2 Hard Drives One OS same system.

M

MIG

Hi again, I had a question before I started hoping someone has tried and
done this so I can shorten my install time.

I have a new build with 2 HDs one SATA, one old IDE. I want to install WinXP
Pro on both and will boot primarilly to SATA drive. I want to be able to
select upon start-up to boot to the IDE (without going into the bios) if I
choose. I really dont care about the drive letters on the second drive, but
I assume the will be C, D, etc. as long as the primary drive is C, D, E etc.
which I am sure it will be. I dont really car about accessing one drive from
the other, I am simply looking at two independent drives which I can select
to boot to upon startup.

Can this be done like I described. I thought the SATA drive needs to have
the OS installed first, but need to confirm.

Reason: the SATA drive will be used entirely for work. In the past I had
one drive and somehow inadvertantly I would end up with some virus where I
would have to format and re-install. I cannot endure the downtime. So the
second drive will be use to mess around so to speak, test software, surf the
net, etc. and if I pick up a virus it is seperated. Or if a family member
needs to use the computer they stay far away from my work.

Thanks again in advance, and BTW Happy New Year to all.
 
J

Jerry

You may need to install the SATA drivers using F6 and a floppy during the XP
install to that drive.
 
S

Shenan Stanley

MIG said:
Hi again, I had a question before I started hoping someone has
tried and done this so I can shorten my install time.

I have a new build with 2 HDs one SATA, one old IDE. I want to
install WinXP Pro on both and will boot primarilly to SATA drive.
I want to be able to select upon start-up to boot to the IDE
(without going into the bios) if I choose. I really dont care
about the drive letters on the second drive, but I assume the will
be C, D, etc. as long as the primary drive is C, D, E etc. which I
am sure it will be. I dont really car about accessing one drive
from the other, I am simply looking at two independent drives which
I can select to boot to upon startup.

Can this be done like I described. I thought the SATA drive needs
to have the OS installed first, but need to confirm.

Reason: the SATA drive will be used entirely for work. In the
past I had one drive and somehow inadvertantly I would end up with
some virus where I would have to format and re-install. I cannot
endure the downtime. So the second drive will be use to mess around
so to speak, test software, surf the net, etc. and if I pick up a
virus it is seperated. Or if a family member needs to use the
computer they stay far away from my work.

Thanks again in advance, and BTW Happy New Year to all.

Install on one drive - use a virtual machine to 'play around' and take a
snapshot each time you update/clean the virtual machine so you can revert to
that snapshot whenever you desire (like if something goes wrong.)

You need two Windows XP licenses for what you are wanting to do (or even
what I am suggesting.)

You can disable one drive or the other in the BIOS and install that way.
Then you can really have separate systems - determined by which drive you
enable in the BIOS at the time. That seems to me what you really want
anyway - that way they are truly kept separate - one OS/drive never really
seeing anything on the other drive - because it is disabled in the BIOS
whenever the other is up.

Or get a drive bay to remove/put in a different drive.

Leave it open and unplug one, plug in the other when needed.

But what I wouldn't do is what you seem to want - the drives to be there
both with OSes on them and expect that even though they can see each other -
something bad happening to one will not affect the other.
 
A

Al

You can create a dual boot system utilizing dual installations of XP as you
describe. Immaterial which drive you install XP on first (With dissimilar
OSs the earliest version is installed first) - boot.ini will be modified to
provide option to select boot drive and set a default.
 
D

DL

Its actually quite hard to 'inadvertantly get a virus' it takes quite a bit
of user stupidity
 
M

MIG

Thanks for all the responses, except DL. DL, your response wasn't helpful as
well as uninformed. I will let you know how it works out for those who might
be interested.
 
A

Anna

MIG said:
Hi again, I had a question before I started hoping someone has tried and
done this so I can shorten my install time.

I have a new build with 2 HDs one SATA, one old IDE. I want to install
WinXP
Pro on both and will boot primarilly to SATA drive. I want to be able to
select upon start-up to boot to the IDE (without going into the bios) if I
choose. I really dont care about the drive letters on the second drive,
but
I assume the will be C, D, etc. as long as the primary drive is C, D, E
etc.
which I am sure it will be. I dont really car about accessing one drive
from
the other, I am simply looking at two independent drives which I can
select
to boot to upon startup.

Can this be done like I described. I thought the SATA drive needs to have
the OS installed first, but need to confirm.

Reason: the SATA drive will be used entirely for work. In the past I had
one drive and somehow inadvertantly I would end up with some virus where I
would have to format and re-install. I cannot endure the downtime. So the
second drive will be use to mess around so to speak, test software, surf
the
net, etc. and if I pick up a virus it is seperated. Or if a family member
needs to use the computer they stay far away from my work.

Thanks again in advance, and BTW Happy New Year to all.


MIG...
In addition to the suggestions you've already received, let me add another
option for your
consideration since it just might be an ideal solution for your stated
objective...

1. First of all I'm assuming you're working with a desktop PC which seems
likely under the circumstances.

2. I'm also assuming your current PC case has an available vacant 5 1/4"
bay. Two vacant 5 1/4" bays would be even better!

3. Consider equipping your PC with a removable HDD. If you're not familiar
with that type of device
and without going into too many details at this point just let me say that a
"mobile rack" (designed to
house a removable tray or caddy which contains the HDD) is affixed to a 5
1/4" bay on the computer
case. The installation of such is quite simple - not any more complicated
than installing a CD/DVD
optical drive in one's system. And the cost of a mobile rack is quite
reasonable these days.

4. The beauty of this type of hardware configuration is that you can work
with multiple HDDs, each
effectively isolated from each other (when desired) containing different
operating systems (if
desired). Through a simple turn of a keylock on the mobile rack, you can
thus boot to this drive or that
drive without the need for any "bootloader" or any other multi-booting
software and generally
speaking without the need for continuing to access the BIOS to set the boot
priority order.

5. In your particular situation where the system contains a PATA and a SATA
HDD and you've
indicated you would be primarily booting the latter type of HDD, it probably
would be desirable for you to use the mobile rack designed for a PATA/IDE
type of HDD and internally install your SATA HDD (as it is now installed).

With this configuration you would set your BIOS HDD boot priority order so
that the PATA HDD
(installed as a removable HDD) would be first in boot priority order
followed by the
internally-connected SATA HDD.

So that when the mobile rack's keylock is in the "ON" position (thus both
HDDs are connected in the
system), the system will boot to the PATA HDD and the SATA HDD would then,
of course, be a
secondary drive in the system.

On the other hand, if you turned the mobile rack's keylock to the "OFF"
position, then the system
would boot to the internally-connected SATA HDD.

Using this above-described type of configuration it *would* be necessary for
the user to access the
BIOS setting to change the boot priority order *only* under the circumstance
where he/she desires to
boot to the SATA HDD *and* desires the PATA HDD to be connected (accessed)
as a secondary
HDD during that session. However, since you've indicated you have no need to
ordinarily have
access to a secondary-connected drive, I presume this should pose no problem
for you in terms of
not being able to (ordinarily) access the PATA HDD after booting to your
SATA HDD.

On the other hand there might be instances where you *would* want to have
access to the secondary HDD installed as a removable HDD after booting to
your internally-connected SATA HDD. That would be, for example, where you
desired to clone (or disk-image) the contents of your day-to-day working
SATA HDD to another HDD to maintain on a routine basis a comprehensive
backup system or have other reasons to access a secondary-connected HDD.
While there would be no problem in using another HDD installed in another
removable tray of your mobile rack as the "destination" HDD, i.e., the
recipient of the cloned contents (or disk-image) of the SATA HDD, there
would be need under those circumstances to access the BIOS boot priority
order (as explained in the preceding paragraph) in order to change the HDD
boot priority order so that the first boot is to your SATA HDD with the
mobile rack containing a PATA HDD set to "ON". Of course you could avoid
even this situation by utilizing a USB (or eSATA) external HDD for this and
other purposes, e.g., storage of other data.

(The preceding scenario is one reason why we highly recommend the
installation of *two* mobile racks should that be practical depending upon
the availability of two vacant 5 1/4" bays on the desktop's PC case. That
configuration completely avoids any future need to access the BIOS boot
priority order as well as providing enormous flexibility for the PC user.)

6. You'll have no problem with drive letter assignments regardless of which
HDD is booted to.
Whatever drive is booted to will be assigned a C: drive letter. The
secondary HDD (should it be
connected) will have some other drive letter assigned to it by the OS.
Subsequently if & when the
latter drive becomes the boot drive it will be assigned the C: drive letter
by the OS and the drive that
previously had a C: drive letter assignment will be assigned (by the system)
another drive letter
should that drive be connected as a secondary HDD.

7. Note that with the use of removable HDDs you can utilize an *infinite*
number of removable trays
(for use in a single mobile rack), thus each family member could be provided
with their own HDD for
their exclusive use. Each would simply remove their removable HDD from the
mobile rack when
finished with their business.

As I hope you can see from the above description there's great flexibility
for the user in utilizing one or more removable HDDs in one's desktop PC
system.

8. I'm assuming you have, or will be using, a disk-cloning program to
initially clone the contents of one HDD to the other HDD. I believe you've
received some recommendations re this. Should you be
interested in my recommendation I'll be glad to provide it.

We've been working with removable hard drives for about 15 years and
probably have installed or help install more than a thousand of these
devices over those years. By & large we've found this
desktop PC hardware configuration a most desirable one for the great
majority of desktop PC users.
And we've found that the only regret virtually every desktop PC user of
these devices has had is that
they didn't install them sooner!

Anyway should this hardware configuration prove practical in your situation,
give it some consideration or at least keep it in mind as something you
might want to consider in the future. If you're interested in pursuing
further, so indicate and I'll provide more detailed info about this kind of
system.
Anna
 
S

Shenan Stanley

<snipped>
<link to entire conversation in posting below>


MIG...
In addition to the suggestions you've already received, let me add
another option for your
consideration since it just might be an ideal solution for your
stated objective...

1. First of all I'm assuming you're working with a desktop PC which
seems likely under the circumstances.

2. I'm also assuming your current PC case has an available vacant 5
1/4" bay. Two vacant 5 1/4" bays would be even better!

Consider equipping your PC with a removable HDD.<snipped>

The preceding scenario is one reason why we highly recommend the
installation of *two* mobile racks should that be practical
depending upon the availability of two vacant 5 1/4" bays on the
desktop's PC case. That configuration completely avoids any future
need to access the BIOS boot priority order as well as providing
enormous flexibility for the PC user.

As I hope you can see from the above description there's great
flexibility for the user in utilizing one or more removable HDDs in
one's desktop PC system.

Anyway should this hardware configuration prove practical in your
situation, give it some consideration or at least keep it in mind
as something you might want to consider in the future. If you're
interested in pursuing further, so indicate and I'll provide more
detailed info about this kind of system.

Anna,

I wouldn't call it adding another option - just repeating in [much]
great[er] detail one already given in the conversation. ;-)

http://www.microsoft.com/communitie...27-9cc2-3f37fb7ff8c1&cat=&lang=&cr=&sloc=&p=6
 
A

Anna

Shenan Stanley said:
<snipped>
<link to entire conversation in posting below> (SNIP)
Anna,

I wouldn't call it adding another option - just repeating in [much]
great[er] detail one already given in the conversation. ;-)

http://www.microsoft.com/communitie...27-9cc2-3f37fb7ff8c1&cat=&lang=&cr=&sloc=&p=6


Shenan:
Well perhaps the "much greater detail" will be of some additional benefit to
the OP as well as other readers who might be interested in the concept of
installing one or more removable HDDs in their desktop PC.
Anna
 
M

MIG

Anna and Shenan thanks for the info regarding this option. Anna I do
appreciate the additional detail. Btw which rack do you recommend? And
additional info on disk-cloning would be appreciated. I always like to learn
and keep good info because I never know when I may need it.

At this point after reading my MB manual there is an option after the
computer POST and prior to Windows starting to load I hit the F8 key and a
window pops up allowing me to choose which device I want to boot from. If I
do not hit F8 and sinply allow windows to load it will boot to what I have
specified in the BIOS. I didnt have to set up anything for this optional
window and I wasnt sure if it would work after I read it - but it did.

Thanks again.

Anna said:
Shenan Stanley said:
<snipped>
<link to entire conversation in posting below> (SNIP)
Anna,

I wouldn't call it adding another option - just repeating in [much]
great[er] detail one already given in the conversation. ;-)

http://www.microsoft.com/communitie...27-9cc2-3f37fb7ff8c1&cat=&lang=&cr=&sloc=&p=6


Shenan:
Well perhaps the "much greater detail" will be of some additional benefit to
the OP as well as other readers who might be interested in the concept of
installing one or more removable HDDs in their desktop PC.
Anna


.
 
A

Anna

MIG said:
Anna and Shenan thanks for the info regarding this option. Anna I do
appreciate the additional detail. Btw which rack do you recommend? And
additional info on disk-cloning would be appreciated. I always like to
learn
and keep good info because I never know when I may need it.

At this point after reading my MB manual there is an option after the
computer POST and prior to Windows starting to load I hit the F8 key and a
window pops up allowing me to choose which device I want to boot from. If
I
do not hit F8 and sinply allow windows to load it will boot to what I have
specified in the BIOS. I didnt have to set up anything for this optional
window and I wasnt sure if it would work after I read it - but it did.

Thanks again.


MIG:
First of all there is nothing inherently wrong or misguided in accessing
your motherboard's BIOS to access the boot priority order and utilize that
setting to boot to one or the other bootable HDDs you've installed in your
desktop PC. Thousands upon thousands of PC users utilize that process every
day. In your situation pressing the F8 key during the bootup process allows
you to enter the BIOS. In many cases the Delete key or some other key can be
used to access the BIOS.

You previously indicated that you're working with a PATA and a SATA HDD,
each one containing a bootable OS. And you further indicated that you
desired the drives to be separated in some way so that the drive *you* would
be working on would be "earmarked" as your drive, hopefully not to be able
to be accessed by this or that family member, and the latter would be
restricted to working on his or her own "earmarked" drive. At least that's
what I took away from your post re this issue.

I did respond to your post in some detail re the advantages of installing
one or more removable hard drives in your desktop PC case assuming it was
practical to do so. If you have any specific questions re the installation
process and/or the utilization of removable HDDs in their mobile racks it
would be best if you post such I'll be happy to respond.

As to our preference re mobile racks...

For the past few years we've been working primarily with the Athena Power
MR-125B mobile rack. See...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817123302
As you will note it's quite reasonable in price even when it's not "on
sale". Note that this mobile rack is specifically designed for SATA HDDs.

It's an all-plastic model but has proven very reliable for us. (There's also
an all-aluminum version at slightly higher cost). The rack includes a
bottom-mounted 80mm fan that's virtually inaudible. What we particularly
like about it (aside from its reliability and simplicity of operation) is
that rather than use an ON-OFF keylock, a simple push-to-release lever turns
the device on or off, thus it can be easily physically connected or
/disconnected from the system. It's a particularly important consideration
for us since we're continually changing HDDs and trying to find the key can
be an annoyance. But most of these devices do come with the keylock
mechanism and many users prefer that type of switch.

As I mentioned in my last post...the installation of these devices is no
more complicated than installing an optical drive. Of course one's desktop
case must have one or more vacant 5 1/4" bays to accommodate the rack(s).

AthenaPower also markets a number of mobile racks designed for PATA HDDs but
except for a couple of instances we've never really worked with them. See...
http://www.athenapower.us/web_mobile_zoom/mobile.htm
I don't believe newegg carries their PATA models.

Since we work primarily with SATA HDDs it's only infrequently that we need a
mobile rack to house a PATA HDD. When we were working nearly exclusively
with PATA HDDs we used the Lian-Li RH-32 & RH-42 models. I think both models
have virtually disappeared from the market. Since we still have a stock of
the RH-42 model we really don't have any need nowadays to secure any add'l
models designed for PATA HDDs.

Anyway, take a look at newegg's offerings, including mobile racks designed
for PATA HDDs...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...PA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=mobile+racks

As to my preference for a disk-cloning program...

The program we strongly recommend as a comprehensive backup program is the
Casper 6 program. This program is a disk-cloning program and not a
disk-imaging program. It is designed to create what amounts to a
byte-for-byte copy of your day-to-day working HDD. As such it will create a
clone of your "source" HDD, in effect a precise copy of your operating
system, all your programs & applications, configurations, and of course your
personal data. In short, *everything* that's on your day-to-day working HDD.
It's hard to imagine a better backup system for the great majority of PC
users.

The Casper program is extremely simple to use even for an inexperienced
user, reasonably quick in operation, and quite effective. There's virtually
no "learning curve" in undertaking the disk cloning process as one navigates
through the few easy-to-understand screens with a final mouse-click on the
button on the screen which will trigger the disk-cloning process. After
undertaking one or two disk-cloning operations it should take the user no
more than 15 - 20 seconds or so to get to that point.

But the truly significant advantage of the Casper 6.0 disk cloning program
compared with other disk cloning programs that we're familiar with, e.g.,
Acronis True Image, is its ability to create *incremental* disk clones
following the creation of the original (first) disk clone. Employing what
Casper calls its "SmartClone" technology the program can create subsequent
disk clones of the source HDD usually at a fraction of the time it takes to
create a "full" disk clone. This results in a decided incentive for the user
to undertake frequent complete backups of his or her system knowing that
they can create "incremental" disk clones in a relatively short period of
time. Understand that this "incremental disk clone" is a *complete* clone
(copy) of the "source" HDD, not merely an "incremental file". Thus the PC
user is encouraged to maintain reasonably up-to-date *complete* backups of
his/her system.

So if you use the program to back up your system every few days or on a
weekly basis (or even daily) it will probably take not much more than 4 or 5
minutes to complete the disk-cloning operation. Obviously the amount of time
it will take will depend upon the amount of data being cloned and the time
that has elapsed between disk-cloning operations.

Again, bear in mind that the recipient of the clone - the "destination" HDD
(internal or external) - would contain the *complete* contents of one's
internal HDD (presumably the boot drive). Since that destination drive would
be a precise copy of the source HDD, its contents would be immediately
accessible to the user and potentially bootable. Again, what better backup
system can one have? And again - because the Casper disk-cloning operation
takes a relatively short period of time to complete its disk-cloning
operations there's a strong incentive for the user to more frequently keep
their backups up-to-date than they might otherwise do.

The Casper 6.0 program is also capable of scheduling the disk-cloning
process on a daily, weekly, or other time period selected by the user so
that should the user prefer he or she could arrange for automatic backups at
pre-determined times.

A trial version (slightly crippled) of the program is available at
http://www.fssdev.com, so give it a try and see how you like it. Also avail
yourself of the opportunity of trying out other disk-cloning/disk-imaging
programs. Virtually all of the commercial ones have trial versions available
for download.
Anna
 
M

MIG

Thanks again Anna for all the information. Just to clarify though, unless we
are saying the same thing or I think I might not have been clear in my
previous post. When I press F8 as the system POST but prior to the OS
loading this doesnt bring me into the BIOS but rather the BIOS on the MB
reveals a pop-up window in blue which then allows me to select any attached
drive to boot from for that instance only. Then upon shutdown or restart if
I press nothing it then boots to the drive as set in the BIOS.

Funny thing is when I purchased this MB I didnt know about this feature and
upon reading the reviews didn't read about it either.

Anyway, I have kept your info and thanks again.
 
A

Anna

(SNIP)


MIG said:
Thanks again Anna for all the information. Just to clarify though, unless
we
are saying the same thing or I think I might not have been clear in my
previous post. When I press F8 as the system POST but prior to the OS
loading this doesnt bring me into the BIOS but rather the BIOS on the MB
reveals a pop-up window in blue which then allows me to select any
attached
drive to boot from for that instance only. Then upon shutdown or restart
if
I press nothing it then boots to the drive as set in the BIOS.

Funny thing is when I purchased this MB I didnt know about this feature
and
upon reading the reviews didn't read about it either.

Anyway, I have kept your info and thanks again.


MIG:
Yes, I understand you. Many motherboards allow you to (in effect) directly
access the boot priority order in the BIOS through one keystroke or another.
That's fine. I should have been more careful in my wording above! For a
variety of reasons many of us prefer to access the "complete" BIOS when
accessing the boot priority order so we'll do so by pressing the appropriate
keystroke that allows us to do just that. For example, pressing the Delete
key will ordinarily bring up the BIOS involving an Intel motherboard/system.
But it's fine to do just what you're doing.

Turning to the other topic that you raised...

Just out of curiosity...have you made any decision re installing one or more
removable hard drives in your desktop PC system or are you considering some
other option(s)?
Anna
 

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