Kodak 5300 print problems

[measekite]

Ron Baird wrote:

Greetings Greg, I can appreciate your frustration. I am taking your experience back to the engineers I know so they are aware of your situation. They appreciate feedback like this.


You should be on Kodak Tech Support and not conduct your PR in this NG/  It is not a for sale or for corporation ng.  Apparently he thinks the product is not what it should be.  I have not seen very much that is positive other than the selling price of the ink.  But based on how much is wasted and if you buy the premium package that produces the better results nobody really knows what you are saving after you factor in the high cost of the printer.




snip


Ron Baird Eastman Kodak Company "the-changling" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...



I love this printer when it works. But I do not print constantly. The printer can be turned off for maybe a month or more. But when I need it I need it. I had no problems over the years with my old Canon Bubblejet 4300. But they do not make ink anymore so I got rid of it and got the Kodak 5300. After a month off I tried printing and it was very poor text. After calling their tech support, they sent a new print head and ink. Printer was working flawlessly once again! Now after an extended time turned off it is acting like a clogged print head again. I called tech support again. They told me to keep deep cleaning until the quality was good. They did not know how many that would be. But that was the best they can do. Is this normal for this printer? I am thinking it is. Thanks in advance. -- [email protected]

 

[measekite]

Jan Alter wrote:

"Ron Baird" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...



Greetings Greg, I can appreciate your frustration. I am taking your experience back to the engineers I know so they are aware of your situation. They appreciate feedback like this. Actually, this condition might arise you may do not use your printer on a regular basis. Personally, it has been my experience that if you do not print often but leave the printer on when not in use, it will go through a general startup process when you boot up your computer. Generally, when you do, many do this every day, the printer will prepare itself for printing in case you want to use it. If you do not print anything, however, or let it sit idle without power, you have a greater chance of needing to clean the head. I suspect this is something that might happen to other printers as well. I know that with a couple of previous printers that I have had, i.e. an Epson R200, and other Epsons, in the past that this happened to me from time to time. The heads cleared but it cost me the expense of doing the cleaning. I know it can get expensive. Anyway, what I did was create a brief document that had all the colors and black text then saved it as a file that I keep handy. The amount of ink used is small. I make a print of it each week if I do not print some other document. If I do make this print, I then flip over the paper and print the same document on the other side to save paper. Doing this keeps my printer ready for action. If you supply power to the printer, this may not happen as often. I do not have a Kodak printer at home but I am sure this process would work as well.


What they should do is have replaceable printheads like Canon sold at a reasonable price, user changeable waste tanks, permanent ink tanks (6 to 8) and sell the ink in both 4 and 8 ounce bottles for about $2.00 an ounce so one could still use the ink the printer is designed for.  As a matter of fact all of the printer companies should do this.

Even better there should be 8 to 10 receptacles on top of the printhead with sepecial bottles that press in and you do not even have to refill anyrthing.  Just open the cap and place the printer siphon cap on the bottle.


Talk to you soon, Greg, Ron Baird Eastman Kodak Company "the-changling" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...



I love this printer when it works. But I do not print constantly. The printer can be turned off for maybe a month or more. But when I need it I need it. I had no problems over the years with my old Canon Bubblejet 4300. But they do not make ink anymore so I got rid of it and got the Kodak 5300. After a month off I tried printing and it was very poor text. After calling their tech support, they sent a new print head and ink. Printer was working flawlessly once again! Now after an extended time turned off it is acting like a clogged print head again. I called tech support again. They told me to keep deep cleaning until the quality was good. They did not know how many that would be. But that was the best they can do. Is this normal for this printer? I am thinking it is. Thanks in advance. -- [email protected]







Hi Greg, What you are suggesting is common and standard practice for inkjet technology in order to keep the heads clear. With many cars the manufacturer sets a standard of changing oil every 5000 - 7000 miles or 3 months (whether or not the vehicle is used, and assuming it is being run, but infrequently) as a comparison to needed maintenance. Since the Kodak is a new kid on the block some folks seem to expect something revolutionary out of its design besides somewhat cheaper ink. Now if Kodak wanted to gain some real noteworthiness and be first they might consider designing an inkjet printer with easily refillable cartridges. They'd gain glory by reusing the cartridges and truly save folks money and resources. Think of the PR and accolades from environmentalists, Consumers Union and NPR. That all translates into more business. Sell the printer for double its current price and ink in bulk for something closer and cheaper than what it really costs to make and folks will still stand in line to get one of those printers. "The Peoples' Printer" At that rate Kodak would even be giving the non-OEM inks a run for their business.

 

[Arthur Entlich]

As I mentioned in earlier posts, your household climate may alter how a
printer performs. Higher humidity locations, less clogging.

Also, how the ink is formulated can be critical. Dye inks have much
lower clogging problems. Pigment inks may not have resins in them,
meaning they only work with bond paper but not with glossy or specialty
papers.

And also, the dot size used can make a difference to the clogging, but
also the print quality. It isn't "black and white" as it may appear.


Art

 

[Arthur Entlich]

Hi Ron,

Your answer is not unreasonable in the light of the issues with inkjet
printers, but it is disappointing that it appears no one can design a
printer using pigmented inks, especially one with semi-permanent or
permanent inks, which will stay unclogged. As I mentioned in another
posting, the Epson Ultrachromes come closest, but they resolve this by
using a high glycol formulation which gases off the glycol for weeks or
months and is very slow to "dry" (the output is touch dry on output from
the printer, but it isn't really).

I did hope Kodak had overcome this in the head design or ink
formulation. If the only solution is a test printout or similar answer,
why not make it part of the printer firmware and be done with it, and be
upfront about it.

Art

Greetings Greg,

I can appreciate your frustration. I am taking your experience back to the
engineers I know so they are aware of your situation. They appreciate
feedback like this.

Actually, this condition might arise you may do not use your printer on a
regular basis. Personally, it has been my experience that if you do not
print often but leave the printer on when not in use, it will go through a
general startup process when you boot up your computer. Generally, when you
do, many do this every day, the printer will prepare itself for printing in
case you want to use it. If you do not print anything, however, or let it
sit idle without power, you have a greater chance of needing to clean the
head. I suspect this is something that might happen to other printers as
well. I know that with a couple of previous printers that I have had, i.e.
an Epson R200, and other Epsons, in the past that this happened to me from
time to time. The heads cleared but it cost me the expense of doing the
cleaning. I know it can get expensive.

Anyway, what I did was create a brief document that had all the colors and
black text then saved it as a file that I keep handy. The amount of ink used
is small. I make a print of it each week if I do not print some other
document. If I do make this print, I then flip over the paper and print the
same document on the other side to save paper. Doing this keeps my printer
ready for action. If you supply power to the printer, this may not happen as
often. I do not have a Kodak printer at home but I am sure this process
would work as well.

Talk to you soon, Greg,

Ron Baird
Eastman Kodak Company

 

[Arthur Entlich]

As much as my heart is with you, too bad Kodak would have to charge 3
times as much for the printer purchase as equivalent printers are sold
by their competition, and very few would be sold as a result.

Art

 

[Arthur Entlich]

Hi Greg,

Ron may be correct that running a small document once ever 4 days or a
week may use less in than the deep cleaning cycles.


Since I have now asked Ron publicly, and he has to date ignored or not
replied to my request in regard to the amount of each color ink in the 5
color cartridge, since you own one, perhaps you might have a sense of
this, either by some specific tests or results you have, or by the size
of the color chambers within the cartridge.

It is fairly well known that in a 4 color printer (CMYK) the yellow ink
typically runs out first followed by the magenta and then cyan, but they
are relatively close to one another in "normal" well rounded photo printing.

However, in the case of 6 color printing (CcMmYk) the light magenta and
light cyan followed by the yellow are the first three to go in most
cases. Depending upon the way the driver uses these colors, the light M
and C often are used up at nearly twice the volume of the other colors.

So, since Kodak is using a ganged ink cartridge with CcMmY in one and K
in the other, I was wondering if you had any idea about the ink volume
of each color when the cartridge is new. Do you have any idea about this?

Art

 

[Frank]

You should be on Kodak Tech Support and not conduct your PR in this NG/
It is not a for sale or for corporation ng.

And you should shut your stupid ignorant mouth before whats left or your
pea sized brain leaks out onto the floor.
Nobody cares about you or your ignorant uninformed/ill informed opinions.

That Ron is here, identified as an employee of Kodak and is trying to
help posters is ranter significant compared to the utter chaos you
create and the outright crap you post.
My advice is for you to go away and play with your little nikon and
pretend you're a photographer and never show your dumbass around here again.
Now that's very good advice.
Frank

 

[Jerry1111]

Hi Greg,

Ron may be correct that running a small document once ever 4 days or a
week may use less in than the deep cleaning cycles.

I'd agree with that.

It is fairly well known that in a 4 color printer (CMYK) the yellow ink
typically runs out first followed by the magenta and then cyan, but they
are relatively close to one another in "normal" well rounded photo
printing.

However, in the case of 6 color printing (CcMmYk) the light magenta and
light cyan followed by the yellow are the first three to go in most
cases.

Nope. Yellow is always first ;-)
At least in a HP C5180.

 

[measekite]

Hi Greg,

Ron may be correct that running a small document once ever 4 days or a
week may use less in than the deep cleaning cycles.

Now that means that you cannot take a weeks vacation.

 

[Burt]

I'd agree with that.

Nope. Yellow is always first ;-)
At least in a HP C5180.

Jerry1111

Jerry - My experience is pretty much the same as Art's - photo printing with
my Canon i960 (six color) uses light cyan and light magenta at approximately
twice the amount as cyan and magenta. Yellow is used at about 1 1/2 times
the cyan and magenta, and black is used least. If you look on the
Nifty-Stuff Forum for a post by Grandad35 that was some years ago he charted
ink use in his Canon i9900 (eight color printer). His info on each ink
color usage is much more precise as he also includes the number of prints as
well. Ink usage in the i9900 is similar to my i960. The interesting
difference, having to do with red and green carts, is the very little red
and green ink usage in photo printing. My Canon ip5000 (cmyk plus pigmented
black for text) uses more yellow, followed by the cyan and magenta, with
black used least when photo printing. It makes sense as yellow is used to
blend colors with both cyan and magenta in addition to being used itself for
yellow areas in a print.

 

[Jerry1111]

Jerry - My experience is pretty much the same as Art's - photo printing with
my Canon i960 (six color) uses light cyan and light magenta at approximately
twice the amount as cyan and magenta. Yellow is used at about 1 1/2 times
the cyan and magenta, and black is used least.

Don't know why - maybe different manufacturers are mixing colors a bit
differently or, and that's probably the cause, I'm having a date-stamp
on all my photos (and it's of course yellow).
Or maybe they're having different capacities per color.

When my yellow tank is empty I usually refill all 5 carts (black usually
doesn't need refill). Next time refill again starts from yellow. Did
that 6 or 7 times - always yellow is the first one. Amounts of other
inks are different from time to time (I think just because of different
photos).

 

[Greg Cisko]

As I mentioned in earlier posts, your household climate may alter how a
printer performs. Higher humidity locations, less clogging.

Also, how the ink is formulated can be critical. Dye inks have much lower
clogging problems. Pigment inks may not have resins in them, meaning they
only work with bond paper but not with glossy or specialty papers.

And also, the dot size used can make a difference to the clogging, but
also the print quality. It isn't "black and white" as it may appear.

Well at least you did not say the problem was bad AC power

I actually had some printer repair people tell me this over the years.
BTW, as part of my real job I support 2 dozen network printners.
There range from HP8150's to Xeron 8200's and more. So it isn't
like this is my first BBQ dealing with printers.

Thanks for everyone with helpful advice. I appreciated it.

 

[Greg Cisko]

So, since Kodak is using a ganged ink cartridge with CcMmY in one and K in
the other, I was wondering if you had any idea about the ink volume of
each color when the cartridge is new. Do you have any idea about this?

Just by looking at the color cartridge, it looks like 5 equal size
ink compartments.

 

[Arthur Entlich]

Oh, I forgot to mention it could be dirty power. Sometimes it coems dow
the wires in clumps which can clog the heads ;-)

Art

 

[Arthur Entlich]

Thanks, that may explain why I can't get a "semiofficial" response...

Art

 

[Greg Cisko]

Oh, I forgot to mention it could be dirty power. Sometimes it coems dow
the wires in clumps which can clog the heads ;-)

This is usually where I call my helpdesk and tell them to get
another printer repair person in. Someone that can actually
fix the printer

 

[Tony]

Art
Clumpy power is the cause of many problems, not just in printers but vacuum
cleaners, washing machines and of course microwaves. Fortunately there is a
very simple solution.
The clumpy power conditioner (patents pending), it fixes all known clumpy power
problems.........at a price.
It weighs about 3 tons but if you would like one I will send you a prototype at
no charge (except for freight).
Regards
Tony

 

[Ron Baird]

Hi Greg,

I believe that the ink goes into a holding area and likely dries or is
simply collected there. Leaving your printer off and the heads parked is a
good idea and will preserve the ink as best you can over time. Infrequent
use, however, can require cleaning the head etc. and so will take some ink
for that function. Personally, I leave the Epson and a Kodak when I have it
with me, on all the time.

The truth will set you free. I always the what I know and Kodak did not
offer a printer for some time. So, I bought an Epson which I like. Does a
great job on Kodak paper as well. But, when I save my pennies, I will likely
buy a Kodak as it will save me money in the long run.

Glad that the issue cleared itself up. Let me know if you have any issues or
if you think I can help.

Ron Baird
Eastman Kodak Company

Ron,

Thanks much for the reply. I keep the printer off when I do not
use it. That way I figured the print heads would be "parked" (and
therefore sealed) and would not dry out. So I figured it should
not matter how long it is unused. Deep cleaning did eventually
fix everything, but it sucked up on black and one color cartridge.
Where did the ink go?it has to go somewhere. Deep cleaning does
not involve printing, yet it is using some ink . The ink has to go
somewhere.

BTW, very brave of you to mention you do not have a Kodak
printer at home

 

[Ron Baird]

Greetings Mease,

The printhead is replaceable, and they are reasonable. They should not need replacing very often, however, if ever. I am sure our engineers will appreciate your comments as well. Thanks!

Ron Baird
Eastman Kodak Company


Jan Alter wrote:
Greetings Greg,

I can appreciate your frustration. I am taking your experience back to the
engineers I know so they are aware of your situation. They appreciate
feedback like this.

Actually, this condition might arise you may do not use your printer on a
regular basis. Personally, it has been my experience that if you do not
print often but leave the printer on when not in use, it will go through a
general startup process when you boot up your computer. Generally, when
you do, many do this every day, the printer will prepare itself for
printing in case you want to use it. If you do not print anything,
however, or let it sit idle without power, you have a greater chance of
needing to clean the head. I suspect this is something that might happen
to other printers as well. I know that with a couple of previous printers
that I have had, i.e. an Epson R200, and other Epsons, in the past that
this happened to me from time to time. The heads cleared but it cost me
the expense of doing the cleaning. I know it can get expensive.

Anyway, what I did was create a brief document that had all the colors and
black text then saved it as a file that I keep handy. The amount of ink
used is small. I make a print of it each week if I do not print some other
document. If I do make this print, I then flip over the paper and print
the same document on the other side to save paper. Doing this keeps my
printer ready for action. If you supply power to the printer, this may not
happen as often. I do not have a Kodak printer at home but I am sure this
process would work as well.

What they should do is have replaceable printheads like Canon sold at a reasonable price, user changeable waste tanks, permanent ink tanks (6 to 8) and sell the ink in both 4 and 8 ounce bottles for about $2.00 an ounce so one could still use the ink the printer is designed for. As a matter of fact all of the printer companies should do this.

Even better there should be 8 to 10 receptacles on top of the printhead with sepecial bottles that press in and you do not even have to refill anyrthing. Just open the cap and place the printer siphon cap on the bottle.

Talk to you soon, Greg,

Ron Baird
Eastman Kodak Company





I love this printer when it works. But I do not print constantly. The
printer can be turned off for maybe a month or more. But when I need
it I need it. I had no problems over the years with my old Canon
Bubblejet 4300. But they do not make ink anymore so I got rid of it
and got the Kodak 5300. After a month off I tried printing and it was
very poor text. After calling their tech support, they sent a new
print head and ink. Printer was working flawlessly once again! Now
after an extended time turned off it is acting like a clogged print
head again. I called tech support again. They told me to keep deep
cleaning until the quality was good. They did not know how many that
would be. But that was the best they can do.

Is this normal for this printer? I am thinking it is.

Thanks in advance.

--
(e-mail address removed)


Hi Greg,

What you are suggesting is common and standard practice for inkjet
technology in order to keep the heads clear. With many cars the
manufacturer sets a standard of changing oil every 5000 - 7000 miles or 3
months (whether or not the vehicle is used, and assuming it is being run,
but infrequently) as a comparison to needed maintenance.
Since the Kodak is a new kid on the block some folks seem to expect
something revolutionary out of its design besides somewhat cheaper ink.
Now if Kodak wanted to gain some real noteworthiness and be first they
might consider designing an inkjet printer with easily refillable
cartridges. They'd gain glory by reusing the cartridges and truly save folks
money and resources. Think of the PR and accolades from environmentalists,
Consumers Union and NPR. That all translates into more business. Sell the
printer for double its current price and ink in bulk for something closer
and cheaper than what it really costs to make and folks will still stand in
line to get one of those printers. "The Peoples' Printer" At that rate Kodak
would even be giving the non-OEM inks a run for their business.

 

[Ron Baird]

Hi Art,

I have a friend that worked in the designing of the inks and the chemistry
used. Although I am not a chemist, I suspect that Kodak is working on such
technology as I know they spent a considerable amount of money creating inks
that can yield the results they are getting.

As you know, it is quite hard to get ink to work in low picoliter
distribution and stay soluble. My friend shared some of this with me, but I
had no idea what he was talking about. He moved on down south and the
chemistry he does now is mixing a drink after playing golf.

I can say, however, that those like him here at Kodak truly know their
stuff. Expect great things.

Talk to you soon Art,

Ron Baird
Eastman Kodak Company

Hi Ron,

Your answer is not unreasonable in the light of the issues with inkjet
printers, but it is disappointing that it appears no one can design a
printer using pigmented inks, especially one with semi-permanent or
permanent inks, which will stay unclogged. As I mentioned in another
posting, the Epson Ultrachromes come closest, but they resolve this by
using a high glycol formulation which gases off the glycol for weeks or
months and is very slow to "dry" (the output is touch dry on output from
the printer, but it isn't really).

I did hope Kodak had overcome this in the head design or ink formulation.
If the only solution is a test printout or similar answer, why not make it
part of the printer firmware and be done with it, and be upfront about it.

Art