Ode to Kurttrail...

[Leythos]

I would wager that you think that the Patriot Act and torture are
OK...

The PA (patriot act) is very necessary and I support it fully. Being
prior military I understand much of what is required to keep the country
stafe from people sworn to kill all non-muslim people.

Torture, while it's never "OK", it's a fact of life, been used in every
war, still used by most countries, and does save lives.

 

[Newport]

Well said

--

The PA (patriot act) is very necessary and I support it fully. Being
prior military I understand much of what is required to keep the country
stafe from people sworn to kill all non-muslim people.

Torture, while it's never "OK", it's a fact of life, been used in every
war, still used by most countries, and does save lives.

 

[Leythos]

Where before, I might well have
simply thought Kurt was being somewhat intolerant, now I find myself
squarely in support of him.

If his position has not changed, and he can post without being offensive
and not have his posts removed, then how can you support someone that
you didn't support before, considering the only reason the posts were
removed was due to their being offensive?

That's like saying I support a killer because the court found them
guilty.

It appears, since he's able to post still, that as long as he's not
foul, that he won't be deleted. No harm in asking him to be a good
community member, it's not like he is unable to post his position, only
his ranting, when foul, seems to be deleted.

 

[Alias]

The PA (patriot act) is very necessary and I support it fully. Being
prior military I understand much of what is required to keep the country
stafe from people sworn to kill all non-muslim people.

Yeah, if they're a towel head, no need for them to enjoy legal recourse,
bail or even a trial. Just lock them up without telling anyone and throw
away the key. While you're at it, take some photos of the torture
activity and wear a false smile that says "saving lives". I'm sure that
would calm the middle east down and lead us all to world peace in a
Texas jiffy.

Torture, while it's never "OK", it's a fact of life, been used in every
war, still used by most countries, and does save lives.

And do you also think the unprovoked, illegal war in Iraq is a good
thing and that Bush can speak English properly?

Have you ever considered that war is evil and that torture never has a
justification?

Alias

 

[xheggenvy]

The PA (patriot act) is very necessary and I support it fully. Being
prior military I understand much of what is required to keep the country
stafe from people sworn to kill all non-muslim people.

Torture, while it's never "OK", it's a fact of life, been used in every
war, still used by most countries, and does save lives.

LOL! Ask John McCain about that one!

So if the Iraqi's torture you to save Iraqi lives, that's OK?

--
Crnpr!
Xheg
Frys-nabvagrq Zbqrengbe
zvpebfphz.chovp.jvaqbjfrkc.tbabeeurn
uggc://zvpebfphz.pbz/zfpbzzhavgl/vaqrk.cuc?fubjgbcvp=3
"Gehfgjbegul Pbzchgvat" vf bayl nabgure rknzcyr bs na Bklzbeba!
"Cebqhxg-Nxgvivrehat znpug serv"

 

[Kurt Kirsch]

If his position has not changed, and he can post without being offensive
and not have his posts removed, then how can you support someone that
you didn't support before, considering the only reason the posts were
removed was due to their being offensive?

That's like saying I support a killer because the court found them
guilty.

It appears, since he's able to post still, that as long as he's not
foul, that he won't be deleted. No harm in asking him to be a good
community member, it's not like he is unable to post his position, only
his ranting, when foul, seems to be deleted.

Who said all the posts of mine that were removed were offensive? Has
some MS rep publicly stated this and I just missed it?

 

[Leythos]

[snip <<<<< visual indication]

Have you ever considered that war is evil and that torture never has a
justification?

Yes, for a few minutes, I have wondered if war was evil, and I've always
considered it a loss for both sides, but, normally, one side pays a
higher price than the other. In this case, considering what would have
happened had we done nothing, it was the right action and I fully
support it - even to the point of allowing my oldest son to Join the
Military with my blessing.

While you may not value your security, your safety, your fellow country-
mens lives, your freedom, many people around the world do and are
willing to pay for it with more than just lip service.

 

[Leythos]

LOL! Ask John McCain about that one!

So if the Iraqi's torture you to save Iraqi lives, that's OK?

I don't believe there was any conditional part of my statement, what
part didn't play into your political agenda?

 

[kurttrail]

I don't believe there was any conditional part of my statement, what
part didn't play into your political agenda?

Cool! Let's offer you up to the Iraqi Insurgents, and bring our
troops home already!

 

[jt3]

Very well, perhaps I should remove the adjective 'squarely'. However, I did
say that 'I might well have simply though Kurt was being somewhat
intolerant,' which would not disallow my believing that there was a good
deal of sense in much of what he said, only that he might be extreme in his
expression. Consequently, my conclusion is hardly inconsistent.

I find your use of what you assert to be a simile an attempt to misconstrue
the meaning of what I said. I certainly said nothing to justify your
innuendo that I am supporting a malefactor. Or are you judge, jury and
executioner?

J

 

[Winux P]

Ahhh Jupiter, another one that would carpet bomb nations for perceived EULA
infringements, chill out Jupiter don't be so spiteful sir...! See how good
life is without being so angry.

As for Kurt, I never bothered ever to read the EULA until his postings, as
for relevancy this is a Windows XP news forum and a general one at that and,
EULA is a part of Windows XP. Kurt's posts have been an eye opener regarding
the legalities of EULA, and having been involved in four contractual issues,
three of which in courts I can concur with Kurt's postings regarding EULA.
You don't have to go too far in contractual law to see the fallacy of EULA.

As for insults Kurt has been accused of, come on! How sheltered must one's
life be or have been to be offended by whatever anyone posts on a news
server? And how could it even be perceived as personal?

It would be more correct to say that Kurt is being censored cause whom ever
is doing it ejaculates each time they censor someone. If you don't like
reading something, then don't, there's the best for of censorship Jupiter,
having little control of yourself entails not being able to stop or ignore
posts you don't like.

Come on Jupiter, admit it, you read all Kurts posts did you????

- Winux P

: Michael;
: I can not explain why other dangerous posters do not also have their posts
: removed.
: Perhaps the person behind it see posts excessively attacking others and
: organizations as more offensive.
: Even though these newsgroups are technical, Kurt's constant personal
attacks
: at times deserve to be removed.
: Kurt definitely fits if that is the criteria used.
: He has also demonstrated that he cares more about his hate for others than
: he does care for peoples rights.
: If Kurt truly cared about people, he would not have hoped for harm to come
: to my family (he has never met them) simply so he could he have me learn
: something he ASSUMES I do not understand.
: The others may act the way they do out of ignorance or stupidity, Kurt is
: more like blind vengeance.
: His posts and website are evidence of this.
: That is only one of many possible reasons Kurt may have EARNED what he is
: getting.
: Kurt has little or no control of himself and likes to whine when someone
: does what he is incapable...control Kurt.
:
: --
: Jupiter Jones [MVP]
: http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
: http://www.dts-l.org
:
:
: > No, someone is doing a blanket censoring of kurttrails posts. Two of the
: > most dangerous technical posters Talahasee and Andrew E continue to post
: > unabated, but kurttrail who never posts information that causes data
loss
: > gets a blanket censor. Something is really wrong with this peer support
: > newsgroup. It is no longer truly peer support when this happens. It is
now
: > MS moderated, and should be supported by MS as such.
: > --
: > Michael Stevens MS-MVP XP
: > (e-mail address removed)
: > http://www.michaelstevenstech.com
: > For a better newsgroup experience. Setup a newsreader.
: > http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/outlookexpressnewreader.htm
: >
: >
: >
:
:

 

[Leythos]

Very well, perhaps I should remove the adjective 'squarely'. However, I did
say that 'I might well have simply though Kurt was being somewhat
intolerant,' which would not disallow my believing that there was a good
deal of sense in much of what he said, only that he might be extreme in his
expression. Consequently, my conclusion is hardly inconsistent.

I find your use of what you assert to be a simile an attempt to misconstrue
the meaning of what I said. I certainly said nothing to justify your
innuendo that I am supporting a malefactor. Or are you judge, jury and
executioner?

Until he as censored you didn't fully support him, now that he's been
censored you said "now I find myself squarely in support of him.". You
didn't say you support him against censorship, just that you fully
support him since he was censored - nice try, but unless you can find
another way to state it, you support his assertions that people should
violate the licensing agreement since it's not enforced by any court
decision.

[remainder of post left in tact so you can see what you actually said]

J

 

[nubian]

Very well, perhaps I should remove the adjective 'squarely'. However, I did
say that 'I might well have simply though Kurt was being somewhat
intolerant,' which would not disallow my believing that there was a good
deal of sense in much of what he said, only that he might be extreme in his
expression. Consequently, my conclusion is hardly inconsistent.

I find your use of what you assert to be a simile an attempt to misconstrue
the meaning of what I said. I certainly said nothing to justify your
innuendo that I am supporting a malefactor. Or are you judge, jury and
executioner?

Until he as censored you didn't fully support him, now that he's been
censored you said "now I find myself squarely in support of him.". You
didn't say you support him against censorship, just that you fully
support him since he was censored - nice try, but unless you can find
another way to state it, you support his assertions that people should
violate the licensing agreement since it's not enforced by any court
decision.

[remainder of post left in tact so you can see what you actually said]

How does this imply what he supports Kurttrail for? He doesn't specify,
so why put words in his mouth?

--
nubian

http://protectfreedom.tripod.com/index.html
http://protectfreedom.tripod.com/vista.html

 

[Leythos]

Very well, perhaps I should remove the adjective 'squarely'. However, I did
say that 'I might well have simply though Kurt was being somewhat
intolerant,' which would not disallow my believing that there was a good
deal of sense in much of what he said, only that he might be extreme in his
expression. Consequently, my conclusion is hardly inconsistent.

I find your use of what you assert to be a simile an attempt to misconstrue
the meaning of what I said. I certainly said nothing to justify your
innuendo that I am supporting a malefactor. Or are you judge, jury and
executioner?

Until he as censored you didn't fully support him, now that he's been
censored you said "now I find myself squarely in support of him.". You
didn't say you support him against censorship, just that you fully
support him since he was censored - nice try, but unless you can find
another way to state it, you support his assertions that people should
violate the licensing agreement since it's not enforced by any court
decision.

[remainder of post left in tact so you can see what you actually said]

How does this imply what he supports Kurttrail for? He doesn't specify,
so why put words in his mouth?

It would appear that he supports what Kurt stands for - since he didn't
limit the scope of support. Most people that feel the need to partially
support something state the limitation. You might want to go back and
read his reply in context.

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

"And how could it even be perceived as personal?"
When Kurt specifically states he wants harm to come to my family.
People he has never met and knows nothing about.

Kurt is unable to control himself and needs to insult and attack others
since he feels insecure without doing so.
There are many with similar positions and they do not need the attacks as
Kurt does.

"another one that would carpet bomb nations for perceived EULA
infringements"
Such assumptions by you really leave the rest of what you might say
questionable.

The value of what Kurt posts is greatly diminished by his hating attitude.
Because what he says about my family, other people and me, it is clear he is
only concerned for the truth in so much as the truth can hurt Microsoft and
others he hates regardless the cost to others.
If he had any concern for people he would demonstrate the concern instead of
his blind hate.
Until he made that statement about my family, I had some degree of
confidence that he meant what he said. At that time it became clear his
hate overpowered any concern he may have had.

And NO, I do not read all of Kurt's writings.
Yet another wrong assumption on your part.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
http://www.dts-l.org/

 

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

Wager and assume all you want.
Your points are irrelevant unless your point is to drag OFF TOPIC politics
into this newsgroup.
Hopefully you would wager nothing or you can afford to do without.

 

[Winux P]

Assumptions I am not making to you Jupiter, exaggerating I am, but
slanderous, you indeed are. If your *assumption* is correct that Kurttrail
is full of hate, then all credit to him and so what to you Jupiter, cause it
looks like it's rubbed off onto you. Just read below, you wrote it.

The point here is censorship and if a huge conglomerate cannot handle the
words of an individual then Jupiter who really is the insecure, the angry,
spiteful and the weak.

- Winux P

: "And how could it even be perceived as personal?"
: When Kurt specifically states he wants harm to come to my family.
: People he has never met and knows nothing about.
:
: Kurt is unable to control himself and needs to insult and attack others
: since he feels insecure without doing so.
: There are many with similar positions and they do not need the attacks as
: Kurt does.
:
: "another one that would carpet bomb nations for perceived EULA
: infringements"
: Such assumptions by you really leave the rest of what you might say
: questionable.
:
: The value of what Kurt posts is greatly diminished by his hating attitude.
: Because what he says about my family, other people and me, it is clear he
is
: only concerned for the truth in so much as the truth can hurt Microsoft
and
: others he hates regardless the cost to others.
: If he had any concern for people he would demonstrate the concern instead
of
: his blind hate.
: Until he made that statement about my family, I had some degree of
: confidence that he meant what he said. At that time it became clear his
: hate overpowered any concern he may have had.
:
: And NO, I do not read all of Kurt's writings.
: Yet another wrong assumption on your part.
:
: --
: Jupiter Jones [MVP]
: http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/
: http://www.dts-l.org/
:
:
: : >
: > Ahhh Jupiter, another one that would carpet bomb nations for perceived
: > EULA
: > infringements, chill out Jupiter don't be so spiteful sir...! See how
good
: > life is without being so angry.
: >
: > As for Kurt, I never bothered ever to read the EULA until his postings,
as
: > for relevancy this is a Windows XP news forum and a general one at that
: > and,
: > EULA is a part of Windows XP. Kurt's posts have been an eye opener
: > regarding
: > the legalities of EULA, and having been involved in four contractual
: > issues,
: > three of which in courts I can concur with Kurt's postings regarding
EULA.
: > You don't have to go too far in contractual law to see the fallacy of
: > EULA.
: >
: > As for insults Kurt has been accused of, come on! How sheltered must
one's
: > life be or have been to be offended by whatever anyone posts on a news
: > server? And how could it even be perceived as personal?
: >
: > It would be more correct to say that Kurt is being censored cause whom
: > ever
: > is doing it ejaculates each time they censor someone. If you don't like
: > reading something, then don't, there's the best for of censorship
Jupiter,
: > having little control of yourself entails not being able to stop or
ignore
: > posts you don't like.
: >
: > Come on Jupiter, admit it, you read all Kurts posts did you????
: >
: > - Winux P
: >
: > : > : Michael;
: > : I can not explain why other dangerous posters do not also have their
: > posts
: > : removed.
: > : Perhaps the person behind it see posts excessively attacking others
and
: > : organizations as more offensive.
: > : Even though these newsgroups are technical, Kurt's constant personal
: > attacks
: > : at times deserve to be removed.
: > : Kurt definitely fits if that is the criteria used.
: > : He has also demonstrated that he cares more about his hate for others
: > than
: > : he does care for peoples rights.
: > : If Kurt truly cared about people, he would not have hoped for harm to
: > come
: > : to my family (he has never met them) simply so he could he have me
: > learn
: > : something he ASSUMES I do not understand.
: > : The others may act the way they do out of ignorance or stupidity, Kurt
: > is
: > : more like blind vengeance.
: > : His posts and website are evidence of this.
: > : That is only one of many possible reasons Kurt may have EARNED what he
: > is
: > : getting.
: > : Kurt has little or no control of himself and likes to whine when
someone
: > : does what he is incapable...control Kurt.
: > :
: > : --
: > : Jupiter Jones [MVP]
: > : http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
: > : http://www.dts-l.org
: > :
: > :
: > : > No, someone is doing a blanket censoring of kurttrails posts. Two of
: > the
: > : > most dangerous technical posters Talahasee and Andrew E continue to
: > post
: > : > unabated, but kurttrail who never posts information that causes data
: > loss
: > : > gets a blanket censor. Something is really wrong with this peer
: > support
: > : > newsgroup. It is no longer truly peer support when this happens. It
is
: > now
: > : > MS moderated, and should be supported by MS as such.
: > : > --
: > : > Michael Stevens MS-MVP XP
: > : > (e-mail address removed)
: > : > http://www.michaelstevenstech.com
: > : > For a better newsgroup experience. Setup a newsreader.
: > : > http://www.michaelstevenstech.com/outlookexpressnewreader.htm
: > : >
: > : >
: > : >
: > :
: > :
: >
: >
:

 

[Leythos]

The point here is censorship and if a huge conglomerate cannot handle the
words of an individual then Jupiter who really is the insecure, the angry,
spiteful and the weak.

Actually, since his posts are still around in the public, his posts were
not technically censored - they were deleted from a usenet server not
owned/operated by Kurt or anyone outside Microsoft, so they are
completely free to moderate their group as they feel it should be.

There is no single RIGHT TO POST, no single right to carry a post,
nothing that states they have to let you rant or act foul, or even act
nice. Your posts show in their server at their whim, just like every
other Usenet server in operation around the world - the owner/admin can
do anything they want.

If you want free speech, get your own webserver and an ISP that has no
sense of ethics and post anything you want.

 

[Winux P]

I'd ask, if were you a diplomat in your past life? But it's true you are in
this life. If I want free speech I'll fight for it. It doesn't come from a
personal webserver. Condoleeza Rice would say something like that Leythos
and, she has an iron fist.

- Winux P

: In article <[email protected]>, (e-mail address removed)
: says...
: >
: > The point here is censorship and if a huge conglomerate cannot handle
the
: > words of an individual then Jupiter who really is the insecure, the
angry,
: > spiteful and the weak.
:
: Actually, since his posts are still around in the public, his posts were
: not technically censored - they were deleted from a usenet server not
: owned/operated by Kurt or anyone outside Microsoft, so they are
: completely free to moderate their group as they feel it should be.
:
: There is no single RIGHT TO POST, no single right to carry a post,
: nothing that states they have to let you rant or act foul, or even act
: nice. Your posts show in their server at their whim, just like every
: other Usenet server in operation around the world - the owner/admin can
: do anything they want.
:
: If you want free speech, get your own webserver and an ISP that has no
: sense of ethics and post anything you want.
:
: --
:
: (e-mail address removed)
: remove 999 in order to email me

 

[Alias]

[snip <<<<< visual indication]

Have you ever considered that war is evil and that torture never has a
justification?

Yes, for a few minutes, I have wondered if war was evil, and I've always
considered it a loss for both sides, but, normally, one side pays a
higher price than the other. In this case, considering what would have
happened had we done nothing, it was the right action and I fully
support it - even to the point of allowing my oldest son to Join the
Military with my blessing.

While you may not value your security, your safety, your fellow country-
mens lives, your freedom, many people around the world do and are
willing to pay for it with more than just lip service.

What the USA is doing today only promotes more war, not the freedom you
think it does. The USA has never been more despised round the world than
today and this can't lead to anything positive, your boilerplate right
wing BS notwithstanding.

The Patriot Act and the other nefarious and unconstitutional shenanigans
that the current administrating is engaging in strips anyone they want
to label as a terrorist of any and all civil rights. Yaknow, like in
China and the old USSR?

Ever hear of the McCarthy Era? Read the book, The Ugly American?

Alias