Defrag Error Notice

C

ColTom2

Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
 
C

Carey Frisch [MVP]

PerfectDisk 2008 Professional
http://www.raxco.com/home_office/home_perfectdisk_professional.cfm

Free 30 Day Evaluation
http://www.raxco.com/products/downloadit/

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Desktop Experience -
Windows Vista Enthusiast

---------------------------------------------------------------

Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
 
C

ColTom2

Hi Carey:

Will this resolve my current problem or is this software that would
replace Windows XP Defrag?

Thanks.

ColTom2


PerfectDisk 2008 Professional
http://www.raxco.com/home_office/home_perfectdisk_professional.cfm

Free 30 Day Evaluation
http://www.raxco.com/products/downloadit/

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Desktop Experience -
Windows Vista Enthusiast

---------------------------------------------------------------

Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
 
C

Carey Frisch [MVP]

Using PerfectDisk will result in a much better defrag of
all files and a noticeable performance improvement in hard
drive performance.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Desktop Experience -
Windows Vista Enthusiast

---------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Carey:

Will this resolve my current problem or is this software that would
replace Windows XP Defrag?

Thanks.

ColTom2


PerfectDisk 2008 Professional
http://www.raxco.com/home_office/home_perfectdisk_professional.cfm

Free 30 Day Evaluation
http://www.raxco.com/products/downloadit/

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows Desktop Experience -
Windows Vista Enthusiast

---------------------------------------------------------------

Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
 
A

Andrew E.

3rd party utilities are hardly the way to go,in cmd run:CLEANMGR Then:
Defrag C: Once thru,exit cmd,open system properties,advanced,performance,
virtual memory,change,set C: to "no page file" click set 2X,close
out,restart
pc.Back in xp,open cmd,type:Defrag C: Close when thru,reopen system,set
page file to:"let system manage" click set 2X,close out,restart pc...It might
take a time or two,but the fragmented files will end....
 
A

Alias

ColTom2 said:
Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
Click to expand...

Did you just install Windows Live Messenger or Windows Live Mail?

Alias
 
C

ColTom2

Hi Andrew:

I have accomplished your instructions five times and still am getting
defrag error notice. I assume that your "click set 2X" meant click on set
two times.

Do you have any idea as to why I am still getting error notice?

Thanks


3rd party utilities are hardly the way to go,in cmd run:CLEANMGR Then:
Defrag C: Once thru,exit cmd,open system properties,advanced,performance,
virtual memory,change,set C: to "no page file" click set 2X,close
out,restart
pc.Back in xp,open cmd,type:Defrag C: Close when thru,reopen system,set
page file to:"let system manage" click set 2X,close out,restart pc...It
might
take a time or two,but the fragmented files will end....
 
J

John John (MVP)

Unfortunately Anfrew E. sent you a fool's errand! His instructions will
do nothing to change the defrag error report that you are receiving.

The error that you see is that the Master File Table is in 3 fragments.
The Windows XP defragmenter cannot defrag the MFT, you have to use
third party tools if you want to defragment it. The question that comes
to mind is "why is such a small MFT already fragmented"? Did you
convert your drive from FAT32 to NTFS? I'm also not 100% sure how to
interpret the reported size of the MFT and its % usage, certainly the
MFT zone must be much, much, bigger than 107MB, that may be the actual
usage inside the MFT zone, but it would be helpful if you could confirm
the MFT actual size and MFT zone size with the use of the small (28KB)
SysInternals NTFSInfo utility:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897424.aspx

NTFSInfo must be run from the Command Prompt, run it and verify the MFT
Information and see how big the MFT Zone actually is.

John
 
U

Unknown

This is not necessarily an error. If you have a running program in the
background, it may not be able to be defragged.
 
C

ColTom2

Hi John:

Thanks for your reply and here is how it all got started. I ran Windows
Update yesterday and installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0 with it. Shortly
thereafter I tried to defrag and started getting these errors which I had
never gotten before. I uninstalled the Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but it
did nothing to correct this error.

I have not converted any FAT32 files or drive to NFTS.

I downloaded the Zip file for the NFTSInfo utility and extracted file
"ntfsinfo.exe" to the same folder as the zip file. I doubled clicked on it
thinking that would install it before trying to run from Cmd Prompt. A black
screen briefly appeared and went away. I then went to Cmd Prompt and typed
in "NFTSInfo C" and I am getting an error that says "is not recognized as an
internal or external command, operable program or batch file."

Maybe you can tell me what I am doing wrong here.

Thanks


Unfortunately Anfrew E. sent you a fool's errand! His instructions will
do nothing to change the defrag error report that you are receiving.

The error that you see is that the Master File Table is in 3 fragments.
The Windows XP defragmenter cannot defrag the MFT, you have to use
third party tools if you want to defragment it. The question that comes
to mind is "why is such a small MFT already fragmented"? Did you
convert your drive from FAT32 to NTFS? I'm also not 100% sure how to
interpret the reported size of the MFT and its % usage, certainly the
MFT zone must be much, much, bigger than 107MB, that may be the actual
usage inside the MFT zone, but it would be helpful if you could confirm
the MFT actual size and MFT zone size with the use of the small (28KB)
SysInternals NTFSInfo utility:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897424.aspx

NTFSInfo must be run from the Command Prompt, run it and verify the MFT
Information and see how big the MFT Zone actually is.

John
 
J

John John (MVP)

At the Command Prompt if the file that you want to execute is not in a
folder defined in the %PATH% environment variable you have to use the
fully qualified path to the file:

C:\"Folder Path To Unzipped File\ntfsinfo.exe"

or you have to navigate to the folder where the file is located and run
the file from the containing folder.

You can place the file ntfsinfo.exe in the System32 folder and try to
run the command again, it should run as System32 is in the %PATH%
variable. Or you can place the file in the root folder (C:\) and at the
command prompt use the cd\ command to change to the root folder and run
the command there.

John
 
C

ColTom2

Hi John:

Thanks so much for bearing with me. Here is the report:Microsoft Windows
XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Tom and Kitty>ntfsinfo C

NTFS Information Dump V1.01
Copyright (C) 1997 Mark Russinovich
http://www.sysinternals.com

Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 232322 MB
Total sectors : 475797104
Total clusters : 59474638
Free clusters : 55208862
Free space : 215659 MB (92% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 4096
Bytes per MFT record : 1024
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 107 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 786432
MFT zone clusters : 3871072 - 3899488
MFT zone size : 111 MB (0% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 960887

Meta-Data files
---------------

Hopefully the above will tell you what you needed to know in finding a
resolution.

Thanks,

ColTom2


At the Command Prompt if the file that you want to execute is not in a
folder defined in the %PATH% environment variable you have to use the
fully qualified path to the file:

C:\"Folder Path To Unzipped File\ntfsinfo.exe"

or you have to navigate to the folder where the file is located and run
the file from the containing folder.

You can place the file ntfsinfo.exe in the System32 folder and try to
run the command again, it should run as System32 is in the %PATH%
variable. Or you can place the file in the root folder (C:\) and at the
command prompt use the cd\ command to change to the root folder and run
the command there.

John
 
J

John John (MVP)

Sorry for the delay, I had to do a bit of experimentation and research.
Here are my findings.

1- The defragmentation report does not report the size of the MFT Zone,
it only reports the size of the actual MFT.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/174619/en-us

2- While I was able to create a partition with a fragmented MFT, I was
not able to create one with a Reserved MFT Zone of less than 12.5% of
the partition size. The NTFSinfo tool reported the expected 12% MFT
zone, like so:

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 18 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 788838
MFT zone clusters : 2326016 - 3506048
MFT zone size : 4609 MB (12% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 4739171

This expected MFT zone size (12% of drive) differs from the information
that was reported when you ran the tool on your computer, so I did some
searching to see if I could find out why your MFT Zone might be so
small. The answer was provided in a blog on the Diskeeper site:

The Mystery of the Disappearing MFT Reserved Zone!
http://www.diskeeperblog.com/archives/2006/11/the_mystery_of.html

Bottom line is "Don't worry about it!" It's perfectly normal, there is
nothing wrong with your MFT. Although it is better to have the MFT in a
single segment, 3 segments is not the end of the world, it shouldn't
make any noticeable difference in the performance of the file system.

I notice that there is another file shown as being fragmented in your
defrag report, that is a file in use that the defragmenter can't defrag.
You can use PageDefrag to try to defrag the last few in use files that
the Windows defragmenter can't defrag:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897426.aspx

John
Hi John:

Thanks so much for bearing with me. Here is the report:Microsoft Windows
XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Tom and Kitty>ntfsinfo C

NTFS Information Dump V1.01
Copyright (C) 1997 Mark Russinovich
http://www.sysinternals.com

Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 232322 MB
Total sectors : 475797104
Total clusters : 59474638
Free clusters : 55208862
Free space : 215659 MB (92% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 4096
Bytes per MFT record : 1024
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 107 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 786432
MFT zone clusters : 3871072 - 3899488
MFT zone size : 111 MB (0% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 960887

Meta-Data files
---------------

Hopefully the above will tell you what you needed to know in finding a
resolution.

Thanks,

ColTom2


At the Command Prompt if the file that you want to execute is not in a
folder defined in the %PATH% environment variable you have to use the
fully qualified path to the file:

C:\"Folder Path To Unzipped File\ntfsinfo.exe"

or you have to navigate to the folder where the file is located and run
the file from the containing folder.

You can place the file ntfsinfo.exe in the System32 folder and try to
run the command again, it should run as System32 is in the %PATH%
variable. Or you can place the file in the root folder (C:\) and at the
command prompt use the cd\ command to change to the root folder and run
the command there.

John

ColTom2 wrote:

Hi John:

Thanks for your reply and here is how it all got started. I ran Windows
Update yesterday and installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0 with it. Shortly
thereafter I tried to defrag and started getting these errors which I had
never gotten before. I uninstalled the Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but it
did nothing to correct this error.

I have not converted any FAT32 files or drive to NFTS.

I downloaded the Zip file for the NFTSInfo utility and extracted file
"ntfsinfo.exe" to the same folder as the zip file. I doubled clicked on it
thinking that would install it before trying to run from Cmd Prompt. A
black
screen briefly appeared and went away. I then went to Cmd Prompt and typed
in "NFTSInfo C" and I am getting an error that says "is not recognized as
an
internal or external command, operable program or batch file."

Maybe you can tell me what I am doing wrong here.

Thanks


Unfortunately Anfrew E. sent you a fool's errand! His instructions will
do nothing to change the defrag error report that you are receiving.

The error that you see is that the Master File Table is in 3 fragments.
The Windows XP defragmenter cannot defrag the MFT, you have to use
third party tools if you want to defragment it. The question that comes
to mind is "why is such a small MFT already fragmented"? Did you
convert your drive from FAT32 to NTFS? I'm also not 100% sure how to
interpret the reported size of the MFT and its % usage, certainly the
MFT zone must be much, much, bigger than 107MB, that may be the actual
usage inside the MFT zone, but it would be helpful if you could confirm
the MFT actual size and MFT zone size with the use of the small (28KB)
SysInternals NTFSInfo utility:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897424.aspx

NTFSInfo must be run from the Command Prompt, run it and verify the MFT
Information and see how big the MFT Zone actually is.

John

ColTom2 wrote:
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
C

ColTom2

Hi John:

Thanks for all the great info and taking the time to provide it. I haven't
been on my Toshiba laptop since I had also installed Windows Search 4.0 on
it, so I went to it today just to check it. Low and behold I have the same
problem on it as I do with my Sony desktop with the Defrag Error Notice!

With this in mind and knowing that MS provides free tech support for
Windows Update related matters I have sent them an email about all this and
asked for a resolution. The only drawback they have up to 3 business days to
reply etc. Whatever the outcome I will post it back here as soon as possible
so for your own edification so you will know what has transpired with them.

I will give your reference a try tomorrow, but it will be in the afternoon
sometime, as I have an early golf game.

Again I want to express to you my appreciation for all that you have
provided me with. I will keep you posted....

ColTom2


Sorry for the delay, I had to do a bit of experimentation and research.
Here are my findings.

1- The defragmentation report does not report the size of the MFT Zone,
it only reports the size of the actual MFT.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/174619/en-us

2- While I was able to create a partition with a fragmented MFT, I was
not able to create one with a Reserved MFT Zone of less than 12.5% of
the partition size. The NTFSinfo tool reported the expected 12% MFT
zone, like so:

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 18 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 788838
MFT zone clusters : 2326016 - 3506048
MFT zone size : 4609 MB (12% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 4739171

This expected MFT zone size (12% of drive) differs from the information
that was reported when you ran the tool on your computer, so I did some
searching to see if I could find out why your MFT Zone might be so
small. The answer was provided in a blog on the Diskeeper site:

The Mystery of the Disappearing MFT Reserved Zone!
http://www.diskeeperblog.com/archives/2006/11/the_mystery_of.html

Bottom line is "Don't worry about it!" It's perfectly normal, there is
nothing wrong with your MFT. Although it is better to have the MFT in a
single segment, 3 segments is not the end of the world, it shouldn't
make any noticeable difference in the performance of the file system.

I notice that there is another file shown as being fragmented in your
defrag report, that is a file in use that the defragmenter can't defrag.
You can use PageDefrag to try to defrag the last few in use files that
the Windows defragmenter can't defrag:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897426.aspx

John
Hi John:

Thanks so much for bearing with me. Here is the report:Microsoft Windows
XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Tom and Kitty>ntfsinfo C

NTFS Information Dump V1.01
Copyright (C) 1997 Mark Russinovich
http://www.sysinternals.com

Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 232322 MB
Total sectors : 475797104
Total clusters : 59474638
Free clusters : 55208862
Free space : 215659 MB (92% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 4096
Bytes per MFT record : 1024
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 107 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 786432
MFT zone clusters : 3871072 - 3899488
MFT zone size : 111 MB (0% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 960887

Meta-Data files
---------------

Hopefully the above will tell you what you needed to know in finding a
resolution.

Thanks,

ColTom2


At the Command Prompt if the file that you want to execute is not in a
folder defined in the %PATH% environment variable you have to use the
fully qualified path to the file:

C:\"Folder Path To Unzipped File\ntfsinfo.exe"

or you have to navigate to the folder where the file is located and run
the file from the containing folder.

You can place the file ntfsinfo.exe in the System32 folder and try to
run the command again, it should run as System32 is in the %PATH%
variable. Or you can place the file in the root folder (C:\) and at the
command prompt use the cd\ command to change to the root folder and run
the command there.

John

ColTom2 wrote:

Hi John:

Thanks for your reply and here is how it all got started. I ran Windows
Update yesterday and installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0 with it. Shortly
thereafter I tried to defrag and started getting these errors which I had
never gotten before. I uninstalled the Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but it
did nothing to correct this error.

I have not converted any FAT32 files or drive to NFTS.

I downloaded the Zip file for the NFTSInfo utility and extracted file
"ntfsinfo.exe" to the same folder as the zip file. I doubled clicked on it
thinking that would install it before trying to run from Cmd Prompt. A
black
screen briefly appeared and went away. I then went to Cmd Prompt and typed
in "NFTSInfo C" and I am getting an error that says "is not recognized as
an
internal or external command, operable program or batch file."

Maybe you can tell me what I am doing wrong here.

Thanks


Unfortunately Anfrew E. sent you a fool's errand! His instructions will
do nothing to change the defrag error report that you are receiving.

The error that you see is that the Master File Table is in 3 fragments.
The Windows XP defragmenter cannot defrag the MFT, you have to use
third party tools if you want to defragment it. The question that comes
to mind is "why is such a small MFT already fragmented"? Did you
convert your drive from FAT32 to NTFS? I'm also not 100% sure how to
interpret the reported size of the MFT and its % usage, certainly the
MFT zone must be much, much, bigger than 107MB, that may be the actual
usage inside the MFT zone, but it would be helpful if you could confirm
the MFT actual size and MFT zone size with the use of the small (28KB)
SysInternals NTFSInfo utility:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897424.aspx

NTFSInfo must be run from the Command Prompt, run it and verify the MFT
Information and see how big the MFT Zone actually is.

John

ColTom2 wrote:
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
C

ColTom2

Hi John:

Just as a side note about the prior posting saying to try PerfectDisk Pro
2008 on a trial basis.
Well I downloaded and installed it and have been playing around with it etc.
Anyway just now I went back to Windows Defrag and ran it just for the heck
of it and guess what....it ran to completion!

Here is the report which looks like to me still has some files in the
Pagefile and MFT area's, but like I said it ran all the way through to
completion with the Error Notice.
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 16.55 GB
Free space = 210 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 73,432
Average file size = 278 KB
Total fragmented files = 0
Total excess fragments = 0
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,447
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 80,152
Percent MFT in use = 72 %
Total MFT fragments = 2

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None


Do you have any idea as to how this happened? I wonder if it will continue
without the Error Notice??

ColTom2


Sorry for the delay, I had to do a bit of experimentation and research.
Here are my findings.

1- The defragmentation report does not report the size of the MFT Zone,
it only reports the size of the actual MFT.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/174619/en-us

2- While I was able to create a partition with a fragmented MFT, I was
not able to create one with a Reserved MFT Zone of less than 12.5% of
the partition size. The NTFSinfo tool reported the expected 12% MFT
zone, like so:

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 18 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 788838
MFT zone clusters : 2326016 - 3506048
MFT zone size : 4609 MB (12% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 4739171

This expected MFT zone size (12% of drive) differs from the information
that was reported when you ran the tool on your computer, so I did some
searching to see if I could find out why your MFT Zone might be so
small. The answer was provided in a blog on the Diskeeper site:

The Mystery of the Disappearing MFT Reserved Zone!
http://www.diskeeperblog.com/archives/2006/11/the_mystery_of.html

Bottom line is "Don't worry about it!" It's perfectly normal, there is
nothing wrong with your MFT. Although it is better to have the MFT in a
single segment, 3 segments is not the end of the world, it shouldn't
make any noticeable difference in the performance of the file system.

I notice that there is another file shown as being fragmented in your
defrag report, that is a file in use that the defragmenter can't defrag.
You can use PageDefrag to try to defrag the last few in use files that
the Windows defragmenter can't defrag:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897426.aspx

John
Hi John:

Thanks so much for bearing with me. Here is the report:Microsoft Windows
XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Tom and Kitty>ntfsinfo C

NTFS Information Dump V1.01
Copyright (C) 1997 Mark Russinovich
http://www.sysinternals.com

Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 232322 MB
Total sectors : 475797104
Total clusters : 59474638
Free clusters : 55208862
Free space : 215659 MB (92% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 4096
Bytes per MFT record : 1024
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 107 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 786432
MFT zone clusters : 3871072 - 3899488
MFT zone size : 111 MB (0% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 960887

Meta-Data files
---------------

Hopefully the above will tell you what you needed to know in finding a
resolution.

Thanks,

ColTom2


At the Command Prompt if the file that you want to execute is not in a
folder defined in the %PATH% environment variable you have to use the
fully qualified path to the file:

C:\"Folder Path To Unzipped File\ntfsinfo.exe"

or you have to navigate to the folder where the file is located and run
the file from the containing folder.

You can place the file ntfsinfo.exe in the System32 folder and try to
run the command again, it should run as System32 is in the %PATH%
variable. Or you can place the file in the root folder (C:\) and at the
command prompt use the cd\ command to change to the root folder and run
the command there.

John

ColTom2 wrote:

Hi John:

Thanks for your reply and here is how it all got started. I ran Windows
Update yesterday and installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0 with it. Shortly
thereafter I tried to defrag and started getting these errors which I had
never gotten before. I uninstalled the Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but it
did nothing to correct this error.

I have not converted any FAT32 files or drive to NFTS.

I downloaded the Zip file for the NFTSInfo utility and extracted file
"ntfsinfo.exe" to the same folder as the zip file. I doubled clicked on it
thinking that would install it before trying to run from Cmd Prompt. A
black
screen briefly appeared and went away. I then went to Cmd Prompt and typed
in "NFTSInfo C" and I am getting an error that says "is not recognized as
an
internal or external command, operable program or batch file."

Maybe you can tell me what I am doing wrong here.

Thanks


Unfortunately Anfrew E. sent you a fool's errand! His instructions will
do nothing to change the defrag error report that you are receiving.

The error that you see is that the Master File Table is in 3 fragments.
The Windows XP defragmenter cannot defrag the MFT, you have to use
third party tools if you want to defragment it. The question that comes
to mind is "why is such a small MFT already fragmented"? Did you
convert your drive from FAT32 to NTFS? I'm also not 100% sure how to
interpret the reported size of the MFT and its % usage, certainly the
MFT zone must be much, much, bigger than 107MB, that may be the actual
usage inside the MFT zone, but it would be helpful if you could confirm
the MFT actual size and MFT zone size with the use of the small (28KB)
SysInternals NTFSInfo utility:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897424.aspx

NTFSInfo must be run from the Command Prompt, run it and verify the MFT
Information and see how big the MFT Zone actually is.

John

ColTom2 wrote:
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
J

John John (MVP)

Looks fine, the pagefile is in one fragment, it isn't fragmented and the
MFT has gone from 3 to 2 fragments. I don't see anything seriously
wrong there.

John
Hi John:

Just as a side note about the prior posting saying to try PerfectDisk Pro
2008 on a trial basis.
Well I downloaded and installed it and have been playing around with it etc.
Anyway just now I went back to Windows Defrag and ran it just for the heck
of it and guess what....it ran to completion!

Here is the report which looks like to me still has some files in the
Pagefile and MFT area's, but like I said it ran all the way through to
completion with the Error Notice.
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 16.55 GB
Free space = 210 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 73,432
Average file size = 278 KB
Total fragmented files = 0
Total excess fragments = 0
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,447
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 80,152
Percent MFT in use = 72 %
Total MFT fragments = 2

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None


Do you have any idea as to how this happened? I wonder if it will continue
without the Error Notice??

ColTom2


Sorry for the delay, I had to do a bit of experimentation and research.
Here are my findings.

1- The defragmentation report does not report the size of the MFT Zone,
it only reports the size of the actual MFT.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/174619/en-us

2- While I was able to create a partition with a fragmented MFT, I was
not able to create one with a Reserved MFT Zone of less than 12.5% of
the partition size. The NTFSinfo tool reported the expected 12% MFT
zone, like so:

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 18 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 788838
MFT zone clusters : 2326016 - 3506048
MFT zone size : 4609 MB (12% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 4739171

This expected MFT zone size (12% of drive) differs from the information
that was reported when you ran the tool on your computer, so I did some
searching to see if I could find out why your MFT Zone might be so
small. The answer was provided in a blog on the Diskeeper site:

The Mystery of the Disappearing MFT Reserved Zone!
http://www.diskeeperblog.com/archives/2006/11/the_mystery_of.html

Bottom line is "Don't worry about it!" It's perfectly normal, there is
nothing wrong with your MFT. Although it is better to have the MFT in a
single segment, 3 segments is not the end of the world, it shouldn't
make any noticeable difference in the performance of the file system.

I notice that there is another file shown as being fragmented in your
defrag report, that is a file in use that the defragmenter can't defrag.
You can use PageDefrag to try to defrag the last few in use files that
the Windows defragmenter can't defrag:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897426.aspx

John

ColTom2 wrote:

Hi John:

Thanks so much for bearing with me. Here is the report:Microsoft Windows
XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Tom and Kitty>ntfsinfo C

NTFS Information Dump V1.01
Copyright (C) 1997 Mark Russinovich
http://www.sysinternals.com

Volume Size
-----------
Volume size : 232322 MB
Total sectors : 475797104
Total clusters : 59474638
Free clusters : 55208862
Free space : 215659 MB (92% of drive)

Allocation Size
----------------
Bytes per sector : 512
Bytes per cluster : 4096
Bytes per MFT record : 1024
Clusters per MFT record: 0

MFT Information
---------------
MFT size : 107 MB (0% of drive)
MFT start cluster : 786432
MFT zone clusters : 3871072 - 3899488
MFT zone size : 111 MB (0% of drive)
MFT mirror start : 960887

Meta-Data files
---------------

Hopefully the above will tell you what you needed to know in finding a
resolution.

Thanks,

ColTom2


At the Command Prompt if the file that you want to execute is not in a
folder defined in the %PATH% environment variable you have to use the
fully qualified path to the file:

C:\"Folder Path To Unzipped File\ntfsinfo.exe"

or you have to navigate to the folder where the file is located and run
the file from the containing folder.

You can place the file ntfsinfo.exe in the System32 folder and try to
run the command again, it should run as System32 is in the %PATH%
variable. Or you can place the file in the root folder (C:\) and at the
command prompt use the cd\ command to change to the root folder and run
the command there.

John

ColTom2 wrote:


Hi John:

Thanks for your reply and here is how it all got started. I ran Windows
Update yesterday and installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0 with it. Shortly
thereafter I tried to defrag and started getting these errors which I had
never gotten before. I uninstalled the Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but it
did nothing to correct this error.

I have not converted any FAT32 files or drive to NFTS.

I downloaded the Zip file for the NFTSInfo utility and extracted file
"ntfsinfo.exe" to the same folder as the zip file. I doubled clicked on it
thinking that would install it before trying to run from Cmd Prompt. A
black
screen briefly appeared and went away. I then went to Cmd Prompt and typed
in "NFTSInfo C" and I am getting an error that says "is not recognized as
an
internal or external command, operable program or batch file."

Maybe you can tell me what I am doing wrong here.

Thanks


Unfortunately Anfrew E. sent you a fool's errand! His instructions will
do nothing to change the defrag error report that you are receiving.

The error that you see is that the Master File Table is in 3 fragments.
The Windows XP defragmenter cannot defrag the MFT, you have to use
third party tools if you want to defragment it. The question that comes
to mind is "why is such a small MFT already fragmented"? Did you
convert your drive from FAT32 to NTFS? I'm also not 100% sure how to
interpret the reported size of the MFT and its % usage, certainly the
MFT zone must be much, much, bigger than 107MB, that may be the actual
usage inside the MFT zone, but it would be helpful if you could confirm
the MFT actual size and MFT zone size with the use of the small (28KB)
SysInternals NTFSInfo utility:
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897424.aspx

NTFSInfo must be run from the Command Prompt, run it and verify the MFT
Information and see how big the MFT Zone actually is.

John

ColTom2 wrote:




Hi Andrew:

I have accomplished your instructions five times and still am getting
defrag error notice. I assume that your "click set 2X" meant click on set
two times.

Do you have any idea as to why I am still getting error notice?

Thanks


3rd party utilities are hardly the way to go,in cmd run:CLEANMGR Then:
Defrag C: Once thru,exit cmd,open system
properties,advanced,performance,
virtual memory,change,set C: to "no page file" click set 2X,close
out,restart
pc.Back in xp,open cmd,type:Defrag C: Close when thru,reopen system,set
page file to:"let system manage" click set 2X,close out,restart pc...It
might
take a time or two,but the fragmented files will end....

:





Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I
might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0,
but
I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it
is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it
said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully
somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time
before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
T

Twayne

Hi,

I'm not about to read thru all those posts to see where the answer might
be, but I can give you a little advice:
1. You said it's an "error" but it isn't; it's simply a situation
where something can not be defragged because it's in use at the time you
ran defrag. And, the synopsis says "none", which means that all files
which could be defragged, have been defragged.
In your case, over time and several restarts and depending on what
the machine happens to be doing, the number of fragments can change over
time, often going lower, seldom going higher, although Í've seen it
happen.

In the overall, this is a non-issue. If anything it's Microsoft's
typical failure to properly explain/note what things mean. Yu didn't
say so IIRC, but I very much doubt you are experiencing any operational
problems with your PC, right?

So, everything is fine IMO. I've seen the same thing in the past. AT
the moment there are 4 files on my drive that can not be defragged:
That's because they are in-use. If I went to Safe Mode to do the
Defrag, that would cut it down to one or two files, not sure which
anymore since I can only think of the page file being in two fragments
at the moment, but it's no problem and there are no slowdowns, pauses or
glitches in my system. Someday I'll get the time to kill the page file,
do a defrag, and then turn the Page File back on and then it'll not be
fragmented but I'm in no hurry.
I am a fairly heavy user and scheduled Defrag to run monthly
overnight and that seems to be a good number. Some work, especially if
I'm rendering video after editing it, I run a defrag on that drive after
every session, but that's the nature of the way that app works. The
video work creates thousands of temp files and deletes them as the
program gets used, and fragmentation happens very quickly. But other
than that once a month sems to work well for me. Your needs may be
different but in general a normal user can rely on tha Analyze featuer
of Defrag to tell them whether they need to defrage or not.

Also you don't need 3rd party programs for defragging; XP is quite
capable of easily taking care of the situation for a normal to a light
user. IMO all a mess of 3r party apps does is add that many more areas
for things to break or go corrupted; I avoide them when I can, but
that's not to say I don't use them where they have a disting benefit to
me.

If you're curious, a little reading on defrag can be a good thing:
http://www.computerhope.com/software/defrag.htm#07
http://www.internetfixes.com/definitions/IF01012.htm
Defrag Tutorial:
http://www.security-forums.com/viewtopic.php?p=256012
Not abut defrag but handy:
http://www.rahulgaitonde.org/2008/04/25/speed-xp-vista-reclaim-disk-space/
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071218200204AA7YmQu&show=7
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/setup/learnmore/tips/gehrke1.mspx

http://www.windowsnetworking.com/kb...s/Utilities/XPDefragiscommandlinecapable.html


http://articles.techrepublic.com.com/5100-10878_11-6086381.html

As you can see there are lots of hits in my search; many more than I
copied here.

HTH a little,

Twayne
 
C

ColTom2

Hi:

After doing everything that I could think of to resolve this issue,
including talking with Microsoft, the only known solution at this time is to
reformat.

If anyone ever comes up with a known solution I sure wish that you would
post it with the widest dissemination.

Thanks for all the replies.....

ColTom2


Hi:

I am running Windows XP Media Center (2005) SP3 on a Sony desktop
VGC-RA716G and just today starting getting this defrag error notice. I might
add that it started after I had installed Windows Desktop Search 4.0, but I
uninstalled it and am now still getting the same error notice. Also I
installed the Desktop Search 4.0 on my Toshiba laptop and have had no
related problems with it defragging.

The Defrag Error Notice reads as follows:
" Some files on the volume could not be defragged. Please check the
defragmetation report for the list of these files".

Here is a copy of defrag report:
Volume (C:)
Volume size = 227 GB
Cluster size = 4 KB
Used space = 15.97 GB
Free space = 211 GB
Percent free space = 92 %

Volume fragmentation
Total fragmentation = 0 %
File fragmentation = 0 %
Free space fragmentation = 0 %

File fragmentation
Total files = 72,031
Average file size = 269 KB
Total fragmented files = 1
Total excess fragments = 11
Average fragments per file = 1.00

Pagefile fragmentation
Pagefile size = 1.50 GB
Total fragments = 1

Folder fragmentation
Total folders = 6,383
Fragmented folders = 1
Excess folder fragments = 0

Master File Table (MFT) fragmentation
Total MFT size = 107 MB
MFT record count = 78,627
Percent MFT in use = 71 %
Total MFT fragments = 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fragments File Size Files that cannot be defragmented
None

As you can tell from the above report it appears to be one file and it is
not identified as it says "None".

I also ran System Restore back to yesterday and ran Defrag in Safe Mode
and still am getting this error notice.In addition I ran CHKDSK and it said
the volume was clean.

I tried to find a solution on the web, but found none. Hopefully somebody
has an answer to this problem that apparently has happened many time before.

Thanks,

ColTom2
 
J

Jake

Are you by chance running a Norton Anti Virus product? Here is my story. I
recently upgraded my Norton based on a message from Symantic saying there was
a new version, for free, of my product included in my subscription. The
morning before I upgraded, I preformed my system maintance, inculding defrag.
Everything worked fine. Right after upgrading and restarting, everything was
working fine so I went ahead and performed my usual system maintance again.
Low and behold, I got the exact same problem you got. In fact, my wifes
computer also has the same problem and the only thing that was different was
the Norton upgrade. Although I did not realize this was happening to my wifes
computer until a week or two later when I did her system maintence.

I contacted Norton and they could not fix the problem. Even after removing
and reinstalling the Norton product. They claim, not their doing. To be fair,
it might not be thier problem in that both of our systems are set up to
receive and install MS updates Automaticly. Could be a MS update glich. But
sure seems like a coincidence that both are systems are generating the same
message at about the same time after the same upgrade. Just thought I would
check with you on this issue. Thanks for taking the time to go through the
rest of the suggestions. I only understood about 10% of them!
 

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