Registry Cleaners Affecting the Ability to Boot

[db]

yes, I meant to use the
word

"worst"

thanks.

----------

incidentally, I think that
your choice to use any
registry cleaner is up
to you.

I only stick with ccleaner
and one care.

------------

I haven't read pc world in
a long time.

but I will look into it.

thanks again.

--
db·´¯`·...¸><)))º>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
- Systems Analyst
- Database Developer
- Accountancy
- Veteran of the Armed Forces
- @Hotmail.com
- nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[db]

well, I agree. but as a database
programmer, I see the issue from
a different perspective.

my take is that optimizing the
registry database is as important
as optimizing the file system
database.

people don't seem to realize that
windows is simply one large
database.

------------

the smaller the registry database
the less fragmented it will be.

and the likelihood that a superfluous
fragment will become corrupted and
attribute to the crashing of the registry
database will be minimized.

however, because of the fragmentation
that occurs with the file system,

it would be a good idea to run a
check disk and then a defrag.

the initial check disk will ensure that
the registry files will be in sync with
the mft

and the defrag should ensure that
the registry is not fragmented.

then executing a system restore
point before a cleaner would be
my recommendation as the final
steps.

----------

thanks for the link, I will look into
it.

--
db·´¯`·...¸><)))º>
DatabaseBen, Retired Professional
- Systems Analyst
- Database Developer
- Accountancy
- Veteran of the Armed Forces
- @Hotmail.com
- nntp Postologist
~ "share the nirvana" - dbZen

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Unknown]

You don't have enough computer experience to make these statements.
How can cleaning the registry possibly speed up a computer?

 

[Unknown]

PC World only publishes to make money. They write about anything and sucker
people into subscribing.
I am ashamed to say I was a subscriber but after reading it for a few months
I gave up on them.
There are thousands of examples but the last one was really a good one.
They stated if you are installing a computer and you only have a two wire AC
outlet (no ground)
you can install a GFCI outlet. (Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter)
PC World is very similar to the automobile magazines. Did you ever read a
negative report
on any vehicle that advertises in that magazine?

 

[Twayne]

In

Registry cleaners are only

....

Ugh! From the pirating, posing, socio-path with the fake MVP claim and
owner of the nefarious PCBUTT's site!

 

[PA Bear [MS MVP]]

CCleaner at least prompts you to create a backup of the changes you're
making with the Registry Integrity component. God help you if you ignore the
prompt.

 

[thanatoid]

PC World only publishes to make money. They write about
anything and sucker people into subscribing.

<SNIP>

Name ONE magazine that doesn't do the above.

Anyway, I wasn't the one that first mentioned PCWorld here as an
/authority/.
Let's hope they sure for slander, since they state clearly (like
most of such magazines) they're totally independent and take no
kickbacks (which of course is open to interpretation)

I always preferred PCMag, but haven't seen it where I live.

Anyway, you will say and do ANYTHING to win even a pointless
argument, huh?

Keep on rocking in the free world, excuse me, your prison.

 

[HeyBub]

YES

What did you disagree with me about FORMAT command? Please use the
same message so that it can be clarified for you. Have you recently
fixed your system?

On the original question, you asserted (quite emphatically) that the FORMAT
command wipes the disk as part of the formatting process. In fact, the
FORMAT command does not touch the data. There is, actually, an UNFORMAT
command for older versions of DOS with which the user can recover all the
data from a formatted volume and there are utilities for Windows and NTFS
volumes that do the same thing.

Bottom line, despite your claims to the contrary, FORMAT does NOT destroy
the data on a disk.

I don't need clarification.

I have not recently fixed my system, but thanks for asking.

 

[ANONYMOUS]

Prove it to me!! For nutters using their Pcs for email, internet and porn,
they don't have any knowledge of unformatting a HD. I will format the disk
and you unformat can it for me to see if you have the necessary skills.

For Janice - the OP - format is all she needed to do the job. In fact for
most users here, format is the only thing they need to wipe the disk and
start all over again.

For paedos and criminals, I can advise other tools including the ones I
distribute thru CORE (Challenge of Reverse Engineering) brand..

Any more questions.

 

[HeyBub]

And may I disrespectfully point out to those who keep on beating
the dead horse of "improved performance" that neither I nor most
of the other pro-RC posters (IIRC) have ever claimed ANY
performance increase - in fact I have repeatedly stated there is
ZERO performance increase.

I don't know of anybody who has quantified a computer's efficiency before
and after a 'registry cleaning.' I doubt that it's doable.

First, there are always seven registry hives and no cleaner is going to
reduce that number. In almost all cases, when asked, the OS loads an entire
hive into memory and searches it at RAM speed. Further, the search is not
even a sequential search but a tree search. The OS has to make, at most,
maybe five or ten comparisons in the tree to find the requested key.

So, whether the registry contains 1,000 entries or five million, the
difference in access time is unmeasurably small.

 

[Daave]

Good point. (I'm sure a number of people have ignored it.)

 

[The Real Truth MVP]

You are comparing speed vs performance. Any application that does not
uninstall properly, or does not have an uninstaller, can leave entries in
the registry. Over time the computer suffers as the registry fills with
left-over and incorrect entries. Manipulation of the registry might be
required where applications that are using the Registry do not implement
configuration through their user interface. Information required for loading
device drivers and software is stored in the registry, a damaged registry or
leftover orphaned entries will prevent a system from booting successfully.
Malware and it's removal is a big cause of this.You see that a lot in these
NG's when people posts about error messages when booting their system "can't
find file" Those messages are generated from bad entries in the registry.
They directly effect the performance of a system which in a way effects the
speed. You clean the registry of all those bad entries you get rid of the
error message your computer is performing better.


--
The Real Truth http://pcbutts1-therealtruth.blogspot.com/
*WARNING* Do NOT follow any advice given by the people listed below.
They do NOT have the expertise or knowledge to fix your issue. Do not waste
your time.
David H Lipman, Malke, PA Bear, Beauregard T. Shagnasty, Leythos.

 

[Daave]

I don't know of anybody who has quantified a computer's efficiency
before and after a 'registry cleaning.' I doubt that it's doable.

I'm sure someone could establish benchmarks. Bootup times, response
times when double-clicking My Computer, how quickly a particular Web
page loads, etc.

And regarding thanatoid's "disrespectful" remark about beating a dead
horse, that's just a red herring. The issue is not whether or not he or
others in his camp claim improved performance. The issue is the claim of
the companies selling these programs! So many people post here ask
questions about how much of a performance gain do they might expect to
see after running these cleaners. They don't come up with these ideas
out of thin air. It is a result of marketing and advertising. To wit:

http://onecare.live.com/site/en-Us/article/registry_cleaner_why.htm

<quote>
Speed up your PC with our free registry cleaner

As part of its Clean Up scan, the Windows Live OneCare safety scanner
offers a free registry cleaner. Running this scan is a great way to rid
your PC of clutter and keep it running at its speediest.
</quote>

Marketing claptrap! Utter nonsense!

More insanity in these hits:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q="registry+cleaner"+speed&aq=f&aql=&aqi=&oq=

*That* is the reason I say what I say when it comes to registry
cleaning. One does *not* need a registry cleaner to "keep [one's PC]
running at its speediest."

 

[Unknown]

Are you ANONYMOUS' brother?

<SNIP>

Name ONE magazine that doesn't do the above.

Anyway, I wasn't the one that first mentioned PCWorld here as an
/authority/.
Let's hope they sure for slander, since they state clearly (like
most of such magazines) they're totally independent and take no
kickbacks (which of course is open to interpretation)

I always preferred PCMag, but haven't seen it where I live.

Anyway, you will say and do ANYTHING to win even a pointless
argument, huh?

Keep on rocking in the free world, excuse me, your prison.

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Since a lot of you trust magazines, ...

Not if it accepts advertising dollars from the makers of products it
"reviews," I don't. Nor would anyone else with a lick of sense.

... here's a link to a PC World
magazine examining 4 "utility sutes" all of which INCLUDE
REGISTRY CLEANERS.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/113743/the_troublefree_pc.html

For those too lazy to look for the section, here is what the
article says abot RC's:

"Registry cleaners:

Garbage lurking in the Windows Registry is the worst kind of
junk on your hard drive. A program that you've uninstalled may
leave behind an unnecessary Registry key that can end up causing
havoc. If your computer isn't behaving the way it's supposed to-
-for example, a program keeps crashing or the CD-R drive
suddenly doesn't write--there's a good chance the problem is in
the Registry.

And just where, pray tell, does that article offer any references to
any scientific evidence to support such assertions? Where are the
double-blind studies conducted by independent laboratories that confirm
these claims? Any rational or reasonable substantiation is
conspicuously absent, is it not?

However, I notice that the magazine making the above unsubstantiated
claims does accept advertising dollars from the makers of the "reviewed"
products. Coincidence? I think not.

OK?

No.

Now can we PLEASE move on?

Not until wannabe trolls and other members of the Church of Registry
Cleaners either stop trying to mislead the technically naive about the
benefits of registry cleaners, or provide scientifically verifiable
evidence from a disinterested independent source to support your claims.
Until such time, those of us who've learned better from years of
experience will just have to heep on point out your attempts at deception.


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:


http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/555375

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. ~Benjamin Franklin

Many people would rather die than think; in fact, most do. ~Bertrand Russell

The philosopher has never killed any priests, whereas the priest has
killed a great many philosophers.
~ Denis Diderot

 

[thanatoid]

I don't know of anybody who has quantified a computer's
efficiency before and after a 'registry cleaning.' I doubt
that it's doable.

First, there are always seven registry hives and no cleaner
is going to reduce that number. In almost all cases, when
asked, the OS loads an entire hive into memory and searches
it at RAM speed. Further, the search is not even a
sequential search but a tree search. The OS has to make, at
most, maybe five or ten comparisons in the tree to find the
requested key.

So, whether the registry contains 1,000 entries or five
million, the difference in access time is unmeasurably
small.

Are you attempting to make a point, let alone in reply to my
statement?

 

[thanatoid]

I'm sure someone could establish benchmarks. Bootup times,
response times when double-clicking My Computer, how
quickly a particular Web page loads, etc.

And regarding thanatoid's "disrespectful" remark about
beating a dead horse, that's just a red herring. The issue
is not whether or not he or others in his camp claim
improved performance. The issue is the claim of the
companies selling these programs! So many people post here
ask questions about how much of a performance gain do they
might expect to see after running these cleaners. They
don't come up with these ideas out of thin air. It is a
result of marketing and advertising. To wit:

http://onecare.live.com/site/en-Us/article/registry_cleaner_
why.htm

<quote>
Speed up your PC with our free registry cleaner

Do you believe ANYTHING MS claims? When they allow for printing
of a directory's content from Windows (NO command line, NO other
programs) I'll consider talking to them.

As part of its Clean Up scan, the Windows Live OneCare
safety scanner offers a free registry cleaner. Running this
scan is a great way to rid your PC of clutter and keep it
running at its speediest. </quote>

See above.

Marketing claptrap! Utter nonsense!

Ah! You saw the light!

More insanity in these hits:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q="registry+c
leaner%22+speed&aq=f&aql=&aqi=&oq=

Everybody says whatever is necessary to sell garbage. Ever been
to a stereo shop?
You don't trust ANYBODY.

*That* is the reason I say what I say when it comes to
registry cleaning. One does *not* need a registry cleaner
to "keep [one's PC] running at its speediest."

And you are absolutely correct. Now, about that dead horse...

 

[ANONYMOUS]

Are you ANONYMOUS' brother?

Why you want to offer your sister to him as well? You are a bit desperate to
get rid of her aren't you?

 

[Unknown]

You act the same.

Why you want to offer your sister to him as well? You are a bit desperate
to get rid of her aren't you?

 

[HeyBub]

You are comparing speed vs performance. Any application that does not
uninstall properly, or does not have an uninstaller, can leave
entries in the registry. Over time the computer suffers as the
registry fills with left-over and incorrect entries.

Nope. Superfluous or erroneous entries have no effect on speed or
performance.

Manipulation of
the registry might be required where applications that are using the
Registry do not implement configuration through their user interface.
Information required for loading device drivers and software is
stored in the registry, a damaged registry or leftover orphaned
entries will prevent a system from booting successfully.

Nope. A damaged registry will affect a lot of things, true. Erroneous
entries will also affect things. A registry cleaner will have no effect on
these two situations.

Malware and
it's removal is a big cause of this.You see that a lot in these NG's
when people posts about error messages when booting their system
"can't find file" Those messages are generated from bad entries in
the registry. They directly effect the performance of a system which
in a way effects the speed. You clean the registry of all those bad
entries you get rid of the error message your computer is performing
better.

Nope. Messages such as you claim are generated by an executing program, not
a registry entry. It is the executing program that is at fault, not the
registry. In the case you mentioned, after a 'cleaning' the next time the
program executes it will get a "registry key not found" type message rather
than "can't find file."

If an executing program launches a registry key search and the key is not
returned or points to the wrong place, that's not the fault of the registry
and, again, no cleaner is going to help.

The best that a registry cleaner can do is scan the registry and find broken
or missing links. But so what? These links would never get accessed anyway.