Vista upgrade or full....?

[Walter Cohen]

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade product
and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the previous OS,
which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the Vista
upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done away with
the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any longer. You have to
use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more asking for the
previous OS CD (is this true?).

Ok then, so now my options are different in that I have to either buy the
OEM full, Retail full, or Retail upgrade:

If I buy the Vista upgrade I suppose I can do a clean install of XP Pro and
then do the Vista upgrade (seems silly to me).

If I buy the Vista OEM full then I have the no-support issue as well as the
issue of changing/upgrading hardware might cause Vista to burp and [I'd need
a new license anyway. *Not true - can just re-activate from what I just
found out]

If I buy Vista Retail full I have none of these problems, also this is the
most expensive route.

Question: If I do a clean install of XP Pro only to then do the Vista uprade
what extra baggage is left on the machine from XP Pro after I've upgraded to
Vista? Does MS delete [most of] the XP Pro kernel and DLLs or does it leave
the stuff around to clutter my hard drive?

Oh - also, I have 1G of memory right now. Is this sufficient for Vista
Business or even Home Pro, or should I add another GB?

Suggestions??
Walter

 

[Sven]

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.

When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade product
and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the previous OS,
which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).

Recording to Microsoft Denmark you can just install direct on a clean HD
with the Vista Update DVD. Some time along the installation your PC will aks
for a _FULL LICENSE_ cd/dvd, and when this check is over, it will continue
the Vista install. It is the same method used by WindowsXP Upgrade versions.
Don't install any earlier OS first, as it will only make your final
installation bigger. Correct me, if Microsoft Denmark and I are wrong here,
and I will get back to them, so they can look into it again. If you needed
WinXP before upgrading what should people with Windows2000 or Windows 2003
server do?

Cheers
Sven

 

[Rick Rogers]

Hi Walter,

Yes, you have a correct understanding of the Vista upgrade disk and how it
works. If you use the upgrade CD, you can either do an upgrade to the
existing OS or a custom install (which basically allows a clean install
without formatting). Either way, a Vista upgrade is not like previous
upgrades as it does not simply overwrite files with newer versions. Instead,
it replaces the entire OS laying down a block by block image, moving
everything that was to a windows.old folder, and in the case of an upgrade,
then imports in the old settings.

Also, a full 1GB is fine unless your applications are intense (autocad,
multimedia editing, etc.). If so, then bump it up to 2GB or more.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP

Windows help - www.rickrogers.org

 

[Guest]

Walter,
One of the many new technologies in Windows Vista is the way installation
takes place. Every installation, even an upgrade is a clean installation
with a few minor changes. Vista uses an imaging technology to install. When
an upgrade is selected the installation process running under windows PE
starts a tool to migrate the user environment. Under Windows XP this was a
manual process through File and Settings Transfer wizard or the User State
Migration Tool. It is now run before the install starts, files and settings
are saved to a directory on the hard drive, and the old OS directory and
files are deleted from the partition. Windows PE then extracts the Vista
files and migrates back your environment settings.

Machines need a minimum of 1 GB of RAM to be Premium ready. While the1 GB
would be fine for Vista Business, I would recommend 2 GB for Vista Home
Premium. I currently have 2 GB in my laptop running Vista Ultimate edition
and it runs superbly. Vista scales to use the additional memory in some very
helpful ways.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Sven, better check back with your source. This is just not true. You
cannot install Vista on a blank hard drive using an upgrade edition.

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).

Recording to Microsoft Denmark you can just install direct on a clean HD
with the Vista Update DVD. Some time along the installation your PC will
aks
for a _FULL LICENSE_ cd/dvd, and when this check is over, it will continue
the Vista install. It is the same method used by WindowsXP Upgrade
versions.
Don't install any earlier OS first, as it will only make your final
installation bigger. Correct me, if Microsoft Denmark and I are wrong
here,
and I will get back to them, so they can look into it again. If you needed
WinXP before upgrading what should people with Windows2000 or Windows 2003
server do?

Cheers
Sven

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

When you select the custom option, your files are rolled up into a
windows.old file which you can delete afterwards. With the image file
installation methodology Jason comments on there are no snippets of the old
system left behind like there was with XP's file copy method. Use the
custom install option and you will get a "clean" installation.

OEM is for a new computer without an OS. Upgrade will serve your purposes
just fine. You just need to adjust to the idea of how the image technology
works and how it gives you the result you want, that all. Full is always my
favortie option because you do not have any dependencies.

 

[Mike D.]

Since XP is required on a HD for a Vista Upgrade to be installed, is it
possible to do a custom install that involves a FORMAT and basically a
'clean' install? Understanding that if this is an option on Vista Upgrade
that no settings would be preserved...

-Mike

When you select the custom option, your files are rolled up into a
windows.old file which you can delete afterwards. With the image file
installation methodology Jason comments on there are no snippets of the
old system left behind like there was with XP's file copy method. Use the
custom install option and you will get a "clean" installation.

OEM is for a new computer without an OS. Upgrade will serve your purposes
just fine. You just need to adjust to the idea of how the image
technology works and how it gives you the result you want, that all. Full
is always my favortie option because you do not have any dependencies.

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).

Ok then, so now my options are different in that I have to either buy the
OEM full, Retail full, or Retail upgrade:

If I buy the Vista upgrade I suppose I can do a clean install of XP Pro
and then do the Vista upgrade (seems silly to me).

If I buy the Vista OEM full then I have the no-support issue as well as
the issue of changing/upgrading hardware might cause Vista to burp and
[I'd need a new license anyway. *Not true - can just re-activate from
what I just found out]

If I buy Vista Retail full I have none of these problems, also this is
the most expensive route.

Question: If I do a clean install of XP Pro only to then do the Vista
uprade what extra baggage is left on the machine from XP Pro after I've
upgraded to Vista? Does MS delete [most of] the XP Pro kernel and DLLs or
does it leave the stuff around to clutter my hard drive?

Oh - also, I have 1G of memory right now. Is this sufficient for Vista
Business or even Home Pro, or should I add another GB?

Suggestions??
Walter

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

You cannot do a format in this scenario. x86 versions of Vista upgrade
editions must run from within the OS being upgraded. Since the legacy OS is
running you cannot format its system volume out from under it. The system
volume of any running OS is locked. This is not unique to Vista.

If you look at the Upgrade Matrix on Get Ready
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/windowsvista/buyorupgrade/upgradepaths.mspx
The green dots in the table tell you when you can perform an
upgrade-in-place (your files, settings, and apps are preserved) and the
yellow dots tell you when you must perform a custom installation (your
files, settings, and apps are not preserved).

A custom installation does NOT include a format, but all installations of
Vista are clean installations of the OS so it does not matter in the same
way it did with XP and earlier versions of Windows.

 

[Walter Cohen]

So then I "could" do a clean install of XP (format before or during) and
then "upgrade" Vista on top of it and the Vista OS would replace the XP OS,
is that correct?

Thanks,
Walter

 

[Jane C]

Yes. Just install XP SP2, activate it, then do the Vista upgrade.

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Exactly. Since everything is rolled up into the windows.old folder and you
can delete that at your convenience you have what Microsoft calls a clean
install. btw, be sure to turn off Automatic Updates after the XP reinstall.
Waste of time given what you are doing.

 

[bp]

Sven, better check back with your source. This is just not true. You
cannot install Vista on a blank hard drive using an upgrade edition.

What if some time in the future you need to re install? It would be a
silly waste of time to install another older OS first.

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).

Recording to Microsoft Denmark you can just install direct on a clean HD
with the Vista Update DVD. Some time along the installation your PC will
aks
for a _FULL LICENSE_ cd/dvd, and when this check is over, it will continue
the Vista install. It is the same method used by WindowsXP Upgrade
versions.
Don't install any earlier OS first, as it will only make your final
installation bigger. Correct me, if Microsoft Denmark and I are wrong
here,
and I will get back to them, so they can look into it again. If you needed
WinXP before upgrading what should people with Windows2000 or Windows 2003
server do?

Cheers
Sven

 

[bp]

My questions is what happens down the road if I need to re install?
Will I have to reinstall XP before I can reistall Vista?

Since XP is required on a HD for a Vista Upgrade to be installed, is it
possible to do a custom install that involves a FORMAT and basically a
'clean' install? Understanding that if this is an option on Vista Upgrade
that no settings would be preserved...

-Mike

When you select the custom option, your files are rolled up into a
windows.old file which you can delete afterwards. With the image file
installation methodology Jason comments on there are no snippets of the
old system left behind like there was with XP's file copy method. Use the
custom install option and you will get a "clean" installation.

OEM is for a new computer without an OS. Upgrade will serve your purposes
just fine. You just need to adjust to the idea of how the image
technology works and how it gives you the result you want, that all. Full
is always my favortie option because you do not have any dependencies.

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).

Ok then, so now my options are different in that I have to either buy the
OEM full, Retail full, or Retail upgrade:

If I buy the Vista upgrade I suppose I can do a clean install of XP Pro
and then do the Vista upgrade (seems silly to me).

If I buy the Vista OEM full then I have the no-support issue as well as
the issue of changing/upgrading hardware might cause Vista to burp and
[I'd need a new license anyway. *Not true - can just re-activate from
what I just found out]

If I buy Vista Retail full I have none of these problems, also this is
the most expensive route.

Question: If I do a clean install of XP Pro only to then do the Vista
uprade what extra baggage is left on the machine from XP Pro after I've
upgraded to Vista? Does MS delete [most of] the XP Pro kernel and DLLs or
does it leave the stuff around to clutter my hard drive?

Oh - also, I have 1G of memory right now. Is this sufficient for Vista
Business or even Home Pro, or should I add another GB?

Suggestions??
Walter

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Yes, it will be a silly waste of time. But now the user will just have to
waste the time and do it.

Sven, better check back with your source. This is just not true. You
cannot install Vista on a blank hard drive using an upgrade edition.

What if some time in the future you need to re install? It would be a
silly waste of time to install another older OS first.

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business
probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any
longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more
asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).


Recording to Microsoft Denmark you can just install direct on a clean HD
with the Vista Update DVD. Some time along the installation your PC will
aks
for a _FULL LICENSE_ cd/dvd, and when this check is over, it will
continue
the Vista install. It is the same method used by WindowsXP Upgrade
versions.
Don't install any earlier OS first, as it will only make your final
installation bigger. Correct me, if Microsoft Denmark and I are wrong
here,
and I will get back to them, so they can look into it again. If you
needed
WinXP before upgrading what should people with Windows2000 or Windows
2003
server do?

Cheers
Sven

 

[Colin Barnhorst]

Yes.

My questions is what happens down the road if I need to re install?
Will I have to reinstall XP before I can reistall Vista?

Since XP is required on a HD for a Vista Upgrade to be installed, is it
possible to do a custom install that involves a FORMAT and basically a
'clean' install? Understanding that if this is an option on Vista Upgrade
that no settings would be preserved...

-Mike

When you select the custom option, your files are rolled up into a
windows.old file which you can delete afterwards. With the image file
installation methodology Jason comments on there are no snippets of the
old system left behind like there was with XP's file copy method. Use
the
custom install option and you will get a "clean" installation.

OEM is for a new computer without an OS. Upgrade will serve your
purposes
just fine. You just need to adjust to the idea of how the image
technology works and how it gives you the result you want, that all.
Full
is always my favortie option because you do not have any dependencies.

I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go with Vista Business probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.

I wanted to do the same with Vista - clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vista upgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any
longer.
You have to use the Vista upgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more
asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).

Ok then, so now my options are different in that I have to either buy
the
OEM full, Retail full, or Retail upgrade:

If I buy the Vista upgrade I suppose I can do a clean install of XP Pro
and then do the Vista upgrade (seems silly to me).

If I buy the Vista OEM full then I have the no-support issue as well as
the issue of changing/upgrading hardware might cause Vista to burp and
[I'd need a new license anyway. *Not true - can just re-activate from
what I just found out]

If I buy Vista Retail full I have none of these problems, also this is
the most expensive route.

Question: If I do a clean install of XP Pro only to then do the Vista
uprade what extra baggage is left on the machine from XP Pro after I've
upgraded to Vista? Does MS delete [most of] the XP Pro kernel and DLLs
or
does it leave the stuff around to clutter my hard drive?

Oh - also, I have 1G of memory right now. Is this sufficient for Vista
Business or even Home Pro, or should I add another GB?

Suggestions??
Walter

 

[djackson]

Yes.

My questions is what happens down the road if I need to re install?
Will I have to reinstall XP before I can reistallVista?

Since XP is required on a HD for aVistaUpgrade to be installed, is it
possible to do a custom install that involves a FORMAT and basically a
'clean' install? Understanding that if this is an option onVistaUpgrade
that no settings would be preserved...
-Mike
When you select the custom option, your files are rolled up into a
windows.old file which you can delete afterwards. With the image file
installation methodology Jason comments on there are no snippets of the
old system left behind like there was with XP's file copy method. Use
the
custom install option and you will get a "clean" installation.
OEM is for a new computer without an OS. Upgrade will serve your
purposes
just fine. You just need to adjust to the idea of how the image
technology works and how it gives you the result you want, that all.
Full
is always my favortie option because you do not have any dependencies.
I have a Win XP Pro machine and want to go withVistaBusiness probably.
When I went to XP Pro I did a clean install with the XP Pro upgrade
product and at the appropriate time the setup asked for the CD for the
previous OS, which I provided, and the install went through fine.
I wanted to do the same withVista- clean out the hard drive, buy the
Vistaupgrade and do a clean install. However, I understand MS has done
away with the XP-like upgrade scenario and one cannot do that any
longer.
You have to use theVistaupgrade on an XP [Pro] machine - no more
asking
for the previous OS CD (is this true?).
Ok then, so now my options are different in that I have to either buy
the
OEM full, Retail full, or Retail upgrade:
If I buy theVistaupgrade I suppose I can do a clean install of XP Pro
and then do theVistaupgrade (seems silly to me).
If I buy theVistaOEM full then I have the no-support issue as well as
the issue of changing/upgrading hardware might causeVistato burp and
[I'd need a new license anyway. *Not true - can just re-activate from
what I just found out]
If I buyVistaRetail full I have none of these problems, also this is
the most expensive route.
Question: If I do a clean install of XP Pro only to then do theVista
uprade what extra baggage is left on the machine from XP Pro after I've
upgraded toVista? Does MS delete [most of] the XP Pro kernel and DLLs
or
does it leave the stuff around to clutter my hard drive?
Oh - also, I have 1G of memory right now. Is this sufficient forVista
Business or even Home Pro, or should I add another GB?
Suggestions??
Walter- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Licensing is quite interesting with vista.. I wonder how quick
someone will crack the code..