can't see WinME on XP

[Ogg]

I have a WinMe pc (configured as ICS host, btw) with a peer-to-peer XP.
Internet sharing works fine. I can access XP's files from the WInMe fine
too. But the WinMe doesn't show up on the XP's "View Workgroup Computers".
The workgroup name IS the same (MSHOME) on both computers. What could be
the problem? Also.. lately, I seem to have lost access to the
shared-printer that was configured on the XP.. but that is maybe an
unrelated issue?

 

[Chuck]

I have a WinMe pc (configured as ICS host, btw) with a peer-to-peer XP.
Internet sharing works fine. I can access XP's files from the WInMe fine
too. But the WinMe doesn't show up on the XP's "View Workgroup Computers".
The workgroup name IS the same (MSHOME) on both computers. What could be
the problem? Also.. lately, I seem to have lost access to the
shared-printer that was configured on the XP.. but that is maybe an
unrelated issue?

You might want to first look for a misconfigured or overlooked personal
firewall, or other security component. There are several other possibilities
too, and any might be the cause of your problem.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/10/irregularities-in-workgroup-visibility.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/10/irregularities-in-workgroup-visibility.html

Or you could provide "browstat status" and "ipconfig /all" from each computer,
so we can diagnose the problem. Read this article, and linked articles, and
follow instructions precisely (download browstat!):
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/troubleshooting-network-neighborhood.html#AskingForHelp>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/troubleshooting-network-neighborhood.html#AskingForHelp

It's possible that the shared printer problem is related to the other problem.
Let's try and solve one problem at a time.

 

[Ogg]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Sun, 02 Apr 2006 23:48:45 -0700:

C> You might want to first look for a misconfigured or overlooked personal
C> firewall, or other security component.

There is no firewall on the ICS host pc (the WinME)

C> Or you could provide "browstat status" and "ipconfig /all" from each
C> computer, so we can diagnose the problem. ...
C> It's possible that the shared printer problem is related to the other
C> problem. Let's try and solve one problem at a time.

Bummer.. today at bootup on the WinME pc, I don't even see the WinME pc in
the "Entire Network" folder! It use to be there. Prior to that, I disabled
the Browse Master. Hmmm.. I'll put that back to Automatic.


Thanks Chuck! Here's "ipconfig /all" for the WinME pc:

Windows IP Configuration

Host Name . . . . . . . . . : WINME
DNS Servers . . . . . . . . : 67.69.184.220
67.69.184.156
Node Type . . . . . . . . . : Broadcast
NetBIOS Scope ID. . . . . . :
IP Routing Enabled. . . . . : Yes
WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . : No
NetBIOS Resolution Uses DNS : No

0 Ethernet adapter :

Description . . . . . . . . : ICSHARE Adapter.
Physical Address. . . . . . : 44-45-53-54-00-00
DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . : Yes
IP Address. . . . . . . . . : 206.172.235.64
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . : 206.172.235.64
DHCP Server . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.255
Primary WINS Server . . . . :
Secondary WINS Server . . . :
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . : 01 01 80 12:00:00 AM
Lease Expires . . . . . . . : 01 01 80 12:00:00 AM

1 Ethernet adapter :

Description . . . . . . . . : D-Link DFE-538TX 10/100 Adapter
Physical Address. . . . . . : 00-0D-88-40-88-AC
DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
IP Address. . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . :
Primary WINS Server . . . . :
Secondary WINS Server . . . :
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . :
Lease Expires . . . . . . . :

2 Ethernet adapter :

Description . . . . . . . . : PPP Adapter.
Physical Address. . . . . . : 44-45-53-54-00-01
DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . : Yes
IP Address. . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . :
DHCP Server . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.255
Primary WINS Server . . . . :
Secondary WINS Server . . . :
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . :
Lease Expires . . . . . . . :

===========================================
Here is the "ipconfig /all" for the XP pc:

Windows IP Configuration

Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : TheRoze
Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :
Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Hybrid
IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No

Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : mshome.net
Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Realtek RTL8139 Family PCI Fast
Ethernet NIC
Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-40-2B-3B-2D-A4
Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.2
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Monday, April 03, 2006 10:07:02
AM
Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Tuesday, April 04, 2006 10:07:02
AM


===========================================
Here is "browstat status" from the XP pc:

Status for domain KOLICO on transport
\Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{5B5AA5A5-EE8E-41A5-AA19-D7E5600EAEE2}
Browsing is active on domain.
Master browser name is: THEROZE
Master browser is running build 2600
1 backup servers retrieved from master THEROZE
\\THEROZE
There are 1 servers in domain KOLICO on transport
\Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{5B5AA5A5-EE8E-41A5-AA19-D7E5600EAEE2}
There are 1 domains in domain KOLICO on transport
\Device\NetBT_Tcpip_{5B5AA5A5-EE8E-41A5-AA19-D7E5600EAEE2}

==========================================
Here is "browstat listwfw kolico" from the XP pc:

Calling NetServerEnum to enumerate WFW servers.
0 WFW servers returned. 0 total.
There are WFW servers with an active Browser.

==========================================
Will any of this actually help?

 

[Chuck]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Sun, 02 Apr 2006 23:48:45 -0700:

C> You might want to first look for a misconfigured or overlooked personal
C> firewall, or other security component.

There is no firewall on the ICS host pc (the WinME)

C> Or you could provide "browstat status" and "ipconfig /all" from each
C> computer, so we can diagnose the problem. ...
C> It's possible that the shared printer problem is related to the other
C> problem. Let's try and solve one problem at a time.

Bummer.. today at bootup on the WinME pc, I don't even see the WinME pc in
the "Entire Network" folder! It use to be there. Prior to that, I disabled
the Browse Master. Hmmm.. I'll put that back to Automatic.


Thanks Chuck! Here's "ipconfig /all" for the WinME pc:

Will any of this actually help?

Can't hurt. I see no extraneous protocols or transports.

So you say that you're re enabling the Browse Master on WinME. If so, did you
disable the Browser service on TheRoze? You shouldn't have both.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/windows-9x-9598me-and-browser.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/windows-9x-9598me-and-browser.html

Now, besides the browser service issue, and firewalls, there are several
settings that could cause your problem. Go thru my troubleshooting guide, which
provides links to other issues that you need to consider, here are but 2
examples.
# Check for an anonymous access restriction. Any computer which restricts
anonymous access can't be enumerated by the browser.
# Check for an invisibility restriction. Any computer that makes itself totally
invisible can't be seen by the browser, or any other means.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/10/irregularities-in-workgroup-visibility.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/10/irregularities-in-workgroup-visibility.html

What antivirus products do you have on each computer? There could be other
security products, besides simple personal firewalls, that could cause your
problem. Keep an open mind.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/your-personal-firewall-can-either-help.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/your-personal-firewall-can-either-help.html

And remember to diagnose your problems in an ordered procedure.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/08/solving-network-problems-tutorial.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/08/solving-network-problems-tutorial.html

 

[Ogg]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 08:43:31 -0700:

C> On Mon, 3 Apr 2006 10:13:09 -0400, "Ogg" <[email protected]>
wrote:


C> .... I see no extraneous protocols or transports.

C> So you say that you're re enabling the Browse Master on WinME. If so,
C> did you disable the Browser service on TheRoze? You shouldn't have
C> both.
C> http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/windows-9x-9598me-and-browser.html

Well.. I had disabled the Browser Master on the WinME before I shut of the
computer last night. This morning after bootup, I notice that the usual
"WINME" (local computer) is not listed in the My
NetworkPlace/EntireNetwork/(workgroup). Only the XP computer "THEROZE" is
listed.

Meanwhile.. I checked the status of the Browser Master on the XP.. it's set
to "Automatic". Are you saying it should be completely off on the XP pc? I
never fiddled with Browser Master on the XP in the past. Nor did I fiddle
with Browser Master on the WinME pc either; it was always set to "Automatic"
there too.


C> Now, besides the browser service issue, and firewalls, there are several
C> settings that could cause your problem. Go thru my troubleshooting
C> guide, which provides links to other issues that you need to consider,
C> here are but 2 examples.
C> # Check for an anonymous access restriction. Any computer which
C> restricts anonymous access can't be enumerated by the browser.
C> # Check for an invisibility restriction. Any computer that makes itself
C> totally invisible can't be seen by the browser, or any other means.
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/10/irregularities-in-workgroup-visibility
..html

How does this apply to the WinME pc? According to your text: "Hiding Your
Server From Enumeration
If you don't want your server to be displayed in Network Neighborhood, add a
registry value [HKLM \SYSTEM \CurrentControlSet \Services \LanmanServer
\Parameters \Hidden]. Make Hidden a DWORD, with value "00000001". This will
prevent it from reporting any shares to the browser."

....there is no LanmanServer entry in the WinME's registry.


C> What antivirus products do you have on each computer? There could be
C> other security products, besides simple personal firewalls, that could
C> cause your problem. Keep an open mind.
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/your-personal-firewall-can-either-help
..html

I use AVG on both computers. No firewall products on either.

 

[Chuck]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 08:43:31 -0700:

C> On Mon, 3 Apr 2006 10:13:09 -0400, "Ogg" <[email protected]>
wrote:


C> .... I see no extraneous protocols or transports.

C> So you say that you're re enabling the Browse Master on WinME. If so,
C> did you disable the Browser service on TheRoze? You shouldn't have
C> both.
C> http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/windows-9x-9598me-and-browser.html

Well.. I had disabled the Browser Master on the WinME before I shut of the
computer last night. This morning after bootup, I notice that the usual
"WINME" (local computer) is not listed in the My
NetworkPlace/EntireNetwork/(workgroup). Only the XP computer "THEROZE" is
listed.

Meanwhile.. I checked the status of the Browser Master on the XP.. it's set
to "Automatic". Are you saying it should be completely off on the XP pc? I
never fiddled with Browser Master on the XP in the past. Nor did I fiddle
with Browser Master on the WinME pc either; it was always set to "Automatic"
there too.

What I'm saying is that the Browse Master on Windows 9x (ME), and the browser
service on Windows NT (XP) don't always work properly on the same LAN. If both
computers try to run as the master browser, you'll have the sort of problem that
you're describing. And you can't diagnose it, because you can't run browstat on
Windows 9x.

If the "it worked once, just doesn't work now" bit is a problem, read about the
browser in general.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-see.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-see.html

On a LAN with just 2 computers, you only need the browser on one. Pick one, and
disable the browser on the other. Then restart both computers.

C> Now, besides the browser service issue, and firewalls, there are several
C> settings that could cause your problem. Go thru my troubleshooting
C> guide, which provides links to other issues that you need to consider,
C> here are but 2 examples.
C> # Check for an anonymous access restriction. Any computer which
C> restricts anonymous access can't be enumerated by the browser.
C> # Check for an invisibility restriction. Any computer that makes itself
C> totally invisible can't be seen by the browser, or any other means.
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/10/irregularities-in-workgroup-visibility
.html

How does this apply to the WinME pc? According to your text: "Hiding Your
Server From Enumeration
If you don't want your server to be displayed in Network Neighborhood, add a
registry value [HKLM \SYSTEM \CurrentControlSet \Services \LanmanServer
\Parameters \Hidden]. Make Hidden a DWORD, with value "00000001". This will
prevent it from reporting any shares to the browser."

...there is no LanmanServer entry in the WinME's registry.

Not everything in there will apply to Windows ME. If you carefully check all of
the suggestions I provided, and haven't found anything, it's possible that you
have a problem which is specific to Windows ME. You might be well off to check
in microsoft.public.windowsme.networking.

C> What antivirus products do you have on each computer? There could be
C> other security products, besides simple personal firewalls, that could
C> cause your problem. Keep an open mind.
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/your-personal-firewall-can-either-help
.html

I use AVG on both computers. No firewall products on either.

It's possible that AVG contains an antiworm product. Many antiviruses have
expanded to include this.

And you should have a personal firewall on both computers. If you should manage
to infect either computer, would you want the other infected too?
Multi-functional malware is pretty common these days.

It's possible that you have other problems, and it's also possible that you have
a problem that's discussed in one of the articles, but you've overlooked it.
None of those articles are the same as when they were written, I'm adding
content constantly. And some of the added content comes from folks like you.

Malware, and / or LSP / Winsock corruption, is always a possibility too.

 

[Ogg]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:29:02 -0700:

C> What I'm saying is that the Browse Master on Windows 9x (ME), and the
C> browser service on Windows NT (XP) don't always work properly on the
C> same LAN. If both computers try to run as the master browser, you'll
C> have the sort of problem that you're describing. ....

C> On a LAN with just 2 computers, you only need the browser on one. Pick
C> one, and disable the browser on the other. Then restart both computers.

Ok.. I disabled the "Computer Browser" service on the XP. And I forced
"Browser Master" to Enabled on the WinME. This resulted in a worse
situation; the remote XP pc failed to list on my WinME!

Meanwhile, I renabled Browser Master to "Automatic".

Still searching for a fix to this problem.

OH.. While the Browsers where adjusted as you had recommended, but with no
improvements, I also tried forcing "NETBIOS over TCP" on the XP pc. That
also resulted in a worse situation; NET VIEW would report a "nothing found"
error message. Meanwhile, I changed the setting back to the first option in
the Advanced section (TCP/IP, Advanced, WINS, Default option).

Is there a way to use NBTSTAT to reset things? -R and -RR options sound
like they should help.

 

[Chuck]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 11:29:02 -0700:

C> What I'm saying is that the Browse Master on Windows 9x (ME), and the
C> browser service on Windows NT (XP) don't always work properly on the
C> same LAN. If both computers try to run as the master browser, you'll
C> have the sort of problem that you're describing. ....

C> On a LAN with just 2 computers, you only need the browser on one. Pick
C> one, and disable the browser on the other. Then restart both computers.

Ok.. I disabled the "Computer Browser" service on the XP. And I forced
"Browser Master" to Enabled on the WinME. This resulted in a worse
situation; the remote XP pc failed to list on my WinME!

Meanwhile, I renabled Browser Master to "Automatic".

Still searching for a fix to this problem.

All things being equal, and with no problems, you can use either computer as the
browser. If you're seeing different symptoms, whether or not they're worse, the
difference may lead to discovery of the actual problem. But changing browsers
doesn't by itself cause a problem.

OH.. While the Browsers where adjusted as you had recommended, but with no
improvements, I also tried forcing "NETBIOS over TCP" on the XP pc. That
also resulted in a worse situation; NET VIEW would report a "nothing found"
error message. Meanwhile, I changed the setting back to the first option in
the Advanced section (TCP/IP, Advanced, WINS, Default option).

You don't force NBT, you enable it. The default setting lets the DHCP server
determine the appropriate setting. If you're on a LAN that uses a NAT router
with DHCP, the results there will be indeterminate. So you Enable NBT, to be
able to predict the results.

Is there a way to use NBTSTAT to reset things? -R and -RR options sound
like they should help.

You can use NBTSTAT to reset the remote cache name table, and to send name
release packets to WINS. I doubt that either will fix your problem, but you're
welcome to try. There is no magic bullet fix here - you have to find the
problem, then fix the problem.

If there are any problems with alternate solutions, I try and indicate the
alternates. If two different problems have different solutions (generally the
case), fixing one problem won't magically fix the other. And trying a fix for
one problem, if that problem doesn't exist, won't fix the other either.

But please, make one change at a time. Test each change, as you make it. And
read each one of my articles, as I recommend one to you.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/08/solving-network-problems-tutorial.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/08/solving-network-problems-tutorial.html

Did you reboot both computers after making the browser changes? Was NBT Enabled
on both computers? If so, leave both computers as they are, diagnose the
situation, and let us know. Don't make a change, check it immediately, discover
no improvement, and change things back because "that didn't fix anything".

Be patient and persistent.

 

[Ogg]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 14:55:49 -0700:


C> You don't force NBT, you enable it. The default setting lets the DHCP
C> server determine the appropriate setting. If you're on a LAN that uses
C> a NAT router with DHCP, the results there will be indeterminate. So you
C> Enable NBT, to be able to predict the results.

Ok.. I think I understand. But then why did the file share break when I
selected the 2nd option "NETBIOS over TCP"? If the Default setting is the
same (but allows the DHCP server to determine certain things), why did that
work better than the 2nd option?

Anyway.. all is configured back to the way it was.. and now I still don't
have file sharing working. In otherwords, NET VIEW works on the WinME
pc and lists the local computer only! But NET VIEW fails to detect anything
on the XP pc.

Interestingly.. I can enter \\THEROZE (the networked XP pc) in WinME's
"Start \Run .." panel, and the XP pc lists its shared contents! Meanwhile I
created a Mapped drive K:\\THEROZE for convenience.

But the XP pc does not show up in "Network Places \Entire Network
\groupname..."

"Run \\WINME" from the XP pc reports "cannot find network path".

NET VIEW from the XP pc reports "error 6118".



C> Did you reboot both computers after making the browser changes? Was NBT
C> Enabled on both computers? If so, leave both computers as they are,
C> diagnose the situation, and let us know. Don't make a change, check it
C> immediately, discover no improvement, and change things back because
C> "that didn't fix anything".

Yes.. I rebooted after every adjustment. And... I waited several minutes
incase things needed time to resolve. I've seen this timing issue play out
when the network WAS working fine.


C> Be patient and persistent.

That I am.

Since ICS and internet sharing is working fine, I wonder if it would be
better to uninstall and then reinstall the FileSharing on both computers
from scratch - leaving ICS alone.

 

[Chuck]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 14:55:49 -0700:


C> You don't force NBT, you enable it. The default setting lets the DHCP
C> server determine the appropriate setting. If you're on a LAN that uses
C> a NAT router with DHCP, the results there will be indeterminate. So you
C> Enable NBT, to be able to predict the results.

Ok.. I think I understand. But then why did the file share break when I
selected the 2nd option "NETBIOS over TCP"? If the Default setting is the
same (but allows the DHCP server to determine certain things), why did that
work better than the 2nd option?

Anyway.. all is configured back to the way it was.. and now I still don't
have file sharing working. In otherwords, NET VIEW works on the WinME
pc and lists the local computer only! But NET VIEW fails to detect anything
on the XP pc.

Interestingly.. I can enter \\THEROZE (the networked XP pc) in WinME's
"Start \Run .." panel, and the XP pc lists its shared contents! Meanwhile I
created a Mapped drive K:\\THEROZE for convenience.

But the XP pc does not show up in "Network Places \Entire Network
\groupname..."

"Run \\WINME" from the XP pc reports "cannot find network path".

NET VIEW from the XP pc reports "error 6118".

6118 = "The list of servers for this workgroup is not currently available".

This is symptomatic of a computer that doesn't have access to a browse list.

You view Network Places, based upon the browser subsystem. Did you read the
browser article yet?
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-see.html>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-see.html

The "\\TheRoze" command, on the other hand, establishes a temporary session
directly between your computer and TheRoze. The browser is not involved. Nor
is it involved in "new view TheRoze".

You can use browstat to identify problems with the browser, when the computer is
running Windows NT / 2000 / XP. For best results, you need to run browstat on
each computer. You can't do this on your Windows ME computer, and there's one
of the problems.

C> Did you reboot both computers after making the browser changes? Was NBT
C> Enabled on both computers? If so, leave both computers as they are,
C> diagnose the situation, and let us know. Don't make a change, check it
C> immediately, discover no improvement, and change things back because
C> "that didn't fix anything".

Yes.. I rebooted after every adjustment. And... I waited several minutes
incase things needed time to resolve. I've seen this timing issue play out
when the network WAS working fine.

If you'll kindly read the browser article, you'll note that some browser
displays take up to 48 or 51 minutes to refresh. Not several minutes.

C> Be patient and persistent.

That I am.

See above.

Since ICS and internet sharing is working fine, I wonder if it would be
better to uninstall and then reinstall the FileSharing on both computers
from scratch - leaving ICS alone.

You'd be better off buying a NAT router, and leaving ICS alone. But ICS is not
the cause of this problem.

We can work on the problem, if you'd like. But you'll have to make specific
changes, and leave them while we run tests. Since we can't use browstat from
WinME, we'll have to diagnose problems less directly.

You can't uninstall FileSharing, as a single entity. You can un install and re
install numerous components. But how are you going to know what to un install?
Until you know what's causing your problems, you could make your problems worse
by an un install - re install. All settings, and that's assuming that your
problems are caused by a setting, are not reset by just an un install - re
install.

 

[Ogg]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 17:29:14 -0700:

C> 6118 = "The list of servers for this workgroup is not currently
C> available".

C> This is symptomatic of a computer that doesn't have access to a browse
C> list.

C> You view Network Places, based upon the browser subsystem. Did you read
C> the browser article yet?
C> <http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-s
C> ee.html>
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-see.ht
ml

Yes.. I read the article. Thank you for the detailed explanations. All
that is fine and dandy, but I still like to have it working.

OK.. I am convinced by your explanation about "The rules for detecting the
absence of the master browser ("Browse Master" in Windows 9x) vary between
the 2 platforms. This leads to the problems when a working LAN of Windows 9x
computers has a Windows XP computer added."


C> The "\\TheRoze" command, on the other hand, establishes a temporary
C> session directly between your computer and TheRoze. The browser is not
C> involved. Nor is it involved in "new view TheRoze".

Interesting. Thanks for pointing out that the "browser" thing is not
involved in the NET VIEW command report.


C> If you'll kindly read the browser article, you'll note that some browser
C> displays take up to 48 or 51 minutes to refresh. Not several minutes.

Wow.. 51 minutes.. That's insane. I wonder how many IT persons simply
re-installed full OS's when their networks were not working - when all they
had to do was wait a mere 51 minutes. <g>


??>> Since ICS and internet sharing is working fine, I wonder if it would
??>> be better to uninstall and then reinstall the FileSharing on both
??>> computers from scratch - leaving ICS alone.

C> You'd be better off buying a NAT router, and leaving ICS alone. But ICS
C> is not the cause of this problem.

NAT router is not feasible right now. And thankfully yes.. ICS is not the
cause. I would just like to restore the network operations I enjoyed for
over 5 years before this weirdness happend!


C> We can work on the problem, if you'd like. But you'll have to make
C> specific changes, and leave them while we run tests. Since we can't use
C> browstat from WinME, we'll have to diagnose problems less directly.

Here are the specifics to date:

[1] The browser still remains disabled on the XP, and set to "Automatic" on
the WinME. Now after a full day of use (and atleast a couple of re-boots
inbetween), there is still no presence of the XP pc in the MyNetworkPlaces
on the WinME pc.

[2] I can list, copy to/from the XP shares via Mapped Drives or Start \Run
\\XPpcname

[3] NET VIEW from the WinME pc only lists the local machine.

[4] NET VIEW from the XP pc reports "Error 6118".

[5] @WinME pc: I also "Removed" the presenceof ISX/IPX and NETBEUI on the
WinME pc.

[6] @WinME pc: Client for MS Network Properties is set for "Logon and
Restore Network connections".

[7] @XP pc: the WinME pc still does not show up.


C> You can't uninstall FileSharing, as a single entity. You can un install
C> and re install numerous components. But how are you going to know what
C> to un install? Until you know what's causing your problems, you could
C> make your problems worse by an un install - re install. All settings,
C> and that's assuming that your problems are caused by a setting, are not
C> reset by just an un install - re install.

What next? I'm all ears.

 

[Chuck]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Mon, 03 Apr 2006 17:29:14 -0700:

C> 6118 = "The list of servers for this workgroup is not currently
C> available".

C> This is symptomatic of a computer that doesn't have access to a browse
C> list.

C> You view Network Places, based upon the browser subsystem. Did you read
C> the browser article yet?
C> <http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-s
C> ee.html>
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/04/nt-browser-or-why-cant-i-always-see.ht
ml

Yes.. I read the article. Thank you for the detailed explanations. All
that is fine and dandy, but I still like to have it working.

OK.. I am convinced by your explanation about "The rules for detecting the
absence of the master browser ("Browse Master" in Windows 9x) vary between
the 2 platforms. This leads to the problems when a working LAN of Windows 9x
computers has a Windows XP computer added."


C> The "\\TheRoze" command, on the other hand, establishes a temporary
C> session directly between your computer and TheRoze. The browser is not
C> involved. Nor is it involved in "new view TheRoze".

Interesting. Thanks for pointing out that the "browser" thing is not
involved in the NET VIEW command report.

The browser is not involved in "net view \\theroze" or "net view \\winme".

C> If you'll kindly read the browser article, you'll note that some browser
C> displays take up to 48 or 51 minutes to refresh. Not several minutes.

Wow.. 51 minutes.. That's insane. I wonder how many IT persons simply
re-installed full OS's when their networks were not working - when all they
had to do was wait a mere 51 minutes. <g>

The 51 minutes is not magical. It's a result of polling, and retries, and the
master browser election process. Read the Microsoft browser article, if you
like, for an explanation. And it's "up to 51 minutes".

??>> Since ICS and internet sharing is working fine, I wonder if it would
??>> be better to uninstall and then reinstall the FileSharing on both
??>> computers from scratch - leaving ICS alone.

C> You'd be better off buying a NAT router, and leaving ICS alone. But ICS
C> is not the cause of this problem.

NAT router is not feasible right now. And thankfully yes.. ICS is not the
cause. I would just like to restore the network operations I enjoyed for
over 5 years before this weirdness happend!

Well, ICS or NAT router, the problems that you have aren't caused by ICS. If
all computers have any connectivity with each other, that is. ICS does provide
a DHCP server. If there's any connectivity at all between the two computers,
DHCP is presumably good.

C> We can work on the problem, if you'd like. But you'll have to make
C> specific changes, and leave them while we run tests. Since we can't use
C> browstat from WinME, we'll have to diagnose problems less directly.

Here are the specifics to date:

[1] The browser still remains disabled on the XP, and set to "Automatic" on
the WinME. Now after a full day of use (and atleast a couple of re-boots
inbetween), there is still no presence of the XP pc in the MyNetworkPlaces
on the WinME pc.

[2] I can list, copy to/from the XP shares via Mapped Drives or Start \Run
\\XPpcname

[3] NET VIEW from the WinME pc only lists the local machine.

[4] NET VIEW from the XP pc reports "Error 6118".

[5] @WinME pc: I also "Removed" the presenceof ISX/IPX and NETBEUI on the
WinME pc.

[6] @WinME pc: Client for MS Network Properties is set for "Logon and
Restore Network connections".

[7] @XP pc: the WinME pc still does not show up.


C> You can't uninstall FileSharing, as a single entity. You can un install
C> and re install numerous components. But how are you going to know what
C> to un install? Until you know what's causing your problems, you could
C> make your problems worse by an un install - re install. All settings,
C> and that's assuming that your problems are caused by a setting, are not
C> reset by just an un install - re install.

What next? I'm all ears.

I would like you to perform 12 specific tests from each computer, under specific
conditions:
1) NetBT Enabled on both computers.
2) ICF / ICS (or WF / ICS), NetBIOS Helper, Server, Workstation services Started
and Automatic on TheRoze.
3) Client for Microsoft Networks, and File and Printer Sharing for Microsoft
Networks, both installed on both computers.
<http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/troubleshooting-network-neighborhood.html#Components>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/troubleshooting-network-neighborhood.html#Components
4) Stop Browse Master on WinME. Have the Computer Browser service Started and
Automatic on TheRoze. Then wait 1 hour. Then perform tests listed below.
5) Start Browse Master on WinME. Have the Computer Browser service Stopped and
Disabled on TheRoze. Then wait 1 hour. Then perform tests listed below.

Tests to be performed, from each computer, after waiting 1 hour:
1) Observe contents of Network Neighborhood (My Network Places), and list which
computers are seen.
2) Start - Run - "\\TheRoze".
3) Start - Run - "\\WinME".
4) "net view".
5) "net view \\theroze".
6) "net view \\winme".
7) "browstat status" and "browstat listwfw kolico" from TheRoze only.

Note that tests 4 - 6 can use redirection, as you did with "browstat status".
Tests 1 - 3 will be a challenge. Do your best.

I'm aware that you've performed several of these tests already, but under what
conditions? Since this is your computer network, I'll leave it to your
discretion to provide results, remembering that accuracy counts heavily here. I
can't see your computers myself, you're my eyes and ears.

 

[Ogg]

Hello, Chuck!
You wrote on Tue, 04 Apr 2006 23:05:07 -0700:

C> I would like you to perform 12 specific tests from each computer, under
C> specific conditions:
C> 1) NetBT Enabled on both computers.
C> 2) ICF / ICS (or WF / ICS), NetBIOS Helper, Server, Workstation services
C> Started and Automatic on TheRoze.
C> 3) Client for Microsoft Networks, and File and Printer Sharing for
C> Microsoft Networks, both installed on both computers.
C> <http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/troubleshooting-network-neighborh
C> ood.html#Components>
C>
http://nitecruzr.blogspot.com/2005/05/troubleshooting-network-neighborhood.h
tml#Components 4) Stop Browse Master on WinME. Have the Computer Browser
service
C> Started and Automatic on TheRoze. Then wait 1 hour. Then perform tests
C> listed below. 5) Start Browse Master on WinME. Have the Computer
C> Browser service Stopped and Disabled on TheRoze. Then wait 1 hour.
C> Then perform tests listed below.

Regarding steps [3] and [4].. do you want me to REBOOT the WinME and TheRoze
pc after I turn OFF/ON the browser?