This whole PL issue is fairly obvious.

[Night2000]

Hi folks, I've been following this group since 1997. Once in awhile I
will post, but spend most time keeping up with this group lurking.
It's fairly obvious what's happening here. I obviously don't know
either Genna, or Susan. Other than from their posts on these boards.
To me it looks like Genna finally wants to convert the PL to a
database format. Which she had wanted to do for a long time.
Susan on the other hand knows nothing about this type of format. As
she stated she knows HTML.. So it's obvious that by switching Susan
feels like a fish out of water. Thus making her feel like she will
have much less control in maintaining PL as she has done for quite
awhile now. Genna doesn't feel that changing to a database format will
make Susan's job tougher but easier. The problem is Susan is fearing
the unknown cause she is worried that she may not be able to maintain
the new system. Obviously Susan loves maintaining the PL website and
list. She doesn't want to have to lose control of it. What has to
obviously be worked out is for Genna, and Susan to discuss this
privately and get things worked out. These type of open discussions
while interesting, isn't solving the problem. How many posts have
already been made and still nothing is resolved? Sometimes less talk
and more action is required. Susan and Genna, have to resolve this
either on the phone, or if possible in person. Okay time to go back to
my quiet corner of this wonderful group, fights and all! LOL...

Cheers,
Night2000

 

[dszady]

Hi folks, I've been following this group since 1997. Once in awhile I
will post, but spend most time keeping up with this group lurking. It's
fairly obvious what's happening here. I obviously don't know either Genna,
or Susan. Other than from their posts on these boards. To me it looks like
Genna finally wants to convert the PL to a database format. Which she had
wanted to do for a long time. Susan on the other hand knows nothing about
this type of format.

Where does she say that? Are you a mind-reader?

As she stated she knows HTML.. So it's obvious that
by switching Susan feels like a fish out of water. Thus making her feel
like she will have much less control in maintaining PL as she has done for
quite awhile now. Genna doesn't feel that changing to a database format
will make Susan's job tougher but easier. The problem is Susan is fearing
the unknown cause she is worried that she may not be able to maintain the
new system.

How do you know that are you a mind-reader and a pschologist?

Obviously Susan loves maintaining the PL website and list. She
doesn't want to have to lose control of it.

How are these two points obvious?

What has to obviously be
worked out is for Genna, and Susan to discuss this privately and get
things worked out. These type of open discussions while interesting, isn't
solving the problem. How many posts have already been made and still
nothing is resolved? Sometimes less talk and more action is required.
Susan and Genna, have to resolve this either on the phone, or if possible
in person. Okay time to go back to my quiet corner of this wonderful
group, fights and all! LOL...

No one is laughing.
Thanks for your time and my patience,

 

[Bebop & Rocksteady]

Hi folks, I've been following this group since 1997. Once in awhile I
will post, but spend most time keeping up with this group lurking.
It's fairly obvious what's happening here. I obviously don't know
either Genna, or Susan. Other than from their posts on these boards.
To me it looks like Genna finally wants to convert the PL to a
database format. Which she had wanted to do for a long time.
Susan on the other hand knows nothing about this type of format. As
she stated she knows HTML.. So it's obvious that by switching Susan
feels like a fish out of water. Thus making her feel like she will
have much less control in maintaining PL as she has done for quite
awhile now. Genna doesn't feel that changing to a database format will
make Susan's job tougher but easier. The problem is Susan is fearing
the unknown cause she is worried that she may not be able to maintain
the new system. Obviously Susan loves maintaining the PL website and
list. She doesn't want to have to lose control of it. What has to
obviously be worked out is for Genna, and Susan to discuss this
privately and get things worked out. These type of open discussions
while interesting, isn't solving the problem. How many posts have
already been made and still nothing is resolved? Sometimes less talk
and more action is required. Susan and Genna, have to resolve this
either on the phone, or if possible in person. Okay time to go back to
my quiet corner of this wonderful group, fights and all! LOL...

Who ever, is maintaining and paying for the hosting gets to choose how they
want the site, as in essence it is their site.


--
----------------------------------------
Quantum Illusions: http://quantum.2ya.com
FORT Freeware: http://freeware.quantum.2ya.com
Pegasus Mail Support Site: http://pegasus.quantum.2ya.com
DATA Solutions: http://datasolutions.quantum.2ya.com

If you truly want to contact me click the link
http://quantum.2ya.com/email.htm

The future is our past and our past is our future.

 

[JanC]

To me it looks like Genna finally wants to convert the PL to a
database format. Which she had wanted to do for a long time.
Susan on the other hand knows nothing about this type of format. As
she stated she knows HTML..

Susan has just said she's been maintaining the site with a "database" &
"scripting" for 1 or 2 years now... ;-)

 

[Alastair Smeaton]

Who ever, is maintaining and paying for the hosting gets to choose how they
want the site, as in essence it is their site.

however, in this case, this is two people - currently not quite seeing
the world from the same perspective

The "facts" - as stated by many in the main thread

PW site belongs to all of us

genna owns the site

Susan maintains it using databases and html generating scripts

Proposal is to change to something Susan feels less comfortable with
than Genna.

Others have wanted or offered to help.

Why not start a new thread, going forward, not discussing the whys and
wherefores of how Susan and Genna have communicated in the past, and
focusing on how to resolve this issue - it could even have a header so
folks can ignore it if they wish, but clearly contribute if they wish
also.

Lets move forward ?

 

[Roger Johansson]

Who ever, is maintaining and paying for the hosting gets to choose how they
want the site, as in essence it is their site.

We, the participators of acf, are trying to create something available
for free in a world which is based on paying for everything.

To be able to do that we need help from somebody like Genna, who takes
care of the necessary interface to the commercial real world.

I think she has done that in a very good way, probably at some financial
cost to herself.
She just provides the necessary web space and domain name and lets the
group use that web space and domain name for free.

She has not tried to use her formal economical power to control the
content, but some people obviously think that she has done that.

When Genna makes a suggestion about the web site some people may think
that she is giving an order, and that she is using the formal economical
power over the site to force others to do things in another way.

The solution could be to forbid Genna to ever say anything about the
site, which is a completely unreasonable solution, or the solution could
be to realize that Genna has a right to express an opinion and to
participate in the discussions without others taking that as a try to
excercize power.

The PL site is working very well at the moment, thanks to Susan, and
there is no immediate need to change anything.

Maybe the problem is that some people have far too much respect for
formal ownership and the power of money in the present capitalist system
we live in.
When the formal Owner shows up these people think that her words are the
law, that every little idea she throws out has to be obeyed, because she
is the Owner, the person who has the Money.

This kind of thinking causes problem when we are trying to do things in
a voluntary and democratic way.

Genna has clearly declared that she has no intention of using financial
clout or formal ownership to control anything, and we should accept that
and let her express her opinion too.

 

[Bob Adkins]

Hi folks, I've been following this group since 1997. Once in awhile I
will post, but spend most time keeping up with this group lurking.
It's fairly obvious what's happening here. I obviously don't know
either Genna, or Susan. Other than from their posts on these boards.
To me it looks like Genna finally wants to convert the PL to a

Oh oh.

I have a feeling some other things will soon become obvious to you!

Bob

Remove "kins" to reply by e-mail.

 

[Hello]

Hi folks, I've been following this group since 1997.

Can't comment on the technical issues , but I do wish to thank Geena
and Susan for their efforts


--G

 

[jason]

To me it looks like Genna finally wants to convert the PL to a
database format. Which she had wanted to do for a long time.
Susan on the other hand knows nothing about this type of format. As
she stated she knows HTML.. So it's obvious that by switching Susan
feels like a fish out of water. Thus making her feel like she will
have much less control in maintaining PL as she has done for quite
awhile now. Genna doesn't feel that changing to a database format will
make Susan's job tougher but easier. The problem is Susan is fearing
the unknown cause she is worried that she may not be able to maintain
the new system. Obviously Susan loves maintaining the PL website and
list. She doesn't want to have to lose control of it.

I think that's an accurate read of the situation.

Both Genna and Susan are good people. But change can be threatening if
it's not understood that it doesn't NEED to be threatening.

From what I've seen on the other thread, they've finally gotten down to
addressing the database issue head-on. So once everyone just calms down
and starts breathing again, maybe we can start moving in a forward
direction.

 

[Sweet Andy Licious]

I believe the Jews and the Arabs should get together and settle their
differences in a Christian like manner.

[from Best Little Whorehouse in Texas, I forget who said it.]

 

[Susan Bugher]

Night2000 <[email protected]> schreef:
n>


Susan has just said she's been maintaining the site with a "database" &
"scripting" for 1 or 2 years now... ;-)

LOL, I didn't know that was "scripting". . .

I started programming, using spreadsheets/databases/etc. *long* before I
made my first web page. . . just applied the techniques to that. . .

"I've been speaking prose for years and I didn't know it"

Susan

 

[Bob Adkins]

I believe the Jews and the Arabs should get together and settle their
differences in a Christian like manner.

Heh heh heh

Bob

Remove "kins" to reply by e-mail.

 

[Night2000]

No one is laughing.

This is true, your pathetic attempt at humor can produce that effect.

Thanks for your time and my patience,

Your welcome, and your pleasure I'm sure.

 

[dszady]

This is true, your pathetic attempt at humor can produce that effect.

The purpose of this conversation was to allow you to humiliate himself.
And I will tell you it you did that rather well.

Your welcome, and your pleasure I'm sure.

I'll give you one thing: you've got balls - mine, bouncing off your chin.
HTH ****Stick
Thank you for my time and my patience.

 

[JanC]

LOL, I didn't know that was "scripting". . .

From what I understand you write small "programs"/"scripts" (= order group
of spreadsheet-functions) that create HTML from the data in the spreadsheet
tables...

 

[Night2000]

The purpose of this conversation was to allow you to humiliate himself.
And I will tell you it you did that rather well.

The problem is Daryl A-hole Szady, is you have already proven yourself
a fool. Everytime you open your mouth only confirms it. Please
continue.

I'll give you one thing: you've got balls - mine, bouncing off your chin.
HTH ****Stick
Thank you for my time and my patience.

I'm really not into that kind of thing, if you want to get naked and
bounce your balls off of somebody. Try your Maw, I hear when yo Daddy
taught you, he knocked out your teeth, and they never grew back.
Once again the pleasure was all yours.

 

[dszady]

[...]
I'm really not into that kind of thing, if you want to get naked and
bounce your balls off of somebody. Try your Maw, I hear when yo Daddy
taught you, he knocked out your teeth, and they never grew back. Once
again the pleasure was all yours.

Next teeth knocked out will be your Troll.

 

[dszady]

What a putrid waste of a puny penis you are! You should face legal action
for your attempt to impersonate a man, you ridiculous little mascara
face-painted Jerk-In-The-Box. You couldn't get a date if you bought them
dried in a tin, you under-medicated, rump-ruptured chronic self-abuser.
You're the kind of greasy, giggling, girly gombeen who buys STDs from a
viral lab just to make it look like you get laid. Calling you a pea brain
would be an insult to peas, you jellyfish-sucking mental midget. Did your
mother leave you in the dryer too long when you were a kid, you little
tap-dancing Leprechaun in a pink wig? Be careful you don't bump your head
on the door handle on the way out. I bet the highway patrol make you wear
a sign on your fat ass that reads, 'Caution: Wide Load!' Now, my little
ankle-humping hermit, do me a favour and get your clubfoot stook on a busy
train track

Now I have the last word ****tard.
End of discussion.

 

[Susan Bugher]

From what I understand you write small "programs"/"scripts" (= order group
of spreadsheet-functions) that create HTML from the data in the spreadsheet
tables...

Yup.

Susan

 

[Night2000]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 02:55:25 -0400, Night2000 wrote:

[...]
I'm really not into that kind of thing, if you want to get naked and
bounce your balls off of somebody. Try your Maw, I hear when yo Daddy
taught you, he knocked out your teeth, and they never grew back. Once
again the pleasure was all yours.

Next teeth knocked out will be your Troll.

Awe, Daryl A-hole Szady, is upset with me. What's the matter, had it
too easy in ACF picking on the regular folk? You pathetic, smegma
stain. This is only the beginning.