UK residents - Vista advance orders and pricing becoming available

B

Bobby

Great prices.

The Ultimate version (£126) is particularly attractive.

This is how MS should fight piracy not crazy activation schemes.

Bobby
 
M

Mork

How come the 32 & 64 bit flavours of Vista are separate on the OEM version
whereas they are together on the same disc for the retail?
 
C

Colin Barnhorst

Because OEM copies are intended for installation on a new computer. You
pick your OS and the system builder installs it. Why would you need a
second dvd once you have chosen the OS you want installed? You are not
entitled to change your mind later and install the another OEM version. You
can only do that with a retail sku.
 
D

David Hearn

Of course, that's OEM edition, not transferrable to other machines and
limited in which edition (x86/x64) you purchase.

The full edition of Ultimate, non-upgrade is £364 inc VAT. Considering
the $US price is $380 from Amazon.com, and the conversion rate is approx
$2 = £1, that's a 100% mark up (after 17.5% VAT).

D
 
P

Paul-B

David said:
Of course, that's OEM edition, not transferrable to other machines
and limited in which edition (x86/x64) you purchase.

Not true. You may transfer your Windows to another pc provided you
remove/scrap/whetever the original machine was, and it will activate.
I've done that many times for clients who wished me to upgrade their
existing pc's (new mobo/cpu/memory/hard-drive/graphics card).

Totally legal under EC regulations, whatever the EULA says.
 
B

Bobby

Please see the (many) other threads on this topic.

You are not limited to the use of the original machine with an OEM license.
At least not in practice.

So, I say again, this is a great price for Vista Ultimate.

David Hearn said:
Of course, that's OEM edition, not transferrable to other machines and
limited in which edition (x86/x64) you purchase.

The full edition of Ultimate, non-upgrade is £364 inc VAT. Considering
the $US price is $380 from Amazon.com, and the conversion rate is approx
$2 = £1, that's a 100% mark up (after 17.5% VAT).

D
 
B

Brian W

Buy both, it's still cheaper than buying the retail pack with both DVDs in!

Mork said:
So that just leaves one thing....deciding on which version to buy (32 or
64 bit)
 
B

Brian W

Just ordered my Ultimate 32-bit. If I upgrade to 64-bit sometime, it's still
cheaper to buy another OEM copy than to buy a full retail!

Mork said:
So that just leaves one thing....deciding on which version to buy (32 or
64 bit)
 
C

Colin Barnhorst

It's cheaper than having purchased full retail in the beginning. But you
would be out of compliance since you would not be installing x64 on a new
computer that has not had an OS previously.

OEM copies are not intended for replacing an OS. They are intended as the
first OS on a new computer.
 
S

Stuart

Somoeone's gotta fix the Bush defecit!

Dave H said:
In the USA , Vista Ultimate can be bought for $379 dollars which is
approximately £193.

http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Win...s_sr_1/103-5119154-5494229?ie=UTF8&s=software

In the UK the same cheapest version of Vista I have found costs £369.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Windows-Vista-Ultimate-PC/dp/B000KCIA5A

THIS IS OUTRAGEOUS AND TOTALLY UNJUST AND SHOULD BE BROUGHT TO BILL GATES
&
MICROSOFTS ATTENTION.
No wonder piracy is rife!
 
P

Paul-B

Dave said:
In the USA , Vista Ultimate can be bought for $379 dollars which is
approximately £193.

http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Windows-Vista-Ultimate-VERSION/dp/B000
HCTYTE/sr=1-1/qid=1169049710/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-5119154-5494229?ie=UT
F8&s=software

In the UK the same cheapest version of Vista I have found costs
£369.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Microsoft-Windows-Vista-Ultimate-PC/dp/B000KCI
A5A

THIS IS OUTRAGEOUS AND TOTALLY UNJUST AND SHOULD BE BROUGHT TO BILL
GATES & MICROSOFTS ATTENTION.
No wonder piracy is rife!

Retail is £309.95, OEM is £125.67 from Aria... still expensive
though. I doubt whether Mr Gates is interested, given that the extra
profit goes to him and the seller.
 
D

David Hearn

Paul-B said:
Not true. You may transfer your Windows to another pc provided you
remove/scrap/whetever the original machine was, and it will activate.
I've done that many times for clients who wished me to upgrade their
existing pc's (new mobo/cpu/memory/hard-drive/graphics card).

Totally legal under EC regulations, whatever the EULA says.

Apologies - but do you have a link to proof of this?

I'm not talking about proof that it works, but proof that the EULA that
MS put on their OEM products in the EU is not enforceable.

D
 
B

Brian W

Yes, but as long as it works, I ain't complaining! If Ultimate retail was a
lot cheaper, it wouldn't be an issue.
 
P

Paul-B

David said:
Apologies - but do you have a link to proof of this?

I'm not talking about proof that it works, but proof that the EULA
that MS put on their OEM products in the EU is not enforceable.

D

What do you mean by proof? I'm not saying that the Microsoft EULA is
not enforceable, just that any part of any EULA which seeks to deprive
the consumer of his or her right to use legally-acquired software is
unenforceable.

Under EC law any terms and conditions which do not comply with EC
directives are unenforceable within the EC.

Microsoft have never tested this in court, nor would they because they
would almost certainly lose.

I and many other system builders use OEM software legally acquired and
transfer that software when we upgrade or rebuild the PC on which it
was originally installed. My (Microsoft approved) software supplier is
perfectly aware of this, and continues to supply me with oem software
(to obtain which, btw, I do not have to buy hardware from them). I have
no problems activating that software electronically, and have no WGA
problems subsequent to it's installation.
 
B

Brian W

Paul-B said:
I and many other system builders use OEM software legally acquired and
transfer that software when we upgrade or rebuild the PC on which it
was originally installed. My (Microsoft approved) software supplier is
perfectly aware of this, and continues to supply me with oem software
(to obtain which, btw, I do not have to buy hardware from them). I have
no problems activating that software electronically, and have no WGA
problems subsequent to it's installation.


Same as, with my XP OEM disc. There's also no longer a requirement to buy
hardware with OEM software now (otherwise, my Vista order from Aria would be
rejected. It's currently processsing). Even Amazon UK are selling the OEM
versions of Windows.
 
N

Nina DiBoy

Paul-B said:
What do you mean by proof? I'm not saying that the Microsoft EULA is
not enforceable, just that any part of any EULA which seeks to deprive
the consumer of his or her right to use legally-acquired software is
unenforceable.

Under EC law any terms and conditions which do not comply with EC
directives are unenforceable within the EC.

Microsoft have never tested this in court, nor would they because they
would almost certainly lose.

I and many other system builders use OEM software legally acquired and
transfer that software when we upgrade or rebuild the PC on which it
was originally installed. My (Microsoft approved) software supplier is
perfectly aware of this, and continues to supply me with oem software
(to obtain which, btw, I do not have to buy hardware from them). I have
no problems activating that software electronically, and have no WGA
problems subsequent to it's installation.

This may not be true of Generic OEM licences. With XP how it worked was
that if you purchased a generic OEM CD (and henceforth, a licence) for a
machine you built, them you were the OEM manufacturer and therefore you
would decide when the licence is non-transferrable. It's true this may
change with Vista, but I have not seen any supporting documentation from
MS that is has changed yet.

--
Priceless quotes in m.p.w.vista.general group:
http://protectfreedom.tripod.com/kick.html

"Good poets borrow; great poets steal."
- T. S. Eliot
 
B

Brian W

My XP OEM is a generic, MS branded CD. It has been used many times on
different PCs (only one installation at a time). The generic Vista DVD will
I'm sure be the same.
 
D

David Hearn

Paul-B said:
What do you mean by proof? I'm not saying that the Microsoft EULA is
not enforceable, just that any part of any EULA which seeks to deprive
the consumer of his or her right to use legally-acquired software is
unenforceable.

Under EC law any terms and conditions which do not comply with EC
directives are unenforceable within the EC.

By proof, I meant the EC directive which says that when purchasing
software, the license which goes with the software is not enforceable.
Or, one which suggests having an EULA which says "this gets installed on
one device and not transferred" is not enforceable.

Why, for example, does the part of the OEM EULA which says 'you cannot
transfer the license to another device' become unenforceable, but the
bit which says 'may not install this on multiple machines
simultaneously' *is* enforceable?

If one part is unfair, surely the other part is unfair too!

Why shouldn't I be able to install Vista on my home PC and my work PC?
I only use 1 machine at once (either at work or at home, not both).
Surely that's an unfair restriction! If I'm allowed to uninstall the
software and re-install on another machine (ie. only have 1 copy
installed at once), then that's functionally no different to only using
1 machine at once - it just takes longer!

I know that under UK law (Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations
1999) unfair contract terms to consumers are not binding. This does not
apply for businesses. However, only a court can decide if a term is
unfair. So if no one has ever taken it to court, then the term is
deemed to be fair.

Reading through the Office of Fair Trading's website on unfair contract
terms, the sort of things in the EULA appear fair. You accept a
reduction in rights (ie. ability to transfer the OS to another machine)
for a reduction in price. It's standard and fair contract terms. You
pay less, you get less. You pay more, you get more.

The sorts of things which are unfair contract terms are things like,
ability for the supplier to arbitrarily increase costs without warning
or ability to cancel, or requiring 3 months cancellation notice, binding
the user to terms not supplied before purchase.

Read through the documents on the OFT site, including their 'examples of
unfair terms' document.

As it stands, I've not seen anything unfair with the restriction on OEM
software to not be transferred to another machine, provided that you get
a reduction in price because of it - which you do - a signficant one!

D
 

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