Dell sued over bait & switch advertising

[YKhan]

Dell sued over bait-and-switch charges | CNET News.com
http://news.com.com/Dell+sued+over+bait-and-switch+charges/2100-1047_3-5587443.html?tag=st.pop

Yousuf Khan

 

[Robert Myers]

Dell sued over bait-and-switch charges | CNET News.com
http://news.com.com/Dell+sued+over+bait-and-switch+charges/2100-1047_3-5587443.html?tag=st.pop

Yousuf Khan

Martha Stewart out, Michael Dell in. ;-).

RM

 

[Yousuf Khan]

Martha Stewart out, Michael Dell in. ;-).

But can he turn an 8 by 12 jailcell into an ergonomic and aesthetic
tour-de-force?

Yousuf Khan

 

[Gnu_Raiz]

Martha Stewart out, Michael Dell in. ;-).

RM

OK let me get this straight, out is good, in is bad!

Last I heard Martha hired a personal chef to cook for her when she gets
out, how would you like that job! Now thats a good thing! rofl.
http://www.contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.nsf/mndwebpages/stewart lines up top chef

What ever happened to the saying, in like Flint!

I was surprised that this did not happen sooner, I also wonder how long
the product life for parts is at Dell. I mean can you still get parts for
certain models over three years old. I bet a lot of businesses are having
problems, regret their purchase.

When I am near my local University, I sometimes walk through their
computer centers, and I see lots of systems down for repairs, most are
Dells. I bet they do not like the techs/students lab assistants, to dig
into their machines,due to contract issues, other such stuff. Does Dell
still use their own funky, power supply that only work with their
hardware. I know at one time people were trying to take motherboards out
of Dells use them in their own system, but could not due to power supply
wiring issues.

Gnu_Raiz

 

[Tony Hill]

OK let me get this straight, out is good, in is bad!

Last I heard Martha hired a personal chef to cook for her when she gets
out, how would you like that job! Now thats a good thing! rofl.
http://www.contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.nsf/mndwebpages/stewart lines up top chef

What ever happened to the saying, in like Flint!

I was surprised that this did not happen sooner, I also wonder how long
the product life for parts is at Dell. I mean can you still get parts for
certain models over three years old. I bet a lot of businesses are having
problems, regret their purchase.

The problem is that the only real alternative for large business is
HPaq, and it's not like that's an improvement! I'm actually surprised
that it's JUST Dell that they're going after, since HP and Dell are
kinda reminiscent of the US government system of two parties that are
really just the same thing :>

When I am near my local University, I sometimes walk through their
computer centers, and I see lots of systems down for repairs, most are
Dells. I bet they do not like the techs/students lab assistants, to dig
into their machines,due to contract issues, other such stuff. Does Dell
still use their own funky, power supply that only work with their
hardware. I know at one time people were trying to take motherboards out
of Dells use them in their own system, but could not due to power supply
wiring issues.

Funky power supplies are pretty much the norm for big OEMs, the trick
with Dells is that they were physically identical to standard ATX
supplies but where electrically different. Made it just too tempting
for people to try swapping out the board or power supply with a
standard one that just wouldn't work. With HPaq supplies, for
example, they are still non-standard, but at least you KNOW that they
are non-standard since they won't fit into an ATX connector without
the use of a decently large hammer.

 

[Trinity]

I know at one time people were trying to take motherboards out
of Dells use them in their own system, but could not due to power supply
wiring issues.

Some stores sell adapters that get around that issue.

 

[George Macdonald]

The problem is that the only real alternative for large business is
HPaq, and it's not like that's an improvement! I'm actually surprised
that it's JUST Dell that they're going after, since HP and Dell are
kinda reminiscent of the US government system of two parties that are
really just the same thing :>


Funky power supplies are pretty much the norm for big OEMs, the trick
with Dells is that they were physically identical to standard ATX
supplies but where electrically different. Made it just too tempting
for people to try swapping out the board or power supply with a
standard one that just wouldn't work. With HPaq supplies, for
example, they are still non-standard, but at least you KNOW that they
are non-standard since they won't fit into an ATX connector without
the use of a decently large hammer.

So the HPaq connector has different keying for the connector? Is this
something that HP learned from Compaq? I remember the old proprietary
keyboard conectors that Compaq used to have - what a rip-off. All the same
I'd have thought both Dell and HPaq would have the same wires with the same
power and ground connections... just in a different order. In that case a
Molex pin extractor, and a used standard connector for the case of HPaq,
would be all you'd need to rearrange things to the standard order.

 

[Felger Carbon]

Martha Stewart out, Michael Dell in. ;-).

There are criminal trials (such as the one Martha lost), and there are
civil suits (such as the one against Dell the company, not Mike the
chairman). Nobody goes to jail for losing a civil suit. Especially
if the losing party is a company. ;-)

 

[Felger Carbon]

The problem is that the only real alternative for large business is
HPaq, and it's not like that's an improvement! I'm actually surprised
that it's JUST Dell that they're going after, since HP and Dell are
kinda reminiscent of the US government system of two parties that are
really just the same thing :>

The Apple computer company is being sued in civil court (in the UK?)
for selling used parts and computers as new parts and computers. It
would appear the problem is endemic in the computer industry. If the
box has been opened, is the part/computer used??

 

[Alan Walpool]

YKhan> Dell sued over bait-and-switch charges | CNET News.com
YKhan> http://news.com.com/Dell+sued+over+bait-and-switch+charges/2100-1047_3-5587443.html?tag=st.pop

YKhan> Yousuf Khan


It was about time. My friend's son worked for dell in sales, and to
say the least dell has some very interesting sales techniques. I'm
sure other companies use them, but dell is very good at sales.

It still amazes me though that some folks believe everything sales
agent says ;-)). When they find out that have been taken for a ride,
they sue like hell ;-)).

I guess the next suite will be intel for hot chips!

Whatever.

 

[Robert Myers]

There are criminal trials (such as the one Martha lost), and there are
civil suits (such as the one against Dell the company, not Mike the
chairman). Nobody goes to jail for losing a civil suit. Especially
if the losing party is a company. ;-)

I hope you aren't so precise when someone tells a joke at a party,
Felger.

In any case, I'm beginning to wonder if you and that outlaw Michael
Dell don't belong to the same club. ;-).

RM

 

[keith]

The Apple computer company is being sued in civil court (in the UK?)
for selling used parts and computers as new parts and computers. It
would appear the problem is endemic in the computer industry. If the
box has been opened, is the part/computer used??

There is usually a sticker on the system or disclaimer somewhere in the
documentation something on the order of "all components in this ______ are
new or equialent to new" to get around this "problem". I've seen these
"warnings" in automobiles, even. This isn't something strange amH,vil.
....well perhaps a little bad. ;-)

 

[keith]

I hope you aren't so precise when someone tells a joke at a party,
Felger.

In any case, I'm beginning to wonder if you and that outlaw Michael
Dell don't belong to the same club. ;-).

Nah, Felger isn't Mike's type. Martha on the other hand...

 

[Bob Niland]

What ever happened to the saying, in like Flint!

Actually, "In Like Flint" was a movie title, and
was a play on words from the real cliche, which was
"In like Flynn", referring to actor Eroll Flynn,
who had a bit of a reputation with the ladies, and
later managed to avoid successful prosecution for
events involving an underaged lass and his yatch.

Apparently the expression meant "sure to get lucky"
prior to the prosecution, and morphed to "and you'll
get away with it, even if illegal" afterwards.
Any number of web sites have more detail.

None of which has anything to do with Dell, which
is not a brand I buy or endorse when asked.

 

[Tony Hill]

So the HPaq connector has different keying for the connector? Is this
something that HP learned from Compaq? I remember the old proprietary
keyboard conectors that Compaq used to have - what a rip-off.

Proprietary keyboard connector?! The only place I've ever seen one of
those was a Packard Hell, where it has a special keyboard + mouse +
speaker/mic connector all in one. All the Compaq and HP machines I've
come across use plain old PS/2 (or sometimes USB) keyboards and mice.
Mind you, I pretty much only deal with their commercial line, so I
don't know what the deal is with the Presario systems.

All the same
I'd have thought both Dell and HPaq would have the same wires with the same
power and ground connections... just in a different order. In that case a
Molex pin extractor, and a used standard connector for the case of HPaq,
would be all you'd need to rearrange things to the standard order.

Of the HPaq commercial machines that I see (which is a direct
descendant of the old Compaq Deskpro/Evo line), they use all pretty
standard connectors except for the power connector. These are
definitely non-standard. Actually the new ones use one non-standard
connector for the main power but use the standard 4-pin secondary
ATX12V connector (or at least I think it's standard, though I haven't
checked the pin-out). It's not really such a big deal for these
systems though since they're mostly small form factor systems where
any other power supply just wouldn't physically fit in the case. In
the case of the few minitowers we've got, they normally use the exact
same motherboard as their corresponding SFF system, so they're kind of
stuck with the non-standard power connector.

A slightly more annoying problem with these machines is that a
standard floppy drive usually will not work. Fortunately floppies are
rarely used these days, but when they are needed, it's a bit of a PITA
to have to get a specific HPaq (or Dell) part at the rather exorbitant
prices they charge (~$40 US as I recall?)

 

[Hank Oredson]

Actually, "In Like Flint" was a movie title, and
was a play on words from the real cliche, which was
"In like Flynn", referring to actor Eroll Flynn,
who had a bit of a reputation with the ladies, and
later managed to avoid successful prosecution for
events involving an underaged lass and his yatch.

Apparently the expression meant "sure to get lucky"
prior to the prosecution, and morphed to "and you'll
get away with it, even if illegal" afterwards.
Any number of web sites have more detail.

None of which has anything to do with Dell, which
is not a brand I buy or endorse when asked.

What brand would you endorse?

Serious question, about to upgrade and will either
build my own, or buy a Dell or PowerSpec.

Have three Dells in the house (plus 4 other systems).
Dells have been problem-free.

--

... Hank

http://home.earthlink.net/~horedson
http://home.earthlink.net/~w0rli

 

[Alan Walpool]

Hank> What brand would you endorse?

Hank> Serious question, about to upgrade and will either build my
Hank> own, or buy a Dell or PowerSpec.

Hank> Have three Dells in the house (plus 4 other systems). Dells
Hank> have been problem-free.

I recently purchased a dell and was very happy. If you know how to
deal with sales people dell will be fine. I actually ordered from the
net and purchased an excellent server that was loaded for 424 bucks
with tax. Unreal deal.

Good luck

 

[keith]

What brand would you endorse?
KeithKit

Serious question, about to upgrade and will either
build my own, or buy a Dell or PowerSpec.

If you're up to it (it's not hard), build your own. No question!

Have three Dells in the house (plus 4 other systems).
Dells have been problem-free.

So you've never had to replace parts or get service?

 

[Bob Niland]

None of which has anything to do with Dell, which

What brand would you endorse?

It entirely depends on your intended uses. For
my own work (2D-intensive), I build my own. For
neighbors with generic requirements, the MicroTels
that Wal-Mart sells (web only), are perfectly
adequate inexpensive platforms, and are supportable,
as they have both Windows and Linux drivers.

Have three Dells in the house (plus 4 other systems).
Dells have been problem-free.

The question is - when you have a problem, just
how big a problem do you have? One of the things
that has put me off Dell is their periodic forays
into needless proprietary stuff, including motherboard
power connectors.

 

[Alan Walpool]

Bob> It entirely depends on your intended uses. For my own work
Bob> (2D-intensive), I build my own. For neighbors with generic
Bob> requirements, the MicroTels that Wal-Mart sells (web only), are
Bob> perfectly adequate inexpensive platforms, and are supportable,
Bob> as they have both Windows and Linux drivers.

Bob> The question is - when you have a problem, just how big a
Bob> problem do you have? One of the things that has put me off Dell
Bob> is their periodic forays into needless proprietary stuff,
Bob> including motherboard power connectors.

I did not mention that in my last post, but you have an excellent
point. When you purchase a Dell, HP, or some other system you better
be ready to throw it away when it breaks. I purchased a dell during an
excellent special, and will use for a special purchase. However, I do
realize if it breaks after warranty I will probably have to throw it
away. The dell I purchased definitely had some no standard parts.

For desktop computer I build my own, which is pretty easy, and get to
select your parts. Probably costs a little more, but if it breaks you
can fix it easily.

Later,

Alan