Screenshot Captor: A New Definition for Freeware

[thunder7]

I too used "Screenshot Captor" recived a nag screen. When I questioned
the author he was rather rude . I also beta test a lot of programs I
told him where there where bugs He told me I was in error. I have
stopped using his programs!.
I however see http://shellcity.net/ is still hailing him as a "FREEWARE
guru." Shell City also needs to be told. They have a lot of excellent
freeware programs there.
In the true defination of freeware.

 

[mouser]

Gretings,

I am the author of Screenshot Captor, and the person who started the
DonationCoder.com website where it lives.

I've recently written a very long article on our approach; what we are
trying to do with freeware/donationware and why. It touches on some of
these issues (which have come up in another alt.comp.freeware thread):

http://articles.donationcoder.com/One/index.html

I am always willing to discuss these issues and have tried so hard to
be respectfull and helpful in all things related to our site and our
programs; our primary motivation for the entire site is to figure out a
way to keep our software free and accessible while still figuring out a
way to communicate that donations are important to us.

There is one thing I absolutely am really troubled and saddened by
though - it's the comments by thunder that i was somehow rude in some
email or ignored bug reports. If there is one thing I am sure of in
the 15 month history of DonationCoder.com it is that i have not once
been disrespectful or critical to a user or critic of our site. I
personally handle all the emails to the site and I have not once
dismissed a bug report.

In fact, the whole point of our site is try to form a community between
users and coders and engage in a kind of contract where we promise to
work hard to develop and improve software to meet the needs of our
users in return for asking for their financial support and help in
testing software. I hope the people who have know our site feel like
we have done a good job and lived up to our promises in this respect.
I believe they do.

I am available every day, without exception, on our forums, and in our
irc channel. I am always accessible and posts about problems on our
site generally get answered in terms of minutes or hours. We are proud
of being free from the normal forum flame wars and we pride ourselves
on being helpful and courteous.

I am genuinely perplexed by the comment from thunder. Thunder I invite
you to email me ([email protected]) and remind me of our
interactions. I also welcome you post them here if you want to - that
goes for any email or forum or irc chat i have had with anyone in the
history of our site - you are welcome to post any correspondence. If
there is something you felt I did wrong or that I disrespected some
report about bugs I would very much like to hear about it.

I will also say what I've said before - all of our software is meant to
be fully usable for free. We are only trying to encourage donations in
a world where people seem happy to buy commercial software, and happy
to use free software, but almost never donate. If you take the time to
check out our site and decide you are not going to make a donation, you
need only email us and tell us so, and you can skip the normal (what we
think is reasonable) process of waiting for a non-expiring license, and
we will email you one right away.

And I really do ask you to take a look at that article i posted a link
to above; it explains better than I have here what we are trying to do
and why.

-mouser
(e-mail address removed)

ps.Thunder7, seriously - do email me and remind me what I said that
upset you - I have no idea what it could be.

 

[Bob Adkins]

Some freeware does require to get a license key to use the program. For
example, I use the freeware version of Avast & the program runs in
trial mode until you get a free license key. The free license key for
Avast expires once a year & when it expires, you have to get a new key.

Getting a free license key for a freeware prog doesn't bother me
because if it seems like a good program, I'll go thru the hoops of
getting a license key to use the program.

All true, and fair enough.

However, this one is too convoluted for me. I didn't register, and don't
plan to. To do so would be to support Mouser's unusual requirements. I don't
know what his software is, but it's not exactly Feeware. It's more like
"Arm Twist Ware" or "Hassle Ware".

 

[f0dder]

Perhaps calling (some of) the DonationCoder applications "freeware" is
wrong - "DonationWare" might be a more appropriate term. It's important to
note, though, that you do NOT have to donate to be able to use the
applications fully, and in that sense they are "freeware".

It's true that you get nag screens until you sign up at the forum and get a
license key. Apart from being a minor annoyance, how bad is this, though?
The donationcoder.com forums are pretty interesting and useful, so it's not
like it's a loss to signup there.

Not all of the software at DC are nag-until-free-registration, by the way.
My own http://fSekrit.donationcoder.com is "true freeware", and so is a
bunch of the other stuff... look around

 

[John Jay Smith]

Hello, mouser.. are you a developer - programmer?
or do you just run the site?

 

[mouser]

i am the programmer of screenshot captor and several other of the
programs on the site, as well as the main website admin.
(i spent this past weekend writing a complete up-to-date help file for
screenshot captor; not the funnest work but it's exactly the kind of
work we are committed to doing as part of asking for support from our
users; ps. you'll also find at the end of all of our help files a list
of all related shareware and freeware programs).

 

[John Jay Smith]

Ok listen... its a good oportunity to tell you this...I was planning on
emailing you
anyway, but this happened and you popped in.

I will be contacting you shortly via email... I have some ideas what will
be beneficial for both of us and in fact everyone else....

I will add to the email "from john jay smith of the freeware newsgroup"

 

[Klaatu]

Perhaps calling (some of) the DonationCoder applications "freeware" is
wrong - "DonationWare" might be a more appropriate term. It's
important to note, though, that you do NOT have to donate to be able
to use the applications fully, and in that sense they are "freeware".

Even the term "donationware" is not being accurate, since it's not really
a "donation", is it? It's a payment, plain and simple, so "shareware"
would be more accurate. Perhaps "registerware", but certainly not
"freeware".

It's true that you get nag screens until you sign up at the forum and
get a license key. Apart from being a minor annoyance, how bad is
this, though? The donationcoder.com forums are pretty interesting and
useful, so it's not like it's a loss to signup there.

So wouldn't the term "nagware" be better? All nagware nags you to do
something to get rid of the nag, so at least it fits. The bad part is use
of the term "freeware", when these programs are nothing of the sort.

Not all of the software at DC are nag-until-free-registration, by the
way. My own http://fSekrit.donationcoder.com is "true freeware", and
so is a bunch of the other stuff... look around

Why should one need to say "true freeware" when the term "freeware" works
just fine? Since calling (some of) these programs freeware is outright
lying, if one agrees with the commonly accepted definition of the term:
Legally obtainable software that you may use at no cost, monetary *or
otherwise*, for as long as you wish.

 

[mouser]

a lot of these issues also came up and were discussed in this past
alt.comp.freeware thread:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.comp.freeware/browse_frm/thread/7e3e5755136b0a54

 

[mouser]

no matter what *we* would call it on our site -
people find out about and download our software mainly from software
listing sites - fileforum, tucows, softpedia, snapfiles, etc.
and there is always only: Shareware (with a cost field), and Freeware.

from my experience, nagware refers to software you have to BUY to
remove a nag; that is not appropriate for our software.

registerware would probably be more appropriate, but how many
lay-people really know what that means?

 

[f0dder]

(Verata nicktoo!, or however it's spelt

I see your points... it's a bit hard to classify the software, IMHO. The
programs are fully functional and without time expiration (except for the
"visit forum one more time after 6 months to obtain never-expiring license"
thing), and you can get the nag-removing license for free. So I don't think
shareware is an appropriate term?

I think the most important thing, though, is to say that mouser isn't a
con-man and that donationcoder.com is a great site. (No, I'm not getting
paid for this

 

[thunder7]

I really have to apologize to mouser. I am sorry!.-7-
i made a mistake. About DonationCoder.
I a wrong!. We all have bad days you are very nice.

And even though I am very poor.
I do want to help programmers build better programs, this is why I beta
test!.
I do not have very much money but I did donate.
I like to help when I can.

Thank for building the programs you do for us, And you also need money
too, I know you also enjoy eating as much as I.
Please forgive me!.
Thunder7

 

[mouser]

not a problem at all - it was just a misunderstanding; all's well that
ends well

for those curious about thunder7's original post, he had emailed me to
tell me about a bug many months ago, and i emailed back and said that i
would try to fix it right away and remarked: "very annoying". thunder7
thought i was saying him emailing me was very annoying, when i was
really commisserating with him about the bug

 

[tsaint]

Quote: the term "freeware" only means you dont have to pay money....
see this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeware

By any standards of logic - well, almost any - the software at
donationcoders fits this definition.
It does NOT say in your definition anything about any steps you need to
undertake to get the software.

An equally illogical approach would be to say its not freeware because
you have to download it or its not freeware because your
wife has been nagging you this last week.

You need to re-read your quoted definition and assimilate what it says.


Mouser's software does NOT require payment ie "you don't have to pay
money" so it fits the definition, but additionally, you can donate
money if you see fit.
There's nothing to debate if you're happy with the wikipedia
definition.

As a final point, anyone who has dealings with Mouser and donationcoder
would be aware that they are on high moral and ethical ground - darn
nice guy as well.
tony saint

 

[jgpaiva]

I'm jgpaiva, and I'm a regular at donationcoder.com forums. I also make
my best to help DC become even better than it is right now.
As do all of the members i know at donationcoder. Mouser has been very
well succeeded in building a great community, supported by his
software, his very good administration and moderation of the site and
forums. (and also some luck, in finding a bunch of great forum members
)

I can understand people getting mad at having a nag screen in a
software program, after all, most of the people is fooled into thinking
that software authors live out of thin air. I also don't like to have
ads in web pages, popups, nag screens, messages, etc.
What do i do? I try get rid of them. But what i don't agree, is to say
the software authors don't have the right to do that.

Surviving out of donationware isn't easy, just read the article mouser
mentioned, and you'll understand a few important issues that people
often disregard. The truth is: if that nag screen wasn't there, the
donationcoder community would never have been as well succeded, and I
wouldn't have found this great site.

I just think it's important to see both sides of the question in these
matters. I think that if people thought a bit more like that, they'd
even understand that just a nag screen isn't nearly enough for what
mouser's software is worth.

(i don't think there's even anything to debate about the term
"freeware", it's "free" + "software". the english language isn't
ambiguous enough to make that word mean anything else.)

 

[Susan Bugher]

(i don't think there's even anything to debate about the term
"freeware", it's "free" + "software". the english language isn't
ambiguous enough to make that word mean anything else.)

Your definition means Trialware, Adware, Spyware and Warez are all
"Freeware". Is that your true position on the meaning of the word
"Freeware"?

Susan
--
Posted to alt.comp.freeware
Search alt.comp.freeware (or read it online):
http://www.google.com/advanced_group_search?q=+group:alt.comp.freeware
Pricelessware & ACF: http://www.pricelesswarehome.org
Pricelessware: http://www.pricelessware.org (not maintained)

 

[Susan Bugher]

It's disheartening to see so many posts saying Freeware is any software
that's free because. . .

For weeks now I've been working on filling in the missing ware
descriptions on the ACF pages (only a few hundred more to go). If anyone
*likes* those detailed ware descriptions please speak up. I need some
encouragement. . .

Susan
--
Posted to alt.comp.freeware
Search alt.comp.freeware (or read it online):
http://www.google.com/advanced_group_search?q=+group:alt.comp.freeware
Pricelessware & ACF: http://www.pricelesswarehome.org
Pricelessware: http://www.pricelessware.org (not maintained)

 

[Dan Goodman]

It's disheartening to see so many posts saying Freeware is any
software that's free because. . .

For weeks now I've been working on filling in the missing ware
descriptions on the ACF pages (only a few hundred more to go). If
anyone likes those detailed ware descriptions please speak up. I need
some encouragement. . .

Susan

I like them!

--

Dan Goodman
All political parties die at last of swallowing their own lies.
John Arbuthnot (1667-1735), Scottish writer, physician.
Journal http://dsgood.livejournal.com
Clutterers Anonymous unofficial community
http://community.livejournal.com/clutterers_anon/
Decluttering http://decluttering.blogspot.com
Predictions and Politics http://dsgood.blogspot.com
Links http://del.icio.us/dsgood

 

[=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=BBQ=AB?=]

from my experience, nagware refers to software you have to BUY to
remove a nag; that is not appropriate for our software.

Certainly that's the most common type of nagware, but nagging people to
make a "donation" or to visit your website repeatedly is also nagging.

 

[zridling]

DonationCoder.com makes no claim to freeware, but to Donationware.
Mouser and other forum admins have gone out of their way to keep
DonationCoder.com a respectful place online, which is rare in these
rough-and-tumble days on the internet.

I hope you will give it a second chance. There are a host of other
developers who drop in and give advice, discuss coding issues, and even
ask for specific feedback from DonationCoder.com "members." I'm only a
user, but I don't see anything wrong with developers wanting to get
paid a modest sum for their work through structured donations. The four
distinctions of software I regular frequent are:

- Donationware
- Freeware
- Open Source
- Shareware

- Zaine Ridling
THE GREAT SOFTWARE LIST
http://www.anova.org/software/


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