Can Mail be used with Winxp?

[Unknown]

Well stop and think. Is that a valid test to determine the fragility of OE's
..dbx files?
Are YOU really that stupid?.

 

[Unknown]

Is sheer OK?

And what do shears have to do with it? <eg>

 

[Unknown]

Any disruption can wipe out folders BUT, is that an OE program problem or
the compacting program?
Is all the problems caused by NORTON an XP problem?????

 

[Alias]

That is shear stupidity. Run anything and yank the cord out of the wall.

T-Bird wouldn't even blink.

Why
specifically OE compacting?

Due to the fragile .dbx system, of course!

That said, you can lose power at any moment and those who have lost it
while compacting did not like the effects on their Outhouse Distress one
bit.

Course, if you have a UPS, not a problem unless something else should
happen while compacting.

Another test is to let your default .dbx files such as Inbox grow to a
size over, say, 400 MB and then do some compacting.

Alias

 

[Alias]

Any disruption can wipe out folders BUT, is that an OE program problem or
the compacting program?
Is all the problems caused by NORTON an XP problem?????

Norton has noting to do with the compacting program unless you use
Norton to scan email and then they will conflict and it ain't pretty.

Alias

 

[Bruce Hagen]

My last response.

It is a problem with how OE was developed. It has existed with all versions
of Windows and not related to XP. At least with XP/SP2, a copy of dbx files
is backed up when you compact. OE MVPs fought for that for almost a decade.
That said, any third party program is responsible to make their product
compatible with whatever MS develops. If Norton says their AV works with XP
and IE/OE, then it should work.

I don't know if the chicken came before the egg, but Windows programs come
before third party programs that /claim/ they are compatible.

Again. I am /not/ an advocate for MS. Spend some time in the two major OE
newsgroups. In the time I have been here, lost messages and or entire
folders is the most reported problem. Needless to say, if people backed up
OE, like they should any e-mail client, they could easily fix any screw up.

This is a post from today in the OE General newsgroup.

<QP>
I opened OE this morning and all my created folders under local folders are
gone. The only ones remaining are the defaulted folders of OE. Where did
they
go, and can I restore them? I had lots of emails saved in them that I would
like back. Thanks..
</QP>

It is a rare day that we don't see at least one post like this. Before
people started going to Vista and WinMail, or Windows Live Mail, it was
common to see much more than one such post every day.
--

Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express
Imperial Beach, CA

 

[Gary S. Terhune]

I thought about it a long time ago, watched several colleagues spend months,
IIRC, doing painstaking tests, I may even have participated in them myself,
can't recall. And yes, I can say that pulling the cord from the wall while
an OE folder is being compacted is a valid test of DBX fragility versus
other mail storage systems. Versus just about any other file type, for that
matter. Those same fellas still hang out in the groups, so if you want to
know *why* this is so, or *what* makes DBX files much more fragile under the
stated conditions, the OE groups are the place for you to ask. I recommend
you ask nicely. Or you can even claim that what we're telling you is BS and
somebody "here" (in the OE groups, remember) oughta go over "there" (here)
and tell them what's what!

 

[PA Bear [MS MVP]]

Don't bother asking "why" or "how" (which will cause an OE MVP's eyes to
glaze over), just do some searching of Google Groups. You'll find (tens of)
thousands of archived posts that contain variations on "Don't touch your
computer until the compacting process has ended!" or "Do not cancel
Automatic Compacting, should it occur, and do not attempt to close OE via
Task Manager or shutdown your machine if Automatic Compacting is taking
place."

<QP>
[The compacting] process can take several minutes and you should not attempt
to use your computer until it is finished.
</QP>
Source: http://www.insideoe.com/files/maintain.htm#compact

[http://www.insideoe.com is he OE user's Bible]

OE's been an odd, bug-ridden app ever since it was released over a decade
ago, and all further development was stopped in June 2006. We suspect that
the guy who wrote OE has been permanently confined in a lunatic asylum and
wearing a straightjacket for years.
--
~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
MS MVP-IE, Mail, Security, Windows Desktop Experience - since 2002
AumHa VSOP & Admin http://aumha.net
DTS-L http://dts-l.net/

I thought about it a long time ago, watched several colleagues spend
months,
IIRC, doing painstaking tests, I may even have participated in them
myself,
can't recall. And yes, I can say that pulling the cord from the wall while
an OE folder is being compacted is a valid test of DBX fragility versus
other mail storage systems. Versus just about any other file type, for
that
matter. Those same fellas still hang out in the groups, so if you want to
know *why* this is so, or *what* makes DBX files much more fragile under
the
stated conditions, the OE groups are the place for you to ask. I recommend
you ask nicely. Or you can even claim that what we're telling you is BS
and
somebody "here" (in the OE groups, remember) oughta go over "there" (here)
and tell them what's what!

<snip>

 

[PA Bear [MS MVP]]

Don't bother asking "why" or "how" (which will cause an OE MVP's eyes to
glaze over), just do some searching of Google Groups. You'll find (tens of)
thousands of archived posts that contain variations on "Don't touch your
computer until the compacting process has ended!" or "Do not cancel
Automatic Compacting, should it occur, and do not attempt to close OE via
Task Manager or shutdown your machine if Automatic Compacting is taking
place."

<QP>
[The compacting] process can take several minutes and you should not attempt
to use your computer until it is finished.
</QP>
Source: http://www.insideoe.com/files/maintain.htm#compact

[http://www.insideoe.com is he OE user's Bible]

OE's been an odd, bug-ridden app ever since it was released over a decade
ago, and all further development was stopped in June 2006. We suspect that
the guy who wrote OE has been permanently confined in a lunatic asylum and
wearing a straightjacket for years. [1]
=================
[1] Source:
http://groups.google.com/group/micr...lorer.ie6_outlookexpress/msg/c3d34a61101e99e9
--
~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
MS MVP-IE, Mail, Security, Windows Desktop Experience - since 2002
AumHa VSOP & Admin http://aumha.net
DTS-L http://dts-l.net/

I thought about it a long time ago, watched several colleagues spend
months,
IIRC, doing painstaking tests, I may even have participated in them
myself,
can't recall. And yes, I can say that pulling the cord from the wall while
an OE folder is being compacted is a valid test of DBX fragility versus
other mail storage systems. Versus just about any other file type, for
that
matter. Those same fellas still hang out in the groups, so if you want to
know *why* this is so, or *what* makes DBX files much more fragile under
the
stated conditions, the OE groups are the place for you to ask. I recommend
you ask nicely. Or you can even claim that what we're telling you is BS
and
somebody "here" (in the OE groups, remember) oughta go over "there" (here)
and tell them what's what!

<snip>

 

[Gary S. Terhune]

Heh, heh... watching an OE MVP's eyes glaze over... heh, heh...

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS-MVP Shell/User
http://grystmill.com

Don't bother asking "why" or "how" (which will cause an OE MVP's eyes to
glaze over), just do some searching of Google Groups. You'll find (tens
of) thousands of archived posts that contain variations on "Don't touch
your computer until the compacting process has ended!" or "Do not cancel
Automatic Compacting, should it occur, and do not attempt to close OE via
Task Manager or shutdown your machine if Automatic Compacting is taking
place."

<QP>
[The compacting] process can take several minutes and you should not
attempt to use your computer until it is finished.
</QP>
Source: http://www.insideoe.com/files/maintain.htm#compact

[http://www.insideoe.com is he OE user's Bible]

OE's been an odd, bug-ridden app ever since it was released over a decade
ago, and all further development was stopped in June 2006. We suspect
that
the guy who wrote OE has been permanently confined in a lunatic asylum and
wearing a straightjacket for years.
--
~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
MS MVP-IE, Mail, Security, Windows Desktop Experience - since 2002
AumHa VSOP & Admin http://aumha.net
DTS-L http://dts-l.net/

I thought about it a long time ago, watched several colleagues spend
months,
IIRC, doing painstaking tests, I may even have participated in them
myself,
can't recall. And yes, I can say that pulling the cord from the wall
while
an OE folder is being compacted is a valid test of DBX fragility versus
other mail storage systems. Versus just about any other file type, for
that
matter. Those same fellas still hang out in the groups, so if you want to
know *why* this is so, or *what* makes DBX files much more fragile under
the
stated conditions, the OE groups are the place for you to ask. I
recommend
you ask nicely. Or you can even claim that what we're telling you is BS
and
somebody "here" (in the OE groups, remember) oughta go over "there"
(here)
and tell them what's what!

<snip>

 

[Unknown]

I agree totally. However, is it OE or some other program causing the
problem? I'll bet it is not OE.
Also, if YOU were the architect of OE how would you protect the .dbx files
from
being damaged from ANY source? That's my point.

 

[Bruce Hagen]

It is usually the user, (i.e. disrupting a compact process), or a third
party program that causes the problem. But if it were not for the way the
dbx file system stores message data, there wouldn't be any loss of messages
and this would be a moot topic.

Windows Mail in Vista does not use this dbx system. Instead, every message
is stored as a separate .eml file and loss of messages is a rarity.

Of course, as I stated previously, WinMail turned out to be a flop for other
reasons and production of that program stopped in 2006, while Vista was
still in beta.

The recommendation from Microsoft, (not me), is for XP and Vista users to
use Windows Live Mail instead. That is virtually their *fix* for OE and
WinMail issues.

 

[Alan]

Hi Bruce,

So is there any "native default" (for want of a better term) e-mail program
that ships with Vista?

Alan

 

[Bruce Hagen]

Windows Mail comes with Vista. Is that what you're asking?

 

[Alan]

I'm a bit confused, then, when you say that Windows Mail comes with Vista.

In your earlier post you said:

"Windows Mail in Vista does not use this dbx system. Instead, every
message is stored as a separate .eml file and loss of messages is a
rarity.

Of course, as I stated previously, WinMail turned out to be a flop for
other reasons and production of that program stopped in 2006, while
Vista
was still in beta."

If production of WinMail stopped in 2006, then how can WinMail still come
with Vista? I'm obviously missing something.

Of course it doesn't help to lessen confusion that Microsoft persists in
giving similar names to different applications such as Windows Explorer,
Internet Explorer, Outlook, Outlook Express, Windows Mail, Windows Live
Mail.... :->

Alan

 

[Bruce Hagen]

They stopped production of Windows Mail, but the program was complete. (At
least in the minds of MS). They just took Windows Mail as it was and bundled
it with Vista.

OE has been out of production since 2002 IIRC, but it was still available in
XP after that.

 

[Bruce Hagen]

BTY. Here is the newsgroup for Windows Mail if you want to take a look.

Windows Vista Mail Newsgroup.

In your newsreader:
news://msnews.microsoft.com/microsoft.public.windows.vista.mail

On the Web:
http://www.microsoft.com/communitie...t.aspx?dg=microsoft.public.windows.vista.mail
--

Bruce Hagen
MS-MVP Outlook Express
Imperial Beach, CA

 

[PA Bear [MS MVP]]

....due to asking the question. OE MVP's eyes glaze over for lotsa other
reasons, too!

Heh, heh... watching an OE MVP's eyes glaze over... heh, heh...

Don't bother asking "why" or "how" (which will cause an OE MVP's eyes to
glaze over), just do some searching of Google Groups. You'll find (tens
of) thousands of archived posts that contain variations on "Don't touch
your computer until the compacting process has ended!" or "Do not cancel
Automatic Compacting, should it occur, and do not attempt to close OE via
Task Manager or shutdown your machine if Automatic Compacting is taking
place."

<QP>
[The compacting] process can take several minutes and you should not
attempt to use your computer until it is finished.
</QP>
Source: http://www.insideoe.com/files/maintain.htm#compact

[http://www.insideoe.com is he OE user's Bible]

OE's been an odd, bug-ridden app ever since it was released over a decade
ago, and all further development was stopped in June 2006. We suspect
that
the guy who wrote OE has been permanently confined in a lunatic asylum
and
wearing a straightjacket for years.
--
~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
MS MVP-IE, Mail, Security, Windows Desktop Experience - since 2002
AumHa VSOP & Admin http://aumha.net
DTS-L http://dts-l.net/

I thought about it a long time ago, watched several colleagues spend
months,
IIRC, doing painstaking tests, I may even have participated in them
myself,
can't recall. And yes, I can say that pulling the cord from the wall
while
an OE folder is being compacted is a valid test of DBX fragility versus
other mail storage systems. Versus just about any other file type, for
that
matter. Those same fellas still hang out in the groups, so if you want
to
know *why* this is so, or *what* makes DBX files much more fragile under
the
stated conditions, the OE groups are the place for you to ask. I
recommend
you ask nicely. Or you can even claim that what we're telling you is BS
and
somebody "here" (in the OE groups, remember) oughta go over "there"
(here)
and tell them what's what!

<snip>