Legality of installing XP bundled with one computer on another computer

[R. McCarty]

To me I see two distinct types of OEM XP. The first from OEMs like
HP, Dell & Gateway... is a part of the Computer, not sold as a separate
item. The second, a single, OEM copy of XP sold without a computer
for use on a "Single" computer. I can see in the first instance how an XP
license expires because it is considered a physical part of the computer
sold as a "Whole" entity. The second case seems more "Muddy" to me.
If my current XP OEM computer dies - do I throw it, the CD-ROM &
Product key in the dumpster all together ? Or if I build up a new PC to
take it's place do I still own a single OEM license that can be reused ?
I think that differentiation is what clouds the issue on this episode of the
EULA wars.

 

[H. S.]

HS

Taking your point first.. take it up with the corporations.. the computer
manufacturer knows what the OEM agreement entails, the computer stores know
what the agreement entails, and if they don't, they should not be in the
business of selling computers..

They CHOOSE not to make the end user aware because it would jeopardise
sales.. the fact that they choose to un-inform the customer of the
limitations is entirely down to them and their complete and utter lack of
morality.. so talk to them about it.. try to change what is happening out
there.. complain to your government that corporations in your country seem
to have carte blanche to rip you off.. get the consumer laws changed..

Relying on morality is useless, but it shouldn't be, and is a sad reflection
on society as a whole.. the 'oh well, they do it so why shouldn't I" will
not lead to a better society and you know it..

As I had said before, I wasn't talking specifically about OEM and MS
blaming stuff.

Well, if the corporations want they can stop consumers from being
immoral. Something tells me they will never go down that path. They have
the power and money to do so. The fact that they don't speaks a lot.

They have no moral ground to ask their consumers to be moral

 

[ANONYMOUS]

But no refund if you don't agree to the EULA.

NO refund. Sue them if you wnt to. You have the previlege to live in a
democracy and you are entitled to sue anyone who is violating your
rights. Go ahead.

LOL! If someone breaks the EULA, it's up to MS to take them to court.
Activation stops no one.

No MS does not activate the product. PERIOD. You should sue them.

Yep, wait 120 days, reinstall it on another computer and you're done.

This does not apply to OEM versions. Have you tried it or are you
simply talking from your arse? why have you got problems to understand
the question? Have you read the question? If not then do so NOW before
you make a fool of yourself again.

 

[DevilsPGD]

In message <[email protected]> ANONYMOUS

What do you understand by the term COMPUTER? Have you got the slightest
idea what could this term be? I am quite sure what the court will come
out with. It will definitely not what you seem to be thinking.

That's a good point, what is a computer? Can I upgrade my CPU without
it being a new computer? How about RAM?

How about the modem? NIC? Motherboard? Case?

 

[ANONYMOUS]

I have already replied in previous messages what you need to know. Now
let us see you have the guts to sue Microsoft for violating your rights
if any.

Go ahead and let us know how you are getting on.

Thank you.

 

[Alias]

Alias wrote:





NO refund. Sue them if you wnt to. You have the previlege to live in a
democracy and you are entitled to sue anyone who is violating your
rights. Go ahead.





No MS does not activate the product. PERIOD. You should sue them.





This does not apply to OEM versions. Have you tried it or are you
simply talking from your arse? why have you got problems to understand
the question? Have you read the question? If not then do so NOW before
you make a fool of yourself again.

I am referring to generic OEM versions, and you?

Alias

 

[Alias]

I have already replied in previous messages what you need to know.

No, you haven't.

Now
let us see you have the guts to sue Microsoft for violating your rights
if any.

Go ahead and let us know how you are getting on.

Thank you.

Just curious, in your fantasy, I am suing MS for what?

I am getting on fine, thanks.

Alias

 

[ANONYMOUS]

I am referring to generic OEM versions, and you?

I am referring to OEM versions that relates to the question under
consideration. You brain is clearly not in sync with what we are
talking about.

 

[Guest]

This is what I am here for as well. My MB went dead and I bought a new one,
bought a AMD this time too and chunked the Intel. But everything else in my
computer is EXACTLY the same. Except I needed to do a full reinstall and am
having proble with the product key for some reason.

We know they get around selling the OEM with a piece of hardware like a
mouse or something silly. So if the OEM is bound with the product it was sold
with I could move my mouse to a new computer and install it on that. My mouse
is my original computer part it was sold with and the rest is simply an
upgade. LOL or maybe they just sold it to me along with a mouse pad. Is a
mouse pad a hardware? Well it is illuminum for my optical mouse not the
spongy soft one, so it is HARD and it does have some ware and tare on it
HARDWARE?

 

[Guest]

Rene,
Thanks for asking that question. The folks below are correct. Once your
old machine dies, you OEM license dies with it.

You can purchase a new copy of Windows XP Professional. The OEM System
Builder version is probably the least expensive means, but it doesn't include
support from Microsoft as the Retail Box does.

Talk to the company where you purchased your latest computer. They can sell
you a Genuine license.

 

[Mike Hall \(MS-MVP\)]

There is no distinction really.. the generic OEM XP CD in its cute cardboard
packaging exists such that a 'mom and pop' computer store can supply a
'recovery' CD that enables their custom builds to be 'brought back to
factory' as it were, in accordance with pre-installed software being sold as
part of the package.. very few organisations of this type will be able to
afford or have the need to own equipment that allows 30 HDD's to be imaged
all at one time, so the individual generic OEM CD is a godsend..

The fact that these CDs are put on sale by such stores, computer fairs etc
as a cheap way for a user to get XP on an existing system is most likely a
breach of the OEM agreement, especially if the customer is not made aware of
the OEM limitation at the point of sale.. I believe that it states on the
packaging that it should be sold with hardware.. "here, buy it with this $5
mouse.. that's hardware".. nobody can convince me that sellers of the
generic OEM CDs don't know exactly what they are doing.. again, we come to
the morality issue..

How many times have you seen the suggestion in these newsgroups to buy an
OEM generic because it is cheaper.. and how many times do you see any follow
up pointing out why OEM is cheaper?.. some do it, and some don't..
personally, I always recommend that people buy the full version, and I
explain why they should do that..

 

[Mike Hall \(MS-MVP\)]

A computer is a package of parts within a case.. what defines the individual
computer is the motherboard..

 

[Sunny]

Microsoft does not have to take anyone to court. It already has a
system in place which stops you from using the software. It is upto
you, the user,
to take on Microsoft and see if you win. Microsoft will defend itself
in court if needs be but the user has to start the proceedings.

The system in place is called ACTIVATION and as your product will not
activate, MS can remain quiet and wait for you to make the move.

Your info is a tad wrong, OEM copies will activate, and re-activate ;
a. On the original PC,
b. On the original PC after hardware changes, and
c. On another PC after 120 days (approx).
The exeptions are those OEM CDs that have been altered by the "Brandname" PC
manufacturers, to only work with a particular Model PC.
(Many years ago, after complaining to MS OEM Division, that IBM had not
included a "proper" Windows CD, and only a "back to factory settings" CD
that didn't allow me to repair anything, as the files were zipped and
password protected, they sent me an OEM OS CD)

btw, The morality of MS insisting that OEM CDs be scrapped with the PC,
just because they offer them cheaper to manufacturers, in order to capture
more of the consumer market, is a tad low. IMHO

 

[Sunny]

A computer is a package of parts within a case.. what defines the
individual computer is the motherboard..

<snip>
Bit rough, saying the motherboard at $250 defines the $2000 PC ?
(Isn't it about time MS got serious and scrapped OEM CDs ?)

 

[Plato]

Has it ever been tested in court? Until it has it no one knows if it will
stand up. When or if it has it will only be a legal contract in the

Tested in court is NOT the issue. A software author, no matter how large
or small, may write conditions on using/distributing/copying his/her/its
software. No software author actully "sells" the software to you, you
only acquire a "right" to use it.

In other words, the software author is the Landlord and you're the
renter. The Landlord controls the "property".

 

[Guest]

The MB is NOT the defining factor of the computer, a MB can go bad and be
replaced with the exact same or upgraded. It is a part of parts, all parts
must be replaced for it to be a new computer.

As an OEM builder do you think I should throw away the Product Key I put on
the customers computer because of a faulty MB in the duration of the warranty
I give them? No that would be crazy I would loose money each time that
happened. I replace the MB and ship it back and heck the OS won't even know
there is a new board, only if a full HD wipe is required will they need to
re-enter the Product Key and there they use the same one on the side of the
case as before.

If OEM builders can change out the MB because it went bad, the customers can
change out the MB as well.

As long as you are using a single Product Key on one computer, and you dont'
give out the product key and you don't completely change out every single
aspect of the computer then the key is still valid to that user.

 

[Kerry Brown]

Well, Microsoft does not have to take anyone to court. It already
has a system in place which stop you from using the software. It is
upto you to take on Microsoft and see if you win. Microsoft will
defend itself in court if needs be but the user has to start the
proceedings.

The system in place is called ACTIVATION and as your product will not
activate, MS can remain quiet and wait for you to make the move.

This is the best scheme I have come across thus far and it works 99%
of the time.

Generic OEM software will often install and activate on a different pc than
that which it was installed on originally. All you have to do is wait long
enough. The time period seems to be around 120 days. I am one of the few
people who posts here who thinks activation is a good thing. I sell many
more copies of Windows and Office because of it so it has greatly helped my
bottom line. Activation is a tool to fight piracy. It has nothing to do with
proving the legality of the EULA. The EULA is an agreement between two
parties. Only the courts can decide if it is a legally binding agreement. It
is up to the wronged party to sue the other party. If someone installs
Windows on more than one computer or a second computer when the first is
taken out of service then Microsoft is the wronged party so it is up to them
to sue. If a legitimate use of XP results in being denied activation then
the user is the wronged party and they should sue. In the thread under
discussion the user is clearly trying to do something to their advantage not
Microsoft's so why would they sue Microsoft? If they don't get activated and
they've admitted in a public forum they read the EULA and didn't abide by it
then I don't think many courts would side with them. I don't think a ruling
of this sort would prove the EULA is legally binding in other cases. It
would only prove Microsoft's right to deny activation.

Kerry

 

[Kerry Brown]

Tested in court is NOT the issue. A software author, no matter how
large or small, may write conditions on using/distributing/copying
his/her/its software. No software author actully "sells" the software
to you, you only acquire a "right" to use it.

In other words, the software author is the Landlord and you're the
renter. The Landlord controls the "property".

All agreements can be tested in court. This one hasn't. I can state anything
I want when I sell a pc or software. That does not make it legally binding
on the purchaser. If one party thinks the other party has not lived up to
the agreement then they take them to court. That's how the common law system
works. Now if you are talking civil law then maybe you are right but even
then I think it would have to go to court to be sure.

 

[Plato]

All agreements can be tested in court. This one hasn't. I can state anything
I want when I sell a pc or software. That does not make it legally binding
on the purchaser. If one party thinks the other party has not lived up to
the agreement then they take them to court. That's how the common law system
works. Now if you are talking civil law then maybe you are right but even
then I think it would have to go to court to be sure.

Yes of course I agree that any "contract" or "agreement" can be tested
in court. And yes one can state whatever you want when you sell
software.

As an example, when you go park your car at a pay lot or in a hotel's
parking deck, the ticket you get *always* says "We are not responsible
for any damage to your car while it is in our lot". Which is untrue.
You are paying for a safe parking spot. If any damage happens the
business you paid to park at is responsible for covering. The "ticket"
you get with the "not responsible" part is only there to minimize
claims.

Yes, the parking thing has been tested in court, and the lot has been
proven to be responsible. But, they *can* still print whatever they want
on the ticket even if it's been proven in court to be a non-binding
agreement. Heck, you dont get the ticket or
"agreement" until you pay first anyway Just like MS

So, since the MS Legality issue has NOT been tested in court yet, I
would think its responsible to respect the software Author's wishes.
Yes, MS being a jillion dollar company may cloud the view, but would you
say the same if using a small $10 shareware util program written by some
lad in Ireland?

 

[Plato]

parties. Only the courts can decide if it is a legally binding agreement. It
is up to the wronged party to sue the other party. If someone installs
Windows on more than one computer or a second computer when the first is
taken out of service then Microsoft is the wronged party so it is up to them
to sue. If a legitimate use of XP results in being denied activation then
the user is the wronged party and they should sue. In the thread under

It's not a big enough issue to sue or take to small claims court.
Suppose I bought the latest XP2 for $89 and want to put in on 2 pcs. And
I drive a van delivering autoparts for ten bucks/hour. I'd have to take
half a day off to file the case at the county courthouse, then a day [or
more] to appear in court. I'd be out 12 hours of work, or $120.

Yes, I've had such a job before and no, it wouldn't be worth the cost
and hassle.