Connecting components to turn on with one switch

[bud--]

scary pictures:

For those who can read, the horror pictures were handled in the last
post.

Meanwhile, lurkers are invited to review Figure 8 in Bud's citation.
TVs are damaged due to a plug-in protector and defective earthing.
Bud's IEEE paper warns about how plug-in protectors can even contribute
to adjacent TV damage. TVs at 8000+ volts are damaged. Plug-in
protector in figure 8 (even with UL approval and without earthing)
contributes to TV damage. Just another reason why protectors are best
located at the service entrance.

For those who can read, Fig 8 is part of the IEEE explanation of how
SREs work. For those who can read, the IEEE guide recognizes plug-in
surge suppressors as effective.

IEEE does not make recommendation in Bud's papers. IEEE makes
recommendations in standards. Standard contradict what Bud claims:
IEEE Red Book (Std 141):....
.IEEE Green Book (IEEE 142) ....

To take only one example: the IEEE guide, chapter 6, "SPECIFIC
PROTECTION EXAMPLES" shows 2 examples of surge protection. Both use
SREs.
Saying the guides take a lot of space describing, but not recommending
plug-in surge protectors is sutpid. Repeatedly making this claim
requires willful stupidity.

And you also have to be stupid to think the IEEE would publish a guide
to the general public that violates the IEEE color books. Maybe if you
tried real hard you could understand the IEEE and NIST guides

. No earth ground means no effective protection. Even an open switch
will not stop or block such surges. In direct contradiction to what
Bud posts - IEEE recommends the most critical component in any
protection system - earth ground. ....

Your religious views about earthing are still not relevant. As
described nu;merous times, the IEEE guide clearly describes plug-in
suppressors as CLAMPING the voltage on all wires to the common ground
at the protector. Earthing is described as secondary. As you seem to
forget, the IEEE guide was published by the IEEE.

The IEEE and NIST guides clearly say that plug-in suppressors are
effective.
Links to sites that say plug-in suppressors are effective: 2
Your links to sites that say plug-in suppressors are not effective:
always 0

bud--

 

[w_tom]

...
For those who can read, Fig 8 is part of the IEEE explanation of how
SREs work. For those who can read, the IEEE guide recognizes plug-in
surge suppressors as effective.
...

Figure 8 shows two TVs. One is damaged because 8000 volts is created
across that TV - by a circuit using a plug-in protector that was not
properly earthed.

Guide shows how a plug-in protector can even contribute to electronic
damage. Bud says Figure 8 is a recommendation. Instead, the ctiation
shows how a plug-in protector can work AND how it can create
electronics damage.

Meanwhile, one 'whole house' protector - properly earthed - makes
figure 8 of that 'technical discusion' irrelevant. Technical
discussion is not a recommendataion - as Bud posts.

For IEEE recommendations, one consults Standards such as IEEE Red
Book (Standard 141) and IEEE Green Book (Standard 142). What does IEEE
recommend? Earthing. What does Bud avoid discussing? Earthing. No
earth ground means no effective protection. No earthing explains why
no numbers for 'assumed' protection. A building's earthing must be
upgraded to meet and exceed post 1990 National Electrical Code
requirements. Without earthing, that plug-in protector in Figure 8 can
even put the TV at 8000 volts. Bud somehow calls a TV at 8000 volts
effective protection. The effective 'whole house' protector earths
before destructive transients can enter a building. IEEE 'recommends'
earthing for protection.

 

[w_tom]

...
For those who can read, Fig 8 is part of the IEEE explanation of how
SREs work. For those who can read, the IEEE guide recognizes plug-in
surge suppressors as effective.
...

Figure 8 shows two TVs. One is damaged because 8000 volts is created
across that TV - by a circuit using a plug-in protector that was not
properly earthed.

Guide shows how a plug-in protector can even contribute to electronic
damage. Bud says Figure 8 is a recommendation. Instead, the ctiation
shows how a plug-in protector can work AND how it can create
electronics damage.

Meanwhile, one 'whole house' protector - properly earthed - makes
figure 8 of that 'technical discusion' irrelevant. Technical
discussion is not a recommendataion - as Bud posts.

For IEEE recommendations, one consults Standards such as IEEE Red
Book (Standard 141) and IEEE Green Book (Standard 142). What does IEEE
recommend? Earthing. What does Bud avoid discussing? Earthing. No
earth ground means no effective protection. No earthing explains why
no numbers for 'assumed' protection. A building's earthing must be
upgraded to meet and exceed post 1990 National Electrical Code
requirements. Without earthing, that plug-in protector in Figure 8 can
even put the TV at 8000 volts. Bud somehow calls a TV at 8000 volts
effective protection. The effective 'whole house' protector earths
before destructive transients can enter a building. IEEE 'recommends'
earthing for protection.

 

[alanglloyd]

The real fault is that there is no fuse in _every_ plug. In the UK we
are fortunate that that is standard (together with ring-main wiring).
Such fuses can be nominated appropriate to the equipment at the other
end of the wire.

If the varistor is likely to overheat (and it is) then the supply
should have the cheap option of a thermal cutout that I have seen in
many equipment.

Cheap equipment is designed to cheap standards (if any).

Alan Lloyd

 

[bud--]

Figure 8 shows two TVs. One is damaged because 8000 volts is created
across that TV - by a circuit using a plug-in protector that was not
properly earthed.

Guide shows how a plug-in protector can even contribute to electronic
damage.

Repeating from my last post:
For those who can read, Fig 8 is part of the IEEE explanation of how
SREs work. For those who can read, the IEEE guide recognizes plug-in
surge suppressors as effective.

Bud says Figure 8 is a recommendation. Instead, the ctiation
shows how a plug-in protector can work AND how it can create
electronics damage.
Technical
discussion is not a recommendataion - as Bud posts.

Repeating:
To take only one example: the IEEE guide, chapter 6, "SPECIFIC
PROTECTION EXAMPLES" shows 2 examples of surge protection. Both use
SREs.
Saying the guides take a lot of space describing, but not recommending
plug-in surge protectors is sutpid. Repeatedly making this claim
requires willful stupidity.

For IEEE recommendations, one consults Standards such as IEEE Red
Book (Standard 141) and IEEE Green Book (Standard 142). What does IEEE
recommend? Earthing.

Repeating:
And you also have to be stupid to think the IEEE would publish a guide
to the general public that violates the IEEE color books.

What does Bud avoid discussing? Earthing. No
earth ground means no effective protection.

Repeating:
Your religious views about earthing are still not relevant. As
described numerous times, the IEEE guide clearly describes plug-in
suppressors as CLAMPING the voltage on all wires to the common ground
at the protector. Earthing is described as secondary. As you seem to
forget, the IEEE guide was published by the IEEE.


Both the IEEE and NIST recognize plug-in surge suppressors as
effective.
Links to sites that say plug-in suppressors are effective: 2
Your links to sites that say plug-in suppressors are not effective:
still 0
5,347,823 crackpots on the internet and you can't find one who
agrees with you?

bud--