Cost effective inkjet brand (new)?

[zach]

My Canon i860 has been chugging along nicely, I love the cheapo cartridges and
not having to do refills. So of course I recommended Canon to my sister who
needs a new printer. But quickly retracted my recommendation after I found out
that they are now doing the chip on a cartridge thing and seeing the outrageous
prices for new cartridges.

SO... what's the latest consensus for the most cost-effective inkjet? This is
for someone who

1) will not do her own refills but wants to buy compatible cartridges
2) prints mainly b/w
3) want to print an occasional color photo but is not super-discriminating

The messages that I have seen posted here often suggest buying an older printer.
But she really wants something that she can buy locally from a mainstream
retailer.

Thank ye!

 

[zach]

snip

SO... what's the latest consensus for the most cost-effective inkjet? This is
for someone who

snip

As a general serendipitous followup, I just saw this new Infoworld posting
entitled "HP's Time-Bombed Printheads":

http://weblog.infoworld.com/gripeli...ps_timebombed.html?source=NLC-GRIPE2006-12-05


zach

 

[measekite]

My Canon i860 has been chugging along nicely, I love the cheapo cartridges and
not having to do refills. So of course I recommended Canon to my sister who
needs a new printer. But quickly retracted my recommendation after I found out
that they are now doing the chip on a cartridge thing and seeing the outrageous
prices for new cartridges.

That is a ridiculous reason for not choosing one of the best printers
for the money that is being sold today. For the average person the best
narrow format is the Canon IP4300 and they should use OEM ink instead of
the noname relabeled junk.

SO... what's the latest consensus for the most cost-effective inkjet? This is
for someone who

1) will not do her own refills smart
but wants to buy compatible cartridges
i take it back
2) prints mainly b/w
3) want to print an occasional color photo but is not super-discriminating

Thats good since they should not expect much from the generic ink

The messages that I have seen posted here often suggest buying an older printer.

That is like getting an old girl friend

 

[phreak]

I think that any n-1 generation or even current printer that uses BCI-6
ink tanks. Lots of choices in that area.

There are a few people who say that they are doing print tests with
Chromalife-compatible pigment inks pumped into BCI-6 tanks and running
them on i960 and i9900 printers. We'll see if they ever post
results.......

Shut up mealy-mouth-kite.

 

[Michael Johnson, PE]

My Canon i860 has been chugging along nicely, I love the cheapo cartridges and
not having to do refills. So of course I recommended Canon to my sister who
needs a new printer. But quickly retracted my recommendation after I found out
that they are now doing the chip on a cartridge thing and seeing the outrageous
prices for new cartridges.

SO... what's the latest consensus for the most cost-effective inkjet? This is
for someone who

1) will not do her own refills but wants to buy compatible cartridges
2) prints mainly b/w
3) want to print an occasional color photo but is not super-discriminating

The messages that I have seen posted here often suggest buying an older printer.
But she really wants something that she can buy locally from a mainstream
retailer.

Thank ye!

I recommend getting on ebay and searching for a Canon iP5000/4000/3000,
iP6000D, MP780/760 or any PIXMA printer using the BCI-6 cartridges.
They can still be found new or refurbished there. You may pay a little
more for one than you wish but the price of the BCI-6 compatible
cartridges compared to the newer chipped OEM ones will make up for it in
short order.

 

[Burt]

I recommend getting on ebay and searching for a Canon iP5000/4000/3000,
iP6000D, MP780/760 or any PIXMA printer using the BCI-6 cartridges. They
can still be found new or refurbished there. You may pay a little more
for one than you wish but the price of the BCI-6 compatible cartridges
compared to the newer chipped OEM ones will make up for it in short order.

Google Canon ip6000D. Amazon shows several vendors selling these new for
$100 or more. Unless these are phony bait and switch ads this is probably
the last of the new bci-6 cart printers. I think there are also some i9900
large format printers out there as well but that printer is in a different
class costwise.

 

[Michael Johnson, PE]

Google Canon ip6000D. Amazon shows several vendors selling these new for
$100 or more. Unless these are phony bait and switch ads this is probably
the last of the new bci-6 cart printers. I think there are also some i9900
large format printers out there as well but that printer is in a different
class costwise.

I agree. The iP6000D is the best inkjet printer deal going right now
followed by the MP780 for a multifunction unit.

 

[measekite]

phreak wrote:

I think that any n-1 generation or even current printer that uses BCI-6 ink tanks. Lots of choices in that area. There are a few people who say that they are doing print tests with Chromalife-compatible pigment inks pumped into BCI-6 tanks and running them on i960 and i9900 printers. We'll see if they ever post results.......


There are no results since there is nothing compatible.


Shut up mealy-mouth-kite. zach wrote:



My Canon i860 has been chugging along nicely, I love the cheapo cartridges and not having to do refills. So of course I recommended Canon to my sister who needs a new printer. But quickly retracted my recommendation after I found out that they are now doing the chip on a cartridge thing and seeing the outrageous prices for new cartridges. SO... what's the latest consensus for the most cost-effective inkjet? This is for someone who 1) will not do her own refills but wants to buy compatible cartridges 2) prints mainly b/w 3) want to print an occasional color photo but is not super-discriminating The messages that I have seen posted here often suggest buying an older printer. But she really wants something that she can buy locally from a mainstream retailer. Thank ye! -- [email protected]

 

[zach]

I recommend getting on ebay and searching for a Canon iP5000/4000/3000,
iP6000D, MP780/760 or any PIXMA printer using the BCI-6 cartridges.
They can still be found new or refurbished there. You may pay a little
more for one than you wish but the price of the BCI-6 compatible
cartridges compared to the newer chipped OEM ones will make up for it in
short order.

Thanks to everyone who recommended this printer. I found a few places selling it
new for $99.

(And yeah, I know enough to ignore measekite. There is no indication to suggest
that he is anything but genuinely disturbed.)

zach

 

[Bob Headrick]

As a general serendipitous followup, I just saw this new Infoworld posting
entitled "HP's Time-Bombed Printheads":

http://weblog.infoworld.com/gripeli...ps_timebombed.html?source=NLC-GRIPE2006-12-05

The printer referenced in the above posting is a Designjet large format
printer with separate ink supplies and printheads. Do not assume that
things said about a line or printers that include models with ink tanks
nearly one liter apply to low end consumer printers. There are no HP models
with integrated printheads (ink and printheads combined) that enforce any
form of expiration.

- Bob Headrick, MS MVP Pronging/Imaging

 

[phineaspaine]

My Canon i860 has been chugging along nicely, I love the cheapo cartridges and
not having to do refills. So of course I recommended Canon to my sister who
needs a new printer. But quickly retracted my recommendation after I found out
that they are now doing the chip on a cartridge thing and seeing the outrageous
prices for new cartridges.

SO... what's the latest consensus for the most cost-effective inkjet? This is
for someone who

1) will not do her own refills but wants to buy compatible cartridges
2) prints mainly b/w
3) want to print an occasional color photo but is not super-discriminating

The messages that I have seen posted here often suggest buying an older printer.
But she really wants something that she can buy locally from a mainstream
retailer.

Thank ye!

Hey Zach:

I don't believe this! The local Zellers store near where I work has a
brand-spankin'-new Canon i860, still in the box! Don't know where they
found it, and don't know how long they've had it.

Are you interested? If so, post an email address where I can contact
you, plus where are you located?

Bullitt (Ontario, Canada)

 

[measekite]

People who are disturbed are the ones who seek out 3rd generation discontinued technology and pay more money than for up to date current technology.  What a joke.

zach wrote:

"Michael Johnson, PE" <[email protected]> wrote:



I recommend getting on ebay and searching for a Canon iP5000/4000/3000, iP6000D, MP780/760 or any PIXMA printer using the BCI-6 cartridges. They can still be found new or refurbished there. You may pay a little more for one than you wish but the price of the BCI-6 compatible cartridges compared to the newer chipped OEM ones will make up for it in short order.



Thanks to everyone who recommended this printer. I found a few places selling it new for $99. (And yeah, I know enough to ignore measekite. There is no indication to suggest that he is anything but genuinely disturbed.) zach

 

[Frank]

(And yeah, I know enough to ignore measekite. There is no indication to suggest
that he is anything but genuinely disturbed.)

zach

hehehe...good one!
Standby for an unintelligible, childish bullshit response of an answer
from that moron idiot loser know nothing meashershithead.
Frank

 

[phineaspaine]

People who are disturbed are the ones who seek out 3rd generation discontinued technology and pay more money than for up to date current technology. What a joke.

zach wrote:



I recommend getting on ebay and searching for a Canon iP5000/4000/3000,
iP6000D, MP780/760 or any PIXMA printer using the BCI-6 cartridges.
They can still be found new or refurbished there. You may pay a little
more for one than you wish but the price of the BCI-6 compatible
cartridges compared to the newer chipped OEM ones will make up for it in
short order.



Thanks to everyone who recommended this printer. I found a few places selling it
new for $99.

(And yeah, I know enough to ignore measekite. There is no indication to suggest
that he is anything but genuinely disturbed.)

zach

Regardless of what measekite says, sometimes all you need is a decent
printer... not top-of-the-line current technology, but something that
just does the job that you need. It may be 2 generations old, but when
you consider that the last generation added only chipped cartridges
(and the dubious value of "ChromaLife" inks over the previous
ContrastPLUS inks), and that the previous generation added duplex only
(and 9600 dpi for the ip5000), it isn't that far behind. It does print
colour at 4800dpi, still good enough for photos, but doesn't do duplex
like the 1st generation Pixmas. It uses the universally available,
compatible, unchipped BCI-6 (Bk, C, Y, M) dye-based, and BCI-3eBk
pigment-based cartridges, and I believe it includes a full OEM set
(worth the price alone), though they may be past their expiry date.
Why pay for more if you don't need it?

Check out the specs here:

http://www.canon.ca/english/index-p...=657&sgid=23&gid=2&ovr=1&epage=viewall&arch=1

The sale price of this single "brand-new" i860 at Zellers is Cdn$49.99
plus 8% PST and 6% GST plus any shipping to where you need it. I'll
charge just Cdn$15 for my time and effort to get it to you, unless
you're local (please specify your location), in which case I'll tell
you directly where to get it (that's if they still have it, and I'll
need your email address to let you know). If I can still get my hands
on it, I'll just drop it off at the nearest post office, and it'll be
off to you.

Actually, if I just went ahead and bought this thing and put it up on
eBay, I'd probably get more for it.... hmmm.

Bullitt

 

[Burt]

measekite wrote: his usual nonsense (snip)
Regardless of what measekite says, sometimes all you need is a decent
printer... not top-of-the-line current technology, but something that
just does the job that you need. It may be 2 generations old, but when
you consider that the last generation added only chipped cartridges
(and the dubious value of "ChromaLife" inks over the previous
ContrastPLUS inks), and that the previous generation added duplex only
(and 9600 dpi for the ip5000), it isn't that far behind. It does print
colour at 4800dpi, still good enough for photos, but doesn't do duplex
like the 1st generation Pixmas. It uses the universally available,
compatible, unchipped BCI-6 (Bk, C, Y, M) dye-based, and BCI-3eBk
pigment-based cartridges, and I believe it includes a full OEM set
(worth the price alone), though they may be past their expiry date.
Why pay for more if you don't need it?

(snip)

Keep in mind that MK has an iP4000 that he bought a little over two years
ago. About the time he bought it I had purchased an i960, one of the best
photo printers available at the time, on sale for about the same price he
paid for his iP4000. He chided me for buying "old technology". For me,
the duplex feature and additional paper tray are less than useless as I use
it for 100% photo and color graphics printing. I bought a second new i960
on closeout two years ago for $100 and two iP5000 printers (yes, and being
closed out. Next time he criticizes anyone for staying with the "old
technology" ask him how many printers he has purchased to replace his iP4000
so he can move up to the newer (but questionably better) models. Still with
the ancient iP4000, I'm sure.

 

[John McWilliams]

hehehe...good one!
Standby for an unintelligible, childish bullshit response of an answer
from that moron idiot loser know nothing meashershithead.
Frank

Frank, could you possibly forbear the taunting and all? Unless you are
at some level actually trying to encourage his posting.

 

[measekite]

[email protected] wrote:

measekite wrote:



People who are disturbed are the ones who seek out 3rd generation discontinued technology and pay more money than for up to date current technology. What a joke. zach wrote: "Michael Johnson, PE" <[email protected]> wrote: I recommend getting on ebay and searching for a Canon iP5000/4000/3000, iP6000D, MP780/760 or any PIXMA printer using the BCI-6 cartridges. They can still be found new or refurbished there. You may pay a little more for one than you wish but the price of the BCI-6 compatible cartridges compared to the newer chipped OEM ones will make up for it in short order. Thanks to everyone who recommended this printer. I found a few places selling it new for $99. (And yeah, I know enough to ignore measekite. There is no indication to suggest that he is anything but genuinely disturbed.) zach



Regardless of what measekite says, sometimes all you need is a decent printer... not top-of-the-line current technology,

thaat will cost you less and produce more.  :-D


but something that just does the job that you need. It may be 2 generations old, but when you consider that the last generation added only chipped cartridges (and the dubious value of "ChromaLife" inks over the previous ContrastPLUS inks), and that the previous generation added duplex only (and 9600 dpi for the ip5000), it isn't that far behind.


Without duplex it is not even on the same playing field.


It does print colour at 4800dpi, still good enough for photos, but doesn't do duplex like the 1st generation Pixmas. It uses the universally available, compatible, unchipped BCI-6 (Bk, C, Y, M) dye-based, and BCI-3eBk pigment-based cartridges,


Chips are not a big deal


and I believe it includes a full OEM set (worth the price alone), though they may be past their expiry date. Why pay for more if you don't need it? Check out the specs here: http://www.canon.ca/english/index-products.asp?lng=en&prodid=657&sgid=23&gid=2&ovr=1&epage=viewall&arch=1 The sale price of this single "brand-new" i860 at Zellers is Cdn$49.99 plus 8% PST and 6% GST plus any shipping to where you need it. I'll charge just Cdn$15 for my time and effort to get it to you, unless you're local (please specify your location), in which case I'll tell you directly where to get it (that's if they still have it, and I'll need your email address to let you know). If I can still get my hands on it, I'll just drop it off at the nearest post office, and it'll be off to you. Actually, if I just went ahead and bought this thing and put it up on eBay, I'd probably get more for it.... hmmm. Bullitt

 

[Sparky]

(e-mail address removed) wrote:
measekite wrote:
Regardless of what measekite says, sometimes all you need is a decent
printer... not top-of-the-line current technology,
thaat will cost you less and produce more. :-D
Huh?

but something that
just does the job that you need. It may be 2 generations old, but when
you consider that the last generation added only chipped cartridges
(and the dubious value of "ChromaLife" inks over the previous
ContrastPLUS inks), and that the previous generation added duplex only
(and 9600 dpi for the ip5000), it isn't that far behind.

Without duplex it is not even on the same playing field.

Paper's cheap, and duplex is useless to me, so you're right that it's
not even on the same playing field. Why buy soccer balls if you're
interested in playing ice hockey?

It does print
colour at 4800dpi, still good enough for photos, but doesn't do duplex
like the 1st generation Pixmas. It uses the universally available,
compatible, unchipped BCI-6 (Bk, C, Y, M) dye-based, and BCI-3eBk
pigment-based cartridges,

Chips are not a big deal

They are when the companies keep them proprietary so I have to pay $20
for an OEM ink cartridge compared to $3 or $4 for oem. Is Canon's ink
really THAT much better? And if I void the warranty using non-oem
ink...big freaking deal. My ip-4200 just ran out of ink, and I found
that I can buy a whole new ip-4200 printer (with a brand-spanking new
set of OEM inks) for less than I could buy the set of inks alone. That
just sounds a little nutso to me.

I'm curious too, measkite - are you one of those folks who take your
car back to the dealership for regular service so you don't "void the
warranty"? It sounds like that's what you're
recommending...unless....you ARE a "dealer"??? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

 

[measekite]

Sparky wrote:

measekite wrote:



[email protected] wrote: measekite wrote: Regardless of what measekite says, sometimes all you need is a decent printer... not top-of-the-line current technology, thaat will cost you less and produce more. :-D



Huh?



but something that just does the job that you need. It may be 2 generations old, but when you consider that the last generation added only chipped cartridges (and the dubious value of "ChromaLife" inks over the previous ContrastPLUS inks), and that the previous generation added duplex only (and 9600 dpi for the ip5000), it isn't that far behind. Without duplex it is not even on the same playing field.



Paper's cheap, and duplex is useless to me, so you're right that it's not even on the same playing field. Why buy soccer balls if you're interested in playing ice hockey?



It does print colour at 4800dpi, still good enough for photos, but doesn't do duplex like the 1st generation Pixmas. It uses the universally available, compatible, unchipped BCI-6 (Bk, C, Y, M) dye-based, and BCI-3eBk pigment-based cartridges, Chips are not a big deal



They are when the companies keep them proprietary so I have to pay $20 for an OEM ink cartridge compared to $3 or $4 for oem.


Gee Whiz  I just met a bunch of smart people buying Canon ink at Costco for around $10.00 a cartridge.  I am surprised that you are paying twice as much.


Is Canon's ink really THAT much better?

Absolutely


And if I void the warranty using non-oem ink...big freaking deal.

It does not bother me either


My ip-4200 just ran out of ink, and I found that I can buy a whole new ip-4200 printer (with a brand-spanking new set of OEM inks) for less than I could buy the set of inks alone.

Then that is the way to go.  You should take advantage of that deal.


That just sounds a little nutso to me. I'm curious too, measkite - are you one of those folks who take your car back to the dealership for regular service so you don't "void the warranty"?


Nope,  I take my car back to the dealer for service because they know the car, do the job right the first time, and I do not have problems and just pay a little more.  In the long term I probably spend less.


It sounds like that's what you're recommending...unless....you ARE a "dealer"??? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm...

 

[Sparky]

They are when the companies keep them proprietary so I have to pay $20
for an OEM ink cartridge compared to $3 or $4 for oem.

Gee Whiz I just met a bunch of smart people buying Canon ink at Costco for around $10.00 a cartridge. I am surprised that you are paying twice as much.

I'm not, I'm trying to decide which OTHER printer I can buy that
doesn't use proprietary chipped ink cartridges. I saw oem cartridges
advertised for anywhere from $13 to $20 per cartridge, but even at your
"around" $10/cartridge, that comes out to "around" $50 a set, whereas I
can get them for $10 or $12 per non-oem set.

But, even then, the problem I really have with Canon (and other
manufacturers following the same route) is that they're not saying "If
you don't use our inks, your warranty is void.". Instead, they're
dictating that I can only use THEIR ink in MY printer. I should be
able to use lampblack and whale oil if I wanted! If my printer died as
a result of my stupidity, then so much the better - I'd be smarter,
they'd sell me another printer, and everyone would be happy.

Now tossing it back to you, what would your reaction be if you went to
buy a a car and the dealership said that you could only use Crown gas
in the tank, Penzoil oil in the engine, and Dom Perignon in the
windshield washer? Personally, I'd buy a different manufacturer's car.
I was under the impression that a lot of our forefathers fought and
died defending the rights of people to make their own decisions.

Is Canon's ink
really THAT much better?
Absolutely

Have you any independent test results, or is that just the (world's
shortest) gospel according to measkite?

My ip-4200 just ran out of ink, and I found
that I can buy a whole new ip-4200 printer (with a brand-spanking new
set of OEM inks) for less than I could buy the set of inks alone.
Then that is the way to go. You should take advantage of that deal.

I'm still confused though. Why is (ink + printer) < ink? Just using
simple math and economics, that would mean that either printer < 0,
which seems unlikely, or there's another reason...like they're
essentially giving the printer away to get folks into the ink pipeline?
I'm open to other suggestions...

I'm curious too, measkite - are you one of those folks who take your
car back to the dealership for regular service so you don't "void the
warranty"?

Nope, I take my car back to the dealer for service because they know the car, do the job right the first time, and I do not have problems and just pay a little more. In the long term I probably spend less.

Wow, do you still believe in Santa Claus too? My son is a mechanic,
and his first job was in a large Toyota dealership which he lovingly
referred to as "the land of misfit mechanics". Most of the employees
were the dregs who weren't competent or motivated enough to get a job
working in an independent shop, and the dealership still charged an arm
and a leg and tried to jack up the bill with unnecessary work. A lot
of his friends, who also started in dealerships, had the same opinions.
You should find a private garage with capable mechanics you personally
know and trust, and stick with them. You'll be happier, less poor, and
probably safer to boot.