PRoblem with DVD RW drive


B

Bob F

I have a used DVD RW drive that behaves strangly. It works fine for reading DVDs
and CDs and writes CDs fine. It shows in "Computer" as "DVD RAM drive" when no
disk is inserted. Upon inserting a CD or DVD R disk, it goes to displaying as
"CD drive". I can drop files to be written to the drive into it as long as it
does not have a DVD R disk inserted into it. Insert a CD, fine. Insert a DVD,
and I get an error msg "Windows encountered a problem when try to copy this
folder". Without a DVD inserted, it accepts the files fine, and displays the
write file option. Insert a DVD, and the write option goes away. Insert a CD -
everything is fine.

Is this just a bad drive?
 
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P

philo

I have a used DVD RW drive that behaves strangly. It works fine for reading DVDs
and CDs and writes CDs fine. It shows in "Computer" as "DVD RAM drive" when no
disk is inserted. Upon inserting a CD or DVD R disk, it goes to displaying as
"CD drive". I can drop files to be written to the drive into it as long as it
does not have a DVD R disk inserted into it. Insert a CD, fine. Insert a DVD,
and I get an error msg "Windows encountered a problem when try to copy this
folder". Without a DVD inserted, it accepts the files fine, and displays the
write file option. Insert a DVD, and the write option goes away. Insert a CD -
everything is fine.

Is this just a bad drive?


Without 3rd party software, XP cannot write to DVD
 
P

Paul

Bob said:
I have a used DVD RW drive that behaves strangly. It works fine for reading DVDs
and CDs and writes CDs fine. It shows in "Computer" as "DVD RAM drive" when no
disk is inserted. Upon inserting a CD or DVD R disk, it goes to displaying as
"CD drive". I can drop files to be written to the drive into it as long as it
does not have a DVD R disk inserted into it. Insert a CD, fine. Insert a DVD,
and I get an error msg "Windows encountered a problem when try to copy this
folder". Without a DVD inserted, it accepts the files fine, and displays the
write file option. Insert a DVD, and the write option goes away. Insert a CD -
everything is fine.

Is this just a bad drive?

Like, dirty DVD laser/lens ?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/eb/Dismdvd.jpg

*******

DVD uses 650nm light. CD uses 780nm light. The first is
"red", the second is "infrared". Even if your eye cannot
see the "infrared" case, any video camera type device with
silicon sensor can see infrared (even on units that have
an infrared filter to prevent that).

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped....svg/512px-Comparison_CD_DVD_HDDVD_BD.svg.png

The power level of the light source is variable. It is
continuously programmable. On the surface, you might see
references to "read/write/erase" power levels. But the media
itself might report how much energy is needed for the particular
media.

With the drawer closed, and no media present, there might be
no light. When the drawer opens and closes, the drive probably
doesn't have a way of detecting media is present. Turning on
the various lasers, one at a time, and scanning for a reflection,
would tell the drive something is there.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...g-cutaway3.JPG/640px-Dvd-burning-cutaway3.JPG

So at least with the DVD detection case, you'd see red light,
while with the CD case, you'd need to view the thing with
a video camera, to see a "bright" source present. Monochrome
cameras have the infrared filter removed, while color
cameras have an infrared filter in place (to prevent throwing
off the color viewed, when viewing in sunlight). Some security
cameras, the infrared filter "switches out" when going to
night mode.

I also have a kind of strip purchased from RadioShack for $5,
which is an infrared detector. It's good for verifying a signal
is coming from an infrared remote control. But not good enough
for detecting a CD laser. But a video camera or even a webcam
may help there.

Since it is looking for a reflection, there would be a laser light
source, some sort of lens to focus the photodetector, and a
photodetector to receive the light. Even if you see the lasers
at work, it doesn't mean the photodetector is getting anything.
Photodetectors can die too. Like, if you deliver a static discharge
to them. If the previous owner was a smoker, maybe over time
some optical surface could have crud deposited on it.

*******

In terms of media differences, DVD-R or DVD+/-RW would have
a spiral groove pressed into the disc. The laser tracks
that spiral groove, so as the drive is reading, the head assembly
is constantly on the move, tracking the groove.

DVDRAM media consists of concentric circles, like the concentric
tracks on a hard drive. So the tracking task for the drive is
quite different (it still needs to track, if the media is off-center).
I've never owned any DVDRAM media, so don't know a thing about them.
I have two DVDRAM drives here (LG GH22 and GH24 series), and the
icon in WinXP changes when media is detected. With no media present,
they're identified as DVDRAM capable drives.

If you pull DVD-VR media from a "video recorder" device, the format
may not be recognized properly by WinXP. So when doing your tests,
start with a blank and see if a blank is recognized as a blank.

Things like the free Nero InfoTool can display information
about inserted media - that's assuming media is being detected
at all. The InfoTool also displays the capabilities the drive
claims to have. InfoTool was written by a separate developer,
and at one time, the tool was distributed from the developer's
web site as well. I think currently you could download it off
some Nero FTP site if you wanted a copy. It's treated as a
utility.

For example, this drive is not DVDRAM capable. The "Disc" tab
in the bar, is where you get info on freshly loaded media (like
get the media tag off a blank piece of media). The InfoTool graphics
keep changing, and this is a particularly old version.

http://screenshots.en.sftcdn.net/en/scrn/22000/22234/nero-infotool-1.jpg

Paul
 
B

Bob F

Bob said:
I have a used DVD RW drive that behaves strangly. It works fine for
reading DVDs and CDs and writes CDs fine. It shows in "Computer" as
"DVD RAM drive" when no disk is inserted. Upon inserting a CD or DVD
R disk, it goes to displaying as "CD drive". I can drop files to be
written to the drive into it as long as it does not have a DVD R disk
inserted into it. Insert a CD, fine. Insert a DVD, and I get an error
msg "Windows encountered a problem when try to copy this folder".
Without a DVD inserted, it accepts the files fine, and displays the
write file option. Insert a DVD, and the write option goes away.
Insert a CD - everything is fine.
Is this just a bad drive?

I tried burning using Imgburn, and it works fine. This seems to be a problem
with the built into XP burning software. I do remember running into it before,
now that I got it figured out.
 
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B

Bob F

Paul said:
Install this.

"Image Mastering API v2.0 (IMAPIv2.0) for Windows XP (KB932716)"

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=17073

I guess I never even think about people who aren't using
third-party burner software (like the free Imgburn). But you can
add to the built-in Windows jazz if you want.

Paul

I was using the windows function because I was trying to test his drive on a
newly assembled test PC which didn't have the extra software loaded, and I had
forgotten the XP problems with DVDs. Does this API actually make the Windows
Explorer handle DVDs properly, or is additional software still needed? Do
programs like Imgburn install this or just add the functionality themselves?
 
P

Paul

Bob said:
I was using the windows function because I was trying to test his drive on a
newly assembled test PC which didn't have the extra software loaded, and I had
forgotten the XP problems with DVDs. Does this API actually make the Windows
Explorer handle DVDs properly, or is additional software still needed? Do
programs like Imgburn install this or just add the functionality themselves?

It should extend the built-in CD function to cover DVDs.

*******

"IMAPI is the optical burning engine in Windows products.
Version 2 of IMAPI will extend Windows Vista support for
DVD media, to Windows XP and to Windows Server 2003.

Microsoft has learned that some OEMs are incurring sizable
support costs that are associated with having multiple optical
burn engines that are installed on customer systems. Therefore,
some OEMs will require ISVs to migrate to IMAPIv2.0 in order to
reduce the number of burn engines that are shipped. IMAPIv2.0
will enable ISVs to use only one set of APIs for optical burning
that includes DVD burning capabilities for the following operating systems:

* Windows Vista
* Windows XP
* Windows Server 2003"

*******

Adding a program like Imgburn, covers a situation where you
download a bootable ISO9660 file from the Internet (.iso), then
wish to create a bootable CD/DVD. Imgburn can do that. Most
of my burns, are burns of that type (I have a stack of Linux
LiveCD distros here).

The built-in burner, you can drag and drop a folder of stuff
to be burned on the disc. Like a "Send To" function. But the
built-in doesn't cover every possible scenario.

When I wanted to burn a dual layer DVD with video content on it,
Imgburn was able to tell me the layer break was in the wrong
place. So I could go back to a DVD authoring tool and fix it.

But if you need a basic "folder backup" function, the Windows
built-in can do that for you. Since I've *never ever* used
the built-in Windows optical disc functions, I'm actually
the wrong person to answer detailed questions about it. I've
always used third-party burning software. I'm careful
to buy retail drives with a CD in the drive box with software
on it, so I had a burner. But now that Imgburn is free and
available, I can buy an OEM drive and use Imgburn with it. And
never need to know about Windows built-in.

I have the above KB installed though, for the sake of
completeness. If I ever get around to testing the built-in
function, I'm ready :)

*******

An article like this, will give you some terminology. This
article needs to be updated, to capture the improvements
added by that IMAPI2 installation (KB932716). The article
as written, covers the CD-only version of WinXP.

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/features/ultimate_cddvd_burning_guide?page=0,0

HTH,
Paul
 
B

Bob F

Paul said:
It should extend the built-in CD function to cover DVDs.

I tried adding the API to the test PC. It still does not write to DVDs using
windows explorer. No change that I can see.
 
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P

Paul

Bob said:
Yes. And again. No effect.

OK, I wasn't finding any references to doing this,
so I broke down and read the Wikipedia article :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMAPI

"Windows refers to discs created using IMAPI as
Mastered burns in contrast to the term, Live File System
which implies packet writing and does not use IMAPI."

So I guess that means the update I was so excited about,
is half a solution. It doesn't look like it'll handle
a folder.

I found a program which claims to use the IMAPI V2 API
and it supports folders, but a scan on Virustotal wasn't
completely clean. By virtue of the program calling
the IMAPI V2 API, it's detected as "suspicious activity".

There could be some other programs which use IMAPI V2,
but by the end of the day, why not just use the burning
engine that comes with the burner program (like whatever
Imgburn is doing) ?

I was wrong, and it turns out this package for WinXP
is virtually useless... Like adding chrome hubcaps
to a rusty car.

Paul
 

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