AIW 2006 PCI Express

[mga]

Does anybody else have a problem capturing VHS input with the AIW 2006
card?

My card thinks that all my VHS have Macrovision, but they don't.

These tapes do not have Macrovision, they play perfectly when the VCR
is connected directly to the TV, and I can view or capture them
perfectly with the AIW 7500 Radeon card.

 

[Barry Watzman]

I'm not saying that your conclusion is wrong, but it does not follow
from the stated facts.

A macrovision tape is supposed to play perfectly when a VCR is connected
directly to a TV set.

And I'm not sure if the AIW 7500 had macrovision detection.

 

[mga]

I'm not saying that your conclusion is wrong, but it does not follow
from the stated facts.

A macrovision tape is supposed to play perfectly when a VCR is connected
directly to a TV set.

And I'm not sure if the AIW 7500 had macrovision detection.

How does it not follow from the facts?

1) The tape plays perfectly when connected from the VCR to the TV
and
2) The tape does NOT play perfectly when connected from the VCR to the
AIW
= The AIW thinks the tape has Macrovision.
But the tape(s) does not have Macrovision; these are 5-15 year old
tapes and the ones with Macrovision in it clearly display that fact
somewhere in the box.

The AIW 7500 Radeon does have Macrovision in it (I have two tapes with
Macrovision in them and it won't let me copy them withouth error), and
I didn't have a problem backing up the non-Macrovision tapes with it;
that computer crashed, so I bought a new one with a PCI express bus
instead of and AGP bus.

But back to my question, do you know a solution to the problem?

 

[gasper]

Sorry but have to confirm,

Video input is with all cards using the rage theater chipset 200 unusable
to
digitize tapes FROM VCR. There is something wrong with the timebase . You
cannot switch in
the right timebase as with some tv sets. The theater 100 cards don,t have
this problem at all, but haveb record macrovision too

Theater 200 chipset
What I do believe is that they (ati) tried to make a 100% macrovision
locked input which cannot
run over by hardware devices. So they tried to set the timebase and gain
control in a manner that it
would switch off completely whenever VCR macrovision input is detected. and
would not follow
video tape timebase with all tapes.

You can try by yourself : If you play a macrovision protected tape you had
usually a playable on PC screen but not
recordable picture.
Whith theater 200 chipsets you will have NO PICTURE AT ALL AND NO SOUND OR
HORRIBLE HISS !!
AND ALL YOU WILL GET IS MONO SOUND FROM TV (PAL)
With no macrovision tapes picture will still jump in the upper portions of
screen.

Rage Theater 550
With this you will have only two hardware resolutions and it will forever
try to record NTSC even if you have PAL card
There is no interlacing on video input and nor play or record with
macrovision tapes. You will have no problem with timebase
but play and video captures trough external inputs will be HORRIBLE in
quality.
AND ALLYOU WILL GET IS MONO SOUND FROM TV (PAL)

ALL in ALL i can say that ATI don,t really support PAL TV System and have
been ignoring European customers beginning from TV Wonder
times up to now.

I can fully understand why they stopped All in Wonder Operations in Europe.
The video input and TV is pretty unusable if you compare it
with competition which not even have macrovison. They simply cannot sell it
here anymore, computer guys know the problems
and they have very bad reputation grown in decades here.

They don,t do and market products wanted by customer, they only follow media
industry guidelines.

THE ONLY FEATURE WHICH IS PERFECTLY WORKING IS COPY PROTECTION

 

[mga]

Sorry but have to confirm,

Video input is with all cards using the rage theater chipset 200 unusable
to
digitize tapes FROM VCR. There is something wrong with the timebase . You
cannot switch in
the right timebase as with some tv sets. The theater 100 cards don,t have
this problem at all, but haveb record macrovision too

Theater 200 chipset
What I do believe is that they (ati) tried to make a 100% macrovision
locked input which cannot
run over by hardware devices. So they tried to set the timebase and gain
control in a manner that it
would switch off completely whenever VCR macrovision input is detected. and
would not follow
video tape timebase with all tapes.

You can try by yourself : If you play a macrovision protected tape you had
usually a playable on PC screen but not
recordable picture.
Whith theater 200 chipsets you will have NO PICTURE AT ALL AND NO SOUND OR
HORRIBLE HISS !!
AND ALL YOU WILL GET IS MONO SOUND FROM TV (PAL)
With no macrovision tapes picture will still jump in the upper portions of
screen.

Rage Theater 550
With this you will have only two hardware resolutions and it will forever
try to record NTSC even if you have PAL card
There is no interlacing on video input and nor play or record with
macrovision tapes. You will have no problem with timebase
but play and video captures trough external inputs will be HORRIBLE in
quality.
AND ALLYOU WILL GET IS MONO SOUND FROM TV (PAL)

ALL in ALL i can say that ATI don,t really support PAL TV System and have
been ignoring European customers beginning from TV Wonder
times up to now.

I can fully understand why they stopped All in Wonder Operations in Europe.
The video input and TV is pretty unusable if you compare it
with competition which not even have macrovison. They simply cannot sell it
here anymore, computer guys know the problems
and they have very bad reputation grown in decades here.

They don,t do and market products wanted by customer, they only follow media
industry guidelines.

THE ONLY FEATURE WHICH IS PERFECTLY WORKING IS COPY PROTECTION

I am not an expert on ATI cards, so:

Does the AIW 7500 Radeon have the "theater 100" chipset? From what you
are saying, and my experience with it (i.e. I don't have problems
recording from VHS), it looks that way.

Does the AIW 2006 have the "theater 200" chipset? From what you are
describing as its effects on the non-Macrovision tapes, it seems that
way to me. Is there a solution to the problem?

" With no macrovision tapes picture will still jump in the upper
portions of
screen." I don't get jumping in the upper portions of the screen,
but some lines that make it look as if there is some tracking problem
at the top, and periodically it gets darker/lighter, and periodically
also more lines closer to the middle of the screen.

 

[gasper]

AIW Radeon 7500 is Theater 100 chipset
AIW Radeon 2006 is Theater 200 chipset

What you describe ist what I get too if i try to play macrovision tapes with
video input and AIW Radeon X800XT with Theater 200

If upper portions jump to the right, looks like it would start to turn ...
this is timebase VCR failure feature of Theater 200
If whole picture changes in brightness and or looses sync in all or part of
picture this is marcrovision

Sorry for bad English...

I hate their neglance of european customers and tv system
I hate their importance of following copy protection guidelines over
usability

Have a brand new Theater 550 and cannot even record non macrovison external
sources (bad distortion looks like interlacing and horrible distorted sound
with all drivers available. Somebody in Rage 3d wrote it will work stereo
with beta driver 117 but it does not.

All what the Theater really does now is display TV with MONO sound and
record in NTSC format !

 

[mga]

AIW Radeon 7500 is Theater 100 chipset
AIW Radeon 2006 is Theater 200 chipset

What you describe ist what I get too if i try to play macrovision tapes with
video input and AIW Radeon X800XT with Theater 200

If upper portions jump to the right, looks like it would start to turn ...
this is timebase VCR failure feature of Theater 200
If whole picture changes in brightness and or looses sync in all or part of
picture this is marcrovision

Sorry for bad English...

I hate their neglance of european customers and tv system
I hate their importance of following copy protection guidelines over
usability

Have a brand new Theater 550 and cannot even record non macrovison external
sources (bad distortion looks like interlacing and horrible distorted sound
with all drivers available. Somebody in Rage 3d wrote it will work stereo
with beta driver 117 but it does not.

All what the Theater really does now is display TV with MONO sound and
record in NTSC format !

Will using USB capture devices bypass the Macrovision from the AIW card?

 

[J. Clarke]

How does it not follow from the facts?

1) The tape plays perfectly when connected from the VCR to the TV
and
2) The tape does NOT play perfectly when connected from the VCR to the
AIW
= The AIW thinks the tape has Macrovision.
But the tape(s) does not have Macrovision; these are 5-15 year old
tapes and the ones with Macrovision in it clearly display that fact
somewhere in the box.

Are they purchased, prerecorded tapes? If so then they have Macrovision.
Just take it as a given. Macrovision has been the norm on prerecorded
video tapes since some time in the late 1980s.

 

[mga]

Are they purchased, prerecorded tapes? If so then they have Macrovision.
Just take it as a given. Macrovision has been the norm on prerecorded
video tapes since some time in the late 1980s.

They are prerecorded, and they do not have Macrovision, except for two
of them.
If they do have Macrovision, as you claim:
1) How is it that AIW 7500 Radeon plays them all perfectly, except when
it gets to the 2 that have Macrovision?
2) How is it that the AIW 2006 plays them all with some distortions,
except when it gets to the 2 that have Macrovision, in which case 90%
of the screen gets is frozen while the rest of the screen shows the
video?

Initially I thought that the AIW 2006 was identifying the tapes as
having Macrovision, but when comparing the difference in the results,
the problem is something else unless Macrovision has different effects
on different tapes.

 

[J. Clarke]

They are prerecorded, and they do not have Macrovision, except for two
of them.
If they do have Macrovision, as you claim:
1) How is it that AIW 7500 Radeon plays them all perfectly, except when
it gets to the 2 that have Macrovision?

They all have Macrovision. It is rumored that there was a change in the
Macrovision encoding a few years ago. This is perhaps what you are seeing.

2) How is it that the AIW 2006 plays them all with some distortions,
except when it gets to the 2 that have Macrovision, in which case 90%
of the screen gets is frozen while the rest of the screen shows the
video?

Because the AIW 2006 is a piece of crap?

90% of the screen being frozen suggests that there is something wrong with
the board--that is not a normal result of Macrovision protection--the
normal result is lines across the screen.

 

[Danny G.]

Will using USB capture devices bypass the Macrovision from the AIW card?
My AIW in/outputs go to the (vcr2) audio/video receiver (Pioneer vsx-d608) jacks and
that connects every component to my PC and each others S-video jacks.

I don't know why, but I think the Pioneer strips out the copyright protection for all the
components including Macrovision.

 

[Danny G.]

If you are recording the VCR tuner output and then hit 'play'
for awile and then stop what happens?

 

[mga]

If you are recording the VCR tuner output and then hit 'play'
for awile and then stop what happens?

I can view and record TV thru the VCR tuner fine. If I try to view or
record non-Macrovision tapes, I get the effects mentioned in a previous
message, they being different than if I try to view/record Macrovision
also mentioned before.

Do any of the USB 2.0 video capture devices work with the AIW 2006, or
will I have the same problems?

 

[mga]

My AIW in/outputs go to the (vcr2) audio/video receiver (Pioneer vsx-d608) jacks and
that connects every component to my PC and each others S-video jacks.

I don't know why, but I think the Pioneer strips out the copyright protection for all the
components including Macrovision.

What model do you have?

 

[Barry Watzman]

A USB capture device is a TOTALLY separate device. Any such device will
have nothing whatsoever to do with the AIW or the ATI software.

You note that you can record from the tuner; what happens if you try to
record the tape using RF inputs (e.g. using the VCR's channel 2 or 3 RF
output)?

 

[mga]

A USB capture device is a TOTALLY separate device. Any such device will
have nothing whatsoever to do with the AIW or the ATI software.

You note that you can record from the tuner; what happens if you try to
record the tape using RF inputs (e.g. using the VCR's channel 2 or 3 RF
output)?

I know the USB video capture device is another device, but it is not as
you call it "totally separate"; they interact with the video card,
otherwise why would the video devices made by some manufacturers
(Pinnacle Dazzle Video Creator Platinum for example) have minimum
requirement for the video card (see link below).
http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Pinn...51064/catOid/-13044/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

If I view/record the VCR's output coming out thru the VCR's RF output,
I still have the same issue. That would not be a solution anyway since
I am trying to capture through the S-Video input.

 

[J. Clarke]

I know the USB video capture device is another device, but it is not as
you call it "totally separate"; they interact with the video card,
otherwise why would the video devices made by some manufacturers
(Pinnacle Dazzle Video Creator Platinum for example) have minimum
requirement for the video card (see link below).

Because they also have software for playback.

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Pinn...51064/catOid/-13044/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

 

[mga]

Because they also have software for playback.

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Pinn...51064/catOid/-13044/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

Do you know anthing about the quality of capture from these USB
devices?
Do you know if any of them capture in AVI format?

 

[karl.muddiman]

The only other thing I can think of is looking out for one of the devices
that remove the macrovision e.g. macrovision busters.

Haven't tried one of these with a video capture card, friend used to use one
now and again for backing up video tapes.

Just another option to think of if things get really sticky.

Karl

 

[mga]

The only other thing I can think of is looking out for one of the devices
that remove the macrovision e.g. macrovision busters.

Haven't tried one of these with a video capture card, friend used to use one
now and again for backing up video tapes.

Just another option to think of if things get really sticky.

Karl

I have been reading about them, and I see all kind opinions; some of
them work with some cards and not with others, so I need to find one
that works with my card. That assumes that the problem is Macrovision.
If you read some of my previous posts, it now looks like the problem
is something else.