Style Changes When "Backspace" Joins Two Separate Paragraphs

[Suzanne S. Barnhill]

You have to understand that "Define styles based on your formatting"
actually means "Apply a style that is formatted more or less like your
formatting." If you leave this enabled, you may suddenly find that a lot of
paragraphs in a table are unfathomably formatted with the Footer style. More
often, short pieces of text (less than a full line, no punctuation at end)
to which you have applied bold formatting and perhaps a larger font size
will be interpreted as headings and some random heading style (Heading 4,
say, even though you don't have any Heading 1, 2, or 3 paragraphs) applied.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
http://word.mvps.org

I understand the fuller explanation given of my 'in the paragraph mark'
remark. And I'm about the rawest beginner there is. *And* using Word 2000
to
boot!

That's good, and I'm glad you do understand it.

I feel that sometimes it's possible to be too analytical.

Not when you have been daily using a software program for twenty
years. "Define styles based on your formatting": what on earth does
that mean? More to the point--why does it need to be asked? It falls
into the category of one of those head-scratching commands and boxes
to be ticked or unticked, when the logical response would be "Why
would I NOT want to define styles (all styles? styles in this document
alone? exactly which styles?) based on my formatting? Would I want to
define (and what does "define" mean here? set as default? if so, then
why not say, Do You Want to Save as the Default Style the Style With
Which You Formatted This Document When You Created It?)-- I say, would
I want to define a style based on...What?

What?

 

[Graham Mayor]

"Why would I NOT want to define styles (all styles? styles in this document
alone? exactly which styles?) based on my formatting?

The difference here is that it is Word which is deciding what styles to
adopt, from a large built-in style collection, rather than you making the
decision what styles to use.
Of course you should create or modify styles to provide the formatting YOU
want. Word is a style based application, but you need to be in control of
that and not the application.

--
<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>><<>
Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com

<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>><<>

 

[Spoonerism]

I like it!

SNIP >... actually means "Apply a style that is formatted more or less like
your formatting."

Seems like a computer language in which 'a' possibly equals something like
'b' (most of the time)...

 

[Alls Quiet]

You have to understand that "Define styles based on your formatting"
actually means "Apply a style that is formatted more or less like your
formatting." If you leave this enabled, you may suddenly find that a lot of
paragraphs in a table are unfathomably formatted with the Footer style. More
often, short pieces of text (less than a full line, no punctuation at end)
to which you have applied bold formatting and perhaps a larger font size
will be interpreted as headings and some random heading style (Heading 4,
say, even though you don't have any Heading 1, 2, or 3 paragraphs) applied.

Thank you. That's what I always thought it meant and also why I
thought it was one of those nonsensical if not redundant choices Word
seems to give the user. Anyway, I unticked it...as far as the
Backspace issue is concerned, having it ticked (since 2000) appears to
have had no effect.

 

[croy]

You may be right, but I regret the reference has been lost to me in the
mists of time

She most certainly is right!

 

[croy]

Every paragraph in a Word document is formatted with a style (not a
template - the template is the proforma layout of the whole document) - by
installed default the Normal style. The characteristics of the styles are
stored in an area of the paragraph that effectively equates to the area of
the paragraph mark that precedes the paragraph.

What if there is only one paragraph? Where does the
paragraph formatting reside then?

 

[croy]

Was it, though? ISTR that, at one time, deleting the paragraph mark
logically made the first paragraph part of the second, and it acquired the
style of the second. ISTR that we complained bitterly when this behavior was
changed.

I was taught, back in version 2 of Word for Windows, that
the paragraph formatting was contained in the paragraph mark
at trailing end of the paragraph, which corresponds with
what you recall.

The change must've come between version 2 and 6, or between
6 and whatever the next one was. Whenever is was, it marked
the end of my spending money for software made worse. We're
never told ahead of time, about the atrocities that
Microsoft wants us to continue funding. And once you open
the bag, or case, or box, there's no chance for a refund.

Luckily, I got to use Word XP at work before I was tempted
to buy it for home. I would have been *really* cranky if
I'd spent money for that downgraded product!

 

[Spoonerism]

I was taught, back in version 2 of Word for Windows, that
the paragraph formatting was contained in the paragraph mark
at trailing end of the paragraph, which corresponds with
what you recall.

The change must've come between version 2 and 6, or between
6 and whatever the next one was. Whenever is was, it marked
the end of my spending money for software made worse. We're
never told ahead of time, about the atrocities that
Microsoft wants us to continue funding. And once you open
the bag, or case, or box, there's no chance for a refund.

Luckily, I got to use Word XP at work before I was tempted
to buy it for home. I would have been *really* cranky if
I'd spent money for that downgraded product!

ANOTHER reason why I stick to Word 2000! (I am also a VB6 enthusiast -- a
pox on VbNet)

 

[Stefan Blom]

In the final paragraph mark of the document (which, by the way, also stores
the section formatting of the document).

Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP



"croy" wrote in message
What if there is only one paragraph? Where does the
paragraph formatting reside then?

 

[Alls Quiet]

In the final paragraph mark of the document (which, by the way, also stores
the section formatting of the document).

Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

"croy"  wrote in message
What if there is only one paragraph?  Where does the
paragraph formatting reside then?

I have to say that, for non-programmers or non-IT types (for whom Word
would seem to reign supreme in terms of inverse ration of IT knowledge
to user base), this explanation confused me when it first was offered.
This isn't to be ungrateful. As I explained somewhere in the mists of
this thread, I'm grateful to know (to paraphrase J. Lennon, who would
be 70 tomorrow), "You've maked me feel like I've never been wrong."

To wit: the continued reversion to Body Text from Normal when I press
the Backspace between paragraphs...formatted in Normal. On the other
hand, maybe my Word 2000 has somehow developed a life of its own and
is merely cranky in its grand old age.

 

[Stefan Blom]

I can't explain the logic (or lack thereof!) behind this, but that's how
it has been explained to me. Also, it is supported by experiments.
If you select the paragraph mark belonging to a numbered item, and apply
formatting to it, that formatting will be applied to the number.

Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP

 

[Alls Quiet]

If you select the paragraph mark belonging to a numbered item, and apply
formatting to it, that formatting will be applied to the number.

I will experiment with it (part of your post that I snipped). By
"numbered item," I assume you don't mean numbered or auto-formatted
lists, correct? Or do you? (I'm sure I'll find out once I experiment.)

 

[Stefan Blom]

Any paragraph with auto numbering (or bullets) should work the same.

--
Stefan Blom
Microsoft Word MVP
(Message posted via news.eternal-september.org)

If you select the paragraph mark belonging to a numbered item, and apply
formatting to it, that formatting will be applied to the number.

I will experiment with it (part of your post that I snipped). By
"numbered item," I assume you don't mean numbered or auto-formatted
lists, correct? Or do you? (I'm sure I'll find out once I experiment.)

 

[zinkj0114]

I don’t want to sound like a winner, but I had a book in Word doc format that I was trying to load into my Sony Reader. The file was only 900 kb big, but when I loaded it into the Reader it blossomed to 4 MB. I went back to the Word doc file to try to figure out WHY it was so big in the Reader.
I started from the back and cut off 20%, and saved it. Lather rinse repeat. But all smaller versions still loaded into the reader at about 4 MB.
The doc is 160 pages long. When I deleted parts of chapters separated by two returns, the above paragraph would lose its new “12 points”, and revert to Normal style of “10 points”. I figured I had some garbage style-ing buried in there somewhere, even though I had pushed it through notepad several times to strip out all style-ing.
Finally, in desperation, I gutted a previous ebook doc, and inserted the new ebook notepad contents into the gutted region, then removed what was at the top and bottom, and re-saved. THIS effort gave a file that was only 720 kb big. When I loaded into the reader, it stayed the same size. I’ve wasted enough time today on trying to figure out why, but I did want to give you my experience in case it contains some clues.
The reason I might sound like a whiner is because Reveal Codes used to tell me most everything I needed to know. Now I am just guessing at some things, but after 15 years of guessing, I’m pretty good at it.