, and a number
of "bloatware" features, too. I am currently studying up on Avast -
if I feel I can trust it to the extent I can Norton, I may well go to
that, soon. As for McAfee, I have to agree - putting up with McAfee's
way of
doing things is almost not worth being safe from virus - almost. I
would advise avoiding McAfee too. I used it for several years, and got
disgusted with it's ever-bloating approach in successive versions.
Wife still uses it - and hates it - she is going to get something
else, too.
Tony


*I used to be a Norton evangelist in the early 2000s until I found
out just how terribly the system performed with alternatives. I have
not looked back since. Symantec used to be good when they just made an
Antivirus product. It's garbage now.


*I use AVG Free, and it seems fine (better than Norton or McAfee,
IMHO) as long as you remember to update it manually.


*I'm surprised their computers ran fast enough to catch a virus using
Norton. Maybe a cold.


*I would NOT recommend AVG Anti-Virus to anyone, nor would I
recommend any Norton or McAfee application.


*I use AVG 7.5 Anti-Virus (Free) but there are a number of others to
choose from. Stay away from Norton and McAfee.


*McAfee and Norton have been known to cause problems with Outlook
Express since OE came out.
--
Frank Saunders MS-MVP IE,OE/WM


*It is known that Norton products aren't the best ones to use. I had
the same issue as you with NIS2007. My advice is to get rid of
NIS2008 and either buy a better solution -


*A number of experts agree that the retail AV version of McAfee,
Norton and Trend Micro has become cumbersome and bloated for the
average user.The retail version of Norton can play havoc with your
pc. Uninstall it using Norton's own uninstall tool and get a refund


*About McAfee and Norton, my IT guy has never recommended McAfee and
stopped recommending Norton years ago.


* I would still stay away from McAfee antway for various reasons.I
use Avast myself. --
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express
Imperial Beach, CA


*If it was my computer I'd dump McAfee and download Avast for my AV
software.

*But, finding out that Norton & McAfee can cause problems with OE is
something that this NG will stress more.--
Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express


*I found a reference to this memory problem, or something very
similar, on the MS website. They attributed it to McAfee and offered
deinstallation of McAfee as a solution


*Now be smart and uninstall anything else from McAfee or Norton.
Avast! is free for home users: www.avast.com
--
Frank Saunders MS-MVP IE,OE/WM


*If indeed Norton is about to expire you might be advised to
uninstall it, and install another security solution - Norton gives
many people problems and is a resource hog


* I use to have Norton and glad I got rid of it, it caused nothing
but problems and is a resource hog.


*I have SOLVED my System Restore item; it stems from Norton
Anti-virus...all I need is to deactivate it...then run System
Restore...then it works. Thanks,
FLKulchar


*Old news, Mcafee is just as useless as Norton.


*McAfee has been going downhill over the last year regarding its
coverage of pests. Visit www.av-comparatives.org to see some
on-demand scanning results. AVG's detection was higher than
McAfee's. Then review the older comparatives to see how they compared
in previous testing. You'll see AVG has improved while McAfee has
degraded.

*I like AVG and will probably never use McAfee or Norton since they
have proved over many years to be unnecessary resource hogs..


*What happens if you COMPLETELY uninstall anything Norton/Symantec?
Installing SP-2 is a good thing, installing anything Norton is often
bad.

Those are decent in my experience, and since they're free, that's
even better.

ZA is good, especiall if it sits behind a NAT router.

No, not new and well aware of the closed minds about Norton and McAfee
etc.. It's pretty simple; they're just not correct.
And, unlike any of them, I have the figures and data to back it up,
which I provided over a year ago, and to which no one ever responded.

 

[Twayne]

It all depends.

Certain Norton products used on decent systems by people who know what
they are doing won't yield as many unpleasant experiences as other
Norton products used on systems with relatively slow CPUs and only
256MB of RAM by people who don't know what they are doing. And since
market share is up there, there will always be a fair amount of
bashing.

There's a decent thread -- more balanced than what you'll see in this
NG -- you may want to read:

"Norton / Symantec Internet Security and AV - bum rap for resource
usage?"
http://www.wilderssecurity.com/archive/index.php/t-116783.html

I would imagine people with lower-end systems would notice improved
performance if they switched from Norton to something that doesn't
require as much memory, especially if they multitask. I don't have
stats, however, so I will not make any absolute claims. But the
anecdotal evidence I have come across so far has been convincing to
me. But I am always open to hard evidence.

That's a refreshing response to see, and completely reasonable IMO,
since I concur 100%<G>. There is one particular Norton program that
creates what seems to be long delays, etc., and that's their GoBack,
because it's working with such huge amounts of disk space and memory in
order to be able to record and roll back entire disk drives. But
otherwise, if one will read the documentation and the system is up to
the standards required, it runs quite well. Just as with MS, I have
some issues with their default settings too, but that's part of the
experience of learning to use applications; it requires rtfm which too
many people don't do. GoBack saved my bacon many times over until I
learned what imaging was about and switched to that.

Regards,

Twayne

 

[Robert]

Obivously running multiple anti virus programs simulatenously is not
recommended , but what about anti spyware apps ?
If you are running Windows Defender , and a security suite such as Norton ,
Macafee or Zone Alarm that contains real time anti spyware monitoring , does
that create a conflict ?
If so , which component, Defender or the 3rd party app should be disabled ?

TIA

I certainly don't pretend to be a computer expert by any means but
having just gone through a very lengthly process of eliminating a
virus and updating my system I would recommend the following:

Comodo - for you firewall(disable Microsoft firewall):
http://www.personalfirewall.comodo.com/

Windows Defender - spyware protection:
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/default.mspx

Kapersky - Anti-virus (or below)
http://www.kaspersky.com/virusscanner

AVG - Anti-virus:
http://free.grisoft.com/doc/1

AVG Anti-spyware for spyware removal:
http://free.grisoft.com/doc/5390/us/frt/0?prd=asf

Spybot - adware.spyware removal:
http://www.safer-networking.org/en/download/index.html

A-Squared - adware.spyware removal:
http://www.emsisoft.com/en/software/free/

Spywareblaster - spyware removal
http://www.download.com/3001-8022_4...b1ff0f6d6dc458e4bd353&part=dl-SpywareBl?idl=n

SUPERAntispyware - removal of spyware(Highly recommended)
http://www.superantispyware.com/superantispywarefreevspro.html

Hive Cleanup - makes sure your sessions are terminated:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...6D-8912-4E18-B570-42470E2F3582&displaylang=en

Autoruns - turn off items your not using at Startup e.g. Adobe,
Quicktime, Outlook:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...6D-8912-4E18-B570-42470E2F3582&displaylang=en


Hope this
helps,
Robert

 

[Plato]

Obivously running multiple anti virus programs simulatenously is not
recommended , but what about anti spyware apps ?

Same thing. Dont run 2 at a time.