System Partition too small on new Notebook

[Jisha]

I just purchased a new HP Pavilion zd7249cl with XPpro... here's a URL to
the product specs:
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?lc=en&cc=us&docname=c00212374

Before booting the machine from the HDD, I decided to clone the drive (Ghost
2003) to preserve any hidden set-up/Restore partition which might be
there... advance planning in case the HDD fails.

I discovered during this process that, while the HDD is 80gb, the system
partition is only about 20 gb with the remainder of the HDD apparently
un-partitioned. I also verified this using Fdisk off a win98se boot disk.

Seems to me that having only 20gb for system partition is asking for
computer-constipation problem in the future, especially after I install the
Applications I need. I would feel more comfortable with at least 40gb to 60
gb, since I need more space for Applications and less for data, owing to the
way in which I use my previous notebook. It is NOT my primary computer and
is dedicated to a very specific task. (20gb is more than enough for a Data
partition in my case.)


First Question:
Using Fdisk, I saw only 1 partition...
Is it possible for there to be a hidden partition that Fdisk cannot see?


Second Question?
What problems should I expect if I were to attempt the following:
(1) Image the system partition,
(2) Delete existing and create a new & larger system partition using Fdisk
(3) Restore the system partition from the image.

My fear is ending up with a system that cannot boot, but in this worst case
scenario, I could use the System Restore CDs supplied with the computer.
But, I don't think this will happen... and if it does, I've never used it
before I'd have nothing to loose by trying Fdisk /mbr first...

Anyone out there done this successfully?


Third Question:
I'd like to resize the system partition before I ever boot off the HDD.
Could this be a mistake? Should I start up XPpro... THEN resize the system
partition as in Question #2 above? It seems strange for a manufacturer like
HP to ship a computer with 75% of the HDD un-partitioned... Since I haven't
booted the computer from the HDD yet, I can only guess... but maybe someone
out there with an HP zd7000 series notebook knows if the remainder of the
HDD is set-up and formatted by some proprietary method on first start-up?


I KNOW there are a variety of utilities out there designed for this very
situation (i.e. Partition Magic, etc.) but I' like to stay away from that
approach except as a last resort, as it's my understanding that these
utilities write special coding to the boot sector... and I would prefer a
clean boot sector on the principle of "less is better".

Any help or suggestions will be welcomed.

Thanks in advance,
Christopher

PS: This is my first system with XP... but have been using win2000 for years
on my desktops.

 

[Randy Harris]

I just purchased a new HP Pavilion zd7249cl with XPpro... here's a URL to
the product specs:
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?lc=en&cc=us&docname=c00212374

Before booting the machine from the HDD, I decided to clone the drive (Ghost
2003) to preserve any hidden set-up/Restore partition which might be
there... advance planning in case the HDD fails.

I discovered during this process that, while the HDD is 80gb, the system
partition is only about 20 gb with the remainder of the HDD apparently
un-partitioned. I also verified this using Fdisk off a win98se boot disk.

Seems to me that having only 20gb for system partition is asking for
computer-constipation problem in the future, especially after I install the
Applications I need. I would feel more comfortable with at least 40gb to 60
gb, since I need more space for Applications and less for data, owing to the
way in which I use my previous notebook. It is NOT my primary computer and
is dedicated to a very specific task. (20gb is more than enough for a Data
partition in my case.)


First Question:
Using Fdisk, I saw only 1 partition...
Is it possible for there to be a hidden partition that Fdisk cannot see?


Second Question?
What problems should I expect if I were to attempt the following:
(1) Image the system partition,
(2) Delete existing and create a new & larger system partition using Fdisk
(3) Restore the system partition from the image.

My fear is ending up with a system that cannot boot, but in this worst case
scenario, I could use the System Restore CDs supplied with the computer.
But, I don't think this will happen... and if it does, I've never used it
before I'd have nothing to loose by trying Fdisk /mbr first...

Anyone out there done this successfully?


Third Question:
I'd like to resize the system partition before I ever boot off the HDD.
Could this be a mistake? Should I start up XPpro... THEN resize the system
partition as in Question #2 above? It seems strange for a manufacturer like
HP to ship a computer with 75% of the HDD un-partitioned... Since I haven't
booted the computer from the HDD yet, I can only guess... but maybe someone
out there with an HP zd7000 series notebook knows if the remainder of the
HDD is set-up and formatted by some proprietary method on first start-up?


I KNOW there are a variety of utilities out there designed for this very
situation (i.e. Partition Magic, etc.) but I' like to stay away from that
approach except as a last resort, as it's my understanding that these
utilities write special coding to the boot sector... and I would prefer a
clean boot sector on the principle of "less is better".

Any help or suggestions will be welcomed.

Thanks in advance,
Christopher

PS: This is my first system with XP... but have been using win2000 for years
on my desktops.

I'd go ahead and boot it and see what happens. (you've got the Ghost image
to fall back on). If that doesn't make the entire drive available... You
didn't say how you came by that system, but if you got it directly from HP
(I'm doubting that is the case), were it me, I'd be very concerned. HP
doesn't send out systems with 80GB drives only partially configured.
Something is very wrong. Assuming you didn't get it directly from HP...

XP does not have the capability of resizing the partition without losing the
content. If you wish you could restore the Ghost image after resizing. I
would strongly recommend Partition Magic, however. You are mistaken about
it writing "special coding to the boot sector". Absolutely not the case
unless you use Boot Magic (which I don't recommend).

 

[Bioboffin]

I just purchased a new HP Pavilion zd7249cl with XPpro... here's a
URL to the product specs:
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/genericDocument?lc=en&cc=us&docname=c00212374

Before booting the machine from the HDD, I decided to clone the drive
(Ghost 2003) to preserve any hidden set-up/Restore partition which
might be there... advance planning in case the HDD fails.

I discovered during this process that, while the HDD is 80gb, the
system partition is only about 20 gb with the remainder of the HDD
apparently un-partitioned. I also verified this using Fdisk off a
win98se boot disk.

Seems to me that having only 20gb for system partition is asking for
computer-constipation problem in the future, especially after I
install the Applications I need. I would feel more comfortable with
at least 40gb to 60 gb, since I need more space for Applications and
less for data, owing to the way in which I use my previous notebook.
It is NOT my primary computer and is dedicated to a very specific
task. (20gb is more than enough for a Data partition in my case.)

You don't have to install applications on the system partition. Most
applications use a bit of the system partition to put stuff in the registry
or in common folders, but most of an application can be put on the other
partition. You can also move the paging file to the other partition to free
up some more space on the system partition. On my desktop I have a system
partition of only 11 Gb. The other 240Gb is used for the paging file, data
and some (less important) programs. This makes it relatively easy to back up
the system state and system.

John.

 

[Ron Sommer]

Are any of the partitions NTFS file system?
Do not use fdisk /mbr on a NTFS file system.

I am not familar with Ghost.
Will Ghost restore a clone to a partition larger than the partition cloned?

After you fdisk, the partition will need to be formatted.

 

[Alex Nichol]

Before booting the machine from the HDD, I decided to clone the drive (Ghost
2003) to preserve any hidden set-up/Restore partition which might be
there... advance planning in case the HDD fails.

I discovered during this process that, while the HDD is 80gb, the system
partition is only about 20 gb with the remainder of the HDD apparently
un-partitioned. I also verified this using Fdisk off a win98se boot disk.

Seems to me that having only 20gb for system partition is asking for
computer-constipation problem in the future, especially after I install the
Applications I need.

No, it is quite suitable, provided you put user data on a separate
partition. This keeps data safe from being lost if you have to do major
recovery on the system

Control Panel - Admin Tools - Computer Management, select Disk
Management and look lower right for the graphic of the drive. R-click
in the Unallocated space and Create Partition to use the rest of the
drive.

Now open My Computer windows on this new 'drive' (probably D and on
C:\Documents and Settings\username (the one logged in) to show its My
Documents. *Right* drag the folder across, taking *Move* here and the
new drive will be used for all his data. If you have multiple users,
make a folder for each, log on in turn, and drag into their separate
folders

 

[Guest]

Hi Randy,

Thanks for the info re Partition Magic. I'll remember that...

As it turned out, I went ahead and reloaded the system partition image onto
a larger partition, then booted the system. when it was done, the HP setup
routine took over the entire HDD as a single volume. Ha! ... 20gb or 4ogb
system partition size didn't matter in the end!

PLUS... after looking at what app's were preinstalled.... i decided I wanted
less than 5% of them...


So, rather than going through the painful experience of uninstalling what
apps I didn't want (and the associated registry cleanup), I ended up taking
out the HDD & Installing it into one of my w2k computers, where I set up and
formated the drive exactly the way I wanted it, and reinstalled the system
using the supplied recovery disks. This worked like a charm, especially since
I was able to reinstall only the applications I wanted.

And, you're right, I didn't purchase the notebook direct from HP. I needed
something FAST so I bought an off-the-shelf model from one of those "Discount
Wholesale Clubs".

 

[Guest]

Biofoffin... Thanks for your reply.

Yes... I built a desktop recently where I did exactly that... Separate
volumes for system, page file, programs and Data.

Before loading the system, I set up the patitions in advance.
For the program files, I created the "Program Files" folder and mounted the
Program Volume through that folder.

When I loaded the system and applications... windows never knew the
difference, and all applications were loaded on the separate volume.

Later, I moved the page file to it's dedicated volume.

Worked beautifully... since it reduced fragmentation problems associated
with the page file... and I believe it increased performance with my apps...
but only slightly.

I took this approach with my notebook.... going with smaller volume sizes
for system and programs.... because I know I can expand those volume sizes
later if the computer starts to get " constipated"...

Thanks again.

 

[Guest]

Hi Ron,

Thanks for your reply.

Regarding your question about "Ghost" -- YES... you can clone (or load an
image) onto a partition which is larger than the original... you just can't
go smaller. But... I've never needed to decrease the size of a volume... ever!

Re: using Fdisk /mbr on ntfs volumes... I'm not sure about that...
I've followed the win2000.general newsgroup for a few years and have seen
that suggested many times.... by some of the best regulars on that site...
apparantly it's OK to do... but I would welcome further comments on this...
BUT, I do agree with you about proceeding with caution...

But... in this case, I didn't need to use it.

Thanks again

Christopher

 

[Guest]

Hi Alex,

Thanks for your reply.

Your comments were very well taken and implemented.
I've described what I did in a reply to another poster...
Here's a link to that description if you care to take a look:

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/...286755-8da3-459d-a08d-88923ee4f7c3&sloc=en-us

Since you're an MVP... I suppose I don't need to caution you that "URLs may
wrap" )

Thanks again,

Christopher.

 

[Guest]

Thank you to everyone who responded to my OP.

Here is a summary of how I resolved this issue.
So often OP's never come back to report if or how their issue was
resolved... and it's always nice to know that you've been able to help... and
is helpful for other readers in the newsgroup to see the final results.

See the following URLS to my separate replies to everyone who helped:

Note: URLs may wrap...

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/...a18740-f0be-4383-af05-bb4be75ad733&sloc=en-us

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/...286755-8da3-459d-a08d-88923ee4f7c3&sloc=en-us

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/...1fd84f-bd91-456e-9eba-1da9cc488dff&sloc=en-us

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/...2fa950-cabe-493e-b3ed-15cca1ef7568&sloc=en-us

Thanks again everyone,

Christopher