Word 2007 Outline-Numbered Heading Styles

[rgille]

Hello - I was expert at creating outline-numbered heading styles in Word 2003
and earlier. I still haven't figured out the best way to do this in Word
2007. In Word 2007, when I access the Modify Style dialog box for Heading 1
style (for example), click the Format button, then click the Numbering link,
this takes me to a Numbering and Bullets dialog box that does not include
outline numbering. So if I add numbering to my Heading 1 style, it will not
be linked to numbering I add for other heading levels. Not good. I'm aware
of the Multilevel List button on the Ribbon's Home tab, Paragraph group. Is
the best way now to add outline numbering to heading styles to (1) apply
Heading 1 style to a paragraph, (2) pick a multilevel list and apply the list
formatting as direct formatting on top of the Heading 1 paragraph, then (3)
update the Heading 1 style to match the selection? If that's the way to do
it, what's the point of the Numbering link in the Modify Styles dialog box?
And good luck on further modifications to the outline-numbered heading style
– sometimes you have to modify from the Modify Style dialog, sometimes from
multilevel list dialog, and sometimes neither work. (I don't usually
complain about Microsoft, because what's the point, but I have to say it is
frustrating that they changed something that previously worked well and
intuitively.)

 

[rgille]

Thanks Pam, that is very helpful. So, to modify Heading styles integrated
with multilevel list numbering, I go in to modify through the "Define a New
Multilevel List" link, rather than through the Modify Styles dialog box. I
still think it's confusing because if you go in to modify the Heading style
directly (by accessing the Modify Style dialog box), it doesn't seem to allow
modification of the numbering on the Heading styles, even though there is a
Numbering link there. Also, "Define a New Multilevel List" is used in this
case to modify the current list numbering, not to create a new list (since I
don't need to name a new list here). But in any case, so long as I can
modify my heading numbering now, I'm happy. Thanks! - Bob

 

[Stefan Blom]

When opening the multilevel list dialog box, make sure to have the insertion
point in the first top-level paragraph of your list, which for heading
numbering means the first Heading 1 paragraph of the document. If you don't
do that, Word might restart the numbering at the insertion point, but for
numbering linked to paragraph styles you can easily fix it by pressing
Ctrl+Q (to reset paragraph formatting).

If you make use of list styles (Home tab | Multilevel List | Define New List
Style), you will find it easier to edit a list after you've created it; for
example, you can use the Manage Styles dialog box for that purpose.

 

[Stefan Blom]

Yes, that is confusing. I keep it straight by remembering that multilevel
list numbering is not applied or adjusted through the modify styles dialog
(with one (probably a bug) exception: removing numbering from styles after
multilevel list has been changed to none).

Indeed, it is interesting that you can use the Modify Style dialog box to
clear the numbering for a style. As you point out, this might very well be a
bug.

The other (potentially safer) way to clear multilevel numbering from
paragraph styles is via the multilevel list dialog box, choosing "(no
style)" for each numbering level.

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

Bullets and numbering is still in
the modify styles picks because you CAN apply regular numbering and
bullets
through modify styles.

Pam

Also, "Define a New Multilevel List" is used in this

case to modify the current list numbering, not to create a new list (since
I
don't need to name a new list here).

But in any case, so long as I can

modify my heading numbering now, I'm happy. Thanks! - Bob

Yes, using Multilevel lists is the W2007 way to number headings (& of
course
there's another). The method to apply them is this: (1) Place your
cursor in

[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]

frustrating that they changed something that previously worked well and
intuitively.)

 

[James C]

After 2 hours of putzing with multi-level lists, outline list, bullets and
numbers, and headings and the like...I give up. Everytime I think I have
this working... I edit a section of my document and the headings I dont want
numbered get numbers, and the ones I had perfectly numbered reset to 1.1,
1.2, etc. Word 2007 continues to fight against me....

In switched back to Word 2003 and finally got the document to hold the
outline numbering so I could finish the document for an 8 am deadline. Geez,
I thought Ventura Publisher was hard, but honestly it did make bullets and
numbering easy.

Go back ten years, look at desk top publishing style sheets and make it
simple. A style sheet is suppose to make life easier, not an endless series
of changing text an patterns, even when you turn off "automatic update" it
still has a mind of its own.

How come something so critical to writing a good technical document is so
complex in this product? This program costs me money rather save me time.

Come on Microsoft, take a lesson from Apple, make the basic things easy.....

James

Yes, that is confusing. I keep it straight by remembering that multilevel
list numbering is not applied or adjusted through the modify styles dialog
(with one (probably a bug) exception: removing numbering from styles after
multilevel list has been changed to none).

Indeed, it is interesting that you can use the Modify Style dialog box to
clear the numbering for a style. As you point out, this might very well be a
bug.

The other (potentially safer) way to clear multilevel numbering from
paragraph styles is via the multilevel list dialog box, choosing "(no
style)" for each numbering level.

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

Bullets and numbering is still in
the modify styles picks because you CAN apply regular numbering and
bullets
through modify styles.

Pam

Also, "Define a New Multilevel List" is used in this

case to modify the current list numbering, not to create a new list (since
I
don't need to name a new list here).

But in any case, so long as I can

modify my heading numbering now, I'm happy. Thanks! - Bob

Yes, using Multilevel lists is the W2007 way to number headings (& of
course
there's another). The method to apply them is this: (1) Place your
cursor in
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
frustrating that they changed something that previously worked well and
intuitively.)

 

[Stefan Blom]

Not sure if you're actually expecting an answer to this, or if you're just
venting. Note, however, that Microsoft doesn't monitor these groups. We, the
people answering questions here, do it on our own time...

Trying to ask your (implied) question: If this is heading numbering, you can
edit it by placing the insertion point in the first Heading 1 paragraph of
the document and then clicking Home tab | Multilevel List | Define New
Multilevel List. You'll see a dialog box similar to the Customize Outline
Numbered List dialog box of Word 97-2003. The dialog box allows you to
define all aspects of numbering (indentation, number format, linking to
paragraph styles, setting restart options, etc.).

If numbering won't "behave" for a certain level, it might be easier to just
delete the contents of the "Enter formatting for number" box in the dialog
box, and reinsert it via "Number style for this level" and "Include level
number from," typing the punctuation as needed.

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

After 2 hours of putzing with multi-level lists, outline list, bullets and
numbers, and headings and the like...I give up. Everytime I think I have
this working... I edit a section of my document and the headings I dont
want
numbered get numbers, and the ones I had perfectly numbered reset to 1.1,
1.2, etc. Word 2007 continues to fight against me....

In switched back to Word 2003 and finally got the document to hold the
outline numbering so I could finish the document for an 8 am deadline.
Geez,
I thought Ventura Publisher was hard, but honestly it did make bullets and
numbering easy.

Go back ten years, look at desk top publishing style sheets and make it
simple. A style sheet is suppose to make life easier, not an endless
series
of changing text an patterns, even when you turn off "automatic update" it
still has a mind of its own.

How come something so critical to writing a good technical document is so
complex in this product? This program costs me money rather save me time.

Come on Microsoft, take a lesson from Apple, make the basic things
easy.....

James

rgille wrote:
Thanks Pam, that is very helpful. So, to modify Heading styles
integrated
with multilevel list numbering, I go in to modify through the "Define a
New
Multilevel List" link, rather than through the Modify Styles dialog
box.
I
still think it's confusing because if you go in to modify the Heading
style
directly (by accessing the Modify Style dialog box), it doesn't seem to
allow
modification of the numbering on the Heading styles, even though there
is
a
Numbering link there.

Yes, that is confusing. I keep it straight by remembering that
multilevel
list numbering is not applied or adjusted through the modify styles
dialog
(with one (probably a bug) exception: removing numbering from styles
after
multilevel list has been changed to none).

Indeed, it is interesting that you can use the Modify Style dialog box to
clear the numbering for a style. As you point out, this might very well
be a
bug.

The other (potentially safer) way to clear multilevel numbering from
paragraph styles is via the multilevel list dialog box, choosing "(no
style)" for each numbering level.

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

Bullets and numbering is still in
the modify styles picks because you CAN apply regular numbering and
bullets
through modify styles.

Pam

Also, "Define a New Multilevel List" is used in this
case to modify the current list numbering, not to create a new list
(since
I
don't need to name a new list here).
But in any case, so long as I can
modify my heading numbering now, I'm happy. Thanks! - Bob

Yes, using Multilevel lists is the W2007 way to number headings (& of
course
there's another). The method to apply them is this: (1) Place your
cursor in
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
frustrating that they changed something that previously worked well
and
intuitively.)

 

[Paul Willyams]

This works OK for me, setting up a style 1, 1.1, 1.1.1 etc linked to heading
styles. I agree that it is not as intuitive and cannot see why this is not
available from Styles. However, there is another problem I have struck,
which seems really odd:

Setting up your heading styles this was turns them into a Numbered List, not
a Heading. So they no longer appear in to Go To or the Insert
Cross-Reference as Headings. They do appear under the Numbered List type,
along with any other numbered lists, which is really and truly unhelpful.

Thanks to their outline levels they do appear in the Table of Contents.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

If you select the numbering scheme that is linked to the headings, then you
will be using the heading styles, and they will be numbered. You apply the
numbering by applying the appropriate heading style.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

 

[Geodesic]

Hello - I was expert at creating outline-numbered heading styles in Word 2003
and earlier. I still haven't figured out the best way to do this in Word
2007.

I've tried for several days and several times to post to be Microsoft
"community" portal to USENET (word general), but my posts always disappear,
and I never can't see anything to get a response. Like the person above, I
was able to produce multilevel outlines in Word 2003, but have had absolutely
no luck in Word 2007.

Like many of you, I am frustrated, disappointed, even angry at how
complicated and counterintuitive the use of outlines is in Word07. I am not
looking to create a complicated environment in which different 'levels' are
connected to very different formats. I simply want to create outlines in
which (1.) it is easy to move elements around (to promote or demote, to move
up or down), (2.) in which elements can be expanded or collapsed, (3.) all
with a coherent numbering scheme. This is easy in OneNote07 where it is the
default. I finally managed this in WordXP, but not without hard wiring my
'headings' so that only one system was acceptable. Still I did it, having to
"program" WordXP to even get it to produce the most basic outlines. While I
have had Word07 for over a year I still cannot get it to produce even the
most basic outline.

I should point out that if I use the "help" of Word 07, and ask 'how to
create an multilevel outline,' I am forwarded to how to create multilevel
numbered **lists**, lists which don't have the ability to expand and collapse
lower levels. This seems a flaw. When I search around further, I am
forwarded to websites that explain outlines for earlier versions of Word
(where the link between levels was clearer).

So here's the problem more simply:
Suppose I want to create a simple 1/a/1/a/ outline. I go to the outline tab
at the bottom of any page. I type something and assume that Word 07 will
believe I am at 'Level I.' It is unclear because of course I have to go back
to the Home tab on the ribbon in order to see what style is being used, such
as 'Heading 1'. I then go to the paragraph subset of the home tab and choose
multilevel outline. I see the "define new multilevel list' option which
gives some indication of what level I'm at.'

I see 1.) appear at the beginning of the first line. I hit return, see the
second element with its 2.) appear. I now demote that elements using the
shortcut shft-alt-right arrow, expecting it to turn into 'a.)'. But while
the heading on the styles above shifts to 'Heading 2,' the number does not
change. So I end up with outlines that look proceed serially not like a
multilevel list
1.
2.
3.
4.

If the links between the levels and the headings are broken, why is it so
hard to find any information on the Microsoft websites to fix this? Again, I
have followed other information that the Microsoft website has provided since
I simply want to begin with the "format" of each level to be the same - I
don't want blue fonts, bold or italics, changes in the space between
paragraph elements, etc.

I simply want a simple outline, but with more functionality than a numbered
list (eg. including ability to expand and collapse). In the future I might
decide at some level might be bold or not.

For the record, using 'modify style,' these are the styles of the headings:

Heading 1 : Font: (Asian) +Headings Asian, (Default) Calibri, 12 pt,
Justified, Line spacing: Multiple 1.15 li, Widow/Orphan control, Keep with
next, Keep lines together, Level 1, Style: Linked, Quick Style, Priority: 10,
Following style: Normal

Heading2: Level 2, Style: Linked, Hide until used, Quick Style, Priority:
10, Based on: Heading 1, Following style: Normal

Heading3: Level 3, Style: Linked, Hide until used, Quick Style, Priority:
10, Based on: Heading 2, Following style: Normal

Etc. (I don't know anything about this Asian heading). So is there any hope
of creating even the most basic outline which will look something like:
1.
a.
b.
2.

My best, and hope this gets through (and FYI, I am using the Vista64 OS).
As a College Prof. who has also taught writing, I would love to have a
straightforward way to explain this to college level students. I have told
them that outlines are very useful for writing documents, but I can not
longer produce them in Word 2007. G.

 

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

FWIW, if you create a multilevel list (known as an outline-numbered list in
earlier versions) linked to heading styles, you will be able to view the
list members in Outline view in the same way as before (collapsing and
expanding branches as desired).

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org