[help] 1 cpu to rule them all

[Bill Mazlar]

The processor chips of most computers nowadays are somewhat overkill if
all you need to use it for are non-intensive tasks like word processing
and surfing the net. I'm interested in finding a way to have up to 5
multiple users collectively harness the power of only a single computer
to keep my hardware costs down. This would mean 1 cpu tower and input
devices: 5 monitors, 5 keyboards, and 5 mice. As image quality could
be a factor, I would probably opt for LCD screens with DVI rather than
CRT and also take advantage of energy savings. Each user must have an
independent desktop environment and of course, have access to the same
database on the hard drive(s) installed on the system.

With this setup, I could forgo the cost of purchasing a separate server
computer for storage purposes and costs for buying more
motherboards/processors than I would really need (though i suppose i
would need to buy a whole bunch of graphics cards).

I've searched the net far and wide but haven't found any products that
do what I am looking for. Does anyone know if this is even possible
with current hardware out there? Which platforms?

Thanks,

 

[peter]

Wouldnt you also need 5 hard drives to hold 5 operating systems and the appriate
drivers for the video cards??Especially since you wish each user to have an
independent desktop. Lets see 5 HD x100.00 plus 5 video Cards x 100.00 + 5
operating systemsx100.00= $1500.00 or the cost of 4 cheap systems.Thats not even
mentioning the individual programs/mice/keyboards or the fact of where you are
going to find a MOBO that will support 5 PCI video cards plus other PCI devices
you might wish to add.
peter

 

[Just Forget I Was Here]

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 23:18:47 +0000, Bill Mazlar wrote:

You might be interested in this news story:

"AMSTERDAM/LONDON (Reuters) - A pilot project in Africa that aims to
provide a single computer that can be used by four students simultaneously
has stumbled across one of the business world's basic facts of life."

"HP reckons the unique design -- in which four keyboards and monitors are
connected to a single central processing unit -- will save schools up to
60 percent of their ballooning computer costs."

http://www.reuters.co.uk/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=5634993

 

[Roy Culley]

http://h40058.www4.hp.com/products/desktops/441/prod_info.html

HP Multi-user 441 desktop solution

Proven Intel technology:

balancing value with proven desktop technology, the HP 441 desktop
solution utilises the Intel Celeron® and Pentium® 4 processors.

Linux Operating System:

increased reliability and enhanced security minimises maintenance of
the computer in the classroom.

Four-user configuration:

a single system with four concurrent user sessions maximises the
number of seats obtained from a fixed budget and reduces the total
cost of ownership (TCO) per seat.

 

[Abdullah Ramazanoglu]

Wouldnt you also need 5 hard drives to hold 5 operating systems

With Linux, no.
One OS for N concurrent, independent, discrete (local or remote),
secure, graphical user sessions.

BTW if ever one needs 5 OS'es (Linux or else) for some other reason,
then they can all be installed on a single drive (though they don't
run concurrently).

and the appriate drivers for the video cards??Especially since you
wish each user to have an independent desktop. Lets see 5 HD
x100.00 plus 5 video Cards x 100.00 + 5 operating systemsx100.00=
$1500.00 or the cost of 4 cheap systems.Thats not even mentioning
the individual programs/mice/keyboards or the fact of where you

With Linux, the licenses for OS and a whole fleet of apps will cost
zero (including VAT).

are going to find a MOBO that will support 5 PCI video cards plus
other PCI devices you might wish to add. peter

This is quite an interesting savvy idea. I had once played with it
lightly but dismissed it as I couldn't find an affordable solution
for multiple user interface hardware. Now that I'm aware --thanks
to other posters-- that such hardware solutions do exist, I think I
will have to reinvestigate the feasibility of such a solution at my
workplace. Handled properly, this could be next big thing since we
converted the workplace to Linux desktops.
..

 

[Abdullah Ramazanoglu]

Wouldnt you also need 5 hard drives to hold 5 operating systems

With Linux, no.
One OS for N concurrent, independent, discrete (local or remote),
secure, graphical user sessions.

BTW if ever one needs 5 OS'es (Linux or else) for some other reason,
then they can all be installed on a single drive (though they don't
run concurrently).

and the appriate drivers for the video cards??Especially since you
wish each user to have an independent desktop. Lets see 5 HD
x100.00 plus 5 video Cards x 100.00 + 5 operating systemsx100.00=
$1500.00 or the cost of 4 cheap systems.Thats not even mentioning
the individual programs/mice/keyboards or the fact of where you

With Linux, the licenses for OS and a whole fleet of apps will cost
zero (including VAT).

are going to find a MOBO that will support 5 PCI video cards plus
other PCI devices you might wish to add. peter

This is quite an interesting savvy idea. I had once played with it
lightly but dismissed it as I couldn't find an affordable solution
for multiple user interface hardware. Now that I'm aware --thanks
to other posters-- that such hardware solutions do exist, I think I
will have to reinvestigate the feasibility of such a solution at my
workplace. Handled properly, this could be next big thing since we
converted the workplace to Linux desktops.
..

 

[Guest]

So what's new. Client Server computing has been around since the beginning of time.

Get hold of a decent system, install an Open System, attach 'dumb' terminals.

Nothing new. Just that these days you might use a 'free' operating system like Linux intead of IBMs MVS or OS400 [and the equivalents from HP, Sun etc].

Back in the '70s large compaies could have hundreds of users sharing the same CPU. Today you could have 1,000s or 10,000s.

 

[Erik Funkenbusch]

The processor chips of most computers nowadays are somewhat overkill if
all you need to use it for are non-intensive tasks like word processing
and surfing the net. I'm interested in finding a way to have up to 5
multiple users collectively harness the power of only a single computer
to keep my hardware costs down. This would mean 1 cpu tower and input
devices: 5 monitors, 5 keyboards, and 5 mice. As image quality could
be a factor, I would probably opt for LCD screens with DVI rather than
CRT and also take advantage of energy savings. Each user must have an
independent desktop environment and of course, have access to the same
database on the hard drive(s) installed on the system.

I've seen several such systems as this over the years. The most recent is
a Linux based system found here:

http://translate.google.com/transla...=UTF-8&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools

Several years ago I saw similar systems built on Windows, though i've not
seen any recently.

 

[Nathan McNulty]

Not necessarily. Windows XP allows for multiple users to be connected to
the same machine at the same time under different profiles and each can
do tasks of their own. Also, there are video cards that support 3
monitors each and you could just get two PCI video cards that support 3
monitors each to handle 6 users at a time. As for the motherboard
controlling all of those input devices such as mice and keyboards, it is
possible to have multiple mice and keyboards in Windows XP. All that
needs to be done is to assign each one to a different hardware/user
profile. This will be similar to mainframe computers that support
multiple users at a time.

Nathan McNulty

Wouldnt you also need 5 hard drives to hold 5 operating systems and the appriate
drivers for the video cards??Especially since you wish each user to have an
independent desktop. Lets see 5 HD x100.00 plus 5 video Cards x 100.00 + 5
operating systemsx100.00= $1500.00 or the cost of 4 cheap systems.Thats not even
mentioning the individual programs/mice/keyboards or the fact of where you are
going to find a MOBO that will support 5 PCI video cards plus other PCI devices
you might wish to add.
peter

 

[Desi Cortez]

I've seen several such systems as this over the years. The most recent is
a Linux based system found here:

http://translate.google.com/transla...=UTF-8&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools

Several years ago I saw similar systems built on Windows, though i've not
seen any recently.

Are you people dense?

Of course there are multiuser Unix/Linux systems with graphics terminals
attached. That's how real computing was *done* in those days...

 

[Timberwoof]

The processor chips of most computers nowadays are somewhat overkill if
all you need to use it for are non-intensive tasks like word processing
and surfing the net. I'm interested in finding a way to have up to 5
multiple users collectively harness the power of only a single computer
to keep my hardware costs down. This would mean 1 cpu tower and input
devices: 5 monitors, 5 keyboards, and 5 mice. As image quality could
be a factor, I would probably opt for LCD screens with DVI rather than
CRT and also take advantage of energy savings. Each user must have an
independent desktop environment and of course, have access to the same
database on the hard drive(s) installed on the system.

With this setup, I could forgo the cost of purchasing a separate server
computer for storage purposes and costs for buying more
motherboards/processors than I would really need (though i suppose i
would need to buy a whole bunch of graphics cards).

I've searched the net far and wide but haven't found any products that
do what I am looking for. Does anyone know if this is even possible
with current hardware out there? Which platforms?

Thanks,

You could do it, but that's too hard.

Time was when that was a viable way to do things, but nowadays CPUs
really are cheap enough that every user can have his own. Go to eBay and
order a pallet of five Dell Optiplex 150 computers, load 'em up with
Linux, and away you go.

 

[Desi Cortez]

Time was when that was a viable way to do things, but nowadays CPUs
really are cheap enough that every user can have his own. Go to eBay and
order a pallet of five Dell Optiplex 150 computers, load 'em up with
Linux, and away you go.

Exactly.

I don't understand how this 4-user HP machine can be so 'cheap' when 4 high
end PCs today can be had for $150 ( www.pricewatch.com ) and monitors can
be bought for $50. So a 4 user system with PCs would cost $800 ( add in
educational discounts ).

Is HP giving away a server and 4 disk less workstations, or X terminals for
less than $800 ?

 

[Erik Funkenbusch]

Are you people dense?

Of course there are multiuser Unix/Linux systems with graphics terminals
attached. That's how real computing was *done* in those days...

Not the same thing. Those are terminals, which are small computers in
their own right (though often quite dumb ones). The OP is talking about
using a single PC and only hooking up multiple monitors, keyboards and
mice, not terminals.

 

[Desi Cortez]

Erik Funkenbusch wrote:

Not the same thing. Those are terminals, which are small computers in
their own right (though often quite dumb ones). The OP is talking about
using a single PC and only hooking up multiple monitors, keyboards and
mice, not terminals.

Ok, pardon me.

So you would use USB and daisy chain keyboards and then buy a video card for
each terminal?

So would you have to run a mouse, keyboard, terminal wire to each user? Or
is there a single cable that can carry all the information ?

 

[D.Currie]

What you'd save in one-time hardware costs, you'd lose in productivity. Once
user crashes the system and you've got everyone out of work until it gets
fixed.

Wouldnt you also need 5 hard drives to hold 5 operating systems and the appriate
drivers for the video cards??Especially since you wish each user to have an
independent desktop. Lets see 5 HD x100.00 plus 5 video Cards x 100.00 + 5
operating systemsx100.00= $1500.00 or the cost of 4 cheap systems.Thats not even
mentioning the individual programs/mice/keyboards or the fact of where you are
going to find a MOBO that will support 5 PCI video cards plus other PCI devices
you might wish to add.
peter

 

[Kenny S]

The solution is called BETWIN

Find information on my site: www.computerboom.net

you can download the manual here:
http://www.computerboom.net/download/demos/BeTwin2000XP_UM.pdf
and a demo here:

http://www.computerboom.net/download/demos/BeTwin2000XP_UM.pdf

you can purchase to product here:
http://www.thinsoftinc.com/purchase.php?affiliate=CEM

--

Hope this helps. Let us know.
_____________
Kenny S
http://www.computerboom.net
FREE programs and MORE!

---

 

[Kenny S]

sorry the link towards the DEMO is here:

http://www.computerboom.net/download/demos/betwin-ver1-15setup.exe

--

Hope this helps. Let us know.
_____________
Kenny S
http://www.computerboom.net
FREE programs and MORE!

---

 

[Robert E A Harvey]

I'm interested in finding a way to have up to 5
multiple users collectively harness the power of only a single computer
to keep my hardware costs down.

You might also want to consider a thin client solution. Use something
diskless like an Epia mother board or something like this:
http://www.semicom.co.uk/manufacturer/protech/pc_104/104_i613/em104_i613.html
http://www.dsl-ltd.co.uk/products/cpu1232spec.htm

then you run X as a display on the clients, and the applications on
the main machine. http://www.ltsp.org/

Thing is, you are re-inventing the history of computing. For years we
used to share CPUs, then they got very cheap. Somehwere in the
middle, people were selling graphics+keyboard cards so you could have
a 2nd user on one machine, but in the end the cost and complicaiton of
doing it wasn't worth it as the price of individual machines
plummetted

 

[michel]

so does windows 2000........
Terminal services is your friend, but it'll cost you money on licenses.

Michel

Not necessarily. Windows XP allows for multiple users to be connected to
the same machine at the same time under different profiles and each can
do tasks of their own. Also, there are video cards that support 3
monitors each and you could just get two PCI video cards that support 3
monitors each to handle 6 users at a time. As for the motherboard
controlling all of those input devices such as mice and keyboards, it is
possible to have multiple mice and keyboards in Windows XP. All that
needs to be done is to assign each one to a different hardware/user
profile. This will be similar to mainframe computers that support
multiple users at a time.

Nathan McNulty

 

[spike1]

peter wrote:

With Linux, no.
One OS for N concurrent, independent, discrete (local or remote),
secure, graphical user sessions.

BTW if ever one needs 5 OS'es (Linux or else) for some other reason,
then they can all be installed on a single drive (though they don't
run concurrently).

Though, they can if you've got enough horsepower, and run vmware.