Mysterious Partition?

[RScotti]

Hi,
I am about to put RC-1 on my HD as soon as I get the DVD. I am going to make a dual boot OS of RC-1 from Win XP.
I noticed that I now have three primary partitions Windows XP. My HP Recovery and an Unallocated partition with 7.8 MB
which is empty.
I sent HP several messages to find out why it is there and if I have to leave it that way but they will not respond
other that saying I need to contact HP Phone support and they will not answer the question. They put me on hold and
never come back.

I hoping that someone with HP experience can answer if I have to leave the 7.8 MB the way it is? When I checked how to
make the new partition it wipes out that 7.8 MB that is in the middle of my XP and Recovery partitions.



Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[Steve]

Hi,
I am about to put RC-1 on my HD as soon as I get the DVD. I am going to make a dual boot OS of RC-1 from Win XP.
I noticed that I now have three primary partitions Windows XP. My HP Recovery and an Unallocated partition with 7.8 MB
which is empty.
I sent HP several messages to find out why it is there and if I have to leave it that way but they will not respond
other that saying I need to contact HP Phone support and they will not answer the question. They put me on hold and
never come back.

I hoping that someone with HP experience can answer if I have to leave the 7.8 MB the way it is? When I checked how to
make the new partition it wipes out that 7.8 MB that is in the middle of my XP and Recovery partitions.

That tiny partition, usually "Unallocated," is of absolutely no
consequence. Whenever a drive is partitioned, either the whole disc
or just a part, it sets the boundary to the nearest lined up sector.
leaving an odd bit leftover. I have not, in many years, ever seen a
hard drive that did not have between 4 and 9 megs "unallocated." Do
you know how small that actually is?

... Steve ..

 

[Tom Ziegmann]

I believe that 7.8 MB partition is where the boot loader for XP is stored,
because when NTFS is used the BIOS cannot read NTFS so the XP install
creates a FAT partition with the bootloader so that XP can boot.

 

[RScotti]

So that means I have to keep it right?
If that is true than I have to create the vista partition before the XP?
I just tried to do that with Partition Magic and it will let me do that although I thought it was better to have Vista
on the other side (right of XP)

I believe that 7.8 MB partition is where the boot loader for XP is stored,
because when NTFS is used the BIOS cannot read NTFS so the XP install
creates a FAT partition with the bootloader so that XP can boot.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[RScotti]

PS,
Tom excuse me if I am stupid but as I said that partition is blank so how can a boot loader be there?

I believe that 7.8 MB partition is where the boot loader for XP is stored,
because when NTFS is used the BIOS cannot read NTFS so the XP install
creates a FAT partition with the bootloader so that XP can boot.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[RScotti]

Hi,
I just read your and Tom's message and what I am concerned with is not the MB's but the Active partition and if there is
a boot loader there. If there is I will loose my capabilities of booting XP.

Since I can only have four active partitions on a HD. I was going to put a mirror of XP there although ROCK said I
should put in on my External HD.

That tiny partition, usually "Unallocated," is of absolutely no
consequence. Whenever a drive is partitioned, either the whole disc
or just a part, it sets the boundary to the nearest lined up sector.
leaving an odd bit leftover. I have not, in many years, ever seen a
hard drive that did not have between 4 and 9 megs "unallocated." Do
you know how small that actually is?

.. Steve ..

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[RScotti]

Hi Again,
I just tried from the left of Win XP and that also wiped out my 7.8 MB. If that is true about the boot loader I can't
install Vista.
Is that correct? I really want to install RC-1.

I believe that 7.8 MB partition is where the boot loader for XP is stored,
because when NTFS is used the BIOS cannot read NTFS so the XP install
creates a FAT partition with the bootloader so that XP can boot.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[Rick Rogers]

The BIOS doesn't read any file system, it simply passes control of the
system to the mbr on the drive selected to boot. The mbr searches for the
bootloader (be that ntldr, io.sys, grub, lilo, etc.) which then reads the
partition table, interprets the file system, and starts loading the
operating system files.

HP's recovery system use that small partition for access to their recovery
partition. The problem that occurs now is that installing Vista redirects
the mbr to it instead of the HP non-standard bootloader (not unlike many
drive overlays and things like GoBack), and the user loses access to the
recovery information on the small FAT partition until they reinstall the
non-standard bootloader (which in itself is not always an easy task).
Machines of this type should not be employed by the casual user for testing
any beta products unless they understand how to recover this information.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP

Windows help - www.rickrogers.org

 

[RScotti]

Hi Rick,
I do have a set of Recovery Disks in addition to the recovery partition from what I understand I can use the disks to
restore that recovery partition as long as I don't delete the recovery partition.
Would you agree with this?
Thanks for your information, it sounds like that is the case. It's no sense putting a blank active partition unless it
has some purpose.

The BIOS doesn't read any file system, it simply passes control of the
system to the mbr on the drive selected to boot. The mbr searches for the
bootloader (be that ntldr, io.sys, grub, lilo, etc.) which then reads the
partition table, interprets the file system, and starts loading the
operating system files.

HP's recovery system use that small partition for access to their recovery
partition. The problem that occurs now is that installing Vista redirects
the mbr to it instead of the HP non-standard bootloader (not unlike many
drive overlays and things like GoBack), and the user loses access to the
recovery information on the small FAT partition until they reinstall the
non-standard bootloader (which in itself is not always an easy task).
Machines of this type should not be employed by the casual user for testing
any beta products unless they understand how to recover this information.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[RScotti]

I do have a set of Recovery Disks in addition to the recovery partition from what I understand I can use the disks to
restore that recovery partition as long as I don't delete the recovery partition.
Would you agree with this?

Also from what I understand Vista would then control the Win XP boot?

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[John Barnes]

Vista cannot control the xp boot, it can only pass control to the xp boot
files. In order to do this the Vista boot loader has to have a legacy entry
pointing to a legacy system.

 

[RScotti]

Hi John,
How can I find this out? If you need something to tell me let me know and I will try to find it for you.

Vista cannot control the xp boot, it can only pass control to the xp boot
files. In order to do this the Vista boot loader has to have a legacy entry
pointing to a legacy system.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

My Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Socket 775 Chipset Intel 945P
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[Kerry Brown]

When you partition a drive with versions of Windows that can use dynamic
drives you will see that unallocated space. It is used if you convert the
drive to dynamic.

 

[RScotti]

Hi Kerry,
I am going to use Partition Magic to make the drives. I don't know if that is a dynamic drive in fact I don't even know
what a dynamic drive is.

My concern is to try and put Vista on a new partition I can get around what Rick said in this thread by using the
Recovery Disks to recreate my recovery partition and be able to dual boot Win XP and Vista that's all I want.
I am very confused so bear with me.

I bought this computer cause it was suppose to be Vista compatible and I am definitely going to either Home Premium or
Ultimate so as long as I can still boot Win XP I am OK.

When you partition a drive with versions of Windows that can use dynamic
drives you will see that unallocated space. It is used if you convert the
drive to dynamic.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

My Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Socket 775 Chipset Intel 945P
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[Kerry Brown]

As long as you are sure you have a recovery process that works you can
safely use Partition Magic to partition the drive however you want. The 8 MB
unallocated space is not needed. If you don't know what dynamic drives are
it is very unlikely you will ever need them. The best way to dual boot Vista
and XP is to use separate drives. Install a new drive and leave all the
space unallocated. Boot to XP, insert the Vista DVD, and install it to the
new drive. This will setup a dual boot configuration with XP on one drive
and Vista on the other. Do not pick the upgrade option as this will
overwrite your XP installation. There are a couple of things to note about
using Vista with HP and some other OEM computers. Vista overwrites the boot
sector which may cause problems with the factory restore process that uses a
restore partition. Make sure you have a different method of restoring back
to your original configuration in case something goes wrong during the
install. The following applies to all computers. Make sure you have a backup
of any important data. Murphy is always waiting in the background.

 

[RScotti]

Hi Kerry,

The best way to dual boot Vista
and XP is to use separate drives.

This is just for a new HD and NOT a partition on a HD right?
If that is so I guess I have to wait for the RTM.


Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

My Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Socket 775 Chipset Intel 945P
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA 7200 rpm
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[Kerry Brown]

You could also do this with a partition on an existing drive. A separate
drive is a little safer but either will work.

 

[RScotti]

Thanks Kerry,
From what you say I can get RC-1 and that makes me very happy.
Now I just have to wait for the postman. Probably another two weeks according to MS.

You could also do this with a partition on an existing drive. A separate
drive is a little safer but either will work.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

My Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Socket 775 Chipset Intel 945P
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA 7200 rpm
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[RScotti]

I just checked PM and it only gives me a choice of a primary or logical partition with NTFS, FAT 32 and FAT. There is no
option to leave it as unallocated.
There is a wizard that you can use for a new O/S but that has the same options.
Can't I just make it a NTFS and just boot from Win XP?

Install a new drive and leave all the
space unallocated.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

My Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Socket 775 Chipset Intel 945P
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA 7200 rpm
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible

 

[RScotti]

Hi again,Kerry
Sorry, I used the wizard and should have just used the move/resize thing. Although I thought it would be easier to make
it a NTFS but NOT active than boot from XP to install. Why not this way?

As long as you are sure you have a recovery process that works you can
safely use Partition Magic to partition the drive however you want. The 8 MB
unallocated space is not needed. If you don't know what dynamic drives are
it is very unlikely you will ever need them. The best way to dual boot Vista
and XP is to use separate drives. Install a new drive and leave all the
space unallocated. Boot to XP, insert the Vista DVD, and install it to the
new drive. This will setup a dual boot configuration with XP on one drive
and Vista on the other. Do not pick the upgrade option as this will
overwrite your XP installation. There are a couple of things to note about
using Vista with HP and some other OEM computers. Vista overwrites the boot
sector which may cause problems with the factory restore process that uses a
restore partition. Make sure you have a different method of restoring back
to your original configuration in case something goes wrong during the
install. The following applies to all computers. Make sure you have a backup
of any important data. Murphy is always waiting in the background.

Have a good day,
RScotti

remove "nospam" in order to email me.

My Specifications:
HP Windows XP MCE 2005 & Vista RC-1
PentiumD 820 (S) DC 2.8 GHz
Socket 775 Chipset Intel 945P
Asus Motherboard Name: P5LP-LE
Memory Installed 2 GB (2 x 1 GB)
Hard drive 250 GB SATA 7200 rpm
Western Digital External HD 500 GB
16X DVD(+/-)R/RW (+/-)R DL LightScribe drive
Nvidia Video Graphics GeForce 7300LE 256 MB
Sound/Audio Integrated High Definition audio
Realtek ALC 882 chipset Supports up to 8 audio channels Dolby Pro Logic II compatible