Overclocking Qs

[OldGezzer]

I remember when I over clocked my 8800 in the old Altair. Yup, blew up like
cherry bomb it did!

 

[Fishface]

But you guys only seem to overclock your CPU. What about the rest of the
system?
What about making your drives faster and bigger? My 1998-vintage P2/300
had a 6 GB ATA33. My new box has a 40 GB ATA100.

Yep, swapped those parts out somewhere along the line, too. The expense
was spread-out. Hate to tell you, but that 40 GB drive they give you is about
a generation behind in terms of performance. And the upgrade charge alone
is more than the cost of buying and installing the new drive. Probably void your
warranty to do that, though.

What about that old 10Mbps NIC? My new one has a 100Mbps.

Built into most new motherboards, or under $20 for a PCI card.

And that old 4MB Velocity video. Minimal gaming capability ... useless by
today's standards. Any new system today has better video (even if you were
to cheap-out with the Intel on-board video).

Haven't really been much into gaming in the past. The old card isn't much
worse than onboard video. That is, neither is fast enough to play games
decently.

And the 2x CDRW? Now I have 48x.

Put one of those in, too. About fifty bucks a couple years ago.

After a few years, just about everything in the box is obsolete. (Even the
case style becomes passe!)

Old power supplies may not be enough to run modern hardware. And don't
forget that new little square P4 ATX2 connector. I replaced mine with a
top-shelf unit, and then took it out for my new system...

So if I were to upgrade and upgrade and upgrade year by year, I'd be
replacing (almost) everything anyway.

Yeah, pretty much. For a high end system, I believe I can build one for
a lot less than you can buy a comparable performing machine. Of course,
my time is worth nothing, and my yard could use some work... Anyway,
glad you found something that works for you. So have I.

 

[Overlord]

But you guys only seem to overclock your CPU. What about the rest of the
system?

Have you overclocked your ram settings?
What about your TCP/IP settings?
Cable modem?

What about making your drives faster and bigger? My 1998-vintage P2/300 had
a 6 GB ATA33. My new box has a 40 GB ATA100.

15000rpm SCSI drives guy. I'm looking for a good 20-40gig to put in
my 6 year old's computer tho. I'm afraid a 40gig ATA100 is nothing to
brag about.... At one time, yes.

What about that old 10Mbps NIC? My new one has a 100Mbps.

Modern motherboards have onboard gigabit NICs. That's 1000Mbps.
Have you offloaded LAN processing from the CPU to the processor on the
NIC? Else it sits and watches the CPU juggle your game and your
connection.

And that old 4MB Velocity video. Minimal gaming capability ... useless by
today's standards. Any new system today has better video (even if you were
to cheap-out with the Intel on-board video).

True enough. If ya shop around and take a close look at the chips,
some of the onboard video is not too shabby. They're not really
modern. They generally aren't 8x speed. They steal system memory for
textures. Many of the dual CPU motherboards have onboard video but
they don't have AGP slots so you're never going to upgrade the video
using the mb.
Besides, with recent video drivers it takes all of a minute to find
the frequency tab, overclock, test, and lock in the changes.
Hmmm Velocity.... used to have an old STB Velocity 4400 AGP card.
Think it had 16meg on it....

And the 2x CDRW? Now I have 48x.

After a few years, just about everything in the box is obsolete. (Even the
case style becomes passe!)

So if I were to upgrade and upgrade and upgrade year by year, I'd be
replacing (almost) everything anyway.

Ya end up with a lot of parts. Luckily {sic} I have an older son and
a younger son. Everything gets recycled. Everyone is happy when dad
upgrades.

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[David Maynard]

But you guys only seem to overclock your CPU. What about the rest of the
system?

The problem is you are making judgments based on rumor.

What about making your drives faster and bigger? My 1998-vintage P2/300 had a
6 GB ATA33. My new box has a 40 GB ATA100.

What about that old 10Mbps NIC? My new one has a 100Mbps.

And that old 4MB Velocity video. Minimal gaming capability ... useless by
today's standards. Any new system today has better video (even if you were to
cheap-out with the Intel on-board video).

And the 2x CDRW? Now I have 48x.

People capable of, and familiar with, overclocking usually upgrade those
components as they need them and they don't have to wait for a whole new
computer to get a 40 gig drive, or a RAID setup, or a better gaming card, or a
52x CD-RW, or whatever.

After a few years, just about everything in the box is obsolete. (Even the
case style becomes passe!)

So if I were to upgrade and upgrade and upgrade year by year, I'd be
replacing (almost) everything anyway.

The point is they upgrade when they want and with what they want without having
to wait for a 'new box' and compromising with what the manufacturer thinks is
the 'right' combination.

There's nothing wrong with buying pre assembled computers, and it's the best
solution for the typical PC user, but don't be so quick to presume that people
who know what they're doing don't know what they're doing.

And for those who don't initially know what they're doing it can be a valuable
learning experience, if one is so inclined and willing to put in the effort.

 

[127.0.0.1]

Did me some good, and saved me some cash. I bought the cheapest P4C Intel
offers, a 2.4 ghz, and an inexpensive pair of 256-meg ram sticks rated at
200 mhz.

The cpu is now running at 3.3 ghz, faster than any stock P4, and the memory
is at 220 mhz with tighter timings than the default for even more bandwidth.

The system pegs every benchmark and is perfectly stable in every torture
test I can throw at it, looping Prime95 and MemTest86 all night without
errors.

The video card is a cheapo Radeon 9500, modded with a drop of conductive
paint and a bios flash to a full-fledged 9700 and overclocked to faster than
a retail Pro that cost almost three times as much.

I bought the motherboard, cpu and ram for less than Intel wanted for a 3.2g
P4 cpu alone, and my setup is faster. With a cable connection and a case
full of quick drives, it doesn't lag in any category.

Do I notice the speed? Sure I do.

I can crank up the eye candy to the max and get super-smooth framerates in
the most demanding games. Working in Photoshop, burning a DVD, compiling a
database, I don't waste nearly as much time sitting around waiting for the
computer to complete its tasks.

As others have said, it is a hobby. To me, buying a PC someone else put
together and never touching it except to surf or compose e-mail is the real
waste.

But then, I also have a BMW and a Saab turbo parked out front in a land
where I'm not supposed to drive over 65 mph. It's just nice to know I can
occasionally blast around the backroads in a machine that responds instantly
with a real kick in the pants when I give it some juice.

Some people prefer Gateways and Toyotas because they are cheap and fairly
reliable. That's their choice and I respect it.

I have a Dell P4 2.4 on my desk at work. It gets the job done, but it's not
very exciting and everything takes longer than it does on my homemade
system.

That's why I overclock.

* Kudos...

-a|ex ":^)

 

[Fishface]

Who needs to over clock? Is it computer gamers?
I doubt that there are that many people overclocking
for molecular modeling or something.

Nobody needs to overclock. It is a hobby, it is an obsession.
It enables people to get more life from old hardware. It
enables people to get more value from their hard earned cash.
Overclocking is about efficiency. Production tolerances and
marketing BS result in hardware that is often capable of running
faster than spec. Those who do not wish to extract this extra
perfomance are free not to do so. But you're a smart guy, you
could have figured that out yourself. Besides, what else have all we
introverted, ugly people got to do? Yardwork?! Hell, I'm
married-- if my wife caught me dating, I'd probably never get any,
ever again!

 

[newtknight]

It turns out that the person who heads the support for our PCs and data
systems at work has done overclocking, as he sheepishly admitted. However,
he said you only got a little advantage out of it.

So over clocking is like trainspotting, or geocaching. Well if it works for
you go for it.

However, the questions remains why overclocking? Why not overrefrigeration.
Insulate your refrigerator, have fans blowing on the cooling coils, bootleg
refrigerants, tweak the components, and brag about keeping vanilla ice cream
in your refrigerator compartment. Or perhaps it would be to run your
refrigerator on the least wattage as possible.

What happened to all those people who use to endlessly tweak their stereo
sets in the 1960s. What will be the obsession of fiddling in the future?

In the year 2034, will there be a group alt.overexpress.genome and no one at
the least bit interested in computers?

Well most of the overclockers are good sports, and no I didn't notice the
cross-post when I did the original post..

Well I have to go work with my vacuum cleaner. I give it a little higher
voltage feed, and have replaced the blower fan with lighter weight titanium,
and the insides of the extensions and air conduits are coated for less
friction. I am going to win that vacuum cleaner competition at the next
meet.

Ed

 

[Hank]

Well I have to go work with my vacuum cleaner. I give it a little higher
voltage feed, and have replaced the blower fan with lighter weight titanium,
and the insides of the extensions and air conduits are coated for less
friction. I am going to win that vacuum cleaner competition at the next
meet.

Ed

That sounds impressive enough but may I make just one suggestion that might
save you some embarrassment in the future? With all that extra airflow and
pressure you'll be achieving where do you propose that it terminates at? The
stock dust bag??? LOL .... it would blow for sure!!! You best get back to
the drawing board fella.

Hank

 

[John]

It turns out that the person who heads the support for our PCs and data
systems at work has done overclocking, as he sheepishly admitted. However,
he said you only got a little advantage out of it.

The appeal is either buying a top of the line CPU and then squeezing
even more performance out of it to be the king of the hill. Or more
appealing - getting a $70 CPU that performs about on par with a $150
one or so. The best OCers are when you get dirt cheap chip that can
be OCed to a level where theres a fair amount of cost advantage with
minimum fuss - meaning no special cooling etc.

So over clocking is like trainspotting, or geocaching. Well if it works for
you go for it.

However, the questions remains why overclocking? Why not overrefrigeration.
Insulate your refrigerator, have fans blowing on the cooling coils, bootleg
refrigerants, tweak the components, and brag about keeping vanilla ice cream
in your refrigerator compartment. Or perhaps it would be to run your
refrigerator on the least wattage as possible.

You dont get any advantage that way. Now if you could tweak your
refrig to use less electricty by insulating resulting in cost savings
over the insulation and hassle sure it would be worth it.

What happened to all those people who use to endlessly tweak their stereo
sets in the 1960s. What will be the obsession of fiddling in the future?

They are still around. There are still audiophiles that buy zillion
dollar speakers and CD players and tube amps or some other expensive
amps.

 

[David Maynard]

It turns out that the person who heads the support for our PCs and data
systems at work has done overclocking, as he sheepishly admitted. However,
he said you only got a little advantage out of it.

I consider that the Celeron 566 I overclocked to 1020 MHz achieved more than "a
little advantage" but then I don't know how your 'tried-it-once' authority
defines "a little."

Overclocking is just like anything else: it takes some knowledge and the right
components to get the best results.

So over clocking is like trainspotting, or geocaching. Well if it works for
you go for it.

With my old 500 Mhz (overclocked from 300) system now running at 1.5 Gig, it does.

However, the questions remains why overclocking? Why not overrefrigeration.
Insulate your refrigerator, have fans blowing on the cooling coils, bootleg
refrigerants, tweak the components, and brag about keeping vanilla ice cream
in your refrigerator compartment. Or perhaps it would be to run your
refrigerator on the least wattage as possible.

If you come up with a practical and inexpensive way to accomplish a significant
benefit then by all means share. That's what we do with overclocking.

What happened to all those people who use to endlessly tweak their stereo
sets in the 1960s.

I must have missed that. What was being 'endlessly tweaked'? And that's not just
idle curiosity as I still have my 60's Harmon Kardon receiver, Panasonic 7 inch
reel-to-reel tape deck, and Craig 8-track recorder.

What will be the obsession of fiddling in the future?

Whatever can be fiddled with.

In the year 2034, will there be a group alt.overexpress.genome and no one at
the least bit interested in computers?

Maybe we'll finally have the flying cars we were predicted to have by now in
those 50's and 60's 'City of the Future' shows.

Well most of the overclockers are good sports, and no I didn't notice the
cross-post when I did the original post..

Well I have to go work with my vacuum cleaner. I give it a little higher
voltage feed, and have replaced the blower fan with lighter weight titanium,
and the insides of the extensions and air conduits are coated for less
friction. I am going to win that vacuum cleaner competition at the next
meet.

The difference between your 'humorous example' and overclocking is that
experienced overclockers generally know what they're doing and what results to
expect.

It depends on the system. Overclocking used to involve a bit of expertise but
people have gotten lazy with built in overclocking features so that if they're
not there they say it's 'not possible.'

For example, overclocking the old slot-1 celeron 300 involved taping a pin so
the motherboard was 'fooled' into thinking it wanted to run on the 100 MHz FSB,
which took it from 300 MHz to 450. Taping, or jumpering, other pins could
increase the CPU voltage. Then Abit, and others, added BIOS features to set
those via the keyboard and everyone could do it.

Those same pin modifying techniques can work on any motherboard if it has the
FSB capability and the right processor.

 

[Fishface]

But does it do any good? I'm told that you need to gain 30% in
speed before the user notices it. And that's 30% total processing
speed, not just 30% CPU speed. Can you overclock your drives
and your internet to keep up?

If you feel your computer is fast enough, and you don't mind buying
a new one when it isn't, and you don't mind paying top dollar for that
performance, or if you prefer to do other things with your time, there
is absolutely no reason to mess with overclocking.

I bought a motherboard in 1998, put it into a standard ATX case, and
started with a Celeron 300 overclocked to 450 MHz. In a couple
years I put a Pentium III 600e in the same board and clocked it to 800.
In a couple more years I plugged-in a Celeron 1.1A on a Slot-T and
run it at 1.46 GHz. What would have been the cost of that extra free
performance? Quite a bit. How much did I save by not buying a whole
new box twice? Even more.

 

[Dave M]

most dells will not oc due to locked bios. I have heard of people who
replaced bios chip and then used MB bios to do it but never tried it myself.

 

[OldGezzer]

I think your vacuum cleaner sucks. Or at least I hope it does.

 

[Overlord]

It turns out that the person who heads the support for our PCs and data
systems at work has done overclocking, as he sheepishly admitted. However,
he said you only got a little advantage out of it.

So over clocking is like trainspotting, or geocaching. Well if it works for
you go for it.

However, the questions remains why overclocking? Why not overrefrigeration.
Insulate your refrigerator, have fans blowing on the cooling coils, bootleg
refrigerants, tweak the components, and brag about keeping vanilla ice cream
in your refrigerator compartment. Or perhaps it would be to run your
refrigerator on the least wattage as possible.

What happened to all those people who use to endlessly tweak their stereo
sets in the 1960s. What will be the obsession of fiddling in the future?

In the year 2034, will there be a group alt.overexpress.genome and no one at
the least bit interested in computers?

Well most of the overclockers are good sports, and no I didn't notice the
cross-post when I did the original post..

Well I have to go work with my vacuum cleaner. I give it a little higher
voltage feed, and have replaced the blower fan with lighter weight titanium,
and the insides of the extensions and air conduits are coated for less
friction. I am going to win that vacuum cleaner competition at the next
meet.

Sorry dude, for those higher RPMs you need those liquid bearings.

And tell me you at least tweaked the inlet throat for tighter
tolerances between the fan blade and the housing (hell everyone was
doing that Last year!)

And watch that voltage feed! You go over 150 volts and you'll lose
your amatueur status and get bumped into the next vacuum class.
You'll end up at the bottom of the division if you don't have a
supercharger (and you know what they cost!).
I'd go with the larger capacitor specifically for the 0 to 30psi
competition myself.

You're also aware that over 30psi you'll be disqualified if you don't
have a fiberglass or at least nylon dust bag. Sad, but after the
tragedy at last year's competition.....

I've never had all that much luck with the racing slicks. I still do
smoke 'em in the parking lot before competition tho!
Are you one of those experimenting with 4 wheel steering?

The titanium is a nice touch but too brittle for me. You hit that
nitrous and those blades are at the mercy of physics. I hope your
crew in the pit can do a quick changeout before the gravel
competition.
I understand they have moved the stands further back this year....

I'd say more but you probably get all the Vacuum Power magazines like
I do.

Look for me in the modified class. We're using an onboard high
amperage oscillator to change the juice to 300 Hertz to power this
motor (rewound it with 8 gauge Litz wire; it's a screamer!).
Our entry is candy apple red with 10 coats of lacquer.

Good luck! and as they say in Power Vacuuming;
"EAT MY DUST!"

Ed

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[Darth Joules]

The best analogy I can come with is from the world of automobiles.
How many times have you seen on your street hatch-backs, family
saloons, coupes, etc that have received the "hot-rod" treatment from
one degree to another. Who hasn't seen the film "The Fast And The
Furios"?!?!

These boy-racers (and girls) take an otherwise mundane, say,
hatch-back car and with some tweaking, purchase of specialist parts,
modded body parts, and many visits to their garage; the result is
their own personnalized hefty made-over hot-hatch on steriods. BUT
not all "rods" are the same. Some are very much budget, home-grown
jobs.....where as others are an all out no-price-is-too-high
extravaganza of chrome, nitros, ceramic brakes and more besides. And
this "hobby" has been getting a stronger and stronger following since
it's beginning in the 1950's.

Overclocking PCs is very much in the same vain. To simplify, if you
stick a nitro into a hatch-back it'll go much faster than intended by
the manufacturers, but you've got a good chance of blowing up the
engine in doing so. Same goes for overclocking PCs....go too fast and
the CPU will burn out. Think of overclocking as "hot rodding" a PC.
And recently with modding PCs as a newer addition to the culture, just
like with modern "hot rods" if it goes fast it should look good too.

There's always a beginning, never an end.


Darth Joules

 

[David Maynard]

The best analogy I can come with is from the world of automobiles.
How many times have you seen on your street hatch-backs, family
saloons, coupes, etc that have received the "hot-rod" treatment from
one degree to another. Who hasn't seen the film "The Fast And The
Furios"?!?!

These boy-racers (and girls) take an otherwise mundane, say,
hatch-back car and with some tweaking, purchase of specialist parts,
modded body parts, and many visits to their garage; the result is
their own personnalized hefty made-over hot-hatch on steriods. BUT
not all "rods" are the same. Some are very much budget, home-grown
jobs.....where as others are an all out no-price-is-too-high
extravaganza of chrome, nitros, ceramic brakes and more besides. And
this "hobby" has been getting a stronger and stronger following since
it's beginning in the 1950's.

Overclocking PCs is very much in the same vain.

Freudian slip?

To simplify, if you
stick a nitro into a hatch-back it'll go much faster than intended by
the manufacturers, but you've got a good chance of blowing up the
engine in doing so. Same goes for overclocking PCs....go too fast and
the CPU will burn out.

The analogy was good from a motivational standpoint but a technical comparing
between mechanical and electrical systems doesn't necessarily hold. There's no
inertial or frictional loads in electrical systems, for example.

Run a mechanical motor too fast, regardless of the power, and it'll fly apart. A
microprocessor won't.

 

[~misfit~]

Darth Joules wrote:
Run a mechanical motor too fast, regardless of the power, and it'll fly apart. A
microprocessor won't.

No, it'll 'fry' apart.

 

[David Maynard]

apart. A



No, it'll 'fry' apart.

Processor speed alone will not 'fry' it.

If you overvolt it in an attempt to reach higher speeds you can damage it from
the overvolting but that's not because of 'speed'.

 

[~misfit~]

Processor speed alone will not 'fry' it.

If you overvolt it in an attempt to reach higher speeds you can damage it from
the overvolting but that's not because of 'speed'.

I know, I know. It was a poor attempt at a pun.

 

[Ed Medlin]

Overclocking PCs is very much in the same vain.

Freudian slip?

LOL.........David, David.............hehehe......I missed that
completely....


Ed