DESPERATE! Unable to log onto Computer!

[Guest]

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so I ask for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I use Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met with a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had the system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd been using
another user account in my name without a password, and there was, as you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set Privacy and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried accessing Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the hope was that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to "Enter Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer. I've done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was advised by the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the OS and start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and writing of a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been more diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only a small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many hours and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call them anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement and after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and activated an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Harry Ohrn]

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so I ask for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I use Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met with a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had the system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd been using
another user account in my name without a password, and there was, as you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set Privacy and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried accessing Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the hope was that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to "Enter Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer. I've done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was advised by the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the OS and start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and writing of a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been more diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only a small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many hours and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call them anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement and after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and activated an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

First about the password request. Are you being asked for this just after
the computer is started and before you see the Windows logo screen? If so
then it is likely a BIOS password that is being asked for. It is possible
that someone has accessed the BIOS and set a password that prevents your
computer from booting. If you try booting off a Windows 98 Startup disk and
you receive the same message then it is a BIOS password. You will need to
clear the BIOS to remove the password. Consult your motherboard manual on
how to do this. However the tech should have recognized this and advised you
of it.

If this is indeed a problem with the Administrator account you can try using
this tool to remove any administrator password that exists
http://www.webtree.ca/windowsxp/tools/ntpassword/ntpasswordhack.zip Just
follow the instructions included.

Failing the above you can still access your drive and get your data off of
it. You need to have some basic hardware skills. Connect the drive to your
Windows 98 system but ensure you set the jumper on the back of the drive to
the Slave position. Because Windows 98 cannot read an NTFS formatted drive
(which is likely what your XP drive is formatted as) you will need a tool.
NTFS Reader for DOS should help. Download it from
http://www.ntfs.com/products.htm . Boot with the NTFS Reader for DOS disc
and use it to copy the files from your XP drive over to the drive on your
Windows 98 system. You can later transfer them back to the XP machine when
you get it up and running again.

 

[Terry Nippard]

Thanks Harry,

I will, in fact, copy your suggestions and see if the shop tech can learn
something from it. However, there may be more to this than I know enough to
tell you; it seems he mightshould have known of the options you supply here.

I will certainly get back to the group to inform of my success or lack of
it.

Peace,
Terry

 

[John Rampling]

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update (yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the F8 key to get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup, putting me back to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall the most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref I'm sorry to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and TICK the box
'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep my fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I never use
Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all comes out OK

John

 

[Terry Nippard]

Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I think I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win 98 one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and how to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first activated it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C. Does this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Look at the topic "hard disk jumpers and connections".
http://www.storagereview.com/guide2000/ref/hdd/op/jump.html

 

[Terry Nippard]

Hi again,

Sorry but after clicking on the link below I get a "This Page Cannot Be
Displayed" message. I tried accessing through the home page of
storagereview.com but get the same results. I checked my Internet Security
settings and all seems to be in order.

I've been getting the same response with some of the links provided (not
all) at the MS Knowledge Base sites and the aumha sites as I've been
researching my options this evening.

Thank you,
Terry

Look at the topic "hard disk jumpers and connections".
http://www.storagereview.com/guide2000/ref/hdd/op/jump.html

 

[Terry Nippard]

I've gotten through and am reading.
Thank you.

Hi again,

Sorry but after clicking on the link below I get a "This Page Cannot Be
Displayed" message. I tried accessing through the home page of
storagereview.com but get the same results. I checked my Internet Security
settings and all seems to be in order.

I've been getting the same response with some of the links provided (not
all) at the MS Knowledge Base sites and the aumha sites as I've been
researching my options this evening.

Thank you,
Terry

Look at the topic "hard disk jumpers and connections".
http://www.storagereview.com/guide2000/ref/hdd/op/jump.html

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I think I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win 98 one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to
the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and

how

to

with

a

 

[Terry Nippard]

Whew! A great resource to learn valuable and otherwise never-known facts. I
have looked at the hard drives from each unit (Win XP and Win 98) and can
detect no markings to indicate which jumper setting would be the Slave
postion. However, information from each derived through diagnostics software
prior to this problem state that each are Master drive settings. Also, the
pic of a standard jumper pin set in the storageview.com guide supports the
premise that the pin setup is such that the far left is Master. If that
premise is followed, then the second pin set is Slave.

The guide states that if the Data Transfer cable is inadvertently plugged in
upside down there is little possibility of doing harm to the unit, the unit
simply won't work. Can I assume the same if I set the jumper to the second
pin set for trial without markings to identify the pins? Or is there
potential for damage?

Also, I'm not sure how I am to join the two hard drives correctly by cable.
The guide states that cables are generally 18" in length due to problems
courted with cables longer, though cables are available in varying lengths
(i.e. 24" and more). In addition to needing advice on where to connect the
cables (on the Win Xp hard drive and the Win 98) I'm not sure a length of
18" will be adequate.

Currently, the cables on both have three connections, one end to the hard
drive, middle to the CD Rom and the other end to the mothherboard.

If you guys (and gals) still have the patience to assist me with this,
you're certainly to be commended for your levels of personal peace (LOL).

Thank you,
Terry

I've gotten through and am reading.
Thank you.

Hi again,

Sorry but after clicking on the link below I get a "This Page Cannot Be
Displayed" message. I tried accessing through the home page of
storagereview.com but get the same results. I checked my Internet Security
settings and all seems to be in order.

I've been getting the same response with some of the links provided (not
all) at the MS Knowledge Base sites and the aumha sites as I've been
researching my options this evening.

Thank you,
Terry

Look at the topic "hard disk jumpers and connections".
http://www.storagereview.com/guide2000/ref/hdd/op/jump.html

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I

think
I'd

like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win

98
one.

You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to
the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and

how

to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first

activated

it Does
this key
to me
back the
box out
OK I
ask with

was,

as advised
by resolve
the

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

The drive manufacturers all supply diagrams for their drives on their
websites. As far as you browsing issue, try running Start>All
Programs>Accessories>System Tools>Disk Cleanup to clean out the internet
cache. It can be reached from Tools in IE6 also if you are using IE6.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

Whew! A great resource to learn valuable and otherwise never-known facts.
I
have looked at the hard drives from each unit (Win XP and Win 98) and can
detect no markings to indicate which jumper setting would be the Slave
postion. However, information from each derived through diagnostics
software
prior to this problem state that each are Master drive settings. Also, the
pic of a standard jumper pin set in the storageview.com guide supports the
premise that the pin setup is such that the far left is Master. If that
premise is followed, then the second pin set is Slave.

The guide states that if the Data Transfer cable is inadvertently plugged
in
upside down there is little possibility of doing harm to the unit, the
unit
simply won't work. Can I assume the same if I set the jumper to the second
pin set for trial without markings to identify the pins? Or is there
potential for damage?

Also, I'm not sure how I am to join the two hard drives correctly by
cable.
The guide states that cables are generally 18" in length due to problems
courted with cables longer, though cables are available in varying lengths
(i.e. 24" and more). In addition to needing advice on where to connect the
cables (on the Win Xp hard drive and the Win 98) I'm not sure a length of
18" will be adequate.

Currently, the cables on both have three connections, one end to the hard
drive, middle to the CD Rom and the other end to the mothherboard.

If you guys (and gals) still have the patience to assist me with this,
you're certainly to be commended for your levels of personal peace (LOL).

Thank you,
Terry

I've gotten through and am reading.
Thank you.

Hi again,

Sorry but after clicking on the link below I get a "This Page Cannot Be
Displayed" message. I tried accessing through the home page of
storagereview.com but get the same results. I checked my Internet Security
settings and all seems to be in order.

I've been getting the same response with some of the links provided
(not
all) at the MS Knowledge Base sites and the aumha sites as I've been
researching my options this evening.

Thank you,
Terry

Look at the topic "hard disk jumpers and connections".
http://www.storagereview.com/guide2000/ref/hdd/op/jump.html

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I think
I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win 98
one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is
set to
the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and how
to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first

activated

it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C. Does
this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've
downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look
forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update (yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked
instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the F8 key
to
get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup, putting me
back
to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall the
most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref
I'm
sorry
to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and TICK the
box
'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep my
fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I never use
Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all comes out
OK

John

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so I
ask
for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I use
Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met with
a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had the
system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd
been
using
another user account in my name without a password, and there

was,

as
you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set Privacy
and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried
accessing
Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the hope
was
that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to
"Enter
Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer. I've
done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was advised
by
the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the
OS and
start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and
writing
of
a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been more
diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only a
small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other
received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS
Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager
yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve
the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many hours
and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call them
anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no
computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement and
after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and activated
an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied
sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Harry Ohrn]

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the drive to
your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive should have a
legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper settings. If
your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is no plug at
all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a search for
it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power plug can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you notice the
power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a notch to
facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe needs to
be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable (red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the computer. You
can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick Start or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed. Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long time then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98 boots to
the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive letter D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from it to
the C drive.

 

[Terry Nippard]

I have identified both HDD's. The one with Win XP Pro is Fujitsu MPG3204AT.
I've succeeded in getting a diagram of the jumper settings from the website.

The even older one I'm currently using is a Quantum Fireball CR6.4A. I've
left a post at the Tech forum on the HotHardware website. I was unsuccessful
in finding a diagram and haven't received a reply yet.

Am I to understand I can physically remove the HDD containing the data I
want, from its PC chassis bracket? If so, that would certainly shorten the
distance between the two HDD's. Can I then use the IDE cable by
disconnecting the middle connector from the CD Rom, placing that connector
to the HDD and the end connector (the one currently plugged into the HDD)
run to the "receiving" HDD?

Apologies for seeming dense, but I'm still not clear how the IDE cables
between the two HDD's need to be positioned.

Thanks,
Terry

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the drive to
your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive should have a
legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper settings. If
your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is no plug at
all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a search for
it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power plug can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you notice the
power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a notch to
facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe needs to
be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable (red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the computer. You
can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick Start or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed. Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long time then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98 boots to
the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive letter D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from it to
the C drive.



--

Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell/User]
www.webtree.ca/windowsxp

Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I think I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win 98 one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and how to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first activated it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C. Does this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

to
get back sorry ask
for

with

a Privacy
and I've
done by
the writing

activated

 

[John John]

If you can't get around the problem with a password reset utility like:
http://home.eunet.no/~pnordahl/ntpasswd/bootdisk.html then do a
parallel installation of XP.

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;316941#4

DON'T delete/create partitions or format when you install! Just install
XP to a different folder.

John

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Quantum Fireball diagrams are on the Maxtor website.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

I have identified both HDD's. The one with Win XP Pro is Fujitsu MPG3204AT.
I've succeeded in getting a diagram of the jumper settings from the
website.

The even older one I'm currently using is a Quantum Fireball CR6.4A. I've
left a post at the Tech forum on the HotHardware website. I was
unsuccessful
in finding a diagram and haven't received a reply yet.

Am I to understand I can physically remove the HDD containing the data I
want, from its PC chassis bracket? If so, that would certainly shorten the
distance between the two HDD's. Can I then use the IDE cable by
disconnecting the middle connector from the CD Rom, placing that connector
to the HDD and the end connector (the one currently plugged into the HDD)
run to the "receiving" HDD?

Apologies for seeming dense, but I'm still not clear how the IDE cables
between the two HDD's need to be positioned.

Thanks,
Terry

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the drive to
your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive should have a
legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper settings. If
your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is no plug at
all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a search for
it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in
connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power plug can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you notice the
power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a notch to
facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible
faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe needs to
be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable
(red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the computer. You
can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick Start or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed.
Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected
correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long time then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98 boots to
the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive letter
D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is
not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from it to
the C drive.



--

Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell/User]
www.webtree.ca/windowsxp

Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I think I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win 98 one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and how to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first activated
it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C. Does this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update (yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked
instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the F8 key to
get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup, putting me back
to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall
the
most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref I'm sorry
to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and TICK the box
'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep my fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I never use
Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all comes out OK

John

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so I ask
for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I use
Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met

with

a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had the
system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd been using
another user account in my name without a password, and there was, as
you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set Privacy
and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being
accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried accessing
Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the
hope was
that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to "Enter
Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer. I've
done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was advised by
the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the OS and
start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and writing
of
a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been
more
diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only a small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other
received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many
hours and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call them
anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no
computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement and
after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and

activated

an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied
sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Terry Nippard]

Thanks,
I have the jumper diagrams now. Both HDD's were set Primary Master at
factory, I take it. So, if I understand correctly, the XP drive needs to be
set at Slave while the receiving drive remains at factory set?

Quantum Fireball diagrams are on the Maxtor website.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

I have identified both HDD's. The one with Win XP Pro is Fujitsu MPG3204AT.
I've succeeded in getting a diagram of the jumper settings from the
website.

The even older one I'm currently using is a Quantum Fireball CR6.4A. I've
left a post at the Tech forum on the HotHardware website. I was
unsuccessful
in finding a diagram and haven't received a reply yet.

Am I to understand I can physically remove the HDD containing the data I
want, from its PC chassis bracket? If so, that would certainly shorten the
distance between the two HDD's. Can I then use the IDE cable by
disconnecting the middle connector from the CD Rom, placing that connector
to the HDD and the end connector (the one currently plugged into the HDD)
run to the "receiving" HDD?

Apologies for seeming dense, but I'm still not clear how the IDE cables
between the two HDD's need to be positioned.

Thanks,
Terry

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the drive to
your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive should

have
a

legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper settings. If
your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is no

plug
at

all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a

search
for

it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in
connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power plug can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you notice the
power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a

notch
to

facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible
faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe

needs
to

be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable
(red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the computer. You
can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick Start or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed.
Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected
correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long time then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98 boots to
the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive letter
D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is
not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from it to
the C drive.



--

Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell/User]
www.webtree.ca/windowsxp


Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I think I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win 98 one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to
the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and

how
to

ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first activated
it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C. Does this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update (yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked
instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the F8

key
to

get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup, putting me
back
to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall
the
most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref I'm
sorry
to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and TICK

the
box

'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep my fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I never use
Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all comes

out
OK

John

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so

I
ask

for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I use
Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met with
a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had the
system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd been
using
another user account in my name without a password, and there

was,
as

you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set Privacy
and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being
accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried accessing
Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the
hope
was
that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to "Enter
Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer. I've
done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was

advised
by

the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the OS and
start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and
writing
of
a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been
more
diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only a
small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other
received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS
Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve
the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many
hours
and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call them
anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no
computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement and
after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and activated
an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied
sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

On an IDE cable the drive on the end connector gets the Master setting. The
drive at the middle connector of the cable gets the Slave or Cable Select
setting.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

Thanks,
I have the jumper diagrams now. Both HDD's were set Primary Master at
factory, I take it. So, if I understand correctly, the XP drive needs to
be
set at Slave while the receiving drive remains at factory set?

Quantum Fireball diagrams are on the Maxtor website.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

I have identified both HDD's. The one with Win XP Pro is Fujitsu MPG3204AT.
I've succeeded in getting a diagram of the jumper settings from the
website.

The even older one I'm currently using is a Quantum Fireball CR6.4A. I've
left a post at the Tech forum on the HotHardware website. I was
unsuccessful
in finding a diagram and haven't received a reply yet.

Am I to understand I can physically remove the HDD containing the data
I
want, from its PC chassis bracket? If so, that would certainly shorten the
distance between the two HDD's. Can I then use the IDE cable by
disconnecting the middle connector from the CD Rom, placing that connector
to the HDD and the end connector (the one currently plugged into the HDD)
run to the "receiving" HDD?

Apologies for seeming dense, but I'm still not clear how the IDE cables
between the two HDD's need to be positioned.

Thanks,
Terry

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the
recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the drive to
your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive should have
a
legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper settings. If
your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is no plug
at
all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a search
for
it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and
flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in
connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power
plug
can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you notice the
power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a notch
to
facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible
faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe needs
to
be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable
(red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the computer. You
can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an
angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that
shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick Start
or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed.
Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP
system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one
connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected
correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long
time
then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98 boots to
the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive
letter
D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is
not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from it to
the C drive.



--

Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell/User]
www.webtree.ca/windowsxp


Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I
think
I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you
guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win
98
one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set to
the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and how
to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first
activated
it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C.
Does
this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've
downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look
forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update (yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked
instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the F8 key
to
get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the
rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup, putting me
back
to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall
the
most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref
I'm
sorry
to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and TICK the
box
'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep my
fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I never use
Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all comes out
OK

John

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so I
ask
for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I use
Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met
with
a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had the
system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd
been
using
another user account in my name without a password, and there was,
as
you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set
Privacy
and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being
accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried
accessing
Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the
hope
was
that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to
"Enter
Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer.
I've
done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was advised
by
the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the
OS
and
start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and
writing
of
a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been
more
diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only a
small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other
received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS
Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager
yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve
the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many
hours
and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call
them
anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no
computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement and
after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and
activated
an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied
sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Terry Nippard]

Now, I know I'm going to sound even more dense. I have the XP drive set at
Slave. The Win 98 at Master. The IDE cable on the Win 98 drive has one end
plugged into it, the middle to the CD drive, ans the other end to the
motherboard. Where do I plug in the XP drive and take power from?

On an IDE cable the drive on the end connector gets the Master setting. The
drive at the middle connector of the cable gets the Slave or Cable Select
setting.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

Thanks,
I have the jumper diagrams now. Both HDD's were set Primary Master at
factory, I take it. So, if I understand correctly, the XP drive needs to
be
set at Slave while the receiving drive remains at factory set?

Quantum Fireball diagrams are on the Maxtor website.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
I have identified both HDD's. The one with Win XP Pro is Fujitsu MPG3204AT.
I've succeeded in getting a diagram of the jumper settings from the
website.

The even older one I'm currently using is a Quantum Fireball CR6.4A. I've
left a post at the Tech forum on the HotHardware website. I was
unsuccessful
in finding a diagram and haven't received a reply yet.

Am I to understand I can physically remove the HDD containing the data
I
want, from its PC chassis bracket? If so, that would certainly

shorten
the

distance between the two HDD's. Can I then use the IDE cable by
disconnecting the middle connector from the CD Rom, placing that connector
to the HDD and the end connector (the one currently plugged into the HDD)
run to the "receiving" HDD?

Apologies for seeming dense, but I'm still not clear how the IDE cables
between the two HDD's need to be positioned.

Thanks,
Terry

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the
recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the

drive
to

your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive should have
a
legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper

settings.
If

your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is no plug
at
all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a search
for
it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and
flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in
connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power
plug
can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you

notice
the

power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a notch
to
facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible
faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe needs
to
be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable
(red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the

computer.
You

can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an
angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that
shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick Start
or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed.
Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP
system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one
connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected
correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long
time
then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98

boots
to

the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive
letter
D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is
not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from

it
to

the C drive.



--

Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell/User]
www.webtree.ca/windowsxp


Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I
think
I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you
guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the Win
98
one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is

set
to

the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is

and
how

to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first
activated
it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C.
Does
this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've
downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but look
forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update (yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked
instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the

F8
key

to
get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the
rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup,

putting
me

back
to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall
the
most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref
I'm
sorry
to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and TICK the
box
'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep my
fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I

never
use

Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all

comes
out

OK

John

I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before

so
I

ask
for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB.

I
use

Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met
with
a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I

had
the

system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd
been
using
another user account in my name without a password, and there was,
as
you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set
Privacy
and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being
accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried
accessing
Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the
hope
was
that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to
"Enter
Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer.
I've
done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was advised
by
the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall the
OS
and
start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and
writing
of
a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been
more
diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with

only
a

small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other
received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS
Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager
yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to resolve
the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the many
hours
and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call
them
anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no
computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the

basement
and

after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and
activated
an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied
sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Ken Blake]

In

On an IDE cable the drive on the end connector gets the Master
setting. The drive at the middle connector of the cable gets
the
Slave or Cable Select setting.

I'm anything but a hardware expert, so take anything I say here
with a grain of salt. But my understanding is that if you're not
using cable select, the position of the drive on the cable is
irrelevant. It's the jumper settings that determine which is
master and which is slave; whether the drive is at the end of the
cable or in the middle means nothing.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Aha! Look on your motherboard and you should see two controllers, each of
which can take one cable with two connectors on it. If I read you right,
you are only using one of the controllers. The other one sounds like it is
empty.

The set up should look like one cable with two hard drives on it and another
with one or two cd/dvd drives on it. You may need another cable. The drive
for Windows 98 should be the Master on the end connector on the ribbon cable
nearest the edge of the mobo. The XP drive should be Slave on the middle
connector. The cd drive needs to be Master and on the second ribbon cable,
end connector, and that cable should be on the inside controller.

I am visualizing here, because I have never seen your mobo, so if I have it
backwards someone will correct me. In any case, whichever controller the
ribbon cable is connected to on the motherboard now, leave it alone and use
it for both hard drives. Use the second controller for your cd drive(s).
If there is no second cable, buy one.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

Now, I know I'm going to sound even more dense. I have the XP drive set at
Slave. The Win 98 at Master. The IDE cable on the Win 98 drive has one end
plugged into it, the middle to the CD drive, ans the other end to the
motherboard. Where do I plug in the XP drive and take power from?

On an IDE cable the drive on the end connector gets the Master setting. The
drive at the middle connector of the cable gets the Slave or Cable Select
setting.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)

Thanks,
I have the jumper diagrams now. Both HDD's were set Primary Master at
factory, I take it. So, if I understand correctly, the XP drive needs
to
be
set at Slave while the receiving drive remains at factory set?

Quantum Fireball diagrams are on the Maxtor website.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
I have identified both HDD's. The one with Win XP Pro is Fujitsu
MPG3204AT.
I've succeeded in getting a diagram of the jumper settings from the
website.

The even older one I'm currently using is a Quantum Fireball CR6.4A.
I've
left a post at the Tech forum on the HotHardware website. I was
unsuccessful
in finding a diagram and haven't received a reply yet.

Am I to understand I can physically remove the HDD containing the data
I
want, from its PC chassis bracket? If so, that would certainly shorten
the
distance between the two HDD's. Can I then use the IDE cable by
disconnecting the middle connector from the CD Rom, placing that
connector
to the HDD and the end connector (the one currently plugged into the
HDD)
run to the "receiving" HDD?

Apologies for seeming dense, but I'm still not clear how the IDE cables
between the two HDD's need to be positioned.

Thanks,
Terry

If your XP drive is currently formatted as FAT32 that will ease the
recovery
process to be certain. All you should have to do is connect the drive
to
your older Windows 98 system as Windows 98 will read FAT32.

It would help if I knew the make of Hard Drive you are using. Hard
Drives
tend to set the jumpers differently. Typically the Hard Drive
should
have
a
legend stamped on the Hard Drive case that shows the jumper settings.
If
your Hard Drive is a Maxtor then pull the jumper plug so there is
no
plug
at
all across the pins. If your drive is a different brand then do a
search
for
it's jumper settings or post the brand here.

As you can see a Hard Drive has 2 cables that plug in. One is wide and
flat.
This is typically called an IDE cable and connects to the
computer's
motherboard. The other is narrow and is generally white. It is
typically
called the power plug and is usually white with only 4 plug in
connectors.
It comes out of the power supply. Both the IDE cable and the power
plug
can
only be inserted into the hard drive in one directions. If you notice
the
power plug it will have 2 tapered corners and 2 square corners. You
literally cannot plug it in upside down. The IDE cable likely has a
notch
to
facilitate the correct connection however you should note (possible
faint)
red stripe that runs the length of your IDE cable. This red stripe
needs
to
be on the same side as the power plug. Once you plug in the IDE cable
(red
stripe to the right) and the power plug you can turn on the computer.
You
can even dangle the second drive just ensure it isn't touching the
motherboard. A hard drive will run fine if it is upside down or on an
angle
so you don't have to screw it in place.

Restart the computer and watch the POST screen ( the first screen that
shows
when the computer starts) Unless the BIOS is set to do a Quick
Start
or
Display a logo during start-up you should see your devices listed.
Ideally
you will see something listed like:
Primary Master detected: < your current Master should be named
here>
Primary Slave detected: < the drive you've connected from the XP
system
should be named here>
Secondary Master detected: <possibly, but not always, your CD-Rom
device
will be listed>
Secondary Slave detected: <none, or another device if you have one
connect>

If you see this then it is likely you have the drives connected
correctly.
Windows 98 should boot. If it doesn't or seems to take a very long
time
then
it is likely you don't have your settings correct. If Windows 98 boots
to
the desktop it should auto detect the second hard drive as drive
letter
D:
However if your second drive is actually formatted as NTFS or if it is
not
set correctly as slave it will not show.

If it shows you can simply open it and copy the files you need from it
to
the C drive.



--

Harry Ohrn MS-MVP [Shell/User]
www.webtree.ca/windowsxp


Hi John, Harry,

I've retrieved the "sick" unit from the shop this evening and I
think
I'd
like now to try dealing with it myself in consultation with you
guys.

However, I have no idea how to connect the Win XP drive to the
Win
98
one.
You've directed me to use a "jumper" and to ensure the humper is set
to
the
Slave position. Could you help me with what exactly a jumper is and
how
to
ensure I detect the Slave position?

My Win XP went through a check disk on startup when I first
activated
it
this evening, and I noted it was checking the FAT32 system in C.
Does
this
mean I won't need to deploy the NTFS Reader for DOS disc I've
downloaded?

I have had no success in finding the manuals for the unit but
look
forward
to doing this if you have the patience to assist.

Thanks, Terry

When this happened to me it was due to a faulty Windows update
(yes,
Microsoft do sometinmes get it wrong) . The one thing that worked
instantly
was to boot up using 'last configuration that worked' (hit the F8
key
to
get
the relevant menu). This restored my access but unfortunately the
rogue
Update immediately reinstalled itself on the next bootup, putting
me
back
to
square one. The solution was to turn off auto update and uninstall
the
most
recent download that had caused it (can't remember the file ref
I'm
sorry
to
say). I did this in Control Panel / Add/Remove Programs and
TICK
the
box
'show updates'.

As for a permanent solution, I don't know of one. I just keep
my
fingers
crossed and hope nothing really critical happens. Oh, and I never
use
Internet Explorer which is what most of these updates relate
to.

Don't know if this will help in your case but I hope it all comes
out
OK

John

message
I have much info to pass on here and haven't written it before so
I
ask
for
your patience with my lack of knowledge and proper language.
I use Win XP Pro on a Pentium lll with RAM upgraded to 360MB. I
use
Outlook
Express and Internet Explorer.
Mid-February I booted my computer and for the first time was met
with
a
request to enter a Password as Administrator. Previously, I had
the
system
set up so that no Password was required for logon. Also, I'd
been
using
another user account in my name without a password, and there
was,
as
you're
aware, a Guest user account without password.

The only password I'd used before as Administrator was to set
Privacy
and
Security settings for internet. This password is not being
accepted.

Furthermore, in consultion with phone-in MS Support, I tried
accessing
Setup
while booting by use of the Delete key. As I understand it, the
hope
was
that
we could achieve access to the BIOS. Again, I was asked to
"Enter
Current
Password". Nothing has worked.
Microsoft advised that I must take the unit to the manufacturer.
I've
done
so, though no longer under warranty, and just yesterday was
advised
by
the
shop tech there is nothing to be done other than uninstall
the
OS
and
start
over.

My concerns are:
1) I have on the hard drive approximately half the research and
writing
of
a
book I'd been working on for several months (I should have been
more
diligent
in backing up the material externally but have done so with only
a
small
portion of the material). Also, my entire Address Book and other
received
files are in the Outlook Express folders.
2) I no longer have all the diskettes needed to reinstall
drivers.
3) If the shop tech can remove the OS, why can't I do it with MS
Support
over the phone?
4) I received an email from the MS Customer Service Manager
yesterday,
inviting me to contact their supprt technicians in order to
resolve
the
matter. Do they now know something they didn't during the
many
hours
and
events I've spent with them on the phone this month? I will call
them
anyway
once I get my PC back.

The reason I haven't contacted this Newsgroup Forum was I had no
computer
until yesterday. I took an old Pentium ll I had in the basement
and
after
dusting it off, upgraded RAM to 128MB, installed Win 98 and
activated
an
internet account.It is this unit I'm currently using.

Please forgive the length of this post and I hope I've supplied
sufficient
info to enable someone to help me.

Thanking you in advance, I am...
Terry

 

[Terry Nippard]

Okay, perhaps you can tell what I've done wrong.

I've removed the XP HDD and have connected it to the middle plug on the Win
98 IDE cable. One end connects to the Win 98 HDD, the other to the
controller nearest the mobo edge, marked IDE 1. The second controller on the
mobo (IDE 2) has an IDE cable connected with the CD drive connected to the
other end.

I've connected the power cable to the XP HDD from one of two middle
connectors in the series of power wires, the other middle connector to the
Win 98 HDD (original), with the end plugged into the floppy drive
(original). The XP HDD doesn't seem to be getting power (no movement or
lights of any kind).

I haven't found any evidence of the second HDD being recognized. When I boot
the PC, the POST screen opens and disappears too quickly for me to read,
though I've caught a glimpse of the CD Rom listed as Secondary Master.

Thanks again.