HP Tri-Color Cartridges

[Burtron]

Hello-
I had just settled on buying a Canon i860 for it's separate black inks
- One for photo & one for text. Of course, the separare color tanks
are nice, too. But today I went to Staples and Officemax, where I got
into a discussion with Salesmen (Not company reps) at both stores
about the i860 & HP 7960. When I told them about how much I liked the
performance of the HP 7960, but not the way they integrate their
colors into one cartridge, because it is waste & also more expensive -
They both said that all the colors are used up nearly the same - no
matter what is printed - And therefore, no ink is wasted, because the
colors are somehow used to blend with other colors to make different
colors. These guys must be getting a kickback from HP, or something
along those lines. Anyway, one of them said that he would not order
the Canon from Dell, because Dell somehow fixes the printer to only
operate with Dell inks - Not Canon. If anyone has any thoughts on this
please comment. Thanks

 

[Cerridwen]

Hello-
I had just settled on buying a Canon i860 for it's separate black inks
- One for photo & one for text. Of course, the separare color tanks
are nice, too. But today I went to Staples and Officemax, where I got
into a discussion with Salesmen (Not company reps) at both stores
about the i860 & HP 7960. When I told them about how much I liked the
performance of the HP 7960, but not the way they integrate their
colors into one cartridge, because it is waste & also more expensive -
They both said that all the colors are used up nearly the same - no
matter what is printed - And therefore, no ink is wasted, because the
colors are somehow used to blend with other colors to make different
colors. These guys must be getting a kickback from HP, or something
along those lines. Anyway, one of them said that he would not order
the Canon from Dell, because Dell somehow fixes the printer to only
operate with Dell inks - Not Canon. If anyone has any thoughts on this
please comment. Thanks

To the best of my knowledge Dell printers are rebadged Lexmarks - they don't
sell Canons. IMNSHO, that rep doesn't know what he's talking about. Dell do
now, TTBOMK, manufacture ink. If they do brand carts, then it is Lexmark ink
in them.

 

[xNokia3390x]

They both said that all the colors are used up nearly the same - no
matter what is printed - And therefore, no ink is wasted, because the
colors are somehow used to blend with other colors to make different
colors. These guys must be getting a kickback from HP, or something

It all depends on your usage. Once you start using your printer, see if one
color runs out faster than the other. I'm still on my original cartridges
for my i560, and it seems like they're all being used pretty much equally.
So in the end, I really didn't need the printer. It's not saving me as much
money as I thought it would. But like I said, it all depends on your usage.
If you have to print letter heads with a red logo all the time, naturally
you'll use magenta faster.

along those lines. Anyway, one of them said that he would not order
the Canon from Dell, because Dell somehow fixes the printer to only
operate with Dell inks - Not Canon. If anyone has any thoughts on this
please comment. Thanks

I guess he doesn't know what he's talking about in that area...although Dell
does sell rebranded Lexmarks. I personally would never buy a Lexmark, nor
one that's a Lexmark rebranded. Dell should have gotten together with a
real manufacturer like HP or Canon IMO.

 

[Tony1that matters]

Hello-
I had just settled on buying a Canon i860 for it's separate black inks
the Canon from Dell, because Dell somehow fixes the printer to only
operate with Dell inks - Not Canon. If anyone has any thoughts on this
please comment. Thanks

That's round about the best laugh I've had all night. Selling - with spiffs
included - or a higher commission on selected items seems to be the mother
of all invention. I used to be - in another incarnation - a reseller for
Dell: I was amazed to see them take on Lexmark. The point is of course that
Canon or Epson don't need Dell to sell printers.
Separate ink tanks appear at first to be a great virtue: when however you
clean or rather prime notice that it does this for all colours and black.
That said quite a few of our users do order extra single cartridges - mainly
yellow and magenta so far. With the BCI-6 it tends to be light magenta.
It might be best to suggest of your sales hype - sorry type - that you
should never ask him how to get to the next town.
Tony

 

[J. Bronson]

When I had a HP, the yellow aways ran out before the others.

When they refilled it there would almost aways be about 1/4 of the
other colors left.

The same thing happens with the Canon. Only now I do not have to
replace the entire cartridge because the yellow is gone.

I guess it depends on what you print. Outdoors prints would naturally
have more yellows and greens.

It sound like they were trying to bad mouth the single cartridges
because of the costs of a tri color vs singles, and HP seldom use
single cartridges in thier machines.

Hp makes thier money on the ink after market sales. Canon printers
sell at a little higher price, but the ink is MUCH more reasonable.

One HP tri color cartridge will generally more than makes up the
cost difference.

 

[Timothy Lee]

Hello-
I had just settled on buying a Canon i860 for it's separate black inks
- One for photo & one for text. Of course, the separare color tanks
are nice, too. But today I went to Staples and Officemax, where I got
into a discussion with Salesmen (Not company reps) at both stores
about the i860 & HP 7960. When I told them about how much I liked the
performance of the HP 7960, but not the way they integrate their
colors into one cartridge, because it is waste & also more expensive -
They both said that all the colors are used up nearly the same - no
matter what is printed - And therefore, no ink is wasted, because the
colors are somehow used to blend with other colors to make different
colors.

Obviously it depends what is being printed but personally, after about
45,000 pages on a laser I noticed that my yellow and magenta were being
replaced about 2000 pages earlier than the blue.

 

[Tore Lund]

Hello-
I had just settled on buying a Canon i860 for it's separate black inks
- One for photo & one for text. [snip]

I snip at this point because I wonder what you are asking about. If you
are concerned that HP printers will spend ink unevenly from tricolor
cartridges to print black text, this is certainly not the case for many
of them. My 7762 uses the 56 cartridge only to print black text, and I
believe the same is true of the 7960. Naturally, this is only true when
you have a 56 cartridge in the printer.

 

[Larry]

I snip at this point because I wonder what you are asking about. If you
are concerned that HP printers will spend ink unevenly from tricolor
cartridges to print black text, this is certainly not the case for many
of them. My 7762 uses the 56 cartridge only to print black text, and I
believe the same is true of the 7960. Naturally, this is only true when
you have a 56 cartridge in the printer.

The 7760 is that way (only prints black text with #56). The problem lies
in printing text with ANY photo printer. They just aren't any good at
it.That #56 only holds a very little ink driving the per page cost sky
high. The problem is the same with ALL ink-jets. Per page cost is FAR
more than it is with a good laser (except for the ones you see on sale
at Staples/Office Max et al for $199 to $300, those (whether HP,
Lexmark, Qume, or other have toner carts that cost more than half the
price of the printer)

A cheap used laser printer is the way to go if your output is going to
be more than 10-15% text pages. Do some research on laser toner costs,
then do what I did, get a used (WORKING) laser printer that uses a 30 to
40 dollar toner cart.

The number 56 cartridge does a good job, but not for long. You can buy
6000 pages worth of laser toner (old reliable Panasonic Laser printer
bought used for $50) for the price of 1 and a half #56 cartridges.

Larry
Mystic

 

[Burtron]

The 7760 is that way (only prints black text with #56). The problem lies
in printing text with ANY photo printer. They just aren't any good at
it.That #56 only holds a very little ink driving the per page cost sky
high. The problem is the same with ALL ink-jets. Per page cost is FAR
more than it is with a good laser (except for the ones you see on sale
at Staples/Office Max et al for $199 to $300, those (whether HP,
Lexmark, Qume, or other have toner carts that cost more than half the
price of the printer)

A cheap used laser printer is the way to go if your output is going to
be more than 10-15% text pages. Do some research on laser toner costs,
then do what I did, get a used (WORKING) laser printer that uses a 30 to
40 dollar toner cart.

The number 56 cartridge does a good job, but not for long. You can buy
6000 pages worth of laser toner (old reliable Panasonic Laser printer
bought used for $50) for the price of 1 and a half #56 cartridges.

Larry
Mystic

Hello-
Sorry I may not have been clear enough with my question, which is
multi-faceted. Yes, right now, I want to get the best quality B&W
prints possible for my old family photos. But I also want to not waste
so much colored ink when printing color photos. I know that the HP
7960 produces excellent B&W photos, because I bought one and then took
it back because when you run out of one color, you've got to replace
the whole cartridge. I noticed just how much the ink was going down
looking at the graphic indicaters on the monitor while printing the
photos. It's also just the principle of the thing! So, I've decided to
buy the Canon i860 to see just how good it's B&W results are. That's
the best way to really find out. I can always return it with no
penalties if I buy it at Costco or Best Buy. I'm not sure about
Amazon. Think I'd have to pay for the shipping back if nothing is
wrong with it. But Costco is the best when it comes to returns. They
have a 6 month return policy on pc purchases. Anyway, I might just
keep the i860 for text, because I've read that it puts out very fast -
near laser quality text, & my old HP 880c ain't what it used to be.
Further, I'm thinking about also buying the new large format Canon
i9900, which will debute in May for $500. It's supposed to be all to
everything. It utilizes 8 color tanks, and the color & speed is
supposed to be also improved. Just wish they'd come out with standard
format (size) in the same printer. Thanks to all for the input.

 

[Burtron]

The 7760 is that way (only prints black text with #56). The problem lies
in printing text with ANY photo printer. They just aren't any good at
it.That #56 only holds a very little ink driving the per page cost sky
high. The problem is the same with ALL ink-jets. Per page cost is FAR
more than it is with a good laser (except for the ones you see on sale
at Staples/Office Max et al for $199 to $300, those (whether HP,
Lexmark, Qume, or other have toner carts that cost more than half the
price of the printer)

A cheap used laser printer is the way to go if your output is going to
be more than 10-15% text pages. Do some research on laser toner costs,
then do what I did, get a used (WORKING) laser printer that uses a 30 to
40 dollar toner cart.

The number 56 cartridge does a good job, but not for long. You can buy
6000 pages worth of laser toner (old reliable Panasonic Laser printer
bought used for $50) for the price of 1 and a half #56 cartridges.

Larry
Mystic

Larry-
I'm talking about B&W photos - not text. The Canon i860 has a larger
tank just for printing text, and also a smaller dedicated black ink
for photos. The results are supposed to be near laser quality. So, if
I were going to buy a printer for good quality text, Id go with the
i860. And for now, it looks like lasers are not the best for printing
photos period. Although, I have read where archaelogists and the like
are using the lasers for work, but these things are way too expensive,
and are up a notch from regular lasers. hence ,the higher price.
Perhaps as time goes by, they'll improve in performance and price. Who
knows?

 

[Tore Lund]

I know that the HP
7960 produces excellent B&W photos, because I bought one and then took
it back because when you run out of one color, you've got to replace
the whole cartridge.

Did you try the 7960 with the #56 cartridge? I forgot to say it
explicitly: #56 is black ONLY, so you never waste other colors when
writing black text with it.

Larry is right that using the #56 cartridge may be rather expensive if
you print a lot of text. But that is another issue, and it may not be
relevant in your case.

 

[Dick Ballard]

Hello-
I had just settled on buying a Canon i860 for it's separate black inks
- One for photo & one for text. Of course, the separare color tanks
are nice, too. But today I went to Staples and Officemax, where I got
into a discussion with Salesmen (Not company reps) at both stores
about the i860 & HP 7960. When I told them about how much I liked the
performance of the HP 7960, but not the way they integrate their
colors into one cartridge, because it is waste & also more expensive -
They both said that all the colors are used up nearly the same - no
matter what is printed - And therefore, no ink is wasted, because the
colors are somehow used to blend with other colors to make different
colors. These guys must be getting a kickback from HP, or something
along those lines. Anyway, one of them said that he would not order
the Canon from Dell, because Dell somehow fixes the printer to only
operate with Dell inks - Not Canon. If anyone has any thoughts on this
please comment. Thanks

My old Canon BJC-600e with separate ink cartridges (3 color + black)
uses the colors more or less equally over the long term. From one
purchase to the next, I never have more than one cycle of extra
cartridge(s). It probably is cheaper in the long run because the
replacement cycles "dovetail" so as to extend the average life of the
combination. But I'm guessing it is about a 10-15% improvement for the
average user. And it is more annoying because interruptions to replace
a cartridge occur more frequently - "Hey, I just replaced a tank, now
I have to do another one?"

Dick Ballard
(e-mail address removed)

 

[Burtron]

Did you try the 7960 with the #56 cartridge? I forgot to say it
explicitly: #56 is black ONLY, so you never waste other colors when
writing black text with it.

Larry is right that using the #56 cartridge may be rather expensive if
you print a lot of text. But that is another issue, and it may not be
relevant in your case.

Thanks for your response Tore-
Although the B&W ussue is a priority to me, I should have kept it out
of the post, because it seems to have caused confusion. The problem I
have with the 7960 and those like it is when it comes to printing a
color photo not all of the colors in the HP tri-cartridges are used at
the same rate - resulting in having to replace the whole color
cartridge. In other words, when the blue runs out first - There may be
1/4 to 1/2 or more of the other colors within that cartridge that will
have to be discarded. And I don't believe what the two sales reps said
about all of the colors being used up at the same time. Regards

 

[Burtron]

Did you try the 7960 with the #56 cartridge? I forgot to say it
explicitly: #56 is black ONLY, so you never waste other colors when
writing black text with it.

Larry is right that using the #56 cartridge may be rather expensive if
you print a lot of text. But that is another issue, and it may not be
relevant in your case.

Also, Tore & Larry-
Yes, when I had the 7960 I did use the #56 for text and the photo
black (Different shades of gray) for just B&W photos. Again, this was
not the main issue I had with the printer. It was the tri-color
cartridges when printing color photos. I don't mind the two separate
black cartridges at all. It's a real plus for the printer.

 

[Larry]

Thanks for your response Tore-
Although the B&W ussue is a priority to me, I should have kept it out
of the post, because it seems to have caused confusion. The problem I
have with the 7960 and those like it is when it comes to printing a
color photo not all of the colors in the HP tri-cartridges are used at
the same rate - resulting in having to replace the whole color
cartridge. In other words, when the blue runs out first - There may be
1/4 to 1/2 or more of the other colors within that cartridge that will
have to be discarded. And I don't believe what the two sales reps said
about all of the colors being used up at the same time. Regards

RULE TO LIVE BY!

Never believe what a sales rep tells you.

I find refilling the #57 and 58 Cartridges to be a snap.

You need to keep 3 (or is it 4) of each on hand though, and rotate
through them so the printer wont keep telling you the cartridges are
empty.

There is no "smart chip" in the carts for the Photosmart printers, but
there is a serial number and the printer remembers the last 3 or 4 used
so you need to number the carts and always use them in the correct
order.

There are other ways around this, but having more than 3 of each on hand
is the simplest way to handle it.

Keep in mind that NONE of them will last forever, and you will have to
replace cartridges once in a while.

ONLY USE INK FORMULATED FOR THE PRINTER!!!!

There is no such thing as "one size fits all".

I buy my ink from www.inksupply.com for Epson (I have 2) HP (I have 3)
and Canon (I have 3).

Larry
Mystic