Can't shut computer off

G

glee

Paul said:
glee said:
J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
In message <[email protected]>, glee
[]
Give exact examples of what specific problems you encountered from
so-called Registry "clutter" and what Registry entries were found
by your registry cleaner that you claim fixed the issue. Most
Registry

Playing devil's advocate: give exact examples of what specific
problems you encountered from registry cleaners.
snip

Some of the Registry "fixes' on Ramesh's site are directly related to
repairing damage done by Registry cleaners, such as breaking Windows
Help and Support, Search, etc.
http://windowsxp.mvps.org/

The Windows Update forums over the years have documented numerous
issues with Windows, and with activation issues, that are the result
of entries "cleaned" from the Registry. You've spent a long time in
the newsgroups, I would think you have seen these reported for
years.... although if you never strayed out of the
"general.discussion" groups you may not have.

I didn't bring up the topic and make the obnoxious remarks, Twayne
did. He cited nothing, and I asked for some specifics to back up his
claim. The ball was in his court and he punted with insults. I'm not
wasting my time on it.

Once you get past the advert here, the comparison test
tells you a lot about the area.

http://www.informationweek.com/langa-letter-testing-10-windows-registry/171203805?pgno=2

JV16 PowerTools 1.3.0.195 307 (122)
JV16 PowerTools 2005: 800 (53,691,56)
EasyCleaner: 99,0,0
Registry Mechanic: 39(58),19
Registry Repair: 691,124,200
Registry First Aid: 59,123,109
RegistryMedic: 100,80,68
The Registry Drill: 134,110,109
RegistryFix: 105,66,55
CleanMyPC: 130,114,112

"EasyCleaner is the best free tool currently available"

Isn't it amazing, that only the *free* tool deserves the title of
"utility",
while the commercial ones can't manage to find the same things, can't
converge to "zero problems found" ? I'd say Snake Oil sums it
up pretty well. You're fixing something, with apparently
no definition of "broken".

Can I write a random number generator for $29.95 and charge
you for it ? Yes, I think I can manage that. You have 493 "problems",
and when you check again, you'll have 317 problems, and later
today you'll have 19 problems. All via the skillful usage
of my random number generator. Did I touch your registry ?
Of course not :) Why would I do that, when you're a sucker
for this stuff ?

Paul

There's money out there and a sucker is born every minute, I'm told. I
ran EasyCleaner for its report many times in Win9x, but never used it to
actually remove anything, because it never found anything that actually
needed removing. The accent is on "needed". The utility was the best
of the bunch, to be sure.... still not recommended for the "average"
user, IMHO. That was a decent article, thanks for the link.
 
G

glee

Ken Blake said:
He's been on my killfile for a long while now. I don't have to read
his nonsense except when I see it in a quoted message.

LOL... sorry to subject you to the quoted nonsense, in that case!
Reading some of his other replies and posts, I see what you mean by
nonsense.
 
K

Ken Blake, MVP

LOL... sorry to subject you to the quoted nonsense, in that case!


Not to worry. It happens. But I wish my killfile could work not just
on the From line but also in the body of the message.

Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP
 
T

Twayne

In
Ken Blake said:
Not to worry. It happens. But I wish my killfile could
work not just on the From line but also in the body of
the message.

Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP

It can.
 
T

Twayne

In
glee said:
Well the one I believe you stated you use (PC Tools
Registry Mechanic) claims to have a Compaction
feature.... if you use the software, you should be able
to say if it does or not. It's not automatic, it's a
specific tool you have to choose separately as far as I
can see. The fact that a user of the tool like yourself
isn't aware of its features is indicative of either poor
skills by the user (which I doubt in your case) or a
poorly written or documented program. Whether it
actually compacts I don't know. I see no reason for
anyone to buy a useless "cleaner" to get a compaction
feature, when it can be done with the free utility
NTRegOpt, available separately or bundled with the free
ERUNT: http://www.larshederer.homepage.t-online.de/erunt/

NTRegopt is a good tool, but it's has nothing to do with "compacting" or
anything like it. All NTRegopt does is organize things in a sensible order
and eliminate dead space. That alone makes it worth using now and then, In
some cases it can make a noticeable difference in boot time.
Another tool that helps is UPHclean, a User Process manager. It can help
with long shut-down times and does also make occasional difference in shut
down time.
I did download Erunt once but wasn't impressed so didn't leave it
installed.

HTH,

Twayne`
 
G

glee

J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
glee said:
J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
In message <[email protected]>, glee
[]
Give exact examples of what specific problems you encountered from
so-called Registry "clutter" and what Registry entries were found by
your registry cleaner that you claim fixed the issue. Most Registry

Playing devil's advocate: give exact examples of what specific
problems you encountered from registry cleaners.
snip

Some of the Registry "fixes' on Ramesh's site are directly related to
repairing damage done by Registry cleaners, such as breaking Windows
Help and Support, Search, etc.
http://windowsxp.mvps.org/

The Windows Update forums over the years have documented numerous
issues with Windows, and with activation issues, that are the result
of entries "cleaned" from the Registry. You've spent a long time in
the newsgroups, I would think you have seen these reported for
years.... although if you never strayed out of the
"general.discussion" groups you may not have.

I didn't bring up the topic and make the obnoxious remarks, Twayne
did. He cited nothing, and I asked for some specifics to back up his
claim. The ball was in his court and he punted with insults. I'm not
wasting my time on it.

Basically, both sides of this debate have asked the other to give
specific examples (one side asking for things that so-called registry
cleaners have found that genuinely improve things, the other side
asking for definite things RCs have broken).

The above is the closest (from the anti-RC camp) so far - not a
specific example, but at least a link to some such examples.

There are lots of examples, especially if you have spent time over the
years fixing the issues caused by so-called cleaners. I have yet to see
an example from anyone of a definitive case where a 'cleaner' did
anything useful.
 
G

glee

Twayne said:
In

NTRegopt is a good tool, but it's has nothing to do with "compacting"
or anything like it. All NTRegopt does is organize things in a
sensible order and eliminate dead space. That alone makes it worth
using now and then, In some cases it can make a noticeable difference
in boot time.
Another tool that helps is UPHclean, a User Process manager. It can
help with long shut-down times and does also make occasional
difference in shut down time.
I did download Erunt once but wasn't impressed so didn't leave it
installed.


Proving that you don't know what compaction of the Registry is...
NTRegOpt compacts the Registry, that's what its "optimization" is. Try
reading their own documentation.
http://www.larshederer.homepage.t-online.de/erunt/ntregopt.txt
 
D

dadiOH

Twayne said:
NTRegopt is a good tool, but it's has nothing to do with "compacting"
or anything like it. All NTRegopt does is organize things in a
sensible order and eliminate dead space.

Elimination of "dead space" *IS* compaction.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net
 
T

Twayne

In
glee said:
Proving that you don't know what compaction of the
Registry is... NTRegOpt compacts the Registry, that's
what its "optimization" is. Try reading their own
documentation.
http://www.larshederer.homepage.t-online.de/erunt/ntregopt.txt

The "compaction" is precisely what I described; call it what you want, but
.... it works. It's like OE wanting to "compact" every hundred openings or
whatever number it may be.
"Compact" is a generic term that many can understand but without any
precise detail. I always like to know the details of what's going on. The
word has a long description/meaning and explains little used by itself.
Compacting a registry actually re-arranges registry entries in sequence for
better timing, removing dead space and a few other niceties, but it makes
zero changes to the registry's actual contents. It's a word that can also be
used for more than database functions.

HTH,

Twayne`
 
T

Twayne

In
dadiOH said:
Elimination of "dead space" *IS* compaction.

There you go: 1 detail, many left out, and nothing that explains what
happens when "compacting" happens other than dead space s alleviated.
Compaction does a LOT more than that, by defntion.

HTH,

Twayne`
 
G

glee

Twayne said:
In

The "compaction" is precisely what I described; call it what you want,
but ... it works. It's like OE wanting to "compact" every hundred
openings or whatever number it may be.
"Compact" is a generic term that many can understand but without
any precise detail. I always like to know the details of what's going
on. The word has a long description/meaning and explains little used
by itself. Compacting a registry actually re-arranges registry entries
in sequence for better timing, removing dead space and a few other
niceties, but it makes zero changes to the registry's actual contents.
It's a word that can also be used for more than database functions.


Your original statement that I replied to was:
"NTRegopt is a good tool, but it's has nothing to do with "compacting"
or
anything like it. All NTRegopt does is organize things in a sensible
order
and eliminate dead space."

Yet that is what compacting does... it compacts the size of the Registry
by rewriting the hives, removing the slack space so the hives are the
smallest size possible. There is no mention or indication that it
reorganizes the order of the entries in the hives. Compacting is not a
generic term when discussing Registry utilities. Your reply just
reinforces my statement that you didn't know what Registry compaction
was. ::shrug::

Moving along... I noticed your post on Christmas Eve re: your missing
Office XP toolbar. Did it ever occur to you that your repeated use of
Registry "cleaners" could be behind its repeated disappearance?
 
T

Twayne

....
Your original statement that I replied to was:
"NTRegopt is a good tool, but it's has nothing to do with
"compacting" or
anything like it. All NTRegopt does is organize things in
a sensible order
and eliminate dead space."

Yet that is what compacting does... it compacts the size
of the Registry by rewriting the hives,

No, it does NOT rewrite anything. It MOVES it to a sensible order so it can
be run more efficiently. At the same time it moves all extraneous lines to
top or bottom, I forget which, and deletes them.

removing the
slack space so the hives are the smallest size possible.

It tries; sometimes multiple runs are required too.
There is no mention or indication that it reorganizes the
order of the entries in the hives.

There certainly is: you need to do some research.

NTREGOPT
========

Registry Optimization for Windows NT/2000/2003/XP

v1.1j, 10/20/2005, Freeware
Written by Lars Hederer
e-mail: (e-mail address removed)

Look for the latest version here:
http://www.larshederer.homepage.t-online.de/erunt

To find out what's new in this version, please see the "Version
history" section later in this file.



Introduction
------------

Similar to Windows 9x/Me, the registry files in an NT-based system
can become fragmented over time, occupying more space on your hard
disk than necessary and decreasing overall performance. You should
use the NTREGOPT utility regularly, but especially after installing
or uninstalling a program, to minimize the size of the registry files
and optimize registry access.

The program works by recreating each registry hive "from scratch",
thus removing any slack space that may be left from previously
modified or deleted keys.

Optimizing the registry with NTREGOPT


Note: To ensure proper operation of NTREGOPT, you should be logged in
as a system administrator.

To optimize your registry, simply run NTREGOPT, click "OK", and when
the process is complete click "OK" to reboot the computer. You should
do so immediately because any changes made to the registry after
NTREGOPT has been run are lost after the reboot.

Note that depending on your system configuration the optimization
process may take some time, and that the first bar is NOT a progress
bar, just an indicator that the program is still running.

Known problems
--------------

NTREGOPT sometimes fails with error 1450 - "Insufficient system
resources exist to complete the requested service" - when trying to
save an optimized registry hive. I have not yet been able to reproduce
this error on any PC, and reports from affected users indicate that it
also pops up when trying to back up the critical hive using
Microsoft's REGBACK program. This makes it unlikely that there is
anything I can do on my (the programmer's) side. Some users reported
however that they were able to work around the problem by running
NTREGOPT in Windows' safe mode, and in one case uninstalling a
Symantec software suite solved it permanently. One user reported that
increasing the "IRPStackSize" value as described in Microsoft
Knowledge Base article 177078 fixed the problem on his system.

When the system is rebooted after an optimization with NTREGOPT,
Windows Server 2003 will by default display the shutdown event tracker
during logon asking why the system has been shut down unexpectedly.
This is because the info that the shutdown was in fact an expected one
is written to the "old" registry during shutdown of the system which
is replaced by the optimized registry next time the system is booted,
and therefore the shutdown info is discarded and shutdown event
tracker thinks the system crashed. You may want to disable the tracker
to avoid this message in the future (see the Windows help for
information on how to do this).

If you experience any other problems, please email me at
(e-mail address removed) with a detailed description and I will see if
I can help you.



Localization
------------

You can translate this program into your language by editing the
NTREGOPT.LOC file.

Keep in mind that the file should be edited using a Windows based
editor (Notepad), to ensure that any OEM characters are displayed
correctly in the program.

If your language is not yet present on my homepage and you want your
localization to be available to the general public, you are welcome to
send your translated file to me. I will then make it available for
download, with credits of course.

I have included a German language file. If you want to use the program
in German, simply unzip LOC_GER.ZIP into your NTREGOPT folder.



Version history
---------------

v1.1j, 10/20/2005
- Fixed compatibility issues with 64-bit Windows (many thanks to
Ian Smith and Hajo for all testing)
- Enhanced error messages

v1.1i, 08/17/2005
- Optimization results are now calculated correctly when optimization
failed on one or more hives

v1.1h, 03/06/2005
- Updated homepage address

v1.1f, 08/26/2004
- Window position is now screen center instead of desktop center,
fixing display problem when using multiple monitors (thanks John :)

v1.1e, 07/31/2004
- Optimization results: use thousand separator

v1.1d, 07/07/2004
- Optimized error handling

v1.1c, 05/10/2004
- Fixed problems with dynamic disks
- Re-added support for Windows NT 3.51 (got lost with v1.1)

v1.1b, 04/23/2004
- NTREGOPT is now compatible with Windows Server 2003 and Windows XP
Service Pack 2
- Fixed a problem where the registry hives could not be optimized on
some systems

v1.1a, 10/03/2002
- Fixed a problem where the registry hives could not be optimized on
some systems

v1.1, 09/25/2002
- Added command line support
- Show optimization results (initial and new registry size)

v1.0, 11/24/2001
- Initial release



Distribution
------------

The NTREGOPT program is freeware. Please pass it to anyone who you
think may find it useful.

I explicitly allow this program to be included in any file archive,
CD-ROM or other media collection as well as usage in your own programs
provided that all files are kept and remain unchanged. A quick note
via e-mail where my program has been included is appreciated.



Donations
---------

Though I chose to make my programs freeware so that no one is required
to pay for using them, I accept and appreciate donations. So, if you
find my programs helpful and want to support further development,
simply visit my homepage and click one of the "PayPal" buttons, or
donate directly to my e-mail address via PayPal. Thanks in advance!

If you live in Germany and want to make a donation, you may also
transfer money directly to my bank account. Contact me for more
information.



Disclaimer
----------

Use this software at your own risk. I do not take responsibility for
anything that might happen to you or the PC upon use of my program,
including but not limited to: registry destruction, hard disk crash,
heart attack...

Comments and suggestions via e-mail, however, are always welcome!


======================
Moving along... I noticed your post on Christmas Eve re:
your missing Office XP toolbar. Did it ever occur to you
that your repeated use of Registry "cleaners" could be
behind its repeated disappearance?

Nope! I hadn't run the registry cleaner in some time. Plus, just in case, I
looked at the quarantine record to see if it was there - then I could have
put it back.
I HAD run MalwareBytes though I doubt it was responsible for it since it
found nothing. Same with other tools.

You have a: Mind like a beartrap; closed hard.
 
D

dadiOH

Twayne said:
...


No, it does NOT rewrite anything. It MOVES it to a sensible order so
it can be run more efficiently. At the same time it moves all
extraneous lines to top or bottom, I forget which, and deletes them.

Read what you quoted (and what I retained below). It recreates the files
*from scratch*. That means it (a) reads it and then (b) writes it. From
scratch. That means a NEW file.
removing the

It tries; sometimes multiple runs are required too.


There certainly is: you need to do some research.

That's not what you quoted says. There is no need to reorganize
anything...just read, and write what was read *IF* it should be retained; if
not, skip to the next to retain. Et cetera.. That's SOP for sequential
access files including OE's compaction.
______________________

--

dadiOH

The program works by recreating each registry hive "from scratch",
thus removing any slack space that may be left from previously
modified or deleted keys.
<snip>
 
T

Twayne

In
dadiOH said:
Read what you quoted (and what I retained below). It
recreates the files *from scratch*. That means it (a)
reads it and then (b) writes it. From scratch. That
means a NEW file.

That's not what you quoted says. There is no need to
reorganize anything...just read, and write what was read
*IF* it should be retained; if not, skip to the next to
retain. Et cetera.. That's SOP for sequential access
files including OE's compaction. ______________________



<snip>

Nah, there's lots of data out there on this - go look up some of them
yourself if you want more detail. All I'd have done with more deail is
scared off more readers by letting it get so boring no one wants to read it.

For the "snake-oil" people out there:

On the other side of the coin, I had a machine in today that was a holiday
gift to a college student but it was over-run with viruses and other
malware. It indicated 4,322 Registry errors including ActiveX, Invalid
Application Paths, Invald Fle Extensions, Help File problems, MS Shared
Files missing, a lot of uninstall information missing and so on and so on..
I chose Norton's Fix All setting, unwilling to go through that many
entriies myself. Worst case I'd have to do a reinstall for him of some apps.
It started taking a little over 7 minutes to boot, too, BTW.
After the Repair All, all his installed programs still worked. I could
find no problems whatsoever.
The next thing I did was clean out his Add/Remove Programs blanks and
invalids using Add/RemovePro, ran the Registry analyzer again, and no
problems turned up other than a couple us shortcut problems.
Boot time after the work was slightly over 2 minutes, not too bad for a
machine loaded with MSO software and a host of other utilities, not all of
which needed registry entries.
Now I'm not finding any heuristic viral problems or anti-malware finds of
problems other than cookies which isn't a registry issue. So all in all he
got away cheap because I didn't charge for the couple hours looking for
anything that didn't work quite right. I also updated him from IE6 to IE8 in
the process and gave his some free utils including UPHclean and NTRegopt,
gratis. He should be in decent shape for college now where MSO is a
requirement to have.
I warrant my work for 30 days but for kids like this I don't stick to a
strict 30 days; iit's a pleasure to help him, actually. Any person with a
fulltime job though; they pay the full fees, including the DVD backups I
provide.

I can just imagine what the narcissistic closed mind will respond to this,
regardless of the nym he uses for the moment but he's not a person I often
read much unless I just want to irritate him<G>.

He should also note that I didn't spew this all over every group I could
think of, whether it was on topic or off topic. I'm a real user, not just
some dummy who needs to berate others to boost my ego.

HTH,

Twayne`
 
J

J. P. Gilliver (John)

Twayne said:
In Ken Blake, MVP <[email protected]> typed: []
Not to worry. It happens. But I wish my killfile could
work not just on the From line but also in the body of
the message.

Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP

It can.
May depend on what email client (or external utility or service) is
implementing the killfile.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Worst programme ever made? I was in hospital once having a knee operation and I
watched a whole episode of "EastEnders". Ugh! I suppose it's true to life. But
so is diarrhoea - and I don't want to see that on television. - Patrick Moore,
in Radio Times 12-18 May 2007.
 
G

glee

Twayne said:
snip of irrelevancies
I can just imagine what the narcissistic closed mind will respond to
this, regardless of the nym he uses for the moment but he's not a
person I often read much unless I just want to irritate him<G>.

He should also note that I didn't spew this all over every group I
could think of, whether it was on topic or off topic. I'm a real user,
not just some dummy who needs to berate others to boost my ego.

I don't know what you're going on about other than to prove yet again
that you don't know what you are talking about, but I have been posting
with the same posting name of "glee" and my real name in my signature,
and no other, for 15 years in both MSFT and non-MSFT newsgroups, as well
as web forums.
 
G

glee

replied inline...
Twayne said:
No, it does NOT rewrite anything. It MOVES it to a sensible order so
it can be run more efficiently. At the same time it moves all
extraneous lines to top or bottom, I forget which, and deletes them.


It states right in the text you copied from its readme file that "The
program works by recreating each registry hive "from scratch"..."
Recreating from scratch means rewriting, not moving. It doesn't add or
change any Registry entries, but it rewrites them... recreates them.
This is basic reading comprehension.

snip

There certainly is: you need to do some research.


Again.... there is no mention in the readme you posted that it
"reorganizes the order of the entries. Kindly point out where you see
that stated by the program author. If it is mentioned in other
documentation, please post what documentation you found the info in.

Nope! I hadn't run the registry cleaner in some time. Plus, just in
case, I looked at the quarantine record to see if it was there - then
I could have put it back.
I HAD run MalwareBytes though I doubt it was responsible for it
since it found nothing. Same with other tools.

You have a: Mind like a beartrap; closed hard.

Not at all.... you're repeatedly demonstrating that your mind is closed.
You looked at the removed entries by your 'cleaner' and didn't see the
OSA.exe entry so claim the cleaner didn't cause an issue with the Office
Toolbar. Well, the OSA.exe entry isn't in the Registry, it's in the
Common Startup folder. My statement referred to your 'cleaner' possibly
removing other Office-related entries that you do not see as being
related, but which could effect whether the Startup folder item
disappeared as a result. If you removed particular entries that you are
not aware are internally related to the toolbar installation, the
Startup folder entry might have disappeared as a side effect. You are
unable to wrap your mind about any possibility that your 'cleaner' could
have any negative effect.
 
G

glee

J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
glee said:
J. P. Gilliver (John) said:
In message <[email protected]>, glee
[]
Give exact examples of what specific problems you encountered from
so-called Registry "clutter" and what Registry entries were found by
your registry cleaner that you claim fixed the issue. Most Registry

Playing devil's advocate: give exact examples of what specific
problems you encountered from registry cleaners.
snip

Some of the Registry "fixes' on Ramesh's site are directly related to
repairing damage done by Registry cleaners, such as breaking Windows
Help and Support, Search, etc.
http://windowsxp.mvps.org/

The Windows Update forums over the years have documented numerous
issues with Windows, and with activation issues, that are the result
of entries "cleaned" from the Registry. You've spent a long time in
the newsgroups, I would think you have seen these reported for
years.... although if you never strayed out of the
"general.discussion" groups you may not have.

I didn't bring up the topic and make the obnoxious remarks, Twayne
did. He cited nothing, and I asked for some specifics to back up his
claim. The ball was in his court and he punted with insults. I'm not
wasting my time on it.

Basically, both sides of this debate have asked the other to give
specific examples (one side asking for things that so-called registry
cleaners have found that genuinely improve things, the other side
asking for definite things RCs have broken).

The above is the closest (from the anti-RC camp) so far - not a
specific example, but at least a link to some such examples.


J.P., this just came up today on a client's Win7 computer that is only
months old: Microsoft 2010 programs would not start at all, only an
error message related to the virtualization handler (CVH.exe) would pop
up. Office Click2Run was installed. Attempting to run either a repair
or an uninstall from Control Panel for either Office itself or for
Click2Run resulted in the same error message. This is a known effect on
Office 2007 and 2010 from running a Registry cleaner. Special removal
tools must be run to uninstall all traces of Office and Click2Run, and
then Office must be reinstalled from scratch, to fix the mess.

It's just another in the long list of issues that have been directly
connected to the use of Registry 'cleaners' over the years.
 
G

glee

Bill in Co said:
It's called projection. Psych 101. Geesh. "Elementary, my dear
Watson".
(C'mon, Glen, let's move on, lest I start in on what's the best music
era. :)

We both like Joplin, Bill.... it's just that you prefer Scott while I
prefer Janis.
;-)
 
T

Twayne

No, NOTHING get changed, only reorganized / re-ordered.
It states right in the text you copied from its readme
file that "The program works by recreating each registry
hive "from scratch"..." Recreating from scratch means
rewriting, not moving.

Uhh, and what do you think; NOTHING in the registry is CHANGED! Every entry
remains identical to what it was. Regardless of HOW it's done, that is the
end result!

It doesn't add or change any
Registry entries, but it rewrites them... recreates them.
This is basic reading comprehension.

No, it's basc comprehenson actually. The End Result is that no entry is
CHANGED other than its order in the hives.
Again.... there is no mention in the readme you posted
that it "reorganizes the order of the entries. Kindly
point out where you see that stated by the program
author. If it is mentioned in other documentation,
please post what documentation you found the info in.

And again, I never said that was a perfect, all-inclusive description. If
you really want to know more, do your own research. There are gazillions of
decent articles on the Registry online and ranginig from the first
appearance of the registry to today's versions. I'm not some hard-headed
rock like you who needs to be spoon fed everything - I'm not afraid of doing
my own research for many years. I see no need to spoon feed you anything
more - do it yourself.
Not at all.... you're repeatedly demonstrating that your
mind is closed.

No, the only thing I demonstrate is that I DO have an open mind, I don't let
others lead me. The most others can do is make me curious enough to do my
own research whether I'm certain you are wrong or right. Here, all you do is
parrot from a closed mind what you've been spoon fed.

You looked at the removed entries by your
'cleaner' and didn't see the OSA.exe entry so claim the
cleaner didn't cause an issue with the Office Toolbar.

It didn't. EVERY action by it is recorded and saved for later undo moves if
necessary. There actually are some programs that look like malware but
aren't, so in some cases that could be very useful, being able to undo
changes.
Well, the OSA.exe entry isn't in the Registry, it's in
the Common Startup folder. My statement referred to your
'cleaner' possibly removing other Office-related entries
that you do not see as being related, but which could
effect whether the Startup folder item disappeared as a
result.

If it's not in quarantine then it wasn't touched by the cleaner. This
particular cleaner checks paths and entries both IN the registry and on
disk. It does a lot of niceties by pulling up needed info for fixes, on-disk
paths and shortcuts, anything in memory, Program Integrity and many more
checks. EVERYthing is recoverable.

If you removed particular entries that you are
not aware are internally related to the toolbar
installation, the Startup folder entry might have
disappeared as a side effect. You are unable to wrap
your mind about any possibility that your 'cleaner' could
have any negative effect.

You say :unable: I say I know my applications well enough and have used the
long enough to KNOW what they do and in the early days and even occasionally
check on the things it did. It has always been 100% accurate. That's easy
for me to check on because I don't let my registry become a quagmire of
errors and un-needed entriess to make it difficult to check. I seriously
doubt you would be able to easily find anything in the records from a
cleaner that would be useful without a LOT of work.
It's the dummy who allows Errors to exist that eventually suffers the
worst case results.

I think I'm through bothering with your posts; as with many "MVP" types you
think you are superior and work hard to make it seem so.
 

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