Is there something different about first "Administrative Account"

[Don J]

Readimg various posts I get the distinct impression that there is something
special about the first administrator account that is formed at the time of
theoriginal install, that no other administrator accounts formed after it
enjoys. Yet there is no way of recognizing the first administrator account
from those formed after it. One post claims that formation of a second
account, of any type, causes the first administrative account to be alway in
"Safe Mode". But some experimetation shows that this is not the true. Can
anybody explain whether and how the first "Administrative Account" differs
from those formed after it, and if so, how it is recognized as diifferent
once other "Administrative Account" are formed.

Don J


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[Gerry]

Don

http://www.microsoft.com/resources/...proddocs/en-us/usercpl_overview.mspx?mfr=true

--



Hope this helps.

Gerry
~~~~
FCA
Stourport, England
Enquire, plan and execute
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

[Jim]

Readimg various posts I get the distinct impression that there is
something special about the first administrator account that is formed at
the time of theoriginal install, that no other administrator accounts
formed after it enjoys. Yet there is no way of recognizing the first
administrator account from those formed after it. One post claims that
formation of a second account, of any type, causes the first
administrative account to be alway in "Safe Mode". But some
experimetation shows that this is not the true. Can anybody explain
whether and how the first "Administrative Account" differs from those
formed after it, and if so, how it is recognized as diifferent once other
"Administrative Account" are formed.

Don J

Yes there is. The one which is created during installation cannot be
deleted. As far as I can tell, that is the only difference. XP decides
which one is the built in account be inspecting the SID.

Jim

 

[Shenan Stanley]

Readimg various posts I get the distinct impression that there is
something special about the first administrator account that is
formed at the time of theoriginal install, that no other
administrator accounts formed after it enjoys. Yet there is no way
of recognizing the first administrator account from those formed
after it. One post claims that formation of a second account, of
any type, causes the first administrative account to be alway in
"Safe Mode". But some experimetation shows that this is not the
true. Can anybody explain whether and how the first
"Administrative Account" differs from those formed after it, and if
so, how it is recognized as diifferent once other "Administrative
Account" are formed.

How about sticking with the same thread and not starting a new one every
other day? heh

You are misunderstanding something or trying to understand something that
isn't there... It's simple.

- In the default Windows XP Home installation - the Administror account
(built in admin account) is (without hacking) only visible in Safe Mode. If
you see it other than in Safe Mode in Windows XP Home - that install has
been messed with.
- In the default Windows XP Professional (and supersets) installation - if
you create another account and have not changed it so the original
administrator account is 'visible' on the Welcome screen - suddenly you
cannot get to it without changing the setting OR pressing CTRL+ALT+DEL twice
at the welcome screen. If you see the "Administrator" user on the Welcome
Screen logon - that install has been messed with.

http://windowsxp.mvps.org/admins.htm

Is there anything *special* about the built-in administrator? Yes and No.
An administrative level account is an administrative level account.
However - the built-in account cannot be deleted.

It is 'hidden' more often than not by default because it is hoped that would
prevent the less-informed from getting into trouble easily. It is - as I
described in one of the almost identical threads of yours referenced above -
nothing more than security by obscurity and is all but worthless. In fact -
I would say it *is* worthless to hide said account - because anyone who
wants in has done the research and is getting in.

It might prevent the people who bought their computer at Best Buy/Circuit
City/other large chain or online retailer from really messing things up *if*
the store created an account for the user (like "owner") that was a limited
account - but most of the time that is not done. In fact - the majority of
time a machine coming from such a place can be 'broken into' by simply
loggin in as the built-in "administrator" account with NO PASSWORD. Not to
mention - most of the time the "owner" user is a administrative level
account.

 

[Guest]

Why do you continue to have the same paranoia about the default Admin
account, it's simply created by the system, no special powers or abilty
compared to any other admin account created by the user. admin is admin,
that's it!
let go of the paranoia!

 

[Don J]

How come when I install a new copy of "XP Home" and enter the 'Win'
Administrative Account" there is nothing in it that indicates it is in "Safe
Mode"? There was a Post that indicated that the "Normal Administrator
Account" would only be converted to "Safe Mode" after creation of a second
account. But this is also incorrect!

Don J

 

[Don J]

To you it's paranoia. To me its a matter of thoroughly understanding what I
am working with. Shenan Stanley says that "In the default Windows XP Home
installation - the Administror account (built in admin account) is (without
hacking) only visible in Safe Mode". I don't see this phenomina!

Perhaps you can work with something that you don't thoroughly understand.
But sorry I can't!

Don J

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[Don J]

I wish to move all my information from an "Administrative" to a "Limted"
account. When I define and then enter a "Limited" account, the account is
empty. How do I do it?

Don J

 

[Shenan Stanley]

Readimg various posts I get the distinct impression that there is
something special about the first administrator account that is
formed at the time of theoriginal install, that no other
administrator accounts formed after it enjoys. Yet there is no way
of recognizing the first administrator account from those formed
after it. One post claims that formation of a second account, of
any type, causes the first administrative account to be alway in
"Safe Mode". But some experimetation shows that this is not the
true. Can anybody explain whether and how the first
"Administrative Account" differs from those formed after it, and if
so, how it is recognized as diifferent once other "Administrative
Account" are formed.

How about sticking with the same thread and not starting a new one
every other day? heh

You are misunderstanding something or trying to understand
something that isn't there... It's simple.

- In the default Windows XP Home installation - the Administror
account (built in admin account) is (without hacking) only visible
in Safe Mode. If you see it other than in Safe Mode in Windows XP
Home - that install has been messed with.
- In the default Windows XP Professional (and supersets)
installation - if you create another account and have not changed
it so the original administrator account is 'visible' on the
Welcome screen - suddenly you cannot get to it without changing the
setting OR pressing CTRL+ALT+DEL twice at the welcome screen. If
you see the "Administrator" user on the Welcome Screen logon - that
install has been messed with.
http://windowsxp.mvps.org/admins.htm

Is there anything *special* about the built-in administrator? Yes
and No. An administrative level account is an administrative level
account. However - the built-in account cannot be deleted.

It is 'hidden' more often than not by default because it is hoped
that would prevent the less-informed from getting into trouble
easily. It is - as I described in one of the almost identical
threads of yours referenced above - nothing more than security by
obscurity and is all but worthless. In fact - I would say it *is*
worthless to hide said account - because anyone who wants in has
done the research and is getting in.
It might prevent the people who bought their computer at Best
Buy/Circuit City/other large chain or online retailer from really
messing things up *if* the store created an account for the user
(like "owner") that was a limited account - but most of the time
that is not done. In fact - the majority of time a machine coming
from such a place can be 'broken into' by simply loggin in as the
built-in "administrator" account with NO PASSWORD. Not to mention
- most of the time the "owner" user is a administrative level
account.

How come when I install a new copy of "XP Home" and enter the 'Win'
Administrative Account" there is nothing in it that indicates it is
in "Safe Mode"? There was a Post that indicated that the "Normal
Administrator Account" would only be converted to "Safe Mode" after
creation of a second account. But this is also incorrect!

When you install Windows XP Home Edition from an unmodified installation
media - you have to create a user during the setup. That user can be named
ANYTHING except "administrator" or "guest" (I am sure there are other
reserved names - but those two are a definite.)

You say you enter the 'Win Administrator' account <- is that the name of the
user? That is not "Administrator", it contains the word "Administrator",
but that means nothing... I can have the usernames "One Administrator",
"Two Administrator" ---> but that does not make them the same name as the
built in "administrator". They have all the same powers if I put them in
the local "administrators" (notice the S on the end) group.

That is not the built in administrator. You are mistaken. Incorrect.
Wrong.
Or you are wrong about the fact you are using an unmodified installation
media to install Windows XP Home Edition.

Whatever 'post' you are referring to about 'converted to safe mode only
after another account is created' would not be true.

Let me try again to explain what I have already explained to you...

- The built-in administrative account in Windows XP Home can *only* be
accessed through safe mode given a default/unmodified installation/install.
That does *not* mean you cannot log on as *an* administrator - it means you
cannot log on as the built-in administrator unless you boot into safe mode
in Windows XP Home Edition only.

- The built-in administrative account in Windows XP Professional (and
supersets) will remain visible on the Welcome screen until another
administrative account is created - then it will be hidden from the Welcome
screen, but can be added back using several methods or logged into by
pressing CTRL+ALT+DEL twice at the welcome screen and using the classic
logon method.

- The built in administrative level account can be disabled in some cases,
can be easily renamed - but cannot be deleted.

- The built in administrative account has all the rights/privileges as any
other administrative account you create.

- Windows XP Home Edition is not the same as Windows XP Professional.
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition and Windows XP Media Center Edition are based
off Windows XP Professional with some things added and other things removed.
Windows XP x64 is essentially the 64 bit version of Windows XP Professional.
What that means is what is true in Windows XP Home Edition may not be true
in Windows XP Professional (or the superset of versions 'based' off
Professional.)

If you *think* you are logging in as the built-in administrator in Windows
XP Home Edition in normal mode and you know 100% (and can prove 100%) that
your Windows XP Home Installation is as it would be from an unmodified
installation and remained unmodified after the installation - you are
incorrect and can prove this to yourself by putting a file on the desktop,
booting into safe mode and logging in as the user named "administrator" (in
a default setup - unmodified - that would be the username of the built-in
administrator) and seeing that the file is *not* on the desktop.

Interesting aside...
User Accounts That You Create During Setup Are Administrator Account Types
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/293834

Want something from Microsoft that tells you that the true "administrator"
account is only accessible in Windows XP Home Edition (unmodified of course)
from Safe Mode? Here you are: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/290109

This all gets changed with Windows Vista - which is beyond the scope of this
particular subject - but just to blow your mind if you want to read up:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/942956 (The changes to the built-in
administrator account in Windows Vista)

 

[Guest]

I understand wanting to know more, it seems you keep asking the same
questions just worded differently, either you don't want to accept what your
being told, or it appears you have a lack of trust, obviously MS does tend to
do things that are not exactly trustworthy (ie putting security updates on
critical list and they keep you from connecting to the internet, till they
are fixed) forcing you to download WGA, those are just a few.

Using the build in (default) admin account for internet sufring is not a
good idea, so the idea is to leave the built in account alone (create a
strong password), and create an account that gives you the freedom to manage
your computer, without allowing unauthorized access to your pc, via the net.

as it was said before, create a backup admin account just in case, and maybe
rename the backup to something not obviously seen as having admin authority,
as a safety measure.