Active-Inactive Partitions?

[Jethro]

I have a system someone else set up that now has two partitions on the
machine's single drive. The original OS was ME and XP HOME was
installed on it. He ended up with the old ME portion and all its apps
in partition C, and the new XP portion in partition D. Partition C is
the active partition. At boot-up you get the option of selecting ME
or XP, and both seem to work fine.

I want to delete partition C and then add it's space to partition D.
PQMagic warns me to be sure to make the remaining partition the new
active partition after partition C is deleted. I am afraid to proceed
because I can find no way to specify (set) whether a partition is
active or not. I remember the old FDISK enabled you to do that, but
with NTFS, that is out of the question. I worry that if I allow PQM
to delete the partition, my machine will no longer boot up.

Can anyone help here?

Thanks

Jethro

 

[Rich Barry]

You are right about deleting the C: partition. You will lose the
ntloader which resides on C: since you have a dual boot.
See if this helps
http://www.kayodeok.co.uk/weblog/200401/25/remove_windows_me_from_dual_boot.html

 

[Jethro]

You are right about deleting the C: partition. You will lose the
ntloader which resides on C: since you have a dual boot.
See if this helps
http://www.kayodeok.co.uk/weblog/200401/25/remove_windows_me_from_dual_boot.html

looks interesting. Thanks\\Jethro

 

[John John]

I have a system someone else set up that now has two partitions on the
machine's single drive. The original OS was ME and XP HOME was
installed on it. He ended up with the old ME portion and all its apps
in partition C, and the new XP portion in partition D. Partition C is
the active partition. At boot-up you get the option of selecting ME
or XP, and both seem to work fine.

I want to delete partition C and then add it's space to partition D.
PQMagic warns me to be sure to make the remaining partition the new
active partition after partition C is deleted. I am afraid to proceed
because I can find no way to specify (set) whether a partition is
active or not. I remember the old FDISK enabled you to do that, but
with NTFS, that is out of the question. I worry that if I allow PQM
to delete the partition, my machine will no longer boot up.

If you are worried about this the easiest thing to do is to get rid of
all the files on the C: partition *except* the following:

boot.ini
ntldr
NTDETECT.COM
NTBOOTDD.SYS

NTBOOTDD.SYS may or may not be present, it is most likely not present.

Now you should be able to shrink the C: partition to a minimal size
while keeping it active and keeping the above files on it at the same
time. You should have no problems booting in to your Windows installation.

If you absolutely want to get rid of the partition then you will have to
copy the above files to the D: partition and, if PM can do it, tell it
to make the new partition active. You can also use a Windows 98 boot
disk and use fdisk to mark the partition active, that will work even if
the partition is NTFS.

Before you do the changes you will also have to edit the boot.ini file
so that it points to the Windows XP partition. As it is now the ARC
path in the boot.ini file probably points to:

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)

When merged partition 2 will become partition 1 so the right path would be:

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)

Before you do the partition changes you can make a boot diskette an have
several ARC paths in it, will serve to boot the computer if you have
problems. http://www.nu2.nu/bootdisk/ntboot/

Windows XP will (should) retain its D: drive assignment, *do* *not*
attempt to change this! Windows must keep its drive assignment for this
to work properly. As with all disk and partitioning work, you would be
well advised to have a known working backup of your important files
before you proceed. Glitches and errors during disk and partitioning
work are not common but when they do happen they often lead to
catastrophic data loss.

John

 

[cattanack]

I have a system someone else set up that now has two partitions on the
machine's single drive. The original OS was ME and XP HOME was
installed on it. He ended up with the old ME portion and all its apps
in partition C, and the new XP portion in partition D. Partition C is
the active partition. At boot-up you get the option of selecting ME
or XP, and both seem to work fine.

I want to delete partition C and then add it's space to partition D.
PQMagic warns me to be sure to make the remaining partition the new
active partition after partition C is deleted. I am afraid to proceed
because I can find no way to specify (set) whether a partition is
active or not. I remember the old FDISK enabled you to do that, but
with NTFS, that is out of the question. I worry that if I allow PQM
to delete the partition, my machine will no longer boot up.

Can anyone help here?

Do you have the WindowsXP install disk?

Why don't you use the C: drive for a storage and or install drive?

At any rate I think you need to first defrag the drive you have
windows on that you intend to change it's size.

Anyway go> recovery console and go> fixmbr to restore your winxp MRB

If you don't have the install CD the question is will a XP boot disk
from boodisk.com allow you to use fdisk /mbr or fixmbr?

 

[cattanack]

I have a system someone else set up that now has two partitions on the
machine's single drive. The original OS was ME and XP HOME was
installed on it. He ended up with the old ME portion and all its apps
in partition C, and the new XP portion in partition D. Partition C is
the active partition. At boot-up you get the option of selecting ME
or XP, and both seem to work fine.

I want to delete partition C and then add it's space to partition D.
PQMagic warns me to be sure to make the remaining partition the new
active partition after partition C is deleted. I am afraid to proceed
because I can find no way to specify (set) whether a partition is
active or not. I remember the old FDISK

Did I say fixmbr?

To clarify:

FIXBOOT
fixboot drive name:
Use this command to write the new Windows boot sector code on the
system partition. In the command syntax, drive name is the drive
letter where the boot sector will be written. This command fixes
damage in the Windows boot sector. This command overrides the default
setting, which writes to the system boot partition. The fixboot
command is supported only on x86-based computers.

FIXMBR
fixmbr device name
Use this command to repair the MBR of the boot partition. In the
command syntax, device name is an optional device name that specifies
the device that requires a new MBR. Use this command if a virus has
damaged the MBR and Windows cannot start.

So fix boot is the command to use.

 

[Jethro]

You are right about deleting the C: partition. You will lose the
ntloader which resides on C: since you have a dual boot.
See if this helps
http://www.kayodeok.co.uk/weblog/200401/25/remove_windows_me_from_dual_boot.html

I printed kayoed's pages and studied them over TV last night. All I
can say is you gotta be kidding!

Jethro

 

[Jethro]

Do you have the WindowsXP install disk?

Yes I do.

Why don't you use the C: drive for a storage and or install drive?

I don't mind that.

 

[Jethro]

If you are worried about this the easiest thing to do is to get rid of
all the files on the C: partition *except* the following:

boot.ini
ntldr
NTDETECT.COM
NTBOOTDD.SYS

This still sounds rather 'final' in that if it doesn't work, I am deep
doodoo. I wonder if I can do what you suggest, but copy all of C's
original files into a backup folder in D partition (XP) FIRST so I can
copy them back if a subsequent boot fails, assuming I can do that
SOMEHOW if that boot FAILS.

Jethro

 

[Jethro]

If you are worried about this the easiest thing to do is to get rid of
all the files on the C: partition *except* the following:

boot.ini
ntldr
NTDETECT.COM
NTBOOTDD.SYS

NTBOOTDD.SYS may or may not be present, it is most likely not present.

Now you should be able to shrink the C: partition to a minimal size
while keeping it active and keeping the above files on it at the same
time. You should have no problems booting in to your Windows installation.

If you absolutely want to get rid of the partition then you will have to
copy the above files to the D: partition and, if PM can do it, tell it
to make the new partition active.

That's just it - I could find no way to make PM make the new partition
(D) the active partition. The option is grayed out.

You can also use a Windows 98 boot
disk and use fdisk to mark the partition active, that will work even if
the partition is NTFS.

Is that right? I thought FDISK would not handle NTFS at all.

Before you do the changes you will also have to edit the boot.ini file
so that it points to the Windows XP partition. As it is now the ARC
path in the boot.ini file probably points to:

I now have:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="Windows XP Home Edition"
/noexecute=optin /fastdetect
C:\="Microsoft Windows"

 

[John John]

This still sounds rather 'final' in that if it doesn't work, I am deep
doodoo. I wonder if I can do what you suggest, but copy all of C's
original files into a backup folder in D partition (XP) FIRST so I can
copy them back if a subsequent boot fails, assuming I can do that
SOMEHOW if that boot FAILS.

Sure, that would be an additional safety measure but the only files
needed to boot XP are the above ones. Does your machine have a floppy
drive? If yes do this:

Use your Windows XP installation to do this, if you use the Windows ME
installation the diskette will fail.

Start a Command Prompt session and format a floppy diskette:

format a: /u

Copy the files boot.ini, ntldr and NTDETECT.COM from the root of the C:
drive to the diskette, do not change the boot.ini file, copy it to the
diskette as it is. Reboot the computer and go in the BIOS and set the
boot order to the diskette first and boot with the floppy diskette that
you just created. Can you successfully boot the Windows XP
installation? If yes then you have just proved to yourself that all
other files on the C: drive are not needed to boot Windows XP, you have
booted with the diskette only, without using C: at all and the only
needed files were on the diskette. This diskette along with a boot.ini
file that points to the correct Windows folder is all that you need to
start the computer if the boot files go missing.

In his post cattanack has given you additional information on how to get
the installation to boot should it refuse to do so after you remove the
present active partition, after deleting the current active partition
you may need to use the FIXBOOT command to write an NT boot sector to
the new active partition. Along with that, if needed, the BOOTCFG
command can be used to rebuild and add the proper ARC path to the
boot.ini file.

John

 

[John John]

See in-line.

That's just it - I could find no way to make PM make the new partition
(D) the active partition. The option is grayed out.

That doesn't surprise me, I think that if you read through the PM manual
you will find that the documentation specifically says that PM cannot
remove or combine either or of the System or Boot volumes, or if it can
it doesn't recommend that you do so because of the Active partition
issue or because of the drive letter issues on legacy operating systems.

Is that right? I thought FDISK would not handle NTFS at all.

Yes, that is right. Fdisk cannot recognize NTFS logical drives in
extended partitions but it does recognize primary NTFS partitions and
can usually change the active flag on primary partitions even if the
partition is formatted NTFS. You can read here for additional information:

The computer does not start after you change the active partition by
using the Disk Management tool
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/315261

Cannot View NTFS Logical Drive After Using Fdisk
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/310359

Unable to Delete a Partition or Logical DOS Drive Using the Fdisk Utility
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/261473
(The issue in KB216473 is easily resolved with delpart.exe)

Before you do the changes you will also have to edit the boot.ini file
so that it points to the Windows XP partition. As it is now the ARC
path in the boot.ini file probably points to:

I now have:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="Windows XP Home Edition"
/noexecute=optin /fastdetect
C:\="Microsoft Windows"

Until things are straightened out you can leave the existing line as is
and just add a new one, you can edit the file and remove lines once you
are sure that things are OK. After the partitions are combined the file
could be like so:

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Part1 Windows XP Home
Edition" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="Part2 Windows XP Home
Edition" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect

It should boot on partition(1)\WINDOWS. The C:\="Microsoft Windows"
line will no longer be needed, it is used to boot Windows ME.

As mentioned in other posts in this thread you may need to use the
fixboot command after the merge is done.

John

 

[Pegasus \(MVP\)]

I have a system someone else set up that now has two partitions on the
machine's single drive. The original OS was ME and XP HOME was
installed on it. He ended up with the old ME portion and all its apps
in partition C, and the new XP portion in partition D. Partition C is
the active partition. At boot-up you get the option of selecting ME
or XP, and both seem to work fine.

I want to delete partition C and then add it's space to partition D.
PQMagic warns me to be sure to make the remaining partition the new
active partition after partition C is deleted. I am afraid to proceed
because I can find no way to specify (set) whether a partition is
active or not. I remember the old FDISK enabled you to do that, but
with NTFS, that is out of the question. I worry that if I allow PQM
to delete the partition, my machine will no longer boot up.

Can anyone help here?

Thanks

Jethro

With the many questions and replies floating about, it is
unclear where you currently stand. I suggest you give us
a status report.

P.S. You can indeed use fdisk on a Win98 boot disk to
mark a partition as active. This is because each partition
has a number of properties, "active" being one of them,
"NTFS" being another. They are set independently from
each other.

 

[Jethro]

With the many questions and replies floating about, it is
unclear where you currently stand. I suggest you give us
a status report.

P.S. You can indeed use fdisk on a Win98 boot disk to
mark a partition as active. This is because each partition
has a number of properties, "active" being one of them,
"NTFS" being another. They are set independently from
each other.

I have changed nothing yet in the areas discussed. I want to be sure
I am doing what I should do before doing anything.

I haven't used FDISK for more than a year mainly because I am working
with XP (and its NTFS now) exclusively. Somebody before I got
involved had changed the ME partition (C) from FAT32 to NTFS. I had
forgotten some things about FDISK. I didn't remember that you could
deal just with an NTFS's partition's active-inactive property. Sorry.

BTW, the ME partition (C) still boots to ME just fine, if I select it
at boot-up.

Thanks

Jethro

 

[Pegasus \(MVP\)]

I have changed nothing yet in the areas discussed. I want to be sure
I am doing what I should do before doing anything.

I haven't used FDISK for more than a year mainly because I am working
with XP (and its NTFS now) exclusively. Somebody before I got
involved had changed the ME partition (C) from FAT32 to NTFS. I had
forgotten some things about FDISK. I didn't remember that you could
deal just with an NTFS's partition's active-inactive property. Sorry.

BTW, the ME partition (C) still boots to ME just fine, if I select it
at boot-up.

Thanks

Jethro

Fine. Here is a safe way of performing the transition, provided
that you are careful and make notes at every step of the way.
The method assumes that WinXP is installed on a primary
partition, not on a logical drive. It also assumes that you have
saved your important data and EMail files.

1. Copy these hidden files from C:\ to D:\ -
ntldr
ntdetect.com
boot.ini

2. Add a few lines to d:\boot.ini likes so:
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="1 Windows XP Home Edition"
/noexecute=optin /fastdetect
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="2 Windows XP Home Edition"
/noexecute=optin /fastdetect
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(3)\WINDOWS="3 Windows XP Home Edition"
/noexecute=optin /fastdetect
The trick is to give yourself several choices. When things work,
you delete the lines you do not need.

3. Label each of your partitions clearly, e.g. "WinME" and "WinXP".

4. Boot the machine with a Win98 boot disk from
www.bootdisk.com, then run ptedit from
ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/.
Now change the partition type of the WinME partition to a
number that means nothing to Windows, i.e. neither FAT nor
NTFS. This change is fully reversible as long as you remember
WHAT you changed and what the OLD VALUE was.

5. Reboot the machine with your Win98 boot disk,
then set the WinXP partition active.

6. Reboot the machine normally. Select options 1, 2 or 3 from
the boot selector menu until you know which one works.

7. Remove the unwanted lines from C:\boot.ini.

8. If things fail, reverse Steps 4 and 5.

9. If things work, delete the WinME partition, then use
a partition manager (e.g. Acronis) to increase the size
of the WinXP partition.

If you have a spare disk or if you're willing to buy a
second-hand 20 GByte disk then there are totally safe
ways of performing this transition.