USB interruptions

[R. Meijn]

Hi,

Recently I installed an HP Officejet printer with USB interface; software
installed fine and printer also functions normally.
The only thing is that USB connection is lost (disrupts shortly) every now
and then (somewhere between minutes and hours).
Sometimes after reboot, the printer reinstalls itself again as the computer
finds "new hardware".
All USB ports show no problems in device manager
Software reinstallation has no effect, neither has disabling power
management on USB ports.
Changing to other USB ports does not resolve the issue; other USB
peripherals work just fine.
Any suggestions for troubleshooting are more than welcome, as I am out of
options right now.


--
Kind regards,

René Meijn
Hoeven
The Netherlands

 

[R. Meijn]

Hi,

in addition to aforementioned problem the computer is, at the same time,
logging the following message in Event Viewer numerous times:

Event Type: Information
Event Source: MsiInstaller
Event Category: None
Event ID: 11728
Date: 18-12-2008
Time: 00:17:40
User: NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM
Computer: MASTER
Description:
Product: ProductContext -- Configuration completed successfully.

Any ideas?

--
Kind regards,

René Meijn
Hoeven
The Netherlands

 

[smlunatick]

Hi,

in addition to aforementioned problem the computer is, at the same time,
logging the following message in Event Viewer numerous times:

Event Type:     Information
Event Source:   MsiInstaller
Event Category: None
Event ID:                       11728
Date:           18-12-2008
Time:           00:17:40
User:           NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM
Computer:       MASTER
Description:
Product: ProductContext -- Configuration completed successfully.

Any ideas?

--
Kind regards,

René Meijn
Hoeven
The Netherlands

You do not provide enough info. USB ports can have problems if you
have a lot of USB devices all connected onto the same USB root hub or
your power supply is not power enough to provide the USB port power.

 

[R. Meijn]

Hi,

some additional information about the hardware configuration: no external
hub, prnter, scanner, WiFi client and Bluetooth dongle are the only four
peripherals connected to the (motherboard-native) USB ports.
From device manager no conflicts are reported, everthing works properly.

More interesting seems to be the other observation I added in my second mail
as a follow up.
I fail to understand what is happening when MsiInstaller is activated: why,
what is its trigger, why is USB disrupted.
Does anyone know the remedie to counter Event ID 11728?

--
Kind regards,

René Meijn
Hoeven
The Netherlands

 

[smlunatick]

Hi,

some additional information about the hardware configuration: no external
hub, prnter, scanner, WiFi client and Bluetooth dongle are the only four
peripherals connected to the (motherboard-native) USB ports.
From device manager no conflicts are reported, everthing works properly.

More interesting seems to be the other observation I added in my second mail
as a follow up.
I fail to understand what is happening when MsiInstaller is activated: why,
what is its trigger, why is USB disrupted.
Does anyone know the remedie to counter Event ID 11728?

--
Kind regards,

René Meijn
Hoeven
The Netherlands

MSIinstaller seems to be the Windows Installer, used to install most
applications including your printer drivers. It should be noted that
most printers, which connect directly to PCs, now are usually "Plug
and Play" enabled. Windows XP will poll the "Plug and Play" controls
and is XP's "device" data appears to be wrong, XP will attempt to re-
install the drivers. Since the drivers were probably delivered within
a MSI file, the MSIinstaller could be activated for the "re-install."

Every PC have their "on-board" USB ports listed as USB Root Hubs.
Root Hubs are the first USB ports on the PC and are usually paired.

 

[w_tom]

Recently I installed an HP Officejet printer with USB interface; software
installed fine and printer also functions normally.
The only thing is that USB connection is lost (disrupts shortly) every now
and then (somewhere between minutes and hours).

You don't say 'how' the connection is lost. If a hardware problem
causes the interruption, then event (system) logs would have reported
it OR the port appears as defective in Device Manager. Based upon what
I assume I read, you have neither. So it is not clear what this
disruption is.

USB devices that overload a power supply is a popular myth. One
who knows by first learning numbers would know a USB device can never
draw more than 0.500 amps - near zero power. AND a printer does not
draw power from a USB port because the printer needs more power - has
a separate power supply.

A useful reply is not possible due to insufficient and critical
information. Not yet defined is the definition of disruption.

 

[smlunatick]

  You don't say 'how' the connection is lost.  If a hardware problem
causes the interruption, then event (system) logs would have reported
it OR the port appears as defective in Device Manager. Based upon what
I assume I read, you have neither.  So it is not clear what this
disruption is.

   USB devices that overload a power supply is a popular myth.  One
who knows by first learning numbers would know a USB device can never
draw more than 0.500 amps - near zero power.  AND a printer does not
draw power from a USB port because the printer needs more power - has
a separate power supply.

  A useful reply is not possible due to insufficient and critical
information.  Not yet defined is the definition of disruption.

I've encountered the problem where the power supply was not providing
enough power to the USB devices. I had to add a self powered hub,
which fixed this.

 

[Lil' Dave]

You don't say 'how' the connection is lost. If a hardware problem
causes the interruption, then event (system) logs would have reported
it OR the port appears as defective in Device Manager. Based upon what
I assume I read, you have neither. So it is not clear what this
disruption is.

USB devices that overload a power supply is a popular myth. One
who knows by first learning numbers would know a USB device can never
draw more than 0.500 amps - near zero power. AND a printer does not
draw power from a USB port because the printer needs more power - has
a separate power supply.

A useful reply is not possible due to insufficient and critical
information. Not yet defined is the definition of disruption.

I've encountered the problem where the power supply was not providing
enough power to the USB devices. I had to add a self powered hub,
which fixed this.

------------

I hear you. But, the PC's power supply supplies power to the USB onboard
hubs/ports. These USB ports supply power, if needed, supply power to said
USB devices. If such power hungry USB devices are attached, and, such USB
ports cannot deliver the .maximum 5A; an add-on POWERED hub will correct
that but only deliver the same amount of max amperage. The USB ports at
that point only suffice as communications ports for USB.

If I suspected an onboard PC power supply being a source of that problem, I
would also suspect other under amperage potential problems as well. Of
which, I suspect exist right now on your PC.

 

[w_tom]

I've encountered the problem where the power supply was not providing
enough power to the USB devices.  I had to add a self powered hub,
which fixed this.

The way I read it, you included a self powered hub, then only
assumed it was fixing a power problem. In reality, the hub could have
been 'fixing' a data timing or signal strength problem. Did you know
by first identifying the problem - or just know only because a self
powered hub fix something unknown? Not described is USB port shutdown
because the port could not provide sufficient power. Or did that
important error message also not appear?

All is irrelevant to the OP's post about a USB port that does not
power a printer.

 

[R. Meijn]

LS,

having read the responses concerning power supply I personally doubt this is
the issue.
Indeed the printer itself has autonomous power and USB is primarily used for
datacommunications.
Nevertheless, it is not only the printer which has
short/spontaneous/instantaneous disconnects, with a time-interval between
minutes and hours: which means audible USB "on"/"off" sounds.
It is noted also the scanner has a similar problem.
I use the application USBDeview (www.nirsoft.net) as monitor ('watchdog').
Another thing is that the number of disconnects is now considerable less
since a disconnected a (simple, non-powered) USB Card Reader.
Any thoughts.
If it is a software issue: how to diagnose?
If it is a hardware issue: how to test motherboard USB functions?
Any input is highly appreciated.

--
Kind regards,

René Meijn
Hoeven
The Netherlands

 

[w_tom]

Indeed the printer itself has autonomous power and USB is primarily used for
datacommunications.
Nevertheless, it is not only the printer which has
short/spontaneous/instantaneous disconnects, with a time-interval between
minutes and hours: which means audible USB "on"/"off" sounds.
It is noted also the scanner has a similar problem.
I use the application USBDeview (www.nirsoft.net) as monitor ('watchdog')..

Start by eliminating (for now) a major unknown - that USBDeview.
It may be the only reason for failure, one reason for problems, or not
related. But for now, I would eliminate software that may only
complicate a solution.

Second is the unknown AC current leakages. This is 'temporarily'
solved by powering everything from a common source. Or even better,
using devices one at a time to learn what does lockup and what never
does. Should you have a multimeter, then voltage differences
(especially AC voltage) could be measured between the disconnected but
powered USB device and computer USB ports. Mechanically challenging,
but very informative if looking for a device with excessive AC
leakage. Of course all three prong AC plugs are properly safety
grounded - otherwise leakage currents do exist.

Third, this is why USB sponsors plug fests. USB peripheral
manufacturers would bring their products to confirm it did not
interfere with or be obstructed by other USB devices. Is there a
conflict between two USB devices?

Also not provided are useful facts from the system (event) logs and
from Device Manager. If a USB port fails, important facts and numbers
for why may exist.

Were all devices connecting as required and every time in low speed,
medium speed, or high speed? Did any device change speed? You were
not violating USB standards such as using USB extension cords?
Anything else that is trivial not mentioned?