Problems with WiFi and S/W on refurb notebook with 64-bit Vista

[Stratum]

I recently purchased a refurbished HP Pavilion dv9000 (RP250UA#ABA)
notebook computer from eCost.com with 64-bit Vista Ultimate
on it.

I am experiencing several problems both hardware and software
related, and would like to know if others are experiencing similar
issues and if they were able to solve the problem(s).

Problem #1
==========
My primary link with Internet on that computer is through
a household wireless network. Unfortunately, the WiFi once
connected disconnects on a reboot and cannot be reconnected
again until the computer has been off for about 2 hours.
Upon rebooting and bringing the WiFi link back to life, if
I do a reboot after it has been on for only a minute or
so, the WiFi link remains inoperative for several hours.

The problem could be hardware problem reacting to a
temperature rise. However, the computer has only been
on for one or two minutes when WiFi fails... and again
it only fails on a reboot. If I turn it on and leave it
on, the WiFi link stays connected for as long as 20 hours,
which is the longest I have left it on.

Or the problem could be software related. For instance,
the WiFi's device driver might be writing a session cookie with a
lifetime of a couple of hours which refuses to let the wireless link
be reactivated until the cookie expires. I have tried
erasing all history including cookies in my Web browser
just before and just after a reboot... to no avail.

I'm stumped.


Problem #2
==========
I was able to install Visual Studio 2003, which isn't supported
by Vista onto the new system, and it apparently works for a
couple of test projects, one of which is quite large.

But I couldn't install my VS2005 upgrade which depends on
finding Visual Studio 2003. On each installation,
the installer couldn't find a driver and this would
bring the installation to a halt. The missing driver
would change from installation to installation.

So far, I have tried rebuilding the OS, with the help of a
very patient help desk tech in Chennai who calls himself
David. He works for HP. So far... to no avail.

(I might add here that the support from eCost was very
poor, but I realize they aren't technically savvy.)

I'm stumped here, and suspect the two problems are related.
I haven't even attempted to load SQL Express on this
machine.

In the interim, I decided to purchase a second notebook,
another Pavilion at Costco with a slightly scaled down
AMD processor for a hundred bucks less than the refurb system
but with *32-bit* Vista. I am happy to report that everything
works. The performance is superb. VS2005 comes up in a second
or two and after compilation, a large ASP.Net project comes up
as fast the browser can come up. *Loading* the project is
practically instantaneous. The same project takes over a minute
to load on a 2003 vintage desktop.

On the bright side, when I have this problem fixed, I'll
have two 17-inch laptops with extended desktop area.

Jim

 

[Charlie Tame]

I recently purchased a refurbished HP Pavilion dv9000 (RP250UA#ABA)
notebook computer from eCost.com with 64-bit Vista Ultimate
on it.

I am experiencing several problems both hardware and software
related, and would like to know if others are experiencing similar
issues and if they were able to solve the problem(s).

Problem #1
==========
My primary link with Internet on that computer is through
a household wireless network. Unfortunately, the WiFi once
connected disconnects on a reboot and cannot be reconnected
again until the computer has been off for about 2 hours.
Upon rebooting and bringing the WiFi link back to life, if
I do a reboot after it has been on for only a minute or
so, the WiFi link remains inoperative for several hours.

The problem could be hardware problem reacting to a
temperature rise. However, the computer has only been
on for one or two minutes when WiFi fails... and again
it only fails on a reboot. If I turn it on and leave it
on, the WiFi link stays connected for as long as 20 hours,
which is the longest I have left it on.

Or the problem could be software related. For instance,
the WiFi's device driver might be writing a session cookie with a
lifetime of a couple of hours which refuses to let the wireless link
be reactivated until the cookie expires. I have tried
erasing all history including cookies in my Web browser
just before and just after a reboot... to no avail.

I'm stumped.


Problem #2
==========
I was able to install Visual Studio 2003, which isn't supported
by Vista onto the new system, and it apparently works for a
couple of test projects, one of which is quite large.

But I couldn't install my VS2005 upgrade which depends on
finding Visual Studio 2003. On each installation,
the installer couldn't find a driver and this would
bring the installation to a halt. The missing driver
would change from installation to installation.

So far, I have tried rebuilding the OS, with the help of a
very patient help desk tech in Chennai who calls himself
David. He works for HP. So far... to no avail.

(I might add here that the support from eCost was very
poor, but I realize they aren't technically savvy.)

I'm stumped here, and suspect the two problems are related.
I haven't even attempted to load SQL Express on this
machine.

In the interim, I decided to purchase a second notebook,
another Pavilion at Costco with a slightly scaled down
AMD processor for a hundred bucks less than the refurb system
but with *32-bit* Vista. I am happy to report that everything
works. The performance is superb. VS2005 comes up in a second
or two and after compilation, a large ASP.Net project comes up
as fast the browser can come up. *Loading* the project is
practically instantaneous. The same project takes over a minute
to load on a 2003 vintage desktop.

On the bright side, when I have this problem fixed, I'll
have two 17-inch laptops with extended desktop area.

Jim

Jim, I assume you have looked for newer drivers for the WIFI adapter but
have you tried resetting the router to see if you can reconnect sooner?

Some routers dont seem to like Vista and I have seen it suggested that
disabling IPV6 in Vista can help but have no experience of this. I
suggest f you have not already tried it that leaving the router off for
a minute or two might be worth a try.

Is there are way you can try with a wired connection as well, simply to
help diagnose?

As for the VS problem there was, if I recall, an update for 64 bit + a
450Mb service pack. Has Microsoft Update offered any updates for either
VS version - am wondering if maybe you have to update 2003 with
something 64 bit compatible before going on to update to 2005.

You might also try the VS newsgroups...

 

[Andre Da Costa[ActiveWin]]

On the Visual Studio 2003/2005 issue, I believe you can just provide the
2003 disk during installation of 2005 as a qualifying product when
requestion I don't believe you need to have it installed.

 

[Mr. Arnold]

I recently purchased a refurbished HP Pavilion dv9000 (RP250UA#ABA)
notebook computer from eCost.com with 64-bit Vista Ultimate
on it.

I am experiencing several problems both hardware and software
related, and would like to know if others are experiencing similar
issues and if they were able to solve the problem(s).

Problem #1
==========
My primary link with Internet on that computer is through
a household wireless network. Unfortunately, the WiFi once
connected disconnects on a reboot and cannot be reconnected
again until the computer has been off for about 2 hours.
Upon rebooting and bringing the WiFi link back to life, if
I do a reboot after it has been on for only a minute or
so, the WiFi link remains inoperative for several hours.

This sounds like a hardware issue.

The problem could be hardware problem reacting to a
temperature rise. However, the computer has only been
on for one or two minutes when WiFi fails... and again
it only fails on a reboot. If I turn it on and leave it
on, the WiFi link stays connected for as long as 20 hours,
which is the longest I have left it on.

Then it's not a software issue. It's a hardware issue.

Or the problem could be software related. For instance,
the WiFi's device driver might be writing a session cookie with a
lifetime of a couple of hours which refuses to let the wireless link
be reactivated until the cookie expires. I have tried
erasing all history including cookies in my Web browser
just before and just after a reboot... to no avail.

I'm stumped.

What are you talking about? A browser's cookies have nothing to do with the
connection whether it be Ethernet, wireless or dial-up. A Web session is a
stateless session between the client's browser and the Web server. No
connection is being maintained between the two. They are disconnected from
each other each time. A new connection must be made each time the client's
browser wants to communicate with the Web server or the Web server wants to
communicate with the browser -- stateless.

This way, a Web server can service many clients, because it doesn't
maintain state/connection with any of them and session information is
relayed between the client's browser and the Web server so that the Web
server knows who it is in commutations with the next time the clients's
browser establishes connections with the Web server.

A cookie holds bits of state information so that the client's browser and
the Web server can exchange session information between the two, because it
is a stateless session or the connection over the Internet is not
maintained, and neither one knows about anything when connections are
established between them again, unless session information is being kept --
the cookie.

Problem #2
==========
I was able to install Visual Studio 2003, which isn't supported
by Vista onto the new system, and it apparently works for a
couple of test projects, one of which is quite large.

It's not suppoerted on Vista. So why are you trying to do it?

But I couldn't install my VS2005 upgrade which depends on
finding Visual Studio 2003. On each installation,
the installer couldn't find a driver and this would
bring the installation to a halt. The missing driver
would change from installation to installation.

You might be able to upgrate over the top of VS 2005 Express sub-components
(VB, C#, C++ and Web Server) if they are on the machine.

So far, I have tried rebuilding the OS, with the help of a
very patient help desk tech in Chennai who calls himself
David. He works for HP. So far... to no avail.

(I might add here that the support from eCost was very
poor, but I realize they aren't technically savvy.)

I'm stumped here, and suspect the two problems are related.
I haven't even attempted to load SQL Express on this
machine.

In the interim, I decided to purchase a second notebook,
another Pavilion at Costco with a slightly scaled down
AMD processor for a hundred bucks less than the refurb system
but with *32-bit* Vista. I am happy to report that everything
works. The performance is superb. VS2005 comes up in a second
or two and after compilation, a large ASP.Net project comes up
as fast the browser can come up. *Loading* the project is
practically instantaneous. The same project takes over a minute
to load on a 2003 vintage desktop.

I have heard of other .Net software developers having nothing but problems
with a 64 bit Vista machine. At this time, maybe you need to stay 32bit with
Vista and .Net development.

I'll assume you are using a business classed edition of Vista, like
Business, Enterprise or Ultimate, otherwise, you're not going to be able to
do full ASP.Net development, because IIS7 on those versions come with
FrontPage Extensions, and the Home versions do not.

 

[Stratum]

This sounds like a hardware issue.



Then it's not a software issue. It's a hardware issue.

My reason for thinking it's a software issue is because the
elapsed time before WiFi can be used is independent of the
length of time the computer has been turned on. Whether
it was on for fewer than two minutes, or for several days,
about 120 minutes are required before WiFi can be turned
on again. However, I have noticed that I can turn it
on after a boot -- one time only, that is -- and
once left the computer on for several hours before
completing a login so that the machine had probably
approached its normal operating temperature by the
time I connected to WiFi.

What are you talking about? A browser's cookies have nothing to do with
the connection whether it be Ethernet, wireless or dial-up.

It's a client / server architecture and as far as I know,
connection to WiFi service is made through an HTTP REQUEST. And
actually Web browsers have nothing to do with the way cookies are
written although a client browser can be set to prohibit its
host computer from accepting a cookie.


But I'm seeking an answer (I do plenty of server / client programming)
and don't have the time or interest to go off on a tangent.

It's not suppoerted on Vista. So why are you trying to do it?

Because I use an older 2003 project as a source and performance
reference for migration to 2005, and it's easier to do on the
same computer. Since I can do it on the machine with 32-bit
Vista, I pretty much do.

You might be able to upgrate over the top of VS 2005 Express
sub-components (VB, C#, C++ and Web Server) if they are on the machine.

I don't use VS 2005 Express, and I was able to install VS2005
Professional, i.e., the ENU upgrade from Visual Studio 2003
Professional, on a 32-bit version of Vista.

I'll assume you are using a business classed edition of Vista, like
Business, Enterprise or Ultimate, otherwise, you're not going to be
able to do full ASP.Net development, because IIS7 on those versions
come with FrontPage Extensions, and the Home versions do not.

Yup.

 

[Stratum]

My reason for thinking it's a software issue is because the
elapsed time before WiFi can be used is independent of the
length of time the computer has been turned on. Whether
it was on for fewer than two minutes, or for several days,
about 120 minutes are required before WiFi can be turned
on again. However, I have noticed that I can turn it
on after a boot -- one time only, that is -- and
once left the computer on for several hours before
completing a login so that the machine had probably
approached its normal operating temperature by the
time I connected to WiFi.

A correction...

I can turn it on and off and back on again after a boot, but if
I reboot, it won't come back on for a couple of hours. The
boot presents a boundary condition, so to speak. A reboot
also would not delete a cookie if its expiration time is set
to persist for a fixed period... if that's relevant. But
I don't have enough info to say that it is or isn't.

 

[Mr. Arnold]

My reason for thinking it's a software issue is because the
elapsed time before WiFi can be used is independent of the
length of time the computer has been turned on. Whether
it was on for fewer than two minutes, or for several days,
about 120 minutes are required before WiFi can be turned
on again. However, I have noticed that I can turn it
on after a boot -- one time only, that is -- and
once left the computer on for several hours before
completing a login so that the machine had probably
approached its normal operating temperature by the
time I connected to WiFi.

I don't know man. I have used wireless for many years and frequent a
wireless NG. I have never heard of this. I also use wireless on this HP
laptop running Vista, and I have never experienced anything of the sort. I
think you have an equipment issue of some sort. You might want to post to
alt.internet.wireless where there are some professionals there that can help
you.

It's a client / server architecture and as far as I know,
connection to WiFi service is made through an HTTP REQUEST. And
actually Web browsers have nothing to do with the way cookies are written
although a client browser can be set to prohibit its
host computer from accepting a cookie.

So are you saying you have a wireless ISP provider?

And HTTP Request is not a statefull connection in the context that you are
talking about above. It's not being held open based on what you're talking
about. Yes an HTTP Request can be held open but that's usually a .Net NT
Service or Console application uploading or downloading XML data with a Web
Site appliaction over HTTP, as an example which can take a long time to do
this that can be hours and the connection is held open

And there are other ways to keep session state information other than
cookies with a browser, but that's the most common way. But you brought up
cookies and the browser as a possibility of holding a connection open on
wireless. And if this is a wireless home network situation you're talking
about, then I must say that there is no way that's happening. And it's some
other issue.

But I'm seeking an answer (I do plenty of server / client programming)
and don't have the time or interest to go off on a tangent.

I have done it in the past for a number of years too, client/server
programming You're not doing mobil device programming are you? What does a
wireless cookie have to do with it if you're not doing wireless mobil device
programming?

Because I use an older 2003 project as a source and performance
reference for migration to 2005, and it's easier to do on the
same computer. Since I can do it on the machine with 32-bit
Vista, I pretty much do.

You might wind-up getting bit if you continue down this path. You might want
to look at PC2007 (free) (multiple O/S(s) running concurrently) or dual
boot Vista and XP pro. XP Pro running VS 2003.

I'll assume you're using the wireless card that's integrated in the laptop.
May I suggest you find a friend that has a USB wireless card or some other
means of not using that integrated wireless card on the laptop, install it
and see if the problem follows.

 

[Barb Bowman]

You should post the text output of

ipconfig /all run from an elevated cmd prompt.

Do you get an IP after a reboot? Is the default gateway 0.0.0.0 ?

What brand and version wireless radio? What driver?

What router are you using (vendor, model, and hardware rev)? What
version of firmware is in the router? Is it the most recent?

You'd get more help in one of the Vista Networking newsgroups.

I can turn it on and off and back on again after a boot, but if
I reboot, it won't come back on for a couple of hours. The
boot presents a boundary condition, so to speak. A reboot
also would not delete a cookie if its expiration time is set
to persist for a fixed period... if that's relevant. But
I don't have enough info to say that it is or isn't.

--

Barb Bowman
MS Windows-MVP
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone/meetexperts/bowman.mspx
http://blogs.digitalmediaphile.com/barb/

 

[Mr. Arnold]

A correction...

I can turn it on and off and back on again after a boot, but if
I reboot, it won't come back on for a couple of hours. The
boot presents a boundary condition, so to speak. A reboot
also would not delete a cookie if its expiration time is set
to persist for a fixed period... if that's relevant. But
I don't have enough info to say that it is or isn't.

This would make sense of you were using some kind of wireless mobile device
and wireless cookies are being used. You may not even be getting a DHCP IP
due to the wireless card being faulty or the router itself being faulty. And
then things work again and an IP is gotten or issued.

Without a IP being used on the router whether it be a DHCP IP from a DHCP
server such as one used on a router or a static IP on the router, the
machine has no connection and cannot even access the router's admin page nor
the Internet. The card and machine can have 100% signal strength connected
to the wireless router, but without a valid IP, the machine has no
connection period to anything.

What IP does the computer have when you enter IPconfig /all and you're
having this problem? Is the IP zeroes or does the IP start with 169 with the
169 being an indication that the O/S couldn't get a DHCP IP from a DHCP
server and timed out. In either case, the machine doesn't have a connection
to the router nor a connection to the Internet on the wireless.

One other thing, you shouldn't post with your real email address to
newsgroups. Spammers harvest these email addresses, and you'll get hit with
spam mail.

 

[Stratum]

Some routers dont seem to like Vista and I have seen it suggested that
disabling IPV6 in Vista can help but have no experience of this.

I'm not near the machine at the moment, but actually, that does
sound like a useful suggestion. I'll give it a try and report
back.

 

[Stratum]

I'm not near the machine at the moment, but actually, that does
sound like a useful suggestion. I'll give it a try and report
back.

Although (I just thought of this), I did shut off the router
and it had no effect on whether my computer's WiFi comes
on or not.

 

[Mr. Arnold]

Although (I just thought of this), I did shut off the router
and it had no effect on whether my computer's WiFi comes
on or not.

These are not wireless newsgroups. Did you do a hard reset of the router and
a shutdown to correct the firmware of the router? The firmware can become
unstable at times too and weird things can happen.

Two other posters posted up in this NG recently talking about wireless, a
laptop and Vista or some possible software running that was causing
problems. In both cases, it was the integrated card in the laptop that was
the problem. The only way that they found out that the card was the problem
is when they got a stand alone card and installed it on the machine. And
everything worked. Those were brand new machines out of the box. You got a
refurbished one. IPV6 is NOT the problem if at some point you had a good
connection.

What I suspect is that the wireless card in the laptop is the problem, which
can happen, or some possible interference is happening with the wireless
that's causing the connection to not work at times. When it doesn't work, I
suspect that the machine doesn't have an IP, which can even happen in the
middle of the connection that the IP is lost, if something is faulty. At
best, wireless can be flakey to begin with at times and anything can be
happening with the connection. All you have to do is step into a wireless NG
and see the various connection problems a user can have with wireless.

 

[Guest]

I have a similar problem, and instead of making a new thread about it, I
thought I'd post here.

I have a Dell Inspiron 1520 and am running vista. So, my wireless
connection to my router seems to be great, the problem is the internet will
become very sluggish and/or suddenly timeout (despite the fact that my signal
will be at almost 100%).

I am pretty sure it's either a vista/dell/software/wireless issue, or some
combination thereof, and here is my reasoning:

1. If I plug straight into the routher or modem via ethernet, everything is
fine, it completely resolves the issue.
2. My sister's laptop is older than mine and is running XP with a built in
wireless card (sorry, forgot to mention I have an integrated wireless card,
but that should be assumed, right?).
3. I have a USB wireless catcher for my desktop, which works great on my
desktop (running XP), but when I turn my built in wifi for my laptop off, and
plug in the USB wifi catcher, I have the same problems I have with my
integrated card, which leads me to believe it's not a hardware issue.

I'm running a linksys router... the err... wireless-g broadband with speed
booster!

I haven't had much time to search for a solution (school and work has a way
of doing that), but maybe someone has found a solution at this point.

thanks in advance for any help. I'll try and check this thread as often as
possible. Midterms are almost done so I should have a bit more free time
soon.

 

[Barb Bowman]

The correct thing to do IS to start a new thread so that various
peoples issues don't get all jumbled up which makes things more
difficult for people trying to help you resolve your issue.

When you do start the new thread, please post

1. the text output of ipconfig /all run from an elevated command
prompt (not a screen shot)

2. the brand, model, and hardware revision of your router

3. the version of firmware in your router (also check to see if
there is newer firmware and apply it to see if it resolves your
issues)

I have a similar problem, and instead of making a new thread about it, I
thought I'd post here.

I have a Dell Inspiron 1520 and am running vista. So, my wireless
connection to my router seems to be great, the problem is the internet will
become very sluggish and/or suddenly timeout (despite the fact that my signal
will be at almost 100%).

I am pretty sure it's either a vista/dell/software/wireless issue, or some
combination thereof, and here is my reasoning:

1. If I plug straight into the routher or modem via ethernet, everything is
fine, it completely resolves the issue.
2. My sister's laptop is older than mine and is running XP with a built in
wireless card (sorry, forgot to mention I have an integrated wireless card,
but that should be assumed, right?).
3. I have a USB wireless catcher for my desktop, which works great on my
desktop (running XP), but when I turn my built in wifi for my laptop off, and
plug in the USB wifi catcher, I have the same problems I have with my
integrated card, which leads me to believe it's not a hardware issue.

I'm running a linksys router... the err... wireless-g broadband with speed
booster!

I haven't had much time to search for a solution (school and work has a way
of doing that), but maybe someone has found a solution at this point.

thanks in advance for any help. I'll try and check this thread as often as
possible. Midterms are almost done so I should have a bit more free time
soon.

--

Barb Bowman
MS Windows-MVP
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone/meetexperts/bowman.mspx
http://blogs.digitalmediaphile.com/barb/

 

[Guest]

alright. I'm at school right now, and have some studying etc to do, but when
I create a new thread I'll be sure to include those things. Thanks!