Win XP Pro OEM version

[Guest]

Hello:
As stated in an earlier question, I have an OEM copy of XP Pro for a
computer that is no longer in service. I have another computer on which I
would like to have XP Pro. People have said here that I can not legally do
this. My question is, regardless of the legality, will I be able to install
it? Will there be any type of activation problems?

Thanks, in advance. It really makes me crazy that, even though I bought the
software, I don't have the right to use it on another computer, when the
first computer dies. Has anyone ever challanged that in court?

JAM

 

[Patrick J. LoPresti]

(Note: I am not a lawyer, so the following merely represents my
non-expert understanding and opinion.)

Hello:
As stated in an earlier question, I have an OEM copy of XP Pro for a
computer that is no longer in service. I have another computer on
which I would like to have XP Pro. People have said here that I can
not legally do this. My question is, regardless of the legality,
will I be able to install it? Will there be any type of activation
problems?

It will probably install, but it will not activate because it has
already been activated. You could call Microsoft and try to trick
them into resetting the activation, but do you really want to be a
liar and a con artist?

Thanks, in advance. It really makes me crazy that, even though I
bought the software, I don't have the right to use it on another
computer, when the first computer dies.

That is where you are wrong. You did not buy the software. Most
software is licensed, not sold. All you bought was the right to use
the software on a single machine.

Has anyone ever challanged that in court?

Not to my knowledge, but I doubt any such challenge would be
successful. The license agreement makes all of this very clear, and
you actively agreed to accept the license. You may not remember it,
but when you first booted Windows there was a dialog box which said
"please read the following license agreement carefully" and you
clicked "Yes, I accept these terms".

Nobody tried to trick you. The transaction was completely above board
and clearly spelled out. If you accepted the contract without reading
it, I sympathize, but you are still bound by its terms both legally
and ethically.

If you think the terms are ridiculous, you have a simple and proper
recourse: Do not use Windows! You would be far from alone. Try doing
Google searches on "free software", "open source", and "Linux", all of
which are motivated by a gut feeling about software similar to the one
you are expressing.

- Pat
http://unattended.sourceforge.net/

 

[Carey Frisch [MVP]]

The license for an OEM version of Windows XP is tied to
the very first computer it is installed on. It is non-transferable
to another computer. That's one reason OEM versions cost
less to begin with. Only "Retail Versions" of Windows XP
can be transferred to a different computer.

--
Carey Frisch
Microsoft MVP
Windows XP - Shell/User

Be Smart! Protect Your PC!
http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/protect/default.aspx

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

:

| Hello:
| As stated in an earlier question, I have an OEM copy of XP Pro for a
| computer that is no longer in service. I have another computer on which I
| would like to have XP Pro. People have said here that I can not legally do
| this. My question is, regardless of the legality, will I be able to install
| it? Will there be any type of activation problems?
|
| Thanks, in advance. It really makes me crazy that, even though I bought the
| software, I don't have the right to use it on another computer, when the
| first computer dies. Has anyone ever challanged that in court?
|
| JAM
| --
| JMA

 

[Michael Steiner]

The license for an OEM version of Windows XP is tied to
the very first computer it is installed on. It is non-transferable

In this context there is a question I've been asking myself very often
until now - please consider it a serious question.

What exactly defines "the computer it was installed on"? I mean, the
computer that was delivered to the customer was equipped with Windows XP
OEM, so far so good. But, think about the possibility the customer wants
to insert a new graphics board, more RAM, a faster CPU, maybe switch the
mainboard against a better performing one ... finally even another case
for better cooling performance ... up to which extent is the OEM license
still covering the "original computer"?

Thanks,

Michael

 

[Len Segal]

In addition to the other replies . . .

OEM OS CDs are often-times "created" by the large OEM mfrs of computers. If
that is the case, they are customized by the mfr (under license from MS) so
that they will do one of the following:
- Only install on a particular OEM system type, or
- Only have drivers for the particular OEM's line of products, or
- Add additional drivers that can/will cause problems on a different mfr's
system.

So, in addition to the legal issues, there are some real practical issues
involved. i.e. an HP WinXP OEM CD is NOT the same as an eMachine WinXP OEM
CD or a MS "standard" WinXP OEM CD!

If what you have is a MS OEM CD (and NOT marked with another brand on it as
well), the above does not apply in your case.

 

[Len Segal]

Michael,

Your question is an excellent and serious one. One that many of the MVPs
have debated at length privately as well as publicly.

I can only give you MY ANSWER (my opinion, and I am not a lawyer).

Let's keep this simple and assume that we built a clone with a generic MS
OEM OS (NOT a branded system with branded/customized OEM OS):

- If I change cases and move all the components (or at least the
motherboard), I personally consider this a "legal upgrade" that doesn't
invalidate the OEM OS.
- If I replace the motherboard (and maybe the CPU . . . this could be an
upgrade or the motherboard/CPU died) in the same case and all other
components stay the same, again I personally consider this a "legal upgrade"
that doesn't invalidate the OEM OS.
- If I replace the HDD and/or CD-RW/DVD drive with everything else staying
the same, I personally consider this a "legal upgrade" that doesn't
invalidate the OEM OS.
- If I were to replace EVERYTHING at once (build myself a new system and
just cloned the HDD), then I would consider this NOT a "legal upgrade" and
thus I could NOT use the original OEM OS.

The above scenario is what I PERSONALLY feel comfortable defending in a
court of law as "allowable". There are others, including some MS Support
folks that will tell you that if you replace a dead HDD (or upgrade to a
larger HDD) in a system and everything else stays the same, their position
is that you need to buy a new OS. I don't agree, but every one of us has an
"opinion" and nothing makes one opinion better or worse than another
opinion. The only opinion that really counts is what a judge hands down in a
court of law! <g>

 

[Michael Steiner]

Thanks for elaborating on this. As I suspected - a legal gray area ...

 

[Rob]

exactly. most OEMs create what is called an SLP installation (SLP = System
Pre Locked). They create a file that points to a specific BIOS location and
matches a text string stored in that location. They then sign this file
with a verisign certificate, send it to MS who does some manipulation to it
(turning a 100 byte file into a 10+ meg file), then countersign it with
their verisign certificate and send it back to the OEM. So, this file is
encrypted and non-tamperable and if you dont have a string in your BIOS at
the exact location as defined in the file, your XP copy will not work.

 

[Rob]

correction to my other post that hasn't appeared yet

SLP = system locked preinstallation ... brainfart

 

[Patrick J. LoPresti]

On Tue, 24 Aug 2004 08:06:48 -0500, Carey Frisch [MVP] wrote:

What exactly defines "the computer it was installed on"?

That's easy. It is defined by your intentions and, more specifically,
by a court's interpretation of the license.

Law is neither science nor mathematics, and it is always amusing when
engineers try to think about it.

Let's try an analogy by example. It is illegal to export weapons to
certain countries. But it is not illegal to export random little bits
of metal. So, asks our clever engineer, what if I make a gun which
can be broken into tiny little bits of metal? Then I can export each
little bit perfectly legally, and my client can reassemble the pieces
at the other end. Logically, how can I possibly be prosecuted?

Of course, if I try this and get caught, I can explain my "logic" in
court. Then the jury will find me guilty, because obviously my
intention was not to export random bits of metal; it was to export a
gun. And then I can stew in your cell, ranting about how I am the
victim of a logical fallacy.

I mean, the computer that was delivered to the customer was equipped
with Windows XP OEM, so far so good. But, think about the
possibility the customer wants to insert a new graphics board, more
RAM, a faster CPU, maybe switch the mainboard against a better
performing one ... finally even another case for better cooling
performance ... up to which extent is the OEM license still covering
the "original computer"?

See, here in the real world, you always (99.9% of the time) know full
well when you are simply upgrading a component and when you are
upgrading the whole system. When you are upgrading a component, you
do not need to buy a new copy of OEM Windows. When you are upgrading
the whole system, you do. Rationalizing one as an extension of the
other to perform and end-run around the license agreement is illegal
and unethical.

Intentions make all the difference.

- Pat

 

[Guest]

-----Original Message-----
Hello:
As stated in an earlier question, I have an OEM copy of XP Pro for a
computer that is no longer in service. I have another computer on which I
would like to have XP Pro. People have said here that I can not legally do
this.

They are wrong. It is not an issue of being legal or
illegal. The OEM eula says you are not allowed to
transfer to another computer, but it is not the law. It
falls under contract law which means if you don't agree
with the eula but you install the software anyway, you
have a contract dispute, which is not illegal.

My question is, regardless of the legality, will I be
able to install

it? Will there be any type of activation problems?

Possibly. Look here at this site, it will help you
through it.
http://www.microscum.com/mmpafaq/

Thanks, in advance. It really makes me crazy that, even though I bought the
software, I don't have the right to use it on another computer, when the
first computer dies. Has anyone ever challanged that in court?

JAM

No, noone has ever challenged this is court. And even
though it is MS's responsibility to stand up for their own
licensing restrictions, they are too chicken because they
know they will never win it for personal, private home
use. So instead they try to make you do it with their FUD.

 

[Patrick J. LoPresti]

They are wrong. It is not an issue of being legal or
illegal. The OEM eula says you are not allowed to
transfer to another computer, but it is not the law. It
falls under contract law which means if you don't agree
with the eula but you install the software anyway, you
have a contract dispute, which is not illegal.

Wrong. It is not just part of a contract to which you agreed; it is
also governed by copyright law, which gives the creator certain rights
concerning its reproduction. Also, most countries have special
provisions dealing with unauthorized reproduction of software. In the
U.S., for instance, you can be subject to civil penalties up to
$100,000 per infringement (if willful) and criminal penalties up to
$250,000 plus jail time up to five years. The criminal penalties only
apply if you make 10 or more copies whose retail value exceeds $2500,
but the civil penalties could theoretically apply even to a single
unauthorized copy.

No, noone has ever challenged this is court. And even
though it is MS's responsibility to stand up for their own
licensing restrictions, they are too chicken because they
know they will never win it for personal, private home
use. So instead they try to make you do it with their FUD.

Ridiculous. Microsoft goes after corporate infringement all the time,
and they win (or accept a settlement). The only reason they do not
pursue home users is that it would cost more than it gains.

Software piracy is most definitely illegal.

But the legality is really a secondary issue. The point is, what do
you call people who ignore the legal rights of the creator of a
copyrighted work? What do you call people who agree to a contract and
then willfully violate it? I call them scumbags...

The software is Microsoft's. If you do not like their terms, go write
your own software.

- Pat

 

[Bruce Chambers]

Greetings --

No, you're the one who is wrong. It makes absolutely no
difference whether one is
violating the Penal Code or the Civil Code - you're still violating
the law. Whether the matter would be adjudicated in a civil court
versus a criminal court is 100% irrelevant.


Bruce Chambers
--
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