SP2, another unsatisfied customer -- coda

[Al Smith]

I think I found the problem that was screwing up my SP2 install.
Remember, I reported getting a "stop" error most times when I
rebooted? Well, I was browsing around and ran across this
information on this Microsoft page:

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?kbid=884130&product=windowsxpsp2

ZoneAlarm 4.5x Zone Labs 64-bit (NX)
http://www.zonelabs.com This program does not install. If you try
to install it, you receive an "8e" Stop error every time your
computer starts.

This is my version of ZoneAlarm -- specifically, version
4.5.538.001 -- and I do have an AMD Athlon 64 CPU, and the crash
did come during my ZoneAlarm start up (or damn close to it), so
this looks very like my problem.

I lost the original thread, which is why I post this separately.

 

[John Bailo]

I think I found the problem that was screwing up my SP2 install.
Remember, I reported getting a "stop" error most times when I rebooted?
Well, I was browsing around and ran across this information on this
Microsoft page:

Dude.

XP has it's own firewall.

WHy are you running Zone Alarm?!

 

[Ron Martell]

Dude.

XP has it's own firewall.

WHy are you running Zone Alarm?!

The Windows XP firewall only protects against intrusions from the
Internet. It does not stop trojans, rogue applications, etc. from
accessing the Internet to "phone home" or whatever.

Zone Alarm, and most other firewall products, give two way protection
against both incoming and outgoing unwanted traffic.

Hope this explains the situation.


Ron Martell Duncan B.C. Canada
--
Microsoft MVP
On-Line Help Computer Service
http://onlinehelp.bc.ca

In memory of a dear friend Alex Nichol MVP
http://aumha.org/alex.htm

 

[John Bailo]

The Windows XP firewall only protects against intrusions from the
Internet. It does not stop trojans, rogue applications, etc. from
accessing the Internet to "phone home" or whatever.

Zone Alarm, and most other firewall products, give two way protection
against both incoming and outgoing unwanted traffic.

Then how come every time I install a new program, XP asks me if I want
to allow it to "access the Internet".

Yes, you still need a virus protection, but you don't need a firewall.

I recommend the Free Home Edition of AVG -- a very excellent virus
scanner that can integrate with Outlook and Thunderbird.

http://www.grisoft.com/doc/1

 

[TCS]

Then how come every time I install a new program, XP asks me if I want
to allow it to "access the Internet".

Yes, you still need a virus protection, but you don't need a firewall.

Only if you trust microsoft I'd rather not use a firewall that every ****ing
virus on the planet is going to know how to disable.

Of course, I don't do any serious work in windows or use a windows file system
for permenant storage.

 

[Al Smith]

Dude.

XP has it's own firewall.

WHy are you running Zone Alarm?!

I'm used to it, and I like it. I've tried several other firewalls
but don't like them as well. Microsoft's firewall I wouldn't
trust. For one thing, it's only half a firewall. For another, it's
by Microsoft.

 

[Guest]

if you continue to rely solely on the windows firewall you will get burnt, it
offers very little "real" protection, do some research my friend before
advising people

 

[Gordon]

if you continue to rely solely on the windows firewall you will get burnt,
it
offers very little "real" protection, do some research my friend before
advising people

Not at all. It's very good at doing what it does. What it DOESN'T do is stop
outbound traffic. INBOUND, it's very good at.

 

[Tim Smith]

Dude.

XP has it's own firewall.

WHy are you running Zone Alarm?!

Probably because on Windows, you want a firewall on *outgoing*
connections, too, not just incoming connections. The XP firewall only
deals with incoming connections.

 

[chrisv]

John Bailo <[email protected]> wrote:

*plonk*

 

[DWhitley]

XP has it's own firewall.
WHy are you running Zone Alarm?!

Probably because he wants to use one of the real firewalls available
that guards bi directionally and has more in depth control over
different zones.

 

[Terry Fisher]

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]

Then how come every time I install a new program, XP asks me if I want
to allow it to "access the Internet".

you idiot that's not what it's doing. read.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/security/internet/sp2_wfintro.mspx

 

[John Bailo]

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]

Then how come every time I install a new program, XP asks me if I want
to allow it to "access the Internet".

you idiot that's not what it's doing. read.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/security/internet/sp2_wfintro.mspx

No, it does exactly what he asked.

In the column of what it "does do" at the bottom it says:

"Ask for your permission to block or unblock certain connection requests."

The OP was claiming that only Zone Alarm blocked programs on his
computer's side of the firewall from contacting servers on the Internet.
This proves that the XP firewall can block both ways.

 

[Terry Fisher]

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]

Ron Martell wrote:

The Windows XP firewall only protects against intrusions from the
Internet. It does not stop trojans, rogue applications, etc. from
accessing the Internet to "phone home" or whatever.

Zone Alarm, and most other firewall products, give two way protection
against both incoming and outgoing unwanted traffic.

Then how come every time I install a new program, XP asks me if I want
to allow it to "access the Internet".

you idiot that's not what it's doing. read.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/security/internet/sp2_wfintro.mspx

No, it does exactly what he asked.

In the column of what it "does do" at the bottom it says:

"Ask for your permission to block or unblock certain connection requests."

The OP was claiming that only Zone Alarm blocked programs on his
computer's side of the firewall from contacting servers on the Internet.
This proves that the XP firewall can block both ways.

no it doesn't. it only associated it with AOL messenger because it knew
what ports AOL uses. XP firewall does NOT block outbound connections and
nothing you'll read anywhere says it does.

 

[Tom Pepper Willett]

Terry: YOU are correct. The WF does *not* block outbound traffic, as has
been discussed many times here. There is plenty of information searching
the internet stating that fact.

There is a lengthy manual available from MS.

Deploying Windows Firewall Settings for Microsoft Windows XP with Service
Pack 2:
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/deploy/depfwset/default.mspx

"Windows XP Service Pack 2 (SP2) includes the Windows Firewall, a
replacement for the feature previously known as the Internet Connection
Firewall (ICF). Windows Firewall is a stateful host firewall that drops all
unsolicited incoming traffic that does not correspond to either traffic sent
in response to a request of the computer (solicited traffic) or unsolicited
traffic that has been specified as allowed (excepted traffic). This behavior
of Windows Firewall provides a level of protection from malicious users and
programs that use unsolicited incoming traffic to attack computers. With the
exception of some Internet Control Message Protocol (ICMP) messages, Windows
Firewall does not drop outgoing traffic"

Tom
| ["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]
| On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:32:55 GMT, John Bailo said:
| > Terry Fisher wrote:
| >> ["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.]
| >> On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 03:49:10 GMT, John Bailo said:
| >>
| >>>Ron Martell wrote:
| >>>
| >>>>The Windows XP firewall only protects against intrusions from the
| >>>>Internet. It does not stop trojans, rogue applications, etc. from
| >>>>accessing the Internet to "phone home" or whatever.
| >>>>
| >>>>Zone Alarm, and most other firewall products, give two way protection
| >>>>against both incoming and outgoing unwanted traffic.
| >>>
| >>>Then how come every time I install a new program, XP asks me if I want
| >>>to allow it to "access the Internet".
| >>
| >>
| >> you idiot that's not what it's doing. read.
| >>
| >>
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/security/internet/sp2_wfintro.mspx
| >
| > No, it does exactly what he asked.
| >
| > In the column of what it "does do" at the bottom it says:
| >
| > "Ask for your permission to block or unblock certain connection
requests."
| >
| > The OP was claiming that only Zone Alarm blocked programs on his
| > computer's side of the firewall from contacting servers on the Internet.
| > This proves that the XP firewall can block both ways.
|
| no it doesn't. it only associated it with AOL messenger because it knew
| what ports AOL uses. XP firewall does NOT block outbound connections and
| nothing you'll read anywhere says it does.

 

[chrisv]

*plonk*

 

[Al Smith]

Terry: YOU are correct. The WF does *not* block outbound traffic, as has

been discussed many times here. There is plenty of information searching
the internet stating that fact.

That page referred to isn't very clear about this, though, is it?

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/security/internet/sp2_wfintro.mspx

If I hadn't known already that the Windows Firewall doesn't block
outbound traffic, I would assume that it did from this wording:

"It does: Ask for your permission to block or unblock certain
connection requests."

Microsoft should be a little more explicit about the capabilities
of the firewall, but maybe they don't want to admit that it is
crippled.

 

[Tom Pepper Willett]

The link to the page that I provided is clear.

Tom

|> Terry: YOU are correct. The WF does *not* block outbound traffic, as
has
| > been discussed many times here. There is plenty of information
searching
| > the internet stating that fact.
|
| That page referred to isn't very clear about this, though, is it?
|
|
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/security/internet/sp2_wfintro.mspx
|
| If I hadn't known already that the Windows Firewall doesn't block
| outbound traffic, I would assume that it did from this wording:
|
| "It does: Ask for your permission to block or unblock certain
| connection requests."
|
| Microsoft should be a little more explicit about the capabilities
| of the firewall, but maybe they don't want to admit that it is
| crippled.