FAT32 v. NTFS

  • Thread starter Thread starter Tony Stanford
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T

Tony Stanford

Hi -

Can someone give me a bit of simple advice, please?

I'm buying a laptop with Windowsxp which I intend to network (802.11)
with my desktop. It will be a peer to peer network, ie, I will be
accessing files and printers from each machine, in each direction.

If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read files on
it from and to the Win98 machine? Or must I have the XP machine
formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?

Many thanks

Tony
 
Tony said:
Hi -

Can someone give me a bit of simple advice, please?

I'm buying a laptop with Windowsxp which I intend to network (802.11)
with my desktop. It will be a peer to peer network, ie, I will be
accessing files and printers from each machine, in each direction.

If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read files
on it from and to the Win98 machine? Or must I have the XP machine
formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?

In a network, the file system on the "other" system(s) is irrelevant.
 
[X-Posting w/o F'up2 trimmed]
If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read files
on it from and to the Win98 machine?
Yes.

Or must I have the XP machine
formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?

No.
 
Many thanks for the replies.

I'm ignorant about XP, I'm afraid. Is there an advantage to having FAT32
vs NTFS?

Thanks

Tony
 
Tony said:
Hi -

Can someone give me a bit of simple advice, please?

I'm buying a laptop with Windowsxp which I intend to network (802.11)
with my desktop. It will be a peer to peer network, ie, I will be
accessing files and printers from each machine, in each direction.

If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read files on
it from and to the Win98 machine? Or must I have the XP machine
formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?

Many thanks

Tony


The file systems on the various computers communicating over a
network are completely irrelevant, as none of the individual computers'
operating systems ever directly access the other computers' hard drives.
Instead, a computer sends a "request," if you will, for the desired
data, and the operating system of the host ("receiving") computer
accesses its own hard drive (whose file system it obviously can read)
and then sends that data back to the requesting computer as neutral
packets of information that are completely independent of the file
systems on the respective computers. After all, don't you use a
Windows-based PC (whether it's FAT32 or NTFS) to access data stored on
the Internet's mostly Unix servers, which use a completely different
file system?

Personally, I wouldn't even consider using FAT32 when NTFS is an
option. FAT32 has no security capabilities, no compression
capabilities, no fault tolerance, and a lot of wasted hard drive space
on volumes larger than 8 Gb in size. But your computing needs may
vary, and there is no hard and fast answer.

To answer your questions without getting too technical is
difficult, but has been handled quite well by the late Alex Nichol in
the article here:

FAT & NTFS File Systems in Windows XP
http://www.aumha.org/a/ntfs.htm

Somewhat more technical information is here:

Limitations of the FAT32 File System in Windows XP
http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=kb;en-us;Q314463

Choosing Between File Systems
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/tr...prodtechnol/winntas/tips/techrep/filesyst.asp

NTFS file system
http://www.digit-life.com/articles/ntfs/

On the WinXP computer, create local user account(s), with non-blank
password(s), that have the desired access privileges to the desired
shares. Log on to the other PCs using those account(s), and you will be
able to access the designated shares, provided your network is
configured properly. Also, if running WinXP SP1 or later, make sure
that WinXP's built-in firewall is disabled on the internal LAN
connection. If using WinXP SP2, make sure that you've either disabled
the built-in firewall, or set the firewall to allow file and print sharing.

Usually, WinXP's Networking Wizard makes it simple and painless --
almost entirely automatic, in fact. There's a lot of useful,
easy-to-follow information in WinXP's Help & Support files, and here:

Home Networking
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/home/using/howto/homenet/default.asp

Networking Information
http://www.onecomputerguy.com/networking.htm

PracticallyNetworked Home
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/index.htm

Steve Winograd's Networking FAQ
http://www.bcmaven.com/networking/faq.htm


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once. - RAH
 
Great help. Many thanks!

Tony

Hi -
Can someone give me a bit of simple advice, please?
I'm buying a laptop with Windowsxp which I intend to network
(802.11) with my desktop. It will be a peer to peer network, ie, I
will be accessing files and printers from each machine, in each
direction.
If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read
files on it from and to the Win98 machine? Or must I have the XP
machine formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?
Many thanks
Tony


The file systems on the various computers communicating over a
network are completely irrelevant, as none of the individual computers'
operating systems ever directly access the other computers' hard
drives. Instead, a computer sends a "request," if you will, for the
desired data, and the operating system of the host ("receiving")
computer accesses its own hard drive (whose file system it obviously
can read) and then sends that data back to the requesting computer as
neutral packets of information that are completely independent of the
file systems on the respective computers. After all, don't you use a
Windows-based PC (whether it's FAT32 or NTFS) to access data stored on
the Internet's mostly Unix servers, which use a completely different file system?

Personally, I wouldn't even consider using FAT32 when NTFS is an
option. FAT32 has no security capabilities, no compression
capabilities, no fault tolerance, and a lot of wasted hard drive space
on volumes larger than 8 Gb in size. But your computing needs may
vary, and there is no hard and fast answer.

To answer your questions without getting too technical is
difficult, but has been handled quite well by the late Alex Nichol in
the article here:

FAT & NTFS File Systems in Windows XP
http://www.aumha.org/a/ntfs.htm

Somewhat more technical information is here:

Limitations of the FAT32 File System in Windows XP
http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=kb;en-us;Q314463

Choosing Between File Systems
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/TechNet/prodt
echnol/winntas/tips/techrep/filesyst.asp

NTFS file system
http://www.digit-life.com/articles/ntfs/

On the WinXP computer, create local user account(s), with non-blank
password(s), that have the desired access privileges to the desired
shares. Log on to the other PCs using those account(s), and you will
be able to access the designated shares, provided your network is
configured properly. Also, if running WinXP SP1 or later, make sure
that WinXP's built-in firewall is disabled on the internal LAN
connection. If using WinXP SP2, make sure that you've either disabled
the built-in firewall, or set the firewall to allow file and print sharing.

Usually, WinXP's Networking Wizard makes it simple and painless --
almost entirely automatic, in fact. There's a lot of useful,
easy-to-follow information in WinXP's Help & Support files, and here:

Home Networking
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/home/using/howto/homenet/default.asp

Networking Information
http://www.onecomputerguy.com/networking.htm

PracticallyNetworked Home
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/index.htm

Steve Winograd's Networking FAQ
http://www.bcmaven.com/networking/faq.htm
[/QUOTE]
 
Tony said:
Great help. Many thanks!

Tony

You're welcome


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once. - RAH
 
Tony said:
I'm buying a laptop with Windowsxp which I intend to network (802.11)
with my desktop. It will be a peer to peer network, ie, I will be
accessing files and printers from each machine, in each direction.

If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read files on
it from and to the Win98 machine? Or must I have the XP machine
formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?

Yes you will be able to read files on the NTFS pc with the win98 pc. The
network doesn't care what file system you have setup on each pc.
 
On Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:54:25 +0000 (UTC), Tony Stanford
I'm buying a laptop with Windowsxp which I intend to network (802.11)
with my desktop. It will be a peer to peer network, ie, I will be
accessing files and printers from each machine, in each direction.

Cabled network, or WiFi?

If WiFi, consider "your" network as potentially unbounded, no matter
how good your Internet barriers (e.g. NAT router) may be.

That would push you towards NTFS, as part of an attempt to say "you
have to successfully pretend to be the System Administrator before
you're allowed to do that". That cuts down attacks to those malware
and attackers who successfullt pretend to be System Administrator.

If OTOH you have a NAT router to hide your network from the Internet,
and the need for a physical cable connection to be on the LAN, then
you have less need to rely on password band-aids.
If I have the XP machine formatted NTFS, will I be able to read files on
it from and to the Win98 machine? Or must I have the XP machine
formatted FAT32 as well to enable file transfer?

When you access computer A's files from computer B, as is the case via
Internet or network, only computer A has to understand computer A's
file system. So you'd only be forced to stay FATxx if you wanted to
actually run Win98 (or its DOS mode) on that PC, and that's not
possible (safe) if the hard drive is > 137G in size.

See http://cquirke.mvps.org/ntfs.htm

Most folks will say things like "use NTFS it's more secure" or "use
NTFS it's more robust". One could just as easily say "avoid NTFS
because there's hardly any low-level data recovery tools".

So: If you share the PC with people you don't trust, or you open up
your network via WiFi, or you'd rather lose your data than let someone
else see it - then NTFS is for you. NTFS is also your only choice if
you work with files over 2G or 4G in size, e.g. mastering DVDs

OTOH, if you don't have such good backups that you don't care what
happens to what is on your hard drive, then you're better off on
FATxx. If you want to run Winx or DOS mode on the same PC, then FATxx
is your only choice for that.

Then again, you can use both, setting up different volumes for each.

On robustness and data recovery: If you make the whole HD one big C:,
then FAT32 may be more likely to get corrupted than NTFS. But bad
RAM, bad hard drive, or deliberate malware attack will damage or
destroy either file system with equal ease.

If you *do* have file system corruption, your NTFS management tools
are as useless as hitting a broken clock with a hammer in the hope
that the right parts will fall into the right places.

You might have to have a clock-maker's skills to recover data from
FAT32 (as opposed to proprietary intra-chip skills to do the same for
NTFS), but at least the tools are there so you (or whoever you hire)
can apply that know-how to good effect.


-------------------- ----- ---- --- -- - - - -
Tip Of The Day:
To disable the 'Tip of the Day' feature...
 
On Mon, 15 Aug 2005,18:39:01, cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote
If you want to run Winx or DOS mode on the same PC, then FATxx
is your only choice for tha

Many thanks for your highly detailed reply. With an 80gig drive, I think
I'll go for NTS. But your comment above...won't DOS programs run in CMD
mode/CMD box?

Tony
 
That comment was for "dual-boot" systems. If you are not considering to set
up a "dual-boot" system then it should not apply.

Yes, most DOS program should run in the CMD box. However, sevveral
limitations do apply:

Any program that check and fixes files may have problems.
Most DOS based games will either have no sound or run extremely
fast. DOSBox should fix the sound issue.
 
the said:
On Sun, 14 Aug 2005 19:54:25 +0000 (UTC), Tony Stanford
Cabled network, or WiFi?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAH! You chopfucked, know-nothing cuntfungus.

MVP = Most Valueless Prostitute.

<shakes head>
**** me dead. Amazing.
 
Many thanks for your highly detailed reply. With an 80gig drive, I think
I'll go for NTS. But your comment above...won't DOS programs run in CMD
mode/CMD box?

Yes they will, but that's not running Win9x or DOS mode.

Whether you use NT's Cmd.exe, legacy Command.com, or are simply
running programs written for DOS directly, if they are in XP, they are
not running in DOS (mode) - the underlying OS is XP.

So there's the full XP layer of driver and file system support. As
long as the DOS programs stick to the approved level of abstraction,
i.e. opening files to read and write etc., there's no problem; LFNs
and NTFS are hidden from the program.

But if the program tries to go deeper than these "normal" APIs, as
low-level disk utilities etc. do, then that won't be allowed. I'd
expect XP to successfullt defend itself against such attempts, so
there shouldn't be much risk of file system corruption.

Incidentally, the same thing happens in Win9x GUI; Command.com running
within those Windows versions is not "running on DOS" either. Once
again, the underlying Windows OS provides its own level of driver and
file system support, though it is more likely to allow raw hardware
access in the interests of better backward compatibility.

With an 80G HD, I'd be more inclined to partition for speed and data
safety, and then consider what file systems I'd use for each volume.

Simply partitioning a drive doesn't automagically add safety or speed;
it merely facilitates the ability to do so. Depending on size and
order of volumes, as well as what is allowed to go where, you could
break even on data safety and do far worse on performance - or you
could do a lot better in both categories.

But that's another story ;-)

If you do commit to one big C: that's NTFS, then proceed as if data
recovery will be impossible and (within scenarios such as bad RAM,
failing HD, malware payload, "oops I deleted something can I get it
back") data loss almost inevitable. Make and keep lots of backups.


------------ ----- ---- --- -- - - - -
The most accurate diagnostic instrument
in medicine is the Retrospectoscope
 
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005,13:55:57, cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote
Simply partitioning a drive doesn't automagically add safety or speed;
it merely facilitates the ability to do so. Depending on size and
order of volumes, as well as what is allowed to go where, you could
break even on data safety and do far worse on performance - or you
could do a lot better in both categories.

A very helpful and interesting reply. I've ordered the machine now, and
it will come as one big 80gig C:, NTFS. Are you suggesting I should
partition it into smaller partitions to increase performance? Would it
make much difference?

And is NTFS like FAT32 - if you repartition, you have to scrub the disk
and reinstall everything?

Thanks for the advice,

Tony
 
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005,13:55:57, cquirke (MVP Windows shell/user) wrote


A very helpful and interesting reply. I've ordered the machine now, and
it will come as one big 80gig C:, NTFS. Are you suggesting I should
partition it into smaller partitions to increase performance? Would it
make much difference?

And is NTFS like FAT32 - if you repartition, you have to scrub the disk
and reinstall everything?
If you use a tool like Partition Magic, you do not have to scrub
everything to repartition.
 
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005,17:05:31, here_and_there wrote
If you use a tool like Partition Magic, you do not have to scrub
everything to repartition.

Right. Presumably you've used it, and it lives up to its claims?
 

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