UPS service not configured correctly?

G

Gramma

Admin Tools>Services? Uninterruptible Power Supply, "error 2481, the UPS
service is not configured correctly."

I cannot start up this service in Services and get this error. So how do I
configure it correctly? It's been an ongoing problem.

Before calling in a repair service (which I have paid approx $200 for each
two times for the same problem, this time I put the Gateway Restoration disk
in to restart computer, and the only reason I am able to writing this to you
now!

Please help me on starting up this service with a "how to" corectly configure.
 
P

philo

Gramma said:
Admin Tools>Services? Uninterruptible Power Supply, "error 2481, the UPS
service is not configured correctly."

I cannot start up this service in Services and get this error. So how do I
configure it correctly? It's been an ongoing problem.

Before calling in a repair service (which I have paid approx $200 for each
two times for the same problem, this time I put the Gateway Restoration
disk
in to restart computer, and the only reason I am able to writing this to
you
now!

Please help me on starting up this service with a "how to" corectly
configure.


Unless you are actually using a UPS
and it's connected to the computer
and the software for it is installed,
then the message you have is normal and you can ignore it or better still
simply disable the service
 
G

Gramma

Oh, I see. Doubt that I am using UPS and that it would be connected to my
computer. I will disable it. I had suspected that it was the problem with me
not being able to boot up my computer which is then a new subject. Thanks for
the info.
 
1

1PW

Admin Tools>Services? Uninterruptible Power Supply, "error 2481, the UPS
service is not configured correctly."

I cannot start up this service in Services and get this error. So how do I
configure it correctly? It's been an ongoing problem.

Before calling in a repair service (which I have paid approx $200 for each
two times for the same problem, this time I put the Gateway Restoration disk
in to restart computer, and the only reason I am able to writing this to you
now!

Please help me on starting up this service with a "how to" correctly configure.

Hello Gramma:

You have left a great deal to our imagination.

Please give us much more detail. What exact OS (W2K or ?) are you using
on which Gateway computer model? What make/model UPS is in use and how
do the UPS & computer communicate? USB? COM port? What vendor UPS
application support software, if any, and version, is in use for your
UPS. Does your UPS have DIP switch settings and if so, how are they set?

The more specific information you provide, the better you may be helped.

Did the repair service give you a detailed accounting of what was done?
If so, what was UPS/computer specific in their report(s)?

Has technical support been requested from your UPS vendor? If so, what
happened?

What has happened that your system has required its Restoration disk?

Best wishes to you.

Pete
 
S

smlunatick

Oh, I see. Doubt that I am using UPS and that it would be connected to my
computer.  I will disable it. I had suspected that it was the problem with me
not being able to boot up my computer which is then a new subject. Thanksfor
the info.

UPS -- Interruptible Power Supply. A separate unit used to provide
emergency power during a power failure, via the unit's internal
"bulky" batteries. Several models require a "communication cable" to
connect the UPS unit to the PC's USB / Comm port. This communication
cable can transmit the power status (ie: On battery power, power
surge, low voltage etc..) but will send the important status (low-
battery) thus telling the Windows XP to shutdown the system.

Most "home" style PCs would not require a UPS, unless the PC resides
in a "lightning strike" prone area. The use of UPS in these area
should be consider as the UPS will protect the PC from being burnt by
the lightning strike. A UPS is much easier (cheaper) to replace than
is the more expensive PC.
 
W

westom1

Most "home" style PCs would not require a UPS, unless the PC resides
in a "lightning strike" prone area.  The use of UPS in these area
should be consider as the UPS will protect the PC from being burnt by
the lightning strike.  A UPS is much easier (cheaper) to replace than
is the more expensive PC.

UPS has one function - to provide power when AC mains power is
lost. That function is for data protection. UPS does nothing for
surge protection. In fact, surges that are done in microseconds cannot
be stopped by a plug-in UPS that takes milliseconds to respond.

UPS should not be used with some electrical devices (ie small
electric motors). A typical UPS in battery backup mode can output
spikes that may even harm power strip protectors. But computers are
so robust as to make that 'dirty' electricity irrelevant.

Computer may need a UPS to save data if power is lost. Function of
a computer grade UPS is to protect data - not hardware.
 
B

bud--

The best information on surges and surge protection I have seen is at:
<http://www.mikeholt.com/files/PDF/LightningGuide_FINALpublishedversion_May051.pdf>
- "How to protect your house and its contents from lightning: IEEE guide
for surge protection of equipment connected to AC power and
communication circuits" published by the IEEE in 2005 (the IEEE is the
major organization of electrical and electronic engineers in the US).
And also:
<http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/practiceguides/surgesfnl.pdf>
- "NIST recommended practice guide: Surges Happen!: how to protect the
appliances in your home" published by the US National Institute of
Standards and Technology in 2001

The IEEE guide is aimed at those with some technical background.
UPS has one function - to provide power when AC mains power is
lost. That function is for data protection. UPS does nothing for
surge protection. In fact, surges that are done in microseconds cannot
be stopped by a plug-in UPS that takes milliseconds to respond.

As is well know, most UPSs have built in surge protection, like plug-in
surge suppressors. Plug-in suppressors are readily available with high
ratings. UPSs with equivalent high ratings are harder to find. Equipment
(in the US) that is used for surge protection should be listed under
UL1449.

Both the IEEE and NIST guides say plug-in suppressors are effective.

If you are using a plug-in suppressor (including UPS) all interconnected
equipment needs to be connected to the same suppressor. External
connections, like phone, also need to go through the suppressor.
Connecting all wiring through the suppressor prevents damaging voltages
between power and signal wires.
 
L

Leythos

UPS has one function - to provide power when AC mains power is
lost.

Incorrect WTom, most UPS's also protect from Surges or Sags in the Power
to the device they are protecting. Many UPS devices have "automatic
voltage regulation" as well as quality SURGE suppression.

The main function of UPS "Software" is to shutdown the computer when the
battery run time is lower than the expected shutdown time.

The main function of a UPS, a quality UPS, is to provide clean power AND
to protect the device from bad power, such as spikes.

This has been explained to you a zillion times, proven time after time
in the real world, and all of your long winded BS won't change the fact
that a Quality UPS does protect computers from damage by surges.
 
W

westom1

Incorrect WTom, most UPS's also protect from Surges or Sags in the Power
to the device they are protecting. Many UPS devices have "automatic
voltage regulation" as well as quality SURGE suppression.

Computer grade UPSes connect an appliance directly to AC mains when
not in battery backup mode. 'Cleanest' power comes directly from AC
mains. In battery backup mode, this 120 volts UPS outputs two 200
volt square waves with a spike of up to 270 volts between those square
waves. 'Dirty' electricity is irrelevant because computers are so
robust. Power so 'dirty' as to even harm some small electric motors.

APC says same as posted on 10 Dec 2008 in "UPS or no UPS" at:
http://tinyurl.com/6zn9sr
Leythos calls that 'automatic voltage regulation'? Well, yes. When
120 volt AC mains drop something below 87%, then it switches to
batteries and outputs square waves.

Arthur Buse also describes that UPS output in "Filthy Dirty Power..
maybe" on 2 Nov 2008 at:
http://tinyurl.com/6nerja
A cheap UPS, when the mains are supplying the power, just
connects the computer to the mains power using a relay. ...
Mains electricity is a pure sine wave, a gentle curve of a single
frequency. The inverter puts out a ghastly square wave type
thing which contains just about any frequency you can imagine.


Arthur Buse simply confirms those numbers. When the mains are
powered, a UPS connects power through a relay - a direct connection.
When mains fail, output from an inverter is so nasty as to be harmful
to some appliances - but irrelevant to robust protection in all
computers.

Leythos is invited to post those manufacturer spec numbers that
claim protection from each type of surge. He will not because he
cannot.

Let's see. Another UPS spec says 200 joules of protection.
Destructive surges are typically tens or hundreds of thousands of
joules. So 200 joules will absorb a 100,000 joule surge without
damage? Leythos is correct. It does claim a tiny surge protector
component. What Leythos cannot claim is useful or effective
protection. It claims a near zero protector component. Only enough
joules so that Leythos will _believe_ it has surge protection - and
then promote the myth.

From numbers, that UPS has 'virutally' no surge protection. No
wonder it will not list protection for each type of surge in numeric
specs. Some plug-in UPSes discuss filtering because of near zero
protection.

Serious UPSes (ie building wide UPSes) do provide surge protection.
Plug-in UPSes only provide protection in the myths that claim that
protection.

That UPS does not 'clean' electricity. It neither provides nor
claims to provide effecetive surge protection. Its inverter output
(in battery backup mode) is so 'dirty' as to be harmful to power strip
protectors - but not to computers.
 
L

Leythos

Leythos is invited to post those manufacturer spec numbers that
claim protection from each type of surge. He will not because he
cannot.

You've been directed to APC's website, to their products and you've ran
from the thread each time you've been proven wrong.

Many people have posted how their UPS saved their computers while other
devices were damaged, and you've ignored it.

You always seem to run and hide when you're cornered and you always spew
this crap about quality UPS devices NOT protecting anything.....

You've been exposed again WTOM.
 
B

bud--

Let's see. Another UPS spec says 200 joules of protection.
Destructive surges are typically tens or hundreds of thousands of
joules. So 200 joules will absorb a 100,000 joule surge without
damage?

The IEEE guide explains plug-in suppressors work by CLAMPING (limiting)
the voltage on all wires (signal and power) to the common ground at the
suppressor. Plug-in suppressors do NOT work by stopping or absorbing.
And they do not work primarily by earthing. The guide explains earthing
occurs elsewhere. (Read the guide starting pdf page 40).

The author of the NIST guide has looked at suppressors on branch
circuits and found the amount of energy that reaches a suppressor is
surprisingly small. (But I would rather have a suppressor with a high
Joule rating).

Any surge suppressor in the US should be listed under UL1449. The UL
test includes surviving surges and sets a floor for protection.

Both the IEEE and NIST guides say plug-in suppressors are effective.
That includes UPSs with the same circuits.

w has no source that agrees with him that plug-in suppressors do not
NOT work.
 
W

westom1

Many people have posted how their UPS saved their computers while other
devices were damaged, and you've ignored it.

This is the same Leythos who claims invisible surge protectors. He
had a device on one surge protector. A second device was damaged.
That proved the first device was protected? He forgot a dishwasher,
furnace, smoke detectors, other TVs, clock radios, dimmer switches,
and bathroom GFCIs that were not damaged. Devices three through 99
were all protected by invisible protectors. Must be. They also were
not damaged.

Rather than discuss this gapping hole in his reasoning, Leythos
posts insults. Those without engineering training prove their
technical superiority using insults.

That UPS does not even provide a technical number for surge
protection. Somehow 200 joules will absorb thousands of joules
surges? Leythos would have posted that numeric spec if it existed.
He did not because no such protection is claimed even by the
manufacturer. He knows he has protection because 97 other household
appliances were protected by invisible surge protectors.

A plug-in UPS has one function - to provide power during blackouts
and extreme brownouts. (Building wide systems have additional
functions.) When in battery backup mode, that UPS will output
voltage spikes and other 'dirty' electricity that is irrelevant to
robust computers. That same 'dirty' electricity may harm small
electric motors and surge protectors despite myths that it 'cleans'
electricity. An adjacent UPS is only temporary battery power to a
computer. Nothing more. Either that relay connects a computer
directly to AC mains or it connects to battery power - to protect from
data loss.
 
L

Leythos

This is the same Leythos who claims invisible surge protectors. He
had a device on one surge protector. A second device was damaged.
That proved the first device was protected? He forgot a dishwasher,
furnace, smoke detectors, other TVs, clock radios, dimmer switches,
and bathroom GFCIs that were not damaged. Devices three through 99
were all protected by invisible protectors. Must be. They also were
not damaged.

Now you're making up lies and BS WTom, always a sign that you know you
are wrong and need to worm your way out of it.

My experience was in several offices, with the SAME hardware, where one
system was connected to a quality UPS and another, next desk over, was
not. Both systems were on the same AC Power feed, same breaker, and the
one that was protected remained undamaged while the other was toasted.
Seen this many times over the years, enough to know that a quality UPS
device will protect devices from Surges.
Rather than discuss this gapping hole in his reasoning, Leythos
posts insults. Those without engineering training prove their
technical superiority using insults.

LOL, your BS and lies have been exposed many times WTom, even the IEEE
states you're wrong. Even when you were backed into a corner, as you are
in every thread like this, you resort to mockery/attacks and then you
run away.

[snip repeat of BS]
 
W

westom1

Now you're making up lies and BS WTom, always a sign that you know you
are wrong and need to worm your way out of it.

Leythos again attacks on this poster ... and still no UPS
manufacturer spec number that claims protection. Manufacturer cannot
claim protection that does not exist. But Leythos knows that
protection exists?

Another number that Leythos must ignore. It only has 200 joules -
near zero protection. But just enough - just above zero - so that the
technically naive will claim surge protection. Where is that
manufacturer spec? Instead the technically naive has again done what
he always does - attack this poster.

That UPS has one function - to provide temporary power so that a
computer can save data. As demonstrated by numbers from my
oscilloscope (only one of us is an engineer) and demonstrated by a
quote from one UPS manufacturer - APC: a UPS can output electricity
so 'dirty because it is really intended only for a more robust
appliances - ie a computer. That 'dirty' power (ie a spike that is
something less than 270 volts) provides time to save data.

Protection is located elsehwher - and not in visible protectors.
 
L

Leythos

Another number that Leythos must ignore. It only has 200 joules -
near zero protection. But just enough - just above zero - so that the
technically naive will claim surge protection. Where is that
manufacturer spec? Instead the technically naive has again done what
he always does - attack this poster.
Another lie WTOM?

I've never specified which UPS in this thread, so it's your BS that
you're posting again.

I told you to check the APC site, and the UPS's that I use are rated for
a LOT more than 200j.

You've been shown where you're wrong by EXPERTS in the field, even the
IEEE states your are wrong - yet you keep running your mouth like you
need to prove something.

Face it, APC UPS units do protect devices, seen it myself many times,
but you go right on lying to everyone on the board. All anyone has to do
is check the APC website to see that you're a liar.
 
B

bud--

It is SOP.
Another number that Leythos must ignore. It only has 200 joules -
near zero protection.

A made up number. But w doesn't care. If you post actual specs he will
ignore them.

Francois Martzloff was the NIST guru on surges, wrote the NIST guide,
and has many published technical papers on surges. In one of them he
looked at the energy that would reach a plug-in suppressor with surges
coming in on a power line of 2,000 to 10,000A. (The maximum that has any
reasonable possibility is 10,000A.) The maximum energy dissipated in the
MOV was 35 Joules. In 13 of 15 cases it was 1 Joule or less.

One reason is that at about 6,000V (US) there is arc-over from service
panel bus to enclosure(/ground wires/earthing electrode/neutral). After
the arc is established, the arc voltage is hundreds of volts. That dumps
most of the surge energy to earth.

w also ignores under UL1449. (In the US you should only buy a surge
suppressor listed under UL1449). UL tests with a set of surges which the
suppressor must survive with protection intact. That establishes a floor
of protection.
That UPS has one function - to provide temporary power so that a
computer can save data.

As everyone knows, that is bullcrap.

What w really believes is that plug-in suppressors do not work.
But that makes him look kind of stupid. (Like saying a UPS has one
function.)

Both the IEEE and NIST guides say plug-in suppressors are effective.
That includes UPSs with equivalent protection circuits.
 
W

westom1

Francois Martzloff was the NIST guru on surges, wrote the NIST guide,
and has many published technical papers on surges. In one of them he
looked at the energy  that would reach a plug-in suppressor with surges
coming in on a power line of 2,000 to 10,000A.

Francois Martzloff was quite blunt about what plug-in (point of
connection) protectors can do. Martzloff made it the very first
conclusion in his IEEE paper:
Conclusion:
1) Quantitative measurements in the Upside-Down house clearly
show objectionable difference in reference voltages. These occur
even when or perhaps because, surge protective devices are
present at the point of connection of appliances.

Sales promoters of plug-in protectors would forget what Martzloff
really said. Plug-in protectors can even contribute to damage of
adjacent appliances - especially when a 'whole house' protector and
proper earthing is not installed.

Where is the manufacturer specification that claims protection?
Nobody has provided specs for good reason. Even the manufacturer does
not claim such protection.

Same circuit is inside a plug-in UPS and strip protector. 200
joules inside a UPS will absorb surges that are tens or hundreds of
thousands of joules? Yes, when myths live on by ignoring these
numbers. Even Martzloff defines damage because a protector is too
close to appliances.
 
B

bud--

Francois Martzloff was quite blunt about what plug-in (point of
connection) protectors can do. Martzloff made it the very first
conclusion in his IEEE paper:

w forgets to mention that Martzloff said in the same 1994 document:
"Mitigation of the threat can take many forms. One solution.
illustrated in this paper, is the insertion of a properly designed
[multiport plug-in surge suppressor]."

w similarly misattributed views to Martzloff coauthor Arshad Mansoor
and provoked a response from an electrical engineer at
alt.engineering.electrical:
“I found it particularly funny that he mentioned a paper by Dr.
Mansoor. I can assure you that he supports the use of [multiport]
type plug-in protectors. Heck, he just sits down the hall from me.
LOL. “

And in 2001 Martzloff wrote the NIST guide which also says plug-in
suppressors are effective.
Where is the manufacturer specification that claims protection?
Nobody has provided specs for good reason. Even the manufacturer does
not claim such protection.

Nonsense.

Apparently w_ can't google specs for himself because the institution
only lets w look at newsgroups - the internet has dirty pictures.
Same circuit is inside a plug-in UPS and strip protector. 200
joules inside a UPS will absorb surges that are tens or hundreds of
thousands of joules?

If w could only read and think he could find out how plug-in
suppressors work.Repeating:
The IEEE guide explains plug-in suppressors work by CLAMPING
(limiting) the voltage on all wires (signal and power) to the common
ground at the suppressor. Plug-in suppressors do NOT work by stopping
or absorbing. And they do not work primarily by earthing. The guide
explains earthing occurs elsewhere. (Read the guide starting pdf page
40).

w has still not provided any source that agrees with him that plug-in
suppressors do NOT work.

And w can not answer simple questions:
- Why do the only 2 examples of protection in the IEEE guide use plug-
in suppressors?
- Why does the NIST guide says plug-in suppressors are "the easiest
solution"?
- Why does the NIST guide say "One effective solution is to have the
consumer install" a multiport plug-in suppressor?
- Why did Martzloff say in his paper "One solution. illustrated in
this paper, is the insertion of a properly designed [multiport plug-in
surge suppressor]"?

For real science read the IEEE and NIST guides. Both say plug-in
suppressors are effective. So are UPSs with the equivalent circuits.
 
W

westom1

w  forgets to mention that Martzloff said in the same 1994 document:
"Mitigation of the threat can take many forms. One solution.
illustrated in this paper, is the insertion of a properly designed
[multiport plug-in surge suppressor]."

Those authors also stated why a plug-in protector can cause
appliance damage. Where is surge energy dissipated? Effective
protection means surge energy is dissipated harmlessly in earth. Bud
says his plug-in protector with no earthing makes that energy
disappear. No wonder plug-in protector manufacturers never make
protection claims in numeric specifications.

Bud will post incessantly. He is paid to do so. If Bud was honest,
he would have provided plug-in protector specs in every post. He
cannot. Why? No manufacturer claims to protect from the typically
destructive surge. It only protects from one type surge made
irrelevant by protection inside every appliance. Yes, that power
strip is surge protection ... from something that is not destructive.
Destructive surges are dissipated harmlessly in earth (by one 'whole
house' protector), or find earth ground destructively through
household appliances (with or without plug-in protectors).

So where are those specs? Bud cannot even stay on topic: the UPS
that provides battery backup power for data protection. Bud is paid
to promote power strip protectors. Did he also forget to mention that
part? He will even post insult to protect sales.

Bud is a troll who follows me everywhere posting insults and half
truths - as any good sales promoter would do. He posts incessantly to
get the last reply so that you might believe him. Profits are at risk
should you learn facts - ie why every high reliability facility does
not use Bud's protectors. Bud never posts numeric specs because no
plug-in protector manufacturer claims that protection.

Meanwhile, back to the topic. That UPS only provides uninterrupted
power to protect data from blackouts. Despite so many urban legends,
it does not 'clean' electricity. In fact, its output can be so
'dirty' as to harm power strip protectors - but not the superior
protection required inside every computer.
 
L

Leythos

No wonder plug-in protector manufacturers never make
protection claims in numeric specifications.

Another lie, APC does post their protection numbers, wtom always runs
from that fact.
 

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