Error on Samsung?

[Rod Speed]

louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace the
disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the drive?

It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short and
long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read error.
Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely.
This indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and
would very likely have caused increasing levels of additional
damage, had I kept the disk.

So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.

Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few
secors

1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could
also spread.

Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.

Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.

Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.

*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.

Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno



[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.

Which is what you always have to do (eliminate external influences)
before you point the drive out as the sole cause of the problems.

Not even possible in this case.

By checking Power Supply voltage levels, drive temperature
and shock or vibration, they are common causes for bad writes.
Easier said than done though.

Yep, in spades with just one bad.

Since you have only one bad sector it may have been a one off event.

Bloody unlikely to be anything else with just one.

What may need further investigation is the Hardware ECC
recovered count, whether that is normal for Samsung drives or not.

Its normal for Samsung drives.

44 million seems a bit high.

Nope. Mine all have values like that.

 

[JohnH]

louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace the
disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the
drive?
It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short and
long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read error.
Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely.
This indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and
would very likely have caused increasing levels of additional
damage, had I kept the disk.

So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.

Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few
secors

1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could
also spread.

Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.

Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.

Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.

*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.

Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno




[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.
How would I go about doing that?

Don't mind Folkert. He does not know what he is
talking about. He cannot interpret SMART data.

Neither can you.

What you have is a massive amount of marginal secorts.

Nope, just one.

So many in fact that the drive cannot report their number anymore.

Have fun explaining the pending sector data. And the reallocated event numbers.
And the fact that the other values are 0 100 100

Those Hardware ECC recovered numbers are normal for Samsung drives.

A few bad sectrrs could be due to vibration
or a problem with the PSU. This large number

There is no 'large number' of bad sectors.

is almost certaion due to a serious problem with the HDD itself.

Nope, hose Hardware ECC recovered numbers are normal for Samsung drives.

Incidentially finding out what caqused the bad sectors (if
it is an external cause) is only possible with reasonable
effort if it is a relatively low number that is increasing
steadily. If you have that, then you can swap components and
see whether the increaese stops. Personally I never had this,
but some pople had it due to a defective PSU.

Irrelevant in her case because there is just one bad sector.

 

[Arno Wagner]

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace the
disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the
drive?
It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short and
long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read error.
Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely.
This indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and
would very likely have caused increasing levels of additional
damage, had I kept the disk.

So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.

Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few
secors

1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could
also spread.

Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.

Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.

Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.

*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.

Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno




[snip]
You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.
How would I go about doing that?

Don't mind Folkert. He does not know what he is
talking about. He cannot interpret SMART data.

Neither can you.

Nope, just one.

Well, actually it is 11, but you are right, I confused this thread
with another current on. Sorry.

Still, a sector that the disk cannot correct by itself is a strong
warning sign.

BTW, the SMART sekf-test aborts on Ssmsung disks after the
first error found, so you cannot tell how serious the problem
is if the test aborts with an error.

Also for the SMART attributes, SAMSUNG is very optimistic. I
had a dying drive recently (dropped it) where all arrtibutes
indicated it was healthy, but it has numerous sectors that could
not even be written to anymore.

Arno

 

[JohnH]

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace
the disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the
drive?
It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short
and long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read
error. Also there were about 10 files that could not be read
completely. This indicates that the disk surface was actually
damaged and would very likely have caused increasing levels of
additional damage, had I kept the disk.

So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.

Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few
secors

1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could
also spread.

Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.

Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.

Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.

*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.

Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno




[snip]
You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.
How would I go about doing that?
Don't mind Folkert. He does not know what he is
talking about. He cannot interpret SMART data.

Neither can you.

Nope, just one.

Well, actually it is 11,

Nope, just one.

but you are right, I confused this thread with another current on. Sorry.

Yeah, thought you might have managed to mix those two up.

Still, a sector that the disk cannot correct by itself is a strong warning sign.

Nope. Drives dont transparently correct sectors which cant be
read at all. They only spare a sector like that when its written,
essentially so the user can attempt to read that sector repeatedly
with something and may be able to get some data back from it.

BTW, the SMART sekf-test aborts on Ssmsung disks
after the first error found, so you cannot tell how
serious the problem is if the test aborts with an error.

There is more than just the SMART self test that can be used.

Also for the SMART attributes, SAMSUNG is very optimistic.

Most drives are with the SMART attributes.

I had a dying drive recently (dropped it) where all
arrtibutes indicated it was healthy, but it has numerous
sectors that could not even be written to anymore.

Sure, and it isnt the only drive that does its SMART like that.

Essentially they dont see the drive as about to fail while ever
there are still spares that can be used to reallocate bad sectors.

With modern drives, I personally think that any reallocated sectors
are a cause for concern, because that shouldnt be happening when
you consider the basic physics except with drives like Maxtors which
appear to deliberately use marginal sectors and let them get reallocated
away early in the life of the drive with a write check forced for a number
of power cycles. I think thats an unsafe approach when some drives
can be used only very minimally for that many power cycles.

 

[Arno Wagner]

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace
the disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the
drive?
It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short
and long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read
error. Also there were about 10 files that could not be read
completely. This indicates that the disk surface was actually
damaged and would very likely have caused increasing levels of
additional damage, had I kept the disk.

So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.

Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few
secors

1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could
also spread.

Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.

Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.

Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.

*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.

Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno




[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.
How would I go about doing that?

Don't mind Folkert. He does not know what he is
talking about. He cannot interpret SMART data.

Neither can you.

What you have is a massive amount of marginal secorts.

Nope, just one.

Well, actually it is 11,

Nope, just one.

Yeah, thought you might have managed to mix those two up.

Sorry again.

Nope. Drives dont transparently correct sectors which cant be
read at all. They only spare a sector like that when its written,
essentially so the user can attempt to read that sector repeatedly
with something and may be able to get some data back from it.

There is more than just the SMART self test that can be used.

Most drives are with the SMART attributes.

Sure, and it isnt the only drive that does its SMART like that.

Essentially they dont see the drive as about to fail while ever
there are still spares that can be used to reallocate bad sectors.

Hmm. That would make sense. Morale: Don't trust the SMART status
and look at the attributes yourself.

With modern drives, I personally think that any reallocated sectors
are a cause for concern,

No question. I agree completely.

Arno

 

[Jon Arbuckle]

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace the
disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the drive?

It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short and long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read error.
Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely. This
indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and would very like-
ly have caused increasing levels of additional damage, had I kept the disk.

So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.

Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few secors

1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could also spread.

Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.

Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.

Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.

*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.

Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno


[snip]
You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.
How would I go about doing that?
Don't mind Folkert. He does not know what he is
talking about. He cannot interpret SMART data.

Neither can you.

Hey, how can you say that. Arnie is an expert. Arnie knows everything.
Have you no respect?

Well, actually it is 11,

Arnie is now on the line with God. God says 11.

but you are right, I confused this thread with another current on.

Yeah, right after you lectured :

"Fascinating on how you manage to be incompetent even at things that are
easy and quite obvious. And how you are resistant to actually checking things".

You were obviously practicing before the mirror and your mind unconsci-
ously made your fingers type the words and press send, right babblebot?
In other words, you're not to blame. It wasn't you.

Sorry.

You are apologizing to Roddles ?
Yeah, you're really losing it, babblebox.

Still, a sector that the disk cannot correct by itself is a strong
warning sign.

It *was* corrected, you blithering numbnut.

BTW, the SMART sekf-test aborts on Ssmsung disks after the
first error found, so you cannot tell how serious the problem
is if the test aborts with an error.

Pity that it was HUTIL that was run and the report text surely
indicates that more than 1 sector can be expected to be reported.

Also for the SMART attributes, SAMSUNG is very optimistic.

Bla bla bla, more posturing to try to mask your utter blundering.

I had a dying drive recently (dropped it) where all arrtibutes
indicated it was healthy, but it has numerous sectors that could
not even be written to anymore.

Which no doubt it has recorded in the S.M.A.R.T. attribute tables.
If not then that is not a question of being optimistic, that is being
totally wrong.

Of course the tables may well be on the platters and the drive
may have lost the ability to write there too.

 

[Jon Arbuckle]

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
"Arno Wagner" (e-mail address removed)> wrote in message> louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:
C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.
I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung.
Samsung came up with the same error.
The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.
Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace
the disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the drive?

It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short and long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read
error. Also there were about 10 files that could not be read
completely. This indicates that the disk surface was actually
damaged and would very likely have caused increasing levels of
additional damage, had I kept the disk.
So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.
I would advise you to replace the drive.
Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.
It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few secors
1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.
(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could also spread.
Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.
And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.
Yup, it may be.
If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.
Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.
BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.
*If* it is failing.
Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.
Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.
Arno


[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.
How would I go about doing that?

Don't mind Folkert. He does not know what he is
talking about. He cannot interpret SMART data.

Neither can you.

What you have is a massive amount of marginal secorts.

Nope, just one.
Well, actually it is 11,

Nope, just one.

Yeah, thought you might have managed to mix those two up.

Sorry again.

Arnie again apologizing to Rod Speed.
This is really Arnies day. He must be so proud of himself. Overjoyed even.

Arnie knew that. Arnie is an expert.

Arnie knew that too. Afterall, Arnie is an expert.
So Arnie can 'interpret' SMART data.
(He obviously can't read them but who cares about that then).

Actually, he made that up. A recent drive can always write to any sector
(as long as there are spares available).
Whether it can be read back is an entirely different matter.
The only time(s) a sector can not be written is when the track that the
sector is on can not be accessed because of failing servo or when all the
spares have been used up and the target sector is simply non existent.
That will surely be noticeable by the S.M.A.R.T. stats.

Right, so he made that up.

Hmm. That would make sense.

Aadmitting defeat, again? You can't be, you are an EXPERT.

Morale: Don't trust the SMART status and look at the attributes yourself.

What, you learned that just now? You can't be, you are an EXPERT !!!
YOU CAN INTERPRET SMART DATA.

No question.

Utter nonsense.
IBM/Hitachi specify that a bad sector can be written if you simply interrupt
the power. For the sake of performance that sector may be reassigned rather
than tested on the next write even though it may be completely usable.

I agree completely.

You have always been clueless. You always will be.

Arno

Pity IBM/Hitachi drives allow bad sectors to occur when the power is pulled.

 

[Horst Franke]

In news:[email protected] Jon Arbuckle typed:
Hi Jon, and what do You think on NINE quoting levels
without reflecting any of those old statement?
Pls reread the usenet directions!
Horst

 

[Rod Speed]

In news:[email protected] Jon Arbuckle typed:

Hi Jon, and what do You think on NINE quoting levels
without reflecting any of those old statement?

He clearly 'thinks' thats fine, horstshit.

Pls reread the usenet directions!

No such animal, hostshit.

 

[John Turco]

In news:[email protected] Jon Arbuckle typed:

Hi Jon, and what do You think on NINE quoting levels
without reflecting any of those old statement?
Pls reread the usenet directions!
Horst

Hello, Horst:

"Jon Arbuckle" is really Folkert Rienstra, circumventing Arno Wagner's
killfile. Perhaps, you might need a scorecard, to keep up with this
colorful newsgroup of ours? <g>

By the way, nice to see you back! Now, please post something helpful,
okay? ;-)


Cordially,
John Turco <[email protected]>

 

[Arno Wagner]

Hello, Horst:

"Jon Arbuckle" is really Folkert Rienstra, circumventing Arno Wagner's
killfile.

I don't quite understand why he bothers. Unless he changes his
writing "style" as well, it takes me about 5 seconds to recognize
him.

And of course every time he does that, he looses face big time.

(Explanation for Folkert: You show that you need me to see your
answer, i.e. that you really care what I think.)

Arno

 

[louise]

louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be created
because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick tests. Then
I went ahead and went into the deeper level of checking. I am getting
an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung came up
with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace the disk?
Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the drive?
It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a Samsung
that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short and long
SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read error.
Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely.
This indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and
would very likely have caused increasing levels of additional
damage, had I kept the disk.
So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.
Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few secors
1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could go away if you
overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do that), it could
also spread.
Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.
Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.
Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.
*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.
Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno


[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.

Which is what you always have to do (eliminate external influences)
before you point the drive out as the sole cause of the problems.

How would I go about doing that?

By checking Power Supply voltage levels, drive temperature and shock or vi-
bration, they are common causes for bad writes. Easier said than done though.

Since you have only one bad sector it may have been a one off event.

What may need further investigation is the Hardware ECC recovered count,
whether that is normal for Samsung drives or not. 44 million seems a bit high.

TIA

Louise

I do use Everest and check temps from time to time - hard
drive temp almost never above 40 - same for mb and cpu ok

I use a UPS that supposedly regulates power supply -
checking the logs, there doesn't seem to have been any gross
problem

The drive is in a Sonata case which has little rubber
grommet shock absorbers - again, nothing happened that I
know of....

How would I investigate the ECC recovered count?

TIA

Louise

 

[Rod Speed]

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace
the disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the
drive?
It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short
and long SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read
error. Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely.
This indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and
would very likely have caused increasing levels of additional
damage, had I kept the disk.
So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.
Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few
secors
1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could also spread.
Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.
Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.
Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.
*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.
Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno


[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.

Which is what you always have to do (eliminate external influences)
before you point the drive out as the sole cause of the problems.

How would I go about doing that?

By checking Power Supply voltage levels, drive temperature and shock
or vi- bration, they are common causes for bad writes. Easier said than
done though. Since you have only one bad sector it may have been a one off event.

What may need further investigation is the Hardware ECC recovered
count, whether that is normal for Samsung drives or not. 44 million seems a
bit high.

TIA

Louise

I do use Everest and check temps from time to time - hard
drive temp almost never above 40 - same for mb and cpu ok

I use a UPS that supposedly regulates power supply -
checking the logs, there doesn't seem to have been any gross
problem

The drive is in a Sonata case which has little rubber
grommet shock absorbers - again, nothing happened that I
know of....

How would I investigate the ECC recovered count?

No need, all Samsungs have that.

http://www.google.com/search?as_q=samsung&as_epq=Hardware+ECC+Recovered
http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=samsung+"Hardware+ECC+Recovered"&qt_s=Search

 

[Folkert Rienstra]

"louise" (e-mail address removed)> wrote in message Folkert Rienstra wrote:
"Arno Wagner" (e-mail address removed)> wrote in message louise wrote:
Samsung Spinpoint 160mg about a year old with heavy use.

I went to run Norton Ghost and was told the image couldn't be
created because of a disk error.
I ran chkdsk /f
Norton ran fine

I ran the Samsung Diagnostics and all was fine in the quick
tests. Then I went ahead and went into the deeper level of
checking. I am getting an error:

C:2665 H:1 S:863 Error: a media error is detected.

I ran chkdsk /f again and then the deep level Samsung. Samsung
came up with the same error.

The disk appears fine in its day to day activities.

Should I worry about this? Do I need to run out and replace
the disk? Will I suddenly have no disk?

TIA

Louise
Here is a printout of the report. Do I need to replace the drive?

It is a bit hard to say. I recently had the same behaviour on a
Samsung that was dropped. Basically everything was fine, but the short
and long SMART self-tests (long is "surface scan") failed with a read
error. Also there were about 10 files that could not be read completely.
This indicates that the disk surface was actually damaged and
would very likely have caused increasing levels of additional
damage, had I kept the disk.
So you let Samsung bear the cost of your mistake. Nice one.

I would advise you to replace the drive.
Why, she didn't drop it, like you did.

It might be a problem that is at the moment isolated to a few secors
1 'secor', babblemouth. Just one.

(hence seems fine in normal operation). While this problem could
go away if you overwrite the disk (use a disk-clear utility to do
that), it could also spread.
Yup. But not necessarily because of mechanical failure.

And it may be the first symptom of a more serious problem.
Yup, it may be.

If you decide to keep the disk, do regular backup and be prepared
for a catastrophic failure.
Actually, try and findout what caused the bad sector and fix
that, and maybe your catastrophic failure will never happen.

BTW, Samsung should replace this disk under waranty.
*If* it is failing.

Read errors in the surface scan should be enough for that.
Nope, not if the drive isn't failing.

Arno

[snip]

You suggest finding out what caused the bad sector.

Which is what you always have to do (eliminate external influences)
before you point the drive out as the sole cause of the problems.

How would I go about doing that?

By checking Power Supply voltage levels, drive temperature and shock
or vi- bration, they are common causes for bad writes. Easier said than
done though. Since you have only one bad sector it may have been a one off event.

What may need further investigation is the Hardware ECC recovered
count, whether that is normal for Samsung drives or not. 44 million seems a
bit high.
TIA

Louise

I do use Everest and check temps from time to time - hard
drive temp almost never above 40 - same for mb and cpu ok

I use a UPS that supposedly regulates power supply -
checking the logs, there doesn't seem to have been any gross problem

The drive is in a Sonata case which has little rubber grommet shock
absorbers - again, nothing happened that I know of....

So it looks like your drive is just gracefully aging and the appearance of
the bad sector just shows that marginal sectors -that were good enough at
the time that the drive left the factory- are now nearing and passing the
point of where they would have been reassigned in the factory LLF process
*IF* it had been new. This is what the automatic sparing process is for.
Apparently your bad sector hasn't been read for a while so it went beyond
the point where it could have been automatically recovered and replaced.
But that's not even sure since it did eventually get reassigned so supposedly
it did eventually read successfully during one of your tests with Hutil.

By comparing several reports and check if it is out of line.

No need, all Samsungs have that.

http://www.google.com/search?as_q=samsung&as_epq=Hardware+ECC+Recovered
http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=samsung+"Hardware+ECC+Recovered"&qt_s=Search

Well, since these drives appear to be working constantly at the edge of what's
possible already, it isn't really surprising that one of the lesser sectors goes
overboard once in a while. Occasional surface scans should prevent them from
becoming unrecoverable and from failure of not being automatically replaced.

 

[Folkert Rienstra]

I don't quite understand why he bothers. Unless he changes his
writing "style" as well, it takes me about 5 seconds to recognize him.

Esay to claim.
Yet you have responded to each and every Rod Speed sockpuppet post and
he never hides his writing style either.
You even apologized to him several times last week for your blunders invol-
ving others. Can't bring yourself to apologize to the people involved yet
apologizes to nota bene the one person you hate so much that he is in your
killfile. That is so pathetic really.

And of course every time he does that, he looses face big time.

In your wildest dreams only, babblebot.

(Explanation for Folkert: You show that you need me to see your answer,

No, really?
Gosh, I've never thought of it that way. How perceptive of you.

i.e. that you really care what I think.)

Which is obviously a bad thing.

Thanks for that superfluous proof that you don't care what we think and
that you only babble constantly for your own self esteem and self image.
Arnie babbles, therefor Arnie exists.

It's so juvenile and rather pathetic behaviour to filter out the people that
confront you with your blunderings so your self esteem and selfimage don't
get hurt so you can happily keep blabbering and blundering and think that
you are still on top of the heap.

 

[Horst Franke]

In news:[email protected] John Turco typed:

"Jon Arbuckle" is really Folkert Rienstra, circumventing Arno Wagner's
killfile. Perhaps, you might need a scorecard, to keep up with this
colorful newsgroup of ours? <g>

Sorry John, I'm not looking for "colorful" statements but for facts!
Never mind who Jon is.
And all following postings reflect kids are frustrating themselves!
But OK, will have to put several in to my killfile.

By the way, nice to see you back!
Now, please post something helpful, okay? ;-)

I'll be posting facts but never any jokes!
Horst

 

[jtur]

In news:[email protected] John Turco typed:

Sorry John, I'm not looking for "colorful" statements but for facts!
Never mind who Jon is.
And all following postings reflect kids are frustrating themselves!
But OK, will have to put several in to my killfile.

I'll be posting facts but never any jokes!
Horst

Hello, Horst:

Well, I've been unable to receive any Usenet messages, with Netscape
Communicator 4.8 (nor with Outlook Express 6, either), these past few
days. So, I e-mailed my dial-up ISP (Concentric) about it, and they
replied that there's no problem, at their end.

I don't know what the problem is, but it hardly matters, anyway. You
see, Concentric also informed me that their news server "will be
discontinued sometime this year," with no exact date given.

Damn! This means I'll be forced to access Usenet, via Google Groups,
exclusively. I'm doing just that, now, in responding to your post. It's
not nearly as convenient as using Concentric's server and Netscape,
unfortunately.

Recall our earlier exchange, in "Re: who has deskstar gxp 75
dtla-307060 electronics?" (July 30, 2006):

JT>
Further, Google Groups <http://groups.google.com> archives various
newsgroups' content, thereby providing a Web-based portal to Usenet.

HF>
And thus giving a good platform for address spammers ;-(
Here in Europe there's no need for Google, as the local news servers
provide a mirror of other news servers.

JT>
Google is a powerful resource, for the entire world. The fact
that it's abused by a relative handful of bums (as everything
else is, naturally) doesn't negate its overall usefulness.

(Its members can start their own threads, and/or reply to other
ones, as well.)

HF>
No problem. This is a function of news servers I know.

JT>
What happens when one's news server suffers a temporary
crash, however? Mine (news.concentric.net) has normally
been highly reliable, but on the rare occasions it went down,
Google Groups came to my rescue.

Web-based news/mail "servers" do enjoy certain advantages, Horst. <g>

I told you so! As ISP's continue to drop their news servers, Google
Groups is fast becoming many people's sole link to Usenet.


Cordially,
John Turco <[email protected]>

 

[Horst Franke]

Hello, Horst:
Well, I've been unable to receive any Usenet messages, with Netscape
Communicator 4.8 (nor with Outlook Express 6, either), these past few
days. So, I e-mailed my dial-up ISP (Concentric) about it, and they
replied that there's no problem, at their end.

Sorry John, the NG states "HW.storage" and subj. Samsung error.
But You're talking about ISP problems?
Do You mismatch the groups?
And by "messages" do You mean eMails or news postings?
For eMails I know that several servers might block others because
of the large amount of spam news (blacklistings).
Did Concentric gave any glue of an error path?
Or did You got any valuable response when sending a mail?
Something like a bounce or receipient not available?

Damn! This means I'll be forced to access Usenet, via Google Groups,
exclusively. I'm doing just that, now, in responding to your post. It's
not nearly as convenient as using Concentric's server and Netscape,
unfortunately.

Sorry but I don't have any experience with US ISPs.
Google groups do also appear in European groups.
But I by myself only used that as search machine.

Recall our earlier exchange, in "Re: who has deskstar gxp 75
dtla-307060 electronics?" (July 30, 2006):

Can't remember on that. What group was it?
Do You have a news-ID?

JT>
Further, Google Groups <http://groups.google.com> archives various
newsgroups' content, thereby providing a Web-based portal to Usenet.
HF>
And thus giving a good platform for address spammers ;-(
Here in Europe there's no need for Google, as the local news servers
provide a mirror of other news servers.
JT>
Google is a powerful resource, for the entire world. The fact
that it's abused by a relative handful of bums (as everything
else is, naturally) doesn't negate its overall usefulness.
HF>
No problem. This is a function of news servers I know.
JT>
What happens when one's news server suffers a temporary
crash, however? Mine (news.concentric.net) has normally
been highly reliable, but on the rare occasions it went down,
Google Groups came to my rescue.

That's life. Crashes might have many reasons.
And for local ISPs there could also be economical reasons?

I told you so! As ISP's continue to drop their news servers, Google
Groups is fast becoming many people's sole link to Usenet.

Yes, but i think this is only one of the possible alternatives.
It's a large company with many shareholders.

Here in Germany I use "t-online.de" which mirrors a lot bunch
of worldwide NGs. So far no fallouts seen.

Looks like You should checkout for another ISP?
Horst

 

[John Turco]

Sorry John, the NG states "HW.storage" and subj. Samsung error.
But You're talking about ISP problems?
Do You mismatch the groups?

Hello, Horst:

No, I was merely responding to your reply, to my earlier message.

And by "messages" do You mean eMails or news postings?
For eMails I know that several servers might block others because
of the large amount of spam news (blacklistings).

I was only referring to Usenet posts, not e-mail.

Did Concentric gave any glue of an error path?
Or did You got any valuable response when sending a mail?
Something like a bounce or receipient not available?

Oh, sorry, I forgot to follow up: Everything began working normally, the
next day (Friday, 8-25-06).

Sorry but I don't have any experience with US ISPs.
Google groups do also appear in European groups.
But I by myself only used that as search machine.

Google is a great, all-around "machine," Horst. :-J

Can't remember on that. What group was it?
Do You have a news-ID?

That's life. Crashes might have many reasons.
And for local ISPs there could also be economical reasons?

I'm pretty sure that "economical reasons" are behind Concentric's
decision to axe its news server.

Yes, but i think this is only one of the possible alternatives.
It's a large company with many shareholders.

Here in Germany I use "t-online.de" which mirrors a lot bunch
of worldwide NGs. So far no fallouts seen.

Looks like You should checkout for another ISP?
Horst

Instead, I'll just try to find another NNTP service, preferably a free
one.


Cordially,
John Turco <jtur@@concentric.net>