SteadyState and WDP

[Ray]

I work in an elementary school and we are attempting to use
SteadyState with Disk Protection enabled to protect the computers from
the kids in the computer lab and Library. We have redirected the
Desktop and My Documents folders to a network drive - but we have
several applications that don't play nicely and store their data on
the computer's hard drive and don't offer the option of changing the
data location.

Does anyone have any suggestions for some method of getting around
this problem? If we can't find a solution, I'm afraid we're going to
have to abort the whole process.

2 applications specifically are Type 2 Learn 3 by Sunburst Technology
and KidPix by Broderbund/The Learning Company


Thanks In Advance...
Ray

 

[Galen]

My reply is at the bottom of your sent message.

In

I work in an elementary school and we are attempting to use
SteadyState with Disk Protection enabled to protect the computers from
the kids in the computer lab and Library. We have redirected the
Desktop and My Documents folders to a network drive - but we have
several applications that don't play nicely and store their data on
the computer's hard drive and don't offer the option of changing the
data location.

Does anyone have any suggestions for some method of getting around
this problem? If we can't find a solution, I'm afraid we're going to
have to abort the whole process.

2 applications specifically are Type 2 Learn 3 by Sunburst Technology
and KidPix by Broderbund/The Learning Company


Thanks In Advance...
Ray

I hope that this doesn't come out sounding snarky. That is not my intent.

The developers of those applications have probably heard of this issue in
the past and may well have a solution. Have you tried contacting them?

The only rational methods I could think of changing this would be
programatically or via the use of either VMs or some sort of remote
application use such as roaming profiles in an AD.

The above options, given the state of affairs in our current education
system, are likely to be cost prohibitive though the VMs might be more worth
while to look at these days with some recent changes but then you end up
with licensure issues for the virtual OSes. What's the timeline you're
working with?

--
Galen (Not Current MS-MVP)

My Geek Site: http://kgiii.info
Web Hosting: http://whathostingshould.be

"In solving a problem of this sort, the grand thing is to be able to reason
backwards. That is a very useful accomplishment, and a
very easy one, but people do not practise it much. In the every-day affairs
of life it is more useful to reason forwards, and so
the other comes to be neglected. There are fifty who can reason
synthetically for one who can reason analytically." - Sherlock
Holmes

 

[Ray]

Thanks Galen ...
Actually - I have contacted them - Broderbund's response was short and
sweet....

"The product that you are inquiring about is not a network version and
is not supported to run in a network environment.
Sincerely,
Oscar
Customer Service and Technical Support"


The Type 2 Learn product has a network/site license version available
- for another $800. Of course - we don't get any credit for what we
have already purchased, since we've had it a year or so already.

It's funny how so many great tools exist - but nearly all offer only a
portion of the solution you need - any since they tend not to play
well with others, you're left with no easy solution and a lot of
frustration.... With unlimited financial resources, I'm sure this
would be a snap - but for a small, private, 300 student school - these
hurdles may just be a little too high to clear....

Thanks for your time Galen.
Ray

 

[Galen]

My reply is at the bottom of your sent message.

In

Thanks Galen ...
Actually - I have contacted them - Broderbund's response was short and
sweet....

"The product that you are inquiring about is not a network version and
is not supported to run in a network environment.
Sincerely,
Oscar
Customer Service and Technical Support"


The Type 2 Learn product has a network/site license version available
- for another $800. Of course - we don't get any credit for what we
have already purchased, since we've had it a year or so already.

It's funny how so many great tools exist - but nearly all offer only a
portion of the solution you need - any since they tend not to play
well with others, you're left with no easy solution and a lot of
frustration.... With unlimited financial resources, I'm sure this
would be a snap - but for a small, private, 300 student school - these
hurdles may just be a little too high to clear....

Thanks for your time Galen.
Ray

I guess the next step is to revert to my original question at the end of it
all and find out what time frame you're looking at. An AD, roaming profiles,
and an incremental backup may be your alternative that is easier and less
expensive. A VM with a common store and image files to do roll outs might do
the job but be heavier iron than you're wanting to pay for. So, really, I
think the best choice is to find out what you're time frame is and let's see
what can be brainstormed.

(By the way, I have a soft spot for schools which is why I answered.)

--
Galen (Not Current MS-MVP)

My Geek Site: http://kgiii.info
Web Hosting: http://whathostingshould.be

"In solving a problem of this sort, the grand thing is to be able to reason
backwards. That is a very useful accomplishment, and a
very easy one, but people do not practise it much. In the every-day affairs
of life it is more useful to reason forwards, and so
the other comes to be neglected. There are fifty who can reason
synthetically for one who can reason analytically." - Sherlock
Holmes

 

[Anteaus]

A lot depends where these apps store their data and settings. A tool like
InstallRite (http://epsilonsquared.com) might help establish this if the
supplier won't tell you.

Given this knowledge, it might be possible to script a copying of the data
to and from the network.

Roaming profiles- the main issue here is the need to restrict users to tiny
amounts of data.

Though I intensely dislike doing maintenance on roaming-profile systems, as
when you adjust a system-setting you are never exactly sure WHAT you are
changing. It may affect only the Admin profile in which case you've achieved
nothing. It may affect the local computer, regardless of user. It may affect
only this user on this computer. Or, it may screw-up the settings for this
user no matter which computer they use. (oops!) Unless you know exactly where
the program stores its settings, you cannot predict the scope of any change
you make, and this makes maintenance a nightmare.

 

[PA Bear [MS MVP]]

Windows SteadyState Support Forum
http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsToolsandUtilities/ShowForum.aspx?ForumID=1660&SiteID=69

SteadyState Handbook
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=d64af114-336c-4418-beb7-e074e813b498

SteadyState FAQ:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=3d91c4b1-0978-44c2-9014-07e0932384e5
(Published 10 Sept-07)

Tip: Download, read & fully understand the Handbook & FAQ before installing
SteadyState!

 

[Ray]

We did have a basic understanding of SteadyState when we started - or
at least we thought we did. The problem arose when we discovered after
the fact that we had 2 applications that would not run from or allow
us to save their data anywhere except on the C drive. My hope is that
someone far more creative and intelligent than I, would have some
clever method of getting around this problem.

I have a printed copy of the SteadyState handbook on the desk next to
me, and I haven't seen anything in it that tells me how to handle this
issue. If I am missing it - please point it out to me...

Thank you
Ray

 

[Ray]

My reply is at the bottom of your sent message.

In

I guess the next step is to revert to my original question at the end of it
all and find out what time frame you're looking at. An AD, roaming profiles,
and an incremental backup may be your alternative that is easier and less
expensive. A VM with a common store and image files to do roll outs might do
the job but be heavier iron than you're wanting to pay for. So, really, I
think the best choice is to find out what you're time frame is and let's see
what can be brainstormed.

(By the way, I have a soft spot for schools which is why I answered.)

Hmmm... the time frame -

Well - actually we discovered the problem by accident when we rebooted
and realized we cleared the data the kids had entered that day. This
was truly an oversight...so really - there is no time to brainstorm
and figure it out. I was just hoping that someone else had let
something fall through the cracks and had a ready-made solution.

The KidPix program has it's data buried under the "Application Data"
folder for "All Users". I consider that a fairly strange place for
it. Tomorrow, I'm planning on digging through the Registry and seeing
if there is any reference to that location.... Even true roaming
profiles wouldn't solve this part of the problem. I've been
considering a SynToy solution - but I'm not very comfortable with
that..

I really appreciate your interest Galen.
Thanks Again.
Ray

 

[PA Bear [MS MVP]]

Galen's replies notwithstanding, you might be better of posting in the
SteadyState forum.

 

[Galen]

My reply is at the bottom of your sent message.

In

Galen's replies notwithstanding, you might be better of posting in the
SteadyState forum.

I'd definately recommend that as well. My *impression* (from a bit of
reading) is that you're looking at some potential for expensive coding OR an
alternative layout system in your network. Roaming profiles are, in my
opinion, the MOST likely opportunity to get what you want.

Your goal is to use the software effectively.
To use the software with a "Holy Crap" button should a student cause a
malfunction or should an application fail.

You are a private school. Err... I just gave some money to my old school
about three months ago - they'll get to calling again when they have the
first few hockey games won.

In all honesty? I'd suggest you keep going here, doing what PA Bear
suggested as well as setting up a time frame for the repair (it can NOT be
immediate - as such you may have to opt to "work as is" if the work as is is
effective 99% of the time) and contact your local community college or high
school. As you *may* actively compete against the local high school you
might not want to contact them. *random swear* sports trump *random swear*
educational programs constantly.

If you continue with the details when you've looked, continue with the
information here and at their forums, you might get some activism and you
may get some good responses. Just never forget the reason you do what you
do. I am a parent and quasi professional. (I have yet to bother actually
earning any sort of degree as I've yet to see a reason for it.
Certifications and awards have served me just fine, thanks.) It irks me to
no end that the people who TEACH people to be doctors and lawyers or to do
math or to learn engineering or scientific methods are continually paid less
than the people who work in the fields.

In short, post there, post here, post everywhere. If you have a blog,
regardless of the typical content, post there. If you have a local community
television show, ask there...

I guess it is my soft spot for education speaking but, really, keep asking.
Unfortunately with roaming profiles with 300 kids you're looking at expenses
you can't likely afford. Heck, the way things were you couldn't afford. The
way things can be with custom coding you can't really afford. I'd personally
recommend an Active Directory, roaming profiles of course, and a centralized
server to manage it all with an immediate (nearly) base metal restore,
incremental options for restoration, and a storage array that was speedy
enough to keep up. When the kids are gone you can run all the scripts
required to clean out the silliness.

--
Galen (Not Current MS-MVP)

My Geek Site: http://kgiii.info
Web Hosting: http://whathostingshould.be

"In solving a problem of this sort, the grand thing is to be able to reason
backwards. That is a very useful accomplishment, and a
very easy one, but people do not practise it much. In the every-day affairs
of life it is more useful to reason forwards, and so
the other comes to be neglected. There are fifty who can reason
synthetically for one who can reason analytically." - Sherlock
Holmes