4 CONSECUTIVE CORRUPT DISK DISASTERS WITH WIN2K

Z

zeke7

Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer
running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed.
At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same
standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when
it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried
installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc.
Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been
unsuccessful in salvaging the installations.

A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the
following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three
conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes.

Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and
about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc,
some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly
unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is
unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk."

Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of
orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is
unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are
recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message
precluded the crash.

I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts
out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm
going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of,
until I hopefully get a consensus from you:

1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed
on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the
most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with
Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my
iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after
installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB
provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C:
drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002
installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time.

2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked
up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having
to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them.
These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows
Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows
Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters
to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames.
Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation
initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most
recently using the Win2K Backup program.

3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program
shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs)
resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a
handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash,
the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it
mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash
yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but
when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those
shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing
their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages
started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and
the system went down and out.

That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions
from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for
correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
 
D

Dave Patrick

1.)
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/290301
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/239938
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/304465

2.)
Sounds like some file system corruption. I'd download and run the
manufacturer's diagnostic tools. Disk and drive controller.

Test the RAM
http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp

Also;
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/303013


3.)
The application install is responsible for placing the shortcuts. This
really should cause any problems by moving them.


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

zeke7 said:
Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer
running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc
installed.
At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same
standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as
when
it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried
installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc.
Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been
unsuccessful in salvaging the installations.

A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the
following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three
conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes.

Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software
and
about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc,
some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly
unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is
unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk."

Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of
orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is
unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some
are
recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable"
message
precluded the crash.

I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts
out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be.
I'm
going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of,
until I hopefully get a consensus from you:

1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs)
installed
on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash
(the
most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental
with
Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with
my
iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after
installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB
provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt
C:
drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002
installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time.

2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked
up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and
having
to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of
them.
These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows
Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows
Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric
characters
to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long
filenames.
Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation
initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most
recently using the Win2K Backup program.

3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program
shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs)
resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under
a
handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash,
the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it
mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash
yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier,
but
when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of
those
shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started
losing
their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive
messages
started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and
the system went down and out.

That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions
from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for
correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
 
T

The Kat

Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer
running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed.

Chances are you have a bad motherboard,
the IDE controller is causing the corruption.




--

Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk.

This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity...

Remove XYZ to email me
 
Z

zeke7

Thanks Dave--these has got me doing a lot of detective work, zeroing in on
the 137gb / 48-bit issue with initial W2K, issues I thought were sorted out
for the user by SP4. Also seeing Intel Appl Accelerator is needed for my ASUS
P4C800-E MB (Intel 875P / ICH5R chipset).

Dave Patrick said:
1.)
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/290301
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/239938
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/304465

2.)
Sounds like some file system corruption. I'd download and run the
manufacturer's diagnostic tools. Disk and drive controller.

Test the RAM
http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp

Also;
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/303013


3.)
The application install is responsible for placing the shortcuts. This
really should cause any problems by moving them.


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

zeke7 said:
Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer
running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc
installed.
At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same
standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as
when
it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried
installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc.
Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been
unsuccessful in salvaging the installations.

A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the
following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three
conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes.

Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software
and
about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc,
some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly
unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is
unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk."

Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of
orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is
unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some
are
recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable"
message
precluded the crash.

I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts
out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be.
I'm
going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of,
until I hopefully get a consensus from you:

1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs)
installed
on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash
(the
most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental
with
Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with
my
iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after
installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB
provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt
C:
drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002
installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time.

2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked
up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and
having
to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of
them.
These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows
Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows
Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric
characters
to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long
filenames.
Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation
initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most
recently using the Win2K Backup program.

3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program
shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs)
resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under
a
handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash,
the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it
mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash
yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier,
but
when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of
those
shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started
losing
their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive
messages
started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and
the system went down and out.

That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions
from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for
correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
 
Z

zeke7

Ouch... not good news for me, but sounds quite feasible. I assume there's no
software-type test for this to verify its flaky nature?
 
T

The Kat

Ouch... not good news for me, but sounds quite feasible. I assume there's no
software-type test for this to verify its flaky nature?

Other than eliminating other possible sources of the problem.

I had that same problem some years ago.

And DO NOT use the Intel app accelerator!
I've heard of nothing but bad experiences with it.



--

Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk.

This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity...

Remove XYZ to email me
 
D

Dave Patrick

That's what I suspected. In addition if your drive controller is not
natively supported then you'll want to boot the Windows 2000 install CD-Rom.
Then *F6* very early and very important (at setup is inspecting your system)
in the setup to prevent drive controller detection, and select S to specify
additional drivers. Then later you'll be prompted to insert the manufacturer
supplied Windows 2000 driver for your drive controller in drive "A"


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
Z

zeke7

KAt--I mistyped above, meant to to say "... see IF the Intel App Accelerator
is needed"; I checked and it's not, only for older chipsets than what I have.

I did find my BIOS was set to MIPS 1.1, I just switched it to 1.4; do you
think that might have been related?

I have a couple of IDE controller cards that came packaged with hard drives
I bought; thinking one might be going out (I just use one), I swapped it with
the other, checked for the latest manufacturer's drivers & BIOS, things still
corrupted. Are you referring to a PCI controller card, or to the MB's IDE
controller?

Also checked the driver being used for my hard drives, it's an MS
v5.0.2183.1 dated 1999. That seems a little old to accommodate the 137g,
48-bit limitation of yore; is there a newer MS driver out there for Win2K?
(The drive's manufacturer states that they don't provide one, the OS drivers
are fine).

It occurred to me that this corruption problem has occurred only on larger
drives; an old 80g drive with an old install of W2K on it has been working
fine, so I just reformatted and am going to use it for my boot/OS drive to
see if it remains stable.
 
Z

zeke7

Dave--I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing W2K, just so
it doesn't get confused; I wait until the OS is fully updated & operational
before popping in the card and installing its driver with the Windows wizard.

The /kb/303013 link you provided above led me to another one, /kb/331958/,
(also written only for XP) that has me very suspicious: another nagging
problem with my system is that the computer immediately reboots whenever
running Shut Down (not 'Restart') from Windows, and Standby mode locks up the
machine altogether (I have to hit the manual off switch to get it to stay
off). The 331958 article implies the two issues may be related:

"If you experience hard disk corruption, you may also experience other
symptoms including problems starting, restarting, or shutting down Windows
XP, problems running programs, or problems opening or saving documents."

I tried the EnableBigLba regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013, but it
didn't fix the reboot problem.

Dave Patrick said:
That's what I suspected. In addition if your drive controller is not
natively supported then you'll want to boot the Windows 2000 install CD-Rom.
Then *F6* very early and very important (at setup is inspecting your system)
in the setup to prevent drive controller detection, and select S to specify
additional drivers. Then later you'll be prompted to insert the manufacturer
supplied Windows 2000 driver for your drive controller in drive "A"


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

zeke7 said:
Thanks Dave--these has got me doing a lot of detective work, zeroing in on
the 137gb / 48-bit issue with initial W2K, issues I thought were sorted
out
for the user by SP4. Also seeing Intel Appl Accelerator is needed for my
ASUS
P4C800-E MB (Intel 875P / ICH5R chipset).
 
Z

zeke7

I do this because the W2K install menu requires that drivers be on a 3.5-inch
floppy, and I have it only on a CD, along with other install files. I can't
access the CD drive from the F6 install menu, and without many spare 3.5-in
disks at my disposal these daysit proves easier just to wait until I can use
the CD.

The kb/303013 article written for XP states that the ATAPI driver must be
v5.1.2600.1135 or greater; with my W2K SP4 install, it's an earlier
v.5.0.2195.6699 (good enough for W2Kaccording to kb/305098). If not, how can
I download an updated version (kb/303013 indicates it's embedded in the XP
SP1 install).


Dave Patrick said:
"I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing"

I don't know why one would do this. Install the controller driver via F6
during text mode portion of setup. Also read the notes here carefully.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/305098



--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect

zeke7 said:
Dave--I always remove my PCI IDE controller card when installing W2K, just
so
it doesn't get confused; I wait until the OS is fully updated &
operational
before popping in the card and installing its driver with the Windows
wizard.

The /kb/303013 link you provided above led me to another one,
/kb/331958/,
(also written only for XP) that has me very suspicious: another nagging
problem with my system is that the computer immediately reboots whenever
running Shut Down (not 'Restart') from Windows, and Standby mode locks up
the
machine altogether (I have to hit the manual off switch to get it to stay
off). The 331958 article implies the two issues may be related:

"If you experience hard disk corruption, you may also experience other
symptoms including problems starting, restarting, or shutting down Windows
XP, problems running programs, or problems opening or saving documents."

I tried the EnableBigLba regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013, but it
didn't fix the reboot problem.
 
A

Andy

Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer
running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed.
At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same
standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when
it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried
installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc.
Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been
unsuccessful in salvaging the installations.

A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the
following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three
conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes.

After reading your other replies, I am still hazy as to what kind of
disks you're using, what controller they're connected to, and how
you're installing Windows 2000.

One scenario that guarantees disk corruption is as follows:
1. start with a disk larger than 137GB in capacity
2. use software other than Windows 2000 setup to partition (to its
full capacity) and format the disk
3. install Windows 2000, but fail to configure it to properly access
past the 137GB point on the disk
4. start using the disk and filling it up; once Windows tries to
access past the 137GB point, the lack of 48-bit LBA capability causes
disk access to wrap around to the beginning of the disk, resulting in
corruption.
Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and
about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc,
some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly
unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is
unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk."

Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of
orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is
unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are
recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message
precluded the crash.

I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts
out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm
going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of,
until I hopefully get a consensus from you:

1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed
on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the
most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with
Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my
iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after
installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB
provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C:
drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002
installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time.

2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked
up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having
to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them.
These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows
Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows
Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters
to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames.
Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation
initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most
recently using the Win2K Backup program.

3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program
shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs)
resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a
handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash,
the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it
mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash
yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but
when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those
shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing
their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages
started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and
the system went down and out.

That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions
from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for
correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
 
Z

zeke7

Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and
200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected
through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS
P4C800-E.

Regarding your points:

2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started the
format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in
Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all
cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc.

3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly access
past the 137GB point on the disk"? Is there a configuration I need to run? I assumed that with SP4, this would be automated; is it not? Please advise.

(In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba
regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the latest
service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this
machine and same OS.

4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with my
data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case,
are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this?

Andy said:
Am consistently getting a corrupted C: drive on my desktop PC computer
running Windows 2000 SP4 with latest updates, firewall/virus etc installed.
At least 4 crashes / complete formats/reinstalls in as many weeks. Same
standard hardware & software (other than the latest Windows Updates) as when
it ran fine, for years; do have many new files for My Docs, however. Tried
installing on different hard disks, do a slow NTFS format beforehand, etc.
Recovery Console and Emergency Repair Disks have consistently been
unsuccessful in salvaging the installations.

A detailed description of SW/HW/processes would be overly long; the
following is a summary in the hopes some of you recognize one of three
conditions described below as being definitely related to the crashes.

After reading your other replies, I am still hazy as to what kind of
disks you're using, what controller they're connected to, and how
you're installing Windows 2000.

One scenario that guarantees disk corruption is as follows:
1. start with a disk larger than 137GB in capacity
2. use software other than Windows 2000 setup to partition (to its
full capacity) and format the disk
3. install Windows 2000, but fail to configure it to properly access
past the 137GB point on the disk
4. start using the disk and filling it up; once Windows tries to
access past the 137GB point, the lack of 48-bit LBA capability causes
disk access to wrap around to the beginning of the disk, resulting in
corruption.
Typical incident is a couple of days or so after reloading all software and
about 120gb data files (about 20,000 digicamera jpgs, numerous mp3s, etc,
some with longish filenames), suddenly middle of doing something seemingly
unrelated, pop-up windows appear saying "C: drive [or folder therein] is
unreadable / corrupt. Run chkdsk."

Have to reboot of course to run chkdsk, when it runs it finds thousands of
orphan file records to delete and index entries to fix, then the disk is
unbootable and lots of data and program / system files are missing; some are
recovered by chkdsk. One time a "C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable" message
precluded the crash.

I think I have it narrowed down to 3 possible causes. Knowledgeable sorts
out there, please review and advise on which one you think it might be. I'm
going to avoid all three on my next reinstall, which I'm in the middle of,
until I hopefully get a consensus from you:

1. Outlook 2002 (along with its required Office XP service packs) installed
on a system otherwise running Office 2000 Premium. On at least one crash (the
most recent), Outlook 2000 had been inadvertently installed coincidental with
Outlook 2002. (I need v.2002 so that I can synch my Outlook contacts with my
iPAQ PocketPC 2003 PDA). A problem initially starting that program after
installation led to a corrupt web access profile error for which MS KB
provided a fix. And during that latest crash, concurrent with the corrupt C:
drive message boxes popping up were boxes asking for the Outlook 2002
installation CD, thoroughly irrelevant for what I was doing at the time.

2. Long filenames. I've found a few data files that have long names locked
up in Windows 2000, unable to delete or rename them from Explorer and having
to run arcane commands/switches from the Command window to get rid of them.
These files include some mp3s, possibly some photos, and also some Windows
Update files downloaded to disk from Microsoft Update Catalog (not Windows
Update), which inexplicably appends a long string of alphanumeric characters
to many of its update downloads, some of which have already long filenames.
Restoration of data files from backup hard drives during re-installation
initially entailed copying directly from drive to drive in Explorer, most
recently using the Win2K Backup program.

3. Reorganizing the disorganized plethora of shortcuts in the Program
shortcuts folders (C:\Documents and Settings\...\Start Menu\Programs)
resulting from a reinstall so that all are in the \All Users\ folder under a
handful of categorized parent folders. A little prior to one recent crash,
the system locked up when I moved one such folder group there that it
mistakenly thought were program files. And during the most recent crash
yesterday, the folders were reorganized successfully a few hours earlier, but
when the system crashed that was the first symptom noticed: copies of those
shortcuts (MS Office ones) placed in the Quick Launch toolbar started losing
their icon images; shortly thereafter the corrupt folder / C; drive messages
started popping up (along with the Outlook 2002 install disk requests) and
the system went down and out.

That's it; already verbose. Obviously a major malfunction. Quick reactions
from the experts out there please: any of these situations ring a bell for
correlation with sudden NTFS disk corruption?
 
D

Dave Patrick

You can easily overcome this by attaching a floppy drive long enough to get
through the install or look at doing an unattended installation. Given the
problems I'd think you would be ready to overcome these problems.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/288344


Use the last article. I erroneously posted the XP article.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/305098




--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
D

Dave Patrick

This is why I asked you to read the document carefully.

Operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support enabled by default
(such as Microsoft Windows 98, Microsoft Windows Millennium Edition (Me), or
Windows 2000) that are installed on a partition that spans beyond the 28-bit
LBA boundary (137GB) will experience data corruption or data loss.

The installation of operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support
enabled by default (such as Windows 98, Windows Me, or Windows 2000) on a
partition that is beyond the 28-bit LBA boundary (137 GB) is unsuccessful
and leaves behind a temporary installation folder.


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
T

The Kat

KAt--I mistyped above, meant to to say "... see IF the Intel App Accelerator
is needed"; I checked and it's not, only for older chipsets than what I have.

That's good.

Have you considered your power supply?
That can also be a problem, if it is just beginning to go bad,
AND if it's just 'dirty' power.



--

Lumber Cartel (tinlc) #2063. Spam this account at your own risk.

This sig censored by the Office of Home, Land & Planet Insecurity...

Remove XYZ to email me
 
Z

zeke7

This is why I asked you to read the document carefully.

Operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support enabled by default
(such as Microsoft Windows 98, Microsoft Windows Millennium Edition (Me), or
Windows 2000) that are installed on a partition that spans beyond the 28-bit
LBA boundary (137GB) will experience data corruption or data loss.

The installation of operating systems that do not have 48-bit LBA support
enabled by default (such as Windows 98, Windows Me, or Windows 2000) on a
partition that is beyond the 28-bit LBA boundary (137 GB) is unsuccessful
and leaves behind a temporary installation folder.

--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]http://www.microsoft.com/protect

zeke7 said:
Andy: thanks for the input. Am using Western Digital Caviars, a 180 and
200gb; W2K crashed on both. Sometimes I have other ~200gb disks connected
through a Promise UltraTX 100 IDE controller card. Motherboard is an ASUS
P4C800-E.
Regarding your points:
2. Always use Windows to format, a single partition. Sometimes I started
the
format from the Windows install disk, other times formatted the disk in
Windows as a secondary drive while running Win2K from another disk. In all
cases, used NTFS, the default sector size etc.
3. Intriguing: what do you mean by "fail to configure it to properly
access
(In response to Dave's reply above, I just started doing the EnableBigLba
regedt32 tweak described in /kb/303013; why isn't this included in the
latest
service pack or hotfix?) In the past, >137g disks have run fine on this
machine and same OS.
4. This sounds like what's happened: it's after I populate the disk with
my
data files, which probably load it up past that limit. If that's the case,
are you saying that the EnableBigLba tweak should fix this?

Dave: have received lots of good input from various folks on this
post; would like to reach a conclusion here:

I believe this 48-bit LBA issue you've identified is the core problem
I've experienced. Do you concur?

If I perform the EnableBigLba regfix on a 200g disk with Win2K
installed but not yet loaded with files past 137gb, are you confident
this will stabilize the system regarding the problems I experienced
when I do load it past 137gb? (A careful read of 305098 seems to imply
this.)

This is the first I've heard of this regfix. Though the issue may seem
second-nature to Windows experts, it's not exactly intuitive from an
end-user perspective to anticipate and seek out an answer to a problem
they don't even know exists. Given the prevalence of >137gb hard
drives for many years now, I'm flabbergasted why this regfix hasn't
been incorporated in a Hotfix or SP release; I thought this kind of
problem is what those releases are supposed to address.
 
D

Dave Patrick

Yes, I suspect it's the primary problem. The controller driver may be
another. I think you'll want to install to a partition smaller than ~137 gB
in size and temp connect a floppy drive so you can add the correct
controller driver via F6 during text mode portion of setup.


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
Z

zeke7

Yes, I suspect it's the primary problem. The controller driver may be
another. I think you'll want to install to a partition smaller than ~137 gB
in size and temp connect a floppy drive so you can add the correct
controller driver via F6 during text mode portion of setup.

--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]http://www.microsoft.com/protect

zeke7 said:
Dave: have received lots of good input from various folks on this
post; would like to reach a conclusion here:
I believe this 48-bit LBA issue you've identified is the core problem
I've experienced. Do you concur?
If I perform the EnableBigLba regfix on a 200g disk with Win2K
installed but not yet loaded with files past 137gb, are you confident
this will stabilize the system regarding the problems I experienced
when I do load it past 137gb? (A careful read of 305098 seems to imply
this.)
This is the first I've heard of this regfix. Though the issue may seem
second-nature to Windows experts, it's not exactly intuitive from an
end-user perspective to anticipate and seek out an answer to a problem
they don't even know exists. Given the prevalence of >137gb hard
drives for many years now, I'm flabbergasted why this regfix hasn't
been incorporated in a Hotfix or SP release; I thought this kind of
problem is what those releases are supposed to address.

Dave--Thanks much for your advice and endurance ; ).

[I'm not seeing some of your latest posts here going through the MS-
TechNet website, but do see them using Google Groups; I wonder why?]

BTW, another reason I pull the Promise controller card during
installation is to save cumulative time given the numerous reboots
required by the 75+ Windows 2K updates and other software installs, so
each bootup can zip right into the MB BIOS and then launch Windows
without having to wait for the controller card's BIOS initial,
somewhat slow drive-detection process before reaching the MB BIOS.
Each boot is a good bit speedier. Easy enough to pop in the card and
install it later once Windows and other software are installed. (I did
contact Promise for direction on which BIOS and driver to use for my
card.)
 
D

Dave Patrick

Try connecting directly to news.microsoft.com

http://www.microsoft.com/dynamics/community/joindiscussion.mspx



Have these ones on hand prior to the install.

Be sure to apply SP4 and these two below to your new install before
connecting to any network. Internet included. (sasser, msblast)
http://download.microsoft.com/download/E/6/A/E6A04295-D2A8-40D0-A0C5-241BFECD095E/W2KSP4_EN.EXE
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/MS03-043.mspx
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/MS03-049.mspx

Then

Rollup 1 for Microsoft Windows 2000 Service Pack 4
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...CF-8850-4531-B52B-BF28B324C662&displaylang=en


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 

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