O.T. Can't logon to the Internet:

P

Paul

Sorry Paul, I must not have caught that message. Please
bear in mind I've been staring at this computer for many
hours trying to work with it.

For whatever reason(Network delay)? the 8200 went back to
logging on normally with the Internet automatically signing
on and no warning that my computer was at risk or the firewall
turned off.

I used the Resource CD to install (2) updates that it said my computer
needed when I loaded the disk. There were more options that I could
have loaded but I wasn't sure about them so I played it safe and only
loaded the two that pop-ed up when I opened the CD program.

I checked afterwards and the (2) question marks are still there.

Robert

Two choices.

1. Use msinfo32.exe to get some information about
the device in question.

I tried to post a picture here, but it's pretty hard
to give you a link without some distracting advertising on it.
This shows you what to look for.

http://oi39.tinypic.com/1z4joxt.jpg

( http://i39.tinypic.com/1z4joxt.gif )

You can use Start : Run : msinfo32.exe
to run the program and get the information.

*******

2. Or take the side off the computer and
look at the PCI card.

Paul
 
M

magineer02

Referencing the msinfo32.exe you said, "that there was a way but he won't use it". I took that to mean that you thought it too difficult for me to attempt. So I didn't.

In any case, the 8200 now logs on normally and the Internet automatically signs on as it should. Also, I found my Santa Cruz - Turtle Beach CD with the Audio controller.

I installed it into the 8200 and checked the device manager afterward and it's clean!! There's only one last thing. I seem to remember seeing that the system restore was set to max. Should it be that high or should I lower it?

Anything else?

Otherwise, I want to thank everyone that has been patient with me and has helped fix my computer. I really appreciate all your good advice and taking the time to explain things.

Thanks,
Robert
 
P

Paul

Referencing the msinfo32.exe you said, "that there was a way but he won't use it". I took that to mean that you thought it too difficult for me to attempt. So I didn't.

In any case, the 8200 now logs on normally and the Internet automatically signs on as it should. Also, I found my Santa Cruz - Turtle Beach CD with the Audio controller.

I installed it into the 8200 and checked the device manager afterward and it's clean!! There's only one last thing. I seem to remember seeing that the system restore was set to max. Should it be that high or should I lower it?

Anything else?

Otherwise, I want to thank everyone that has been patient with me and has helped fix my computer. I really appreciate all your good advice and taking the time to explain things.

Thanks,
Robert

If the networking delay at startup becomes annoying, you
can use the "ngen executequeueditems" thing. I watch for the
symptoms on my machine, to come back after a Windows Update
monthly run. It's just a matter of finding a copy of ngen.exe
on the computer, to run that.

And good work, getting the drivers installed.

Paul
 
P

Paul

Bill said:
Only if you think you may need to go back really far in time, which in
itself, can be problematic. So no, you don't need to have it set to max.

I usually keep about a week or two's worth of restore points, just in case,
which reserves only a couple of gigabytes (2000 MB) or so in the System
Restore settings. And especially if you've now got your system working
right now, then what's the point of having the older restore points?
Speaking of which, if your system is working right right now, you should
make a fresh one.

The size of the restore points varies depending on what changes have been
made to your system, but over here I've found it typically averages around
200 MB (sometimes less) or so. That's why I suggested reserving 2000 MB or
so for the restore points. Whatever you free up gives you that much more
free disk space, too.

Having said all that, if you think there's ever a chance you may need to
restore to a point much further back in time, then think twice about it.
The "only" thing you lose is a lot of disk space if you keep it at max.

I used to have my System Restore set to 3GB.

But I also do regular backups of one sort or another. System Restore
is nice, but backups cover the possibility of hardware failures. Like
the C: drive that only lasted a year.

I have backups all over the place. (Sorta like a guy
dropping towels in the bathroom :) )

Paul
 
M

magineer02

Thanks, I appreciate that but I couldn't have
done it without your help and everyone else s (yes,
I read all the posts).

I'll keep an eye out for the network delay and and
copy paste your instructions for future reference.

I've also made restore points and set the disk usage
for restore points at 6% (halfway).

Thanks again for all your help,
Robert
 
M

magineer02

I agree, besides System restore I was thinking of using a flash drive
for my external image backup. I do have a 1TB external backup but I use
that for my Dell 8500 and don't want to mix the systems.

I think after reading Paul's post I'll change my System Restore setting
to 3%. I seem to recall previously on the 8200 where the System Restore was eating up all the memory on the HD because it was set to 12%.


Robert
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

I agree, besides System restore I was thinking of using a flash drive
for my external image backup.


How big a flash drive? How big is the drive you want to image?

You can use a flash drive if you want to, but a flash drive that's big
enough for most people would be very expensive. An external hard drive
that's big enough would be much less expensive, and just as good
(perhaps better, since it might last longer than a flash drive).
 
P

Paul

Bill said:
Maybe, but I think the jury is still out on this (re: the lifetime issue,
not the cost issue).

Most SSDs use "wear leveling" to help in that regard, since continous writes
to the same area can and do shorten its life. But outside of that, one
might expect the SSD to last longer, since its all solid state. However,
that assumption assumes there's no siginificant gate leakage over time, and
that's an assumption which may not hold (over several years). Perhaps some
else here has more info on it.

But we don't know what kind of Flash drive it is. It's
probably a pen drive of some sort. The reliability there
could be brand specific.

Paul
 
M

magineer02

The flash drive is a SanDisk Cruzer Glide USB
Flash Drive 32GB and the 8200 HD is about 132GB.


Thanks,
Robert
 
P

Paul

The flash drive is a SanDisk Cruzer Glide USB
Flash Drive 32GB and the 8200 HD is about 132GB.


Thanks,
Robert

The reviews on that one, aren't that good actually.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA12K0NF9221

This is one of the ones I got this year. While it has a USB3
interface, I use it strictly with the USB2 ports on my
computer (it works with both). I don't have any USB3 ports
or USB3 cards. This pen drive is more of a match for USB2,
as when connected to USB3 it doesn't go that much faster.
I can get 35MB/sec on reads with this thing. Still, for $20,
it was pretty good. Compared to some of the other stuff sitting
next to it, in the big box store I bought it at.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820191433

And there are some very nice pen drives, with quad channel
controller, that run a lot faster. Around $99 will give you
a pen drive with awesome benchmarks.

Ounce for ounce, a hard drive is cheaper. The same $99, will buy
you a lot more hard drive space. Anywhere from 1TB to 2TB.

Paul
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

p.s. the HD is something like 89% free.


So you already have a flash drive that's big enough? OK, then go ahead
and use it.

But 32GB isn't very big, and at some time in the not very distant
future, you'll probably need to buy something bigger.
 
M

magineer02

Understood; one last question if I may. Eventually,
my Seagate 1TB External HD is going to fill up. So
do I start deleting backups and system images or do
I just buy another external HD?

What do you guys do?

Thanks,
Robert
 
P

Paul

Understood; one last question if I may. Eventually,
my Seagate 1TB External HD is going to fill up. So
do I start deleting backups and system images or do
I just buy another external HD?

What do you guys do?

Thanks,
Robert

If you're a home user like us, you're probably
not all that organized. And you'll forget to do the
backups, before you run out of disk space :)

It you're a paid IT person, who does nothing
but backups, the boss will make you use "best
practice". Some "pattern" which everyone in the
industry uses, whatever that is.

So I'll just make one up.

*******

You can use a variable density method.

Let's take my 20GB C: and my 1TB drive as an
example. I have room for 50 full backups.
Now, say I adopt the following pattern.
I back up every day. I keep one backup
at the end of the week. I keep four weekly
backups until the end of the month. I keep one
of those as a monthly backup. I keep the monthly
backups for a year. At the end of a year, I recycle
the monthly ones, and keep just one of them (say Dec)
as my yearly backup. That's about 23 rotating
backups, and an accumulation of one per year after
that. In 27 years time, (2040), I've used up
my 50 storage slots.

....
2010 Yearly \
2011 Yearly \__ These accumulate
2012 Yearly / Yearly
Jan monthly \
Feb monthly \
Mar monthly \
.... \
Nov monthly \
Week 1 (weekly) \___ These rotate
Week 2 (weekly) / Daily, weekly, monthly
Week 3 (weekly) /
Week 4 (weekly) /
Mon /
Tues /
Wed /
.... /
Sun /

So later, if today is Wednesday, and I lost a file
or ruined my registry, I could restore from the Tuesday
file. The density is very high, in the near term, because
I place the most value on the things I've done recently.

Whereas, a file I edited a year ago, I probably don't
need daily resolution in my archiving. Instead of keeping
365 backups, I keep just one of those for future consideration.
That is balancing the odds I'll never need to access the
yearly at all, versus needing to check back to see if I
have a copy.

I have needed to go back that far. One experiment I was
doing, I needed to go back two years, to find a clean
enough WinXP image, for the experiment I was doing. More
recent backups had the problem in them, and couldn't be
used. But I normally, never need to go back that far.
Most of the time, yesterday's backup is the one I need.

*******

To do the chart and pattern, you almost need a calendar program,
to tell you which file to toss, which file to keep and
re-label, and so on. It's very confusing!

Now, in addition to that, you need both software
redundancy and hardware redundancy. I can
combine both concepts, in a less than ideal way.
I can do two backups a day. I do an Acronis one,
with the 23 rotating backup pattern above, to one
hard drive. I can do a Macrium Reflect one, to a
second hard drive, having its own 23 rotating backups
made with Macrium. If a backup hard drive fails, I
still have my backups on the other drive (like a RAID 1
mirror in a sense).

If I find I go to do a restoration, and my Macrium
software is somehow broken, I can take the second
drive, and try to restore the Acronis backup I made.
Between the two brands of software, one of them is
bound to work.

See how complicated this is ? You almost
need a backup software, that incorporates best practice
in its scheduler, and it tells you what to do.
If you keep track of this with paper, you're
sure to screw up the pattern.

Some people keep a yearly or two, in their
safety deposit box. Someone with significant
banking records say, might do that. You might
occasionally make a DVD out of the most valuable
files, for later.

So that's a scheme I just made up for your amusement.
IT people have some kind of "pattern" they use, which
balances cost and storage space, versus the needs
of the users. If the users decide "monthlies forever"
is the way to go, I'll be using up my 50 storage
slots a lot faster.

My own backups are event based. My hard drive is
failing (SMART statistics look bad), I make a full image,
and store that somewhere. Two years from now, I realize
that file is obsolete or not worth much, and overwrite
with some other backup. Some backups are made, because
I need insurance for an experiment, and I leave the backup
there (lazy), and it comes in handy months later. That's
how a home user thinks. In a "not organized" way. My
backup density is erratic at best.

Enjoy,
Paul
 
M

magineer02

Lots of good information.

I couldn't find how to create backups
or creating a system image on the 8200
and read that only XP Professional has
this capability.


Also, I recently tried running update
on the 8200 and was taking forever
network delay?). I searched and found
(3) ngen.exe files.

I opened the command prompt and typed:

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319\ngen.exe executequeueditems

and it came back as command as not recognizable.

Robert
 
P

Paul

Lots of good information.

I couldn't find how to create backups
or creating a system image on the 8200
and read that only XP Professional has
this capability.


Also, I recently tried running update
on the 8200 and was taking forever
network delay?). I searched and found
(3) ngen.exe files.

I opened the command prompt and typed:

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319\ngen.exe executequeueditems

and it came back as command as not recognizable.

Robert

I tried your command here, and it ran just fine. Mine
returned "All compilation targets are up to date".

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319\ngen.exe executequeueditems

Try navigating to the folder in question, and see if
the ngen.exe file is there ? Maybe the file doesn't
exist or something.

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319

*******

Bill says to try a third party backup.

Macrium Reflect Free is available from the lower left corner here.

http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx

Windows XP comes with NTBackup. I've run the backup
as a test, but never tried doing a restore from it.
So I don't know the details of what you use for boot
media if restoring to a blank disk. I do have a
BartPE CD, with a NTBackup 5 plugin, but that's cheating.
It took me quite a few tries, to get good at making
BartPE stuff (that was good enough to actually use).
And since I have Macrium and other tools, I haven't
really needed to rely on that stuff at all. My BartPE,
is for if I'm visiting someone who needs recovery
from their ntbackup.

I don't really know if this would work in an emergency.

http://oi42.tinypic.com/15n1vz8.jpg

( http://i42.tinypic.com/15n1vz8.gif )

Paul
 
M

magineer02

I'll check out Bills recommendations after I resolve
all the issues.

I did navigate to the file and checked it before
entering it in the command prompt and it was there.

The only difference I can think of is that my
command prompt isn't just a C:\_ it has

C\Documents and Settings\My Name>_

Could this be the problem and how do I remove all
the appendages or find a simple command prompt?

Thanks,
Robert
 
P

Paul

I'll check out Bills recommendations after I resolve
all the issues.

I did navigate to the file and checked it before
entering it in the command prompt and it was there.

The only difference I can think of is that my
command prompt isn't just a C:\_ it has

C\Documents and Settings\My Name>_

Could this be the problem and how do I remove all
the appendages or find a simple command prompt?

Thanks,
Robert

That's not an issue. That is how mine starts.

If you want to navigate to C:\, you can use

cd \

as a command in the Command Prompt window. You can also
say things like

cd Windows

to go to the next level down. Or

cd ..

to go up a level. The "change directory" command
has all sorts of nifty options.

*******

That affects the current working directory (data directory),
as well as potentially affecting the execution path if the
executable happens to be in that directory. I think
the current working data directory, is in the execution path
as well. The execution path can be edited as an environment
variable, and some software installers will "add" their
directory to the execution path.

NGEN is not in the execution path, which is why I gave that
long example as a means to execute it. I wrote the command
this way on my machine, so the computer would find it. After
verifying the file was actually in that directory.

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319\ngen.exe executequeueditems

If the path variable had C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319
added to it, the command could have been shortened to just the ngen.exe
part.

I don't know why yours is not working.

*******

In this example, the user is getting a "not recognized" error,
because it's still a %PATH% issue. Perhaps ngen.exe is executing
and some dependency it needs is not working (different from
how it works on my system here). This is just an illustration
of a user debugging a script problem, and messing around
by editing the %PATH% environment variable, until his problem
is solved.

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/...recognized-as-an-internal-or-external-command

About the only thing I can suggest, is the Aaron Stebner .net tester,
which tests that .net installations are able to execute a test program.
I don't expect this covers every situation, so it may not actually
complain about your installation. That's why I'm not really
expecting this to be upset or anything.

netfx_setupverifier_new

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/astebner/archive/2008/10/13/8999004.aspx

This is the link to the Skydrive ZIP package with the
netfx_setupverifier_new test program inside. It gives
a small dialog window, with a pulldown menu for the various
versions of .net. You select a version, then ask the tool
to test it. I don't really think this will shine any light
on your problem, but you're welcome to try. It will likely
"pass" your setup and not complain. Maybe some .dll the
ngen.exe program needs, is missing or something. Pre-compilation
of a .net assembly may still be carried out, as a part of
running this test, but I'm not sure ngen.exe is used for
that process each time. I tend to think of ngen.exe
is something that "sits off to the side" of normal
activities. It could be busted, and you wouldn't
otherwise notice, because all the important stuff
would still work.

http://cid-27e6a35d1a492af7.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/Blog|_Tools/netfx|_setupverifier|_new.zip

HTH,
Paul
 
M

micky

Would the safest thing for him to do, Paul, be to just go into Control
Panel, and select System, Hardware, Device Manager, and then go to the
yellow exclamation point item, and right click on it and find the option
there (and only there) to install an updated driver - and then insert his
CD? Rather than just inserting the CD and trying to install everything?
Just wondering....

BTW, pink is the microphone input, and blue is the line input, at least as I
recall. (I don't know what the yellow is for, and am too lazy to google it
(he can do that :)

One of them is the speaker/headphone output but nobody knows which
one.
 
M

magineer02

I tried running update again with no luck. Also, the 8200
has a yellow triangle with a question mark on the bottom
right hand side of the screen from time to time. I tried holding
the mouse over it and clicking it to see what it was but neither
worked.

I checked device manager and it was all good.

I searched again for ngen.exe, this is what I have:

C:\WINDOWS\ Prefetch executequeueditems

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v1.1.4322\ngen.exe executequeueditems

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0.50727\ngen.exe executequeueditems

C:\WINDOWS\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319\ngen.exe executequeueditems

I open up the command prompt and did the first one:

It came back with this:

Display the ngen state
ngen executeQueuedItems [1:2:3]
Executes queued complilation jobs.
If priority is not specified all queued compilation jobs are done.
If priority is specified all queued compilation jobs with greater or equal
prority than the specified are done. <short form: eqi>
negen queue [pause: continue: status]
Allows the user to pause and continue the NGen Service, and to
query its status.

Scenarios:
/Debug - Generate images that can be that can be used under a debugger
/Profile - Generate images that can be that can be used under a profiler
- Generate the minimal number of native images
required by this scenario


Config:
/ExConFig:<path to exe> - Use the configuration of the specified

/AppBase:<path to appbase directory> - Use the specified directory as
the appbase


Thoughts/Suggestions
Robert
 

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