Another day, more inexcusably stupid mistakes caused by Vista

[Jupiter Jones [MVP]]

As I already suggested, do not know the numbers but I am sure they were
significant.
Perhaps I could count the push pins on the Map Point posting but that would
be far to time consuming.
Without knowing how many were in this or previous Betas makes a numerical
comparison difficult.

I do know there were many that were TechNet, MSDN subscribers as well as
other Microsoft programs.
But I also know there were many others that had no such connection.
All computer experience levels seemed to be very well covered.

There was even a "Friends & Family" (name may not be accurate) for those
with minimal experience and they were able to call Microsoft for support for
almost any issue.
AFAIK, this was the only group that had anything like formal tech support.

--
Jupiter Jones [MVP]
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar
http://www.dts-l.org

There were many, many people who beta tested the MS operating systems
before Vista who, in spite of diligent work on those prior tests, received
no invitation to participate this time. It's my impression that,
excluding the public beta, the number of beta testers this time around was
significantly smaller than on those prior tests. For a long time testing
seemed to be limited to MSDN and TechNet Plus subscribers plus enterprise
IT personnel selected by MS. Is that not true?
As I said, from the outside, it was difficult to know, but I just raise
the question about the size and composition of the Beta group because it's
beginning to appear that there are significantly more problems with the
Vista upgrade than there have been with previous MS operating systems.

I paraphrase rather than quote, but Scot Finnie, a well-known,
widely-respected, and well established PC journalist, has publicly stated
that he's switched to a Mac for his main work computer
(http://www.scotsnewsletter.com/88.htm) because he's lost faith in MS's
ability to address the concerns and needs of the rank and file customer
( http://tinyurl.com/34lwcx ). Whereas he thinks that MS was previously
devoted to finding the best way to accomplish tasks and make the PC the
best tool for work and communication in the office and home, he believes
that they're now concerned with but two things: (1) acceptance by "the
Enterprise" and (2) avoiding the perception that they're not concerned
with making the OS secure.

Might not the severe [by prior standards] restriction on the number of
beta testers be a manifestation of this paradigm shift Finnie perceives?
I'm just asking. Could his observations explain why there is less
enthusiasm for Vista than for any prior MS OS release? Could listening to
more average customers during the beta have prevented some of the glaring
problems we see listed here? Just asking.

 

[Adam Albright]

As I already suggested, do not know the numbers but I am sure they were
significant.

Many people have already or soon will come to one of two conclusions:

a. The majority of beta testers don't have a clue what they're doing.
b. Microsoft ignores many of the "bugs" beta testers report.

I've futher observed that is seems to be the position of most MVP's
that post here and in similar Microsoft groups that their main purpose
is to watch Microsoft's back rather then factually discuss real
issues. You see endless responses from MVP's that actually are awfully
lame excuses and pointless comments such as nobody forced you to
upgrade or you shouldn't upgrade if you actually use your computer for
anything serious or the always popular it isn't Microsoft's fault, go
yell at the hardware vendor.

The Vista Upgrade Advisor is little more than a marketing tool. Its
sole purpose seems to be to get people to buy the latest version of
Windows, since it seems prone to tell you that your system IS "Vista
Ready" only to find out AFTER you actually start to install it that it
is anything but.

Perhaps some people here have a different concept of what exactly
UPGRADE means. To them I suggest you find a dictionary and look the
word 'upgrade' up. I did and in part what I found was; upgrade means
to improve or enhance, make a higher grade or rank, to improve the
quality or value or effectiveness and performance.

Well duh... I don't think so. One could argue that Vista puts a
prettier face on Windows. One could say in some areas Windows has
improved. However I know of nobody that turns on their computer and
simply sits in awe of the desktop or any view Vista itself generates.
The purpose of all operating systems is to intergrade your hardware
and software. This is where Vista is likely to fall flat on its face.
Ever worse the latest version of Windows has the highly annoying habit
of trying to take control instead of accepting that YOU as the owner
and end user should be control.

Upgrade to me means and what laughingly the Vista Upgrade advisor
often tells you is both your hardware and software are READY and in
Microsoft's own words, should not present any issues.

I beg to differ. My expereince with Vista so far has been a nighmare
of hardware and some software issues THAT VISTA PASSED AS READY. My
idea of ready doesn't mean disabling SATA drives or Vista not even
being able to "see" them. My idea of ready doesn't mean it prevents a
printer control center that functioned perfectly in XP to now be
hidden several layers deep in the control panel and also lose features
I use often.

Even on its own Vista is comical in its ignorance. How can a OS be so
dumb that on its own it disables its own browser then says you aren't
connected to the Internet, then offers a dial-up box asking for your
log-in and password when you're currently running a broadband only
connection that Vista has to know about since it used to to
automatically download and install Windows upgrades?

How can Vista be so clueless that its new Media Player can play a
video start to finsh without a hitch then if the player it set to
replay return to the beginning then only present a totally disorted
image of nothing but hortozional lines?

Yep, the Mac guys have reason to make fun of the latest version of
Windows. Five years in developement and these kind of inexcusable dumb
errors not only got past the Vista Development team but legions of
beta testers as well?

It isn't that I'm using anything exotic, while I build my own system,
its all name brand, popular selections anybody can get as hardware.
Even if it says Vista Ready on the box, obviously it isn't. So I join
the Mac guys in laughting at the absurity of it all. Of course I'm not
really surprised, just disappointed. Microsoft has been getting away
with releasing one broken version of Windows after another for 20
years. I guess some things never change.

 

[quakechick]

Many people have already or soon will come to one of two conclusions:

a. The majority of beta testers don't have a clue what they're doing.
b. Microsoft ignores many of the "bugs" beta testers report.

I've futher observed that is seems to be the position of most MVP's
that post here and in similar Microsoft groups that their main purpose
is to watch Microsoft's back rather then factually discuss real
issues. You see endless responses from MVP's that actually are awfully
lame excuses and pointless comments such as nobody forced you to
upgrade or you shouldn't upgrade if you actually use your computer for
anything serious or the always popular it isn't Microsoft's fault, go
yell at the hardware vendor.

The Vista Upgrade Advisor is little more than a marketing tool. Its
sole purpose seems to be to get people to buy the latest version of
Windows, since it seems prone to tell you that your system IS "Vista
Ready" only to find out AFTER you actually start to install it that it
is anything but.

Perhaps some people here have a different concept of what exactly
UPGRADE means. To them I suggest you find a dictionary and look the
word 'upgrade' up. I did and in part what I found was; upgrade means
to improve or enhance, make a higher grade or rank, to improve the
quality or value or effectiveness and performance.

Well duh... I don't think so. One could argue that Vista puts a
prettier face on Windows. One could say in some areas Windows has
improved. However I know of nobody that turns on their computer and
simply sits in awe of the desktop or any view Vista itself generates.
The purpose of all operating systems is to intergrade your hardware
and software. This is where Vista is likely to fall flat on its face.
Ever worse the latest version of Windows has the highly annoying habit
of trying to take control instead of accepting that YOU as the owner
and end user should be control.

Upgrade to me means and what laughingly the Vista Upgrade advisor
often tells you is both your hardware and software are READY and in
Microsoft's own words, should not present any issues.

I beg to differ. My expereince with Vista so far has been a nighmare
of hardware and some software issues THAT VISTA PASSED AS READY. My
idea of ready doesn't mean disabling SATA drives or Vista not even
being able to "see" them. My idea of ready doesn't mean it prevents a
printer control center that functioned perfectly in XP to now be
hidden several layers deep in the control panel and also lose features
I use often.

Even on its own Vista is comical in its ignorance. How can a OS be so
dumb that on its own it disables its own browser then says you aren't
connected to the Internet, then offers a dial-up box asking for your
log-in and password when you're currently running a broadband only
connection that Vista has to know about since it used to to
automatically download and install Windows upgrades?

How can Vista be so clueless that its new Media Player can play a
video start to finsh without a hitch then if the player it set to
replay return to the beginning then only present a totally disorted
image of nothing but hortozional lines?

Yep, the Mac guys have reason to make fun of the latest version of
Windows. Five years in developement and these kind of inexcusable dumb
errors not only got past the Vista Development team but legions of
beta testers as well?

It isn't that I'm using anything exotic, while I build my own system,
its all name brand, popular selections anybody can get as hardware.
Even if it says Vista Ready on the box, obviously it isn't. So I join
the Mac guys in laughting at the absurity of it all. Of course I'm not
really surprised, just disappointed. Microsoft has been getting away
with releasing one broken version of Windows after another for 20
years. I guess some things never change.

That is unfortunate, but not everyone has had the same experience as
you! Most are finding that everything goes off without a hitch, such as
mine. Now I had to go into the bios and enable my ide bus, but it was
disabled so no biggie, and my second hdd wasn't recognized, well it was
in fat 32 so no surprise i went to computer management and formatted
it, again no biggie, these were my errors and I quickly had them resolved!!!