Fade resistent Canon aftermarket ink?

[sam]

I have a Canon IP5000 which does a fine job.
I use it for photos and general purpose printing.
I have been refilling with MIS with pretty good
results, but looking for better

I am looking for aftermarket ink that will be as
fade resistant as the Canon ink. After trying several
different brands and reading many reviews I can't
seem to find any as good. Even various vendors
say their ink is not quite as good as Canon.

I am now thinking of getting an IP4200 for photo
printing and using aftermarket ink in the IP5000
for general purpose printing. The IP4200 sells
for about what an set of ink cartridges sell for.
I have even seen new IP4200 for $50 with the
UPC code removed.

In the past I bough 2 IP4200's that were both
DOA. Any suggestions appreciated

 

[Frank]

I have a Canon IP5000 which does a fine job.
I use it for photos and general purpose printing.
I have been refilling with MIS with pretty good
results, but looking for better

I am looking for aftermarket ink that will be as
fade resistant as the Canon ink. After trying several
different brands and reading many reviews I can't
seem to find any as good. Even various vendors
say their ink is not quite as good as Canon.

I am now thinking of getting an IP4200 for photo
printing and using aftermarket ink in the IP5000
for general purpose printing. The IP4200 sells
for about what an set of ink cartridges sell for.
I have even seen new IP4200 for $50 with the
UPC code removed.

In the past I bough 2 IP4200's that were both
DOA. Any suggestions appreciated

You should try this:

Krylon® Preserve It!® Digital Photo & Paper Protectant.

They say:

"Protection is easy with Krylon® Preserve It!® Digital photos, greeting
cards, address labels, scrapbook materials and more last twice as long
once you add this layer of protection. Without it, moisture, fading,
early aging, ink runs and damage from smudges can ruin your most
precious valuables."

It probably uses the very same uv resistant chemical that oem ink
relabelers (i.e., canon, hp, epson) use and it's very inexpensive.
Frank

 

[Yianni]

It is proven that *any* transparent material can't increase uv fade
resistant more than maximum 50%. Most of them about 30%.
On the other hand, canon oem ink don't relate on additive to increase the
fade resistant. It relates on the method/chemicals it manufactures the inks
(actualy the colorants are chemicaly treated -I can't recall exactly how-).

 

[Frank]

It is proven that *any* transparent material can't increase uv fade
resistant more than maximum 50%. Most of them about 30%.
On the other hand, canon oem ink don't relate on additive to increase
the fade resistant. It relates on the method/chemicals it manufactures
the inks (actualy the colorants are chemicaly treated -I can't recall
exactly how-).

Oh ok.
BTW, you got that URL to the "proven" 30-40%?
THX
Frank

 

[measekite]

sam wrote:

snip

I am looking for aftermarket ink that will be as
fade resistant as the Canon ink. After trying several
different brands and reading many reviews I can't
seem to find any as good. Even various vendors
say their ink is not quite as good as Canon.

they will not tell you what they are selling but you are right. generic
ink fades faster, can clog the printhead faster, give poorer results,
and is every way inferior.

I am now thinking of getting an IP4200 for photo
printing and using aftermarket ink in the IP5000
for general purpose printing. The IP4200 sells
for about what an set of ink cartridges sell for.
I have even seen new IP4200 for $50 with the
UPC code removed.

the ip5200 is about the same speed as your ip5000. the ip4200 is
slower. far less frequently on sale (ip5200) i have seen it for
$110.00 after rebate

In the past I bough 2 IP4200's that were both
DOA. Any suggestions appreciated

highly unusual

 

[Taliesyn]

The IP4200 sells for about what an set of ink cartridges sell for.

Now ask me why I won't pay for a new "printer" every time I need a set
of cartridges. It just goes to show that they "give" you the printer and
then later get it all back in installments every time you buy their
overpriced ink. I'm not keen on "leasing" so I cut the umbilical cord
with OEM once I buy a printer. I have a one year post warranty
replacement contract with my office supply store. If the printer goes,
I get a new one. No questions asked.

-Taliesyn

 

[ray]

Now ask me why I won't pay for a new "printer" every time I need a set
of cartridges. It just goes to show that they "give" you the printer and
then later get it all back in installments every time you buy their
overpriced ink. I'm not keen on "leasing" so I cut the umbilical cord
with OEM once I buy a printer. I have a one year post warranty
replacement contract with my office supply store. If the printer goes,
I get a new one. No questions asked.

-Taliesyn

Actually I have seen the IP4200 for $49 new with no UPC code.
I agree with what you say. I have been refilling since I had a
HP2225 about 20? years ago. But my question is there any
aftermarket inks that match Canon color and have similar
fade resistance. I have an IP5000 for general purpose use
that I refill, but photo performance is less than what I demand
when I use aftermarket inks that I have tried.

If I use the 4200 for photos only and buy the $50 printers it
is not that expensive. A good aftermarket ink would be a
cheaper solution and that is why I am asking. I have looked
at nifty forum and Neil Slade's site. Both are good resources,
but I didn't find a complete answer to my concerns there.

I print mainly 8.5 x 11 prints and panoramas so even though
4 x 6 prints are cheap to have done on silver process the
larger sizes are cost prohibitive.

 

[Burt]

Actually I have seen the IP4200 for $49 new with no UPC code.
I agree with what you say. I have been refilling since I had a
HP2225 about 20? years ago. But my question is there any
aftermarket inks that match Canon color and have similar
fade resistance. I have an IP5000 for general purpose use
that I refill, but photo performance is less than what I demand
when I use aftermarket inks that I have tried.

If I use the 4200 for photos only and buy the $50 printers it
is not that expensive. A good aftermarket ink would be a
cheaper solution and that is why I am asking. I have looked
at nifty forum and Neil Slade's site. Both are good resources,
but I didn't find a complete answer to my concerns there.

I print mainly 8.5 x 11 prints and panoramas so even though
4 x 6 prints are cheap to have done on silver process the
larger sizes are cost prohibitive.

Which aftermarket inks have you tried? I use MIS inks in my i960 and am
using up some Computer Friends inks in my wife's ip5000. (Slade said that
they were both sourced from Image Specialist). When I first bought the i960
I did side-by-side comparisons with OEM Canon ink and MIS. I felt that they
were pretty much equal in print quality - the OEM inks actually produced
slightly oversaturated photos - especially in the magenta range - for my
taste, and the MIS was similar. I've used MIS inks now for almost two years
in the i960 and have been very pleased with it. BTW, I got onto the i960
and MIS inks from reading Neil Slade's web site after having problems trying
to refill an Epson ESC900. Taliesyn is using Hobbicolor inks in an ip5000
and I just set up a friends ip5000 with Hobbicolor inks, which he is very
pleased with. Several of the participants on the Nifty-Stuff Forum use
Formulabs inks in Canon printers and are very happy with them.

 

[TJ]

Actually I have seen the IP4200 for $49 new with no UPC code.
I agree with what you say. I have been refilling since I had a
HP2225 about 20? years ago. But my question is there any
aftermarket inks that match Canon color and have similar
fade resistance. I have an IP5000 for general purpose use
that I refill, but photo performance is less than what I demand
when I use aftermarket inks that I have tried.

If I use the 4200 for photos only and buy the $50 printers it
is not that expensive. A good aftermarket ink would be a
cheaper solution and that is why I am asking. I have looked
at nifty forum and Neil Slade's site. Both are good resources,
but I didn't find a complete answer to my concerns there.

I print mainly 8.5 x 11 prints and panoramas so even though
4 x 6 prints are cheap to have done on silver process the
larger sizes are cost prohibitive.

So if you can't find an aftermarket ink with nearly the longevity of OEM
you're going to buy a new printer each time the cartridges run out? That
may work ok for a time or two, but those cheap new printers won't be
available forever. You'll have to change models before long, and don't
expect the new ones to be as good of a deal. The cartridge capacity will
likely be smaller, so you'll have to buy a new printer even *more* often
than you will now. And that will make your prints even more expensive.

I don't know what the solution to your dilemma might be, but I don't
think that's it. Where do you keep these photos that fading is a
problem? If you're archiving digital photos, paper isn't the best way to
do it. They all fade eventually, even OEM, even silver process. You
might better store them electronically and print new copies as you need
them. Consider: If OEM lasts 20 years and a good aftermarket lasts 4
(with proper care), you'll have to print 5 times with the aftermarket
ink, and that last aftermarket print will probably look much better than
the 16 year old OEM print. You'll likely still be ahead with aftermarket.

TJ

 

[ray]

Which aftermarket inks have you tried? I use MIS inks in my i960 and am
using up some Computer Friends inks in my wife's ip5000. (Slade said that
they were both sourced from Image Specialist). When I first bought the i960
I did side-by-side comparisons with OEM Canon ink and MIS. I felt that they
were pretty much equal in print quality - the OEM inks actually produced
slightly oversaturated photos - especially in the magenta range - for my
taste, and the MIS was similar. I've used MIS inks now for almost two years
in the i960 and have been very pleased with it. BTW, I got onto the i960
and MIS inks from reading Neil Slade's web site after having problems trying
to refill an Epson ESC900. Taliesyn is using Hobbicolor inks in an ip5000
and I just set up a friends ip5000 with Hobbicolor inks, which he is very
pleased with. Several of the participants on the Nifty-Stuff Forum use
Formulabs inks in Canon printers and are very happy with them.

I have tried Canon, MIS, Atlascopy (Repototype), and Inktec. I have
some G&G cartridges on order as per Neil Slade recommendation. The
Inktec had a poor cyan match, all colors faded with the magenta about
3 times faster than Canon. Atlascopy was better than Inktec, but not
as good as MIS. MIS has a good initial match, but the magenta fades
more quickly than the other colors. If all colors faded at the same
rate fading would not be much of a problem. Differential fading rates
causes color shifts which are noticeable. I also have problems with
the MIS cyan clogging the cartridge after 2 or 3 refills. It also
takes about 10 flushings to get the cyan ink cleared out of the
printhead whereas the other colors are gone on the first flush. I may
have gotten a bad batch of MIS ink. After reading Neil Slade and
other comments here I did not try Sensient (formula labs) because of
color match. I have not tried Hobbicolors because I do not want to do
business on eBay. If you could send me a 4 x 6 inch print as per my
specification (graduated colors) with no profile settings I would be
interested in testing UV fade resistance.

 

[ray]

So if you can't find an aftermarket ink with nearly the longevity of OEM
you're going to buy a new printer each time the cartridges run out? That
may work ok for a time or two, but those cheap new printers won't be
available forever. You'll have to change models before long, and don't
expect the new ones to be as good of a deal. The cartridge capacity will
likely be smaller, so you'll have to buy a new printer even *more* often
than you will now. And that will make your prints even more expensive.

I didn't say it was an ideal solution, but if the printer is cheaper
than the ink I don't why not to do it. I will use that printer for
photos only and use the IP5000 with refills for everything else. A
couple of printers will keep me until the technology changes to
something better. I no longer use my Teletypes, or chain printers, my
Epson FX100 was retired years ago.

I don't know what the solution to your dilemma might be, but I don't
think that's it. Where do you keep these photos that fading is a
problem? If you're archiving digital photos, paper isn't the best way to
do it. They all fade eventually, even OEM, even silver process. You
might better store them electronically and print new copies as you need
them. Consider: If OEM lasts 20 years and a good aftermarket lasts 4
(with proper care), you'll have to print 5 times with the aftermarket
ink, and that last aftermarket print will probably look much better than
the 16 year old OEM print. You'll likely still be ahead with aftermarket.

TJ

I have several walls with panoramas and 8.5 x 11 photos. Sort of like
wallpaper. Fading is not as much of a problem as color shifting due
to differential fading. My expected lifetime is 14 years so 20 for
OEM is good and I expect my eyesight will be fading by then also. Yes
I have the digital masters archived and can reprint. Printing 5 times
with paper cost included with aftermarket ink is more costly than 1
time with discounted OEM ink. I have some 5 year old prints that
still look fine and some 6 month old prints whose colors look strange.
Unfortunately I did not write on them what ink and paper I used.

 

[Burt]

I have tried Canon, MIS, Atlascopy (Repototype), and Inktec. I have
some G&G cartridges on order as per Neil Slade recommendation. The
Inktec had a poor cyan match, all colors faded with the magenta about
3 times faster than Canon. Atlascopy was better than Inktec, but not
as good as MIS. MIS has a good initial match, but the magenta fades
more quickly than the other colors. If all colors faded at the same
rate fading would not be much of a problem. Differential fading rates
causes color shifts which are noticeable. I also have problems with
the MIS cyan clogging the cartridge after 2 or 3 refills. It also
takes about 10 flushings to get the cyan ink cleared out of the
printhead whereas the other colors are gone on the first flush. I may
have gotten a bad batch of MIS ink. After reading Neil Slade and
other comments here I did not try Sensient (formula labs) because of
color match. I have not tried Hobbicolors because I do not want to do
business on eBay. If you could send me a 4 x 6 inch print as per my
specification (graduated colors) with no profile settings I would be
interested in testing UV fade resistance.

Already did UV fade resistance tests - check out the UV tests done by
Grandad on the Nifty Forum.

 

[measekite]

snip

I am looking for aftermarket ink that will be as
fade resistant as the Canon ink. After trying several
different brands and reading many reviews I can't
seem to find any as good. Even various vendors
say their ink is not quite as good as Canon.

they will not tell you what they are selling but you are right. generic
ink fades faster, can clog the printhead faster, give poorer results,
and is every way inferior.

 

[measekite]

Actually I have seen the IP4200 for $49 new with no UPC code.
I agree with what you say. I have been refilling since I had a
HP2225 about 20? years ago. But my question is there any
aftermarket inks that match Canon color and have similar
fade resistance.

not at all. while too expensive you get what you pay for. and with
generics you get what you deserve

I have an IP5000 for general purpose use
that I refill, but photo performance is less than what I demand
when I use aftermarket inks that I have tried.

of course

If I use the 4200 for photos only and buy the $50 printers it
is not that expensive.

good idea

A good aftermarket ink would be a
cheaper solution and that is why I am asking. I have looked
at nifty forum and Neil Slade's site. Both are good resources,
but I didn't find a complete answer to my concerns there.

you won't. many of the posters are cultish hobbyists and some may even
hae an interest in generic ink

 

[measekite]

So if you can't find an aftermarket ink with nearly the longevity of
OEM you're going to buy a new printer each time the cartridges run
out? That may work ok for a time or two, but those cheap new printers
won't be available forever.

but they sort of will for you can buy a complete set of dye inks (you
probably will not use that much pigmented ink for fotos) for the same
price at costco.

You'll have to change models before long, and don't expect the new
ones to be as good of a deal. The cartridge capacity will likely be
smaller, so you'll have to buy a new printer even *more* often than
you will now. And that will make your prints even more expensive.

not true if you buy ink at costco

I don't know what the solution to your dilemma might be, but I don't
think that's it.

i do

Where do you keep these photos that fading is a problem? If you're
archiving digital photos, paper isn't the best way to do it. They all
fade eventually, even OEM, even silver process. You might better store
them electronically and print new copies as you need them. Consider:
If OEM lasts 20 years and a good aftermarket lasts 4 (with proper
care), you'll have to print 5 times with the aftermarket ink, and that
last aftermarket print will probably look much better than the 16 year
old OEM print. You'll likely still be ahead with aftermarket.

totally false. you forgot the clogged printheads

 

[measekite]

snip

hear ye hear ye tallyho

I have tried Canon, MIS, Atlascopy (Repototype), and Inktec. I have
some G&G cartridges on order as per Neil Slade recommendation. The

Inktec had a poor cyan match,

all colors faded with the magenta about
3 times faster than Canon.

Atlascopy was better than Inktec, but not
as good as MIS. MIS has a good initial match, but the magenta fades
more quickly than the other colors. If all colors faded at the same
rate fading would not be much of a problem. Differential fading rates
causes color shifts which are noticeable.

I also have problems with
the MIS cyan clogging the cartridge

gaw head. ask they who the mfg/formulator is so you do not go out and
buy the same thing from another relabeler and have the same problem but
with a different label on the cart

after 2 or 3 refills.

It also
takes about 10 flushings to get the cyan ink cleared out

of the
printhead whereas the other colors are gone on the first flush. I may
have gotten a bad batch of MIS ink.

you never know what you are getting cause they will not tell you. you
also will never know when they will change their supplier and you either
get something better or worse. canon will give you consistency. the
same goes for epson and hp

After reading Neil Slade and
other comments here I did not try Sensient (formula labs) because of
color match.

i called sensinent in san diego ca and they will only sell their ink in
gallon sizes at a minimum. that becomes too expensive. they will not
tell me where i can get their ink in smaller quantities. the relabelers
that they buy from will not disclose what they are selling so i did not
get a chance to try them. i did here that a bunch of people bought what
they claimed to be formulabs ink and got a bad batch of magenta and had
mucho problems.

I have not tried Hobbicolors because I do not want to do
business on eBay.

i do not blame you.

 

[zakezuke]

not at all. while too expensive you get what you pay for. and with
generics you get what you deserve

1) You mean since one pays more for Lexmark ink that one gets prints
worth 1/3 the price of gold?
2) Why would someone who makes the choice to use aftermarket ink
"deserve" bad things happening.

The point is you are not getting what you pay for. At least with
aftermarket you are getting what you pay for, and that is ink.

 

[Yianni]

If you find *any* such matterial supplier stating it will give more than 50%
please, drop me a note.

 

[Yianni]

And to explain it more. Inks don't fade because of only uv, they fade
because of visible light too. A piece of glass is a very good uv protector,
because it absorbs totally the uv light. If you see some fade tests you will
see that a glass don't improve much the fade resistance. If the glass (a
very good uv absorbent material in a relatively high thickness) can't
increase much the fade resistance, could you imagine there would be another
better material? I don't think so.
If you use a visible light absorbent material it should be green, red, pink
or a totally opaque material, of course not useful at all.