Suggestions for Vista SP1

[lforbes]

As a Network Admin of two networks I have been trying to learn the ins and
outs of Vista before deploying it. So far I have found 3 main areas where
the functionality of XP was removed completely. I would really like to see
Microsoft listen to the users and put this functionality back in with Vista
SP1.

1> Put back the File Types Tab - This tab is needed for those of us who want
to change the default action of a file type or to create AND delete File
Types. Eg. On XP I use the Edit as a default for my vbscripts so the don't
get run inadvertently. I also have to create my own file types for programs
that are installed on the server but not on the local machines eg. .gbf file
types. I want the ability to delete redundant file types without registry
hacking. This functionality was removed with Vista.

2> Put back the ability to view Fonts by Date and to MOVE fonts. This seems
to be a big one for those of us who sort fonts by date. Also it would be
nice if we could MOVE fonts out of the Font Directory instead of having to
copy and delete. In large networks Fonts are a big issue. They take up a
lot of space and resources. Easier Font Management is required.

3> With XP the Import Picture Wizard let you select the specific photos on
the camera you wanted to import. With Vista this functionality has been
remove and it is an All or Nothing import. In a Network with a Graphic
Design business I have thousands of users using hundreds of machines to
import photos. The Cameras are used by multiple users and stored on
different servers. There is no way "Vista" could "Detect" which photos were
imported and which weren't. Also multiple users need to import the SAME
photos.

XP had these built in. Now it appears I am going to have to install 3rd
party software like Google's Picasa, and 3rd party file type editors in
order to do on Vista what I did with XP.

Different and simpler does not always mean better when functionality is
removed.

Thanks

Lara

 

[Synapse Syndrome]

1> Put back the File Types Tab - This tab is needed for those of us who
want to change the default action of a file type or to create AND delete
File Types. Eg. On XP I use the Edit as a default for my vbscripts so the
don't get run inadvertently. I also have to create my own file types for
programs that are installed on the server but not on the local machines
eg. .gbf file types. I want the ability to delete redundant file types
without registry hacking. This functionality was removed with Vista.

2> Put back the ability to view Fonts by Date and to MOVE fonts. This
seems to be a big one for those of us who sort fonts by date. Also it
would be nice if we could MOVE fonts out of the Font Directory instead of
having to copy and delete. In large networks Fonts are a big issue. They
take up a lot of space and resources. Easier Font Management is required.

I really agree with these two. The third doesn't matter so much as I use
Adobe Lightroom or similar. For the second one, I prefer Attributes to be
made availabe, as I set the standard Windows fonts to be Read-Only, so I can
see what else is appeared. Also the ability to set NTF file permissions on
the folder reminds me when an installer is trying to install fonts.

ss.

 

[Adam Albright]

As a Network Admin of two networks I have been trying to learn the ins and
outs of Vista before deploying it. So far I have found 3 main areas where
the functionality of XP was removed completely. I would really like to see
Microsoft listen to the users and put this functionality back in with Vista
SP1.

1> Put back the File Types Tab - This tab is needed for those of us who want
to change the default action of a file type or to create AND delete File
Types. Eg. On XP I use the Edit as a default for my vbscripts so the don't
get run inadvertently. I also have to create my own file types for programs
that are installed on the server but not on the local machines eg. .gbf file
types. I want the ability to delete redundant file types without registry
hacking. This functionality was removed with Vista.

2> Put back the ability to view Fonts by Date and to MOVE fonts. This seems
to be a big one for those of us who sort fonts by date. Also it would be
nice if we could MOVE fonts out of the Font Directory instead of having to
copy and delete. In large networks Fonts are a big issue. They take up a
lot of space and resources. Easier Font Management is required.

3> With XP the Import Picture Wizard let you select the specific photos on
the camera you wanted to import. With Vista this functionality has been
remove and it is an All or Nothing import. In a Network with a Graphic
Design business I have thousands of users using hundreds of machines to
import photos. The Cameras are used by multiple users and stored on
different servers. There is no way "Vista" could "Detect" which photos were
imported and which weren't. Also multiple users need to import the SAME
photos.

XP had these built in. Now it appears I am going to have to install 3rd
party software like Google's Picasa, and 3rd party file type editors in
order to do on Vista what I did with XP.

Different and simpler does not always mean better when functionality is
removed.

Thanks

Lara

You just explained why Microsoft constantly releases buggy versions of
Windows. THEY DON'T LISTEN or want to have experienced beta testers
working in real world situations such as yourself. They pick people
prone to brown nose and just play with the OS, rather than actually
use it to RUN APPLICTIONS or do any real work. Otherwise how can
anybody explain all the mickey mouse crap already discovered in Vista
that's either removed, hidden, changed or broke? It isn't tested very
well. Not real world, not by real experienced users.

 

[Justin]

You just explained why Microsoft constantly releases buggy versions of
Windows. THEY DON'T LISTEN or want to have experienced beta testers
working in real world situations such as yourself. They pick people
prone to brown nose and just play with the OS, rather than actually
use it to RUN APPLICTIONS or do any real work. Otherwise how can
anybody explain all the mickey mouse crap already discovered in Vista
that's either removed, hidden, changed or broke? It isn't tested very
well. Not real world, not by real experienced users.

More nonsense. The only "partly" correct notion here is that MS doesn't
listen. However the absurd and wildly exaggerated comment about the beta
testers is completely unfounded.

Beta testers asked for a LOT. We (yes we) got some things and where denied
others.

However, in direct response to the OP. Do not expect any of your
suggestions to be in SP1. SP1 will only be a collection of updates and more
fixes. Unfortunately

This would be best directed at Fiji which will be after SP1 and more of an
R2 type approach.

 

[Adam Albright]

More nonsense. The only "partly" correct notion here is that MS doesn't
listen. However the absurd and wildly exaggerated comment about the beta
testers is completely unfounded.

Get a clue kid. I was a beta tester for both IBM and Microsoft when
you probably were still running around in diapers. You did manager to
get one thing right. Regardless what some beta testers find regardless
of company they (software vendor) often ignore the advice of testers.
Still way too many testers are sheep and merely play along. I'm always
amazed just how much slips through which are clearly bugs and not just
some feature not getting implemented.

Isn't this the place where Justin usually puts on his Vista
Evangelizing hat and tell us wait till the next release or some other
equally useless comment?

Everytime I read one of your posts I'm reminding of a old TV
commerical where poor Charlie the tuna tried so hard to get noticed
then picked and no matter what he did, he never was. If you're trying
to get noticed by Microsoft Justin, they've already noticed and like
poor Charlie won't EVER pick you. <snicker>

 

[Justin]

Get a clue kid.

Typical adam garbage.

I was a beta tester for both IBM and Microsoft when
you probably were still running around in diapers.

Typical adam garbage.

You did manager to
get one thing right.

Typical adam garbage. I managered?

Regardless what some beta testers find regardless
of company they (software vendor) often ignore the advice of testers.

Typical adam garbage. You can't provide everything for everyone.

Still way too many testers are sheep and merely play along.

Typical adam garbage.

I'm always
amazed just how much slips through which are clearly bugs and not just
some feature not getting implemented.

Typical adam garbage. You have no clue about the bug squashing process.
You have to cut the cord sometimes even if bugs are still present. I
believe the magic number was somewhere near 500 known bugs. There is no
such thing as bug free except in your world.

Isn't this the place where Justin usually puts on his Vista
Evangelizing hat and tell us wait till the next release or some other
equally useless comment?

Typical adam garbage. Next release? What have you imagined now?

Everytime I read one of your posts I'm reminding of a old TV
commerical where poor Charlie the tuna tried so hard to get noticed
then picked and no matter what he did, he never was.

Typical adam garbage.

If you're trying
to get noticed by Microsoft Justin, they've already noticed and like
poor Charlie won't EVER pick you. <snicker>

Typical adam garbage.

At least we know what you're doing when you're not trolling me. You're
discrediting the hard efforts of all beta testers on a specific beta of
which you where not apart of. Typical adam garbage.

 

[lforbes]

Hi,

SP's can put back the functionality or they can be made available as
downloads. The registry is still there with the same structure. It is a
simple problem of adding the tab. I am sure it is just hidden rather than
being removed. I know I can view the Fonts Security using XCacls so they
have just removed the security tab from view as well as the columns. The
File Types still exist in the registry the same way so the tab to view-edit
them can't be that difficult. It may just be a simple registry hack that
someone figures out. I guess I will have to spend some time exploring it -
Like adding to the context menus.

The Windows Photo Import Wizard may need an overhaul but they could release
it as a separate download like they did with GPMC.

I just hope they get on board. I have never had Microsoft REMOVE
functionality that they had in previous versions. Even from Server 2000 to
Server 2003 they never removed anything - just added to it.

Cheers,
Lara

 

[Justin]

Hi,

SP's can put back the functionality or they can be made available as
downloads.

Absolutely! What I failed to clarify was that MS has specifically stated,
no new functionality for Vista SP1. There biggest concern right now are the
~500 bugs that where left in Vista at the time of launch and compatibility.

The registry is still there with the same structure. It is a simple
problem of adding the tab. I am sure it is just hidden rather than being
removed. I know I can view the Fonts Security using XCacls so they have
just removed the security tab from view as well as the columns. The File
Types still exist in the registry the same way so the tab to view-edit
them can't be that difficult. It may just be a simple registry hack that
someone figures out. I guess I will have to spend some time exploring it -
Like adding to the context menus.

The Windows Photo Import Wizard may need an overhaul but they could
release it as a separate download like they did with GPMC.

I just hope they get on board. I have never had Microsoft REMOVE
functionality that they had in previous versions. Even from Server 2000 to
Server 2003 they never removed anything - just added to it.

Agreed, there's lots to iron out.

 

[PowerUser]

GPMC.

I just hope they get on board. I have never had Microsoft REMOVE
functionality that they had in previous versions. Even from Server 2000 to
Server 2003 they never removed anything - just added to it.

You should check out Office 2007 then. Specifically Project 2007. They've
removed so much functionality, it's surprising.

 

[Justin]

You mean the 500 known bugs, what about the bugs real world users are
finding now that so-called beta testers DIDN'T find?

What about them? If you find something then send it to MS. If it can be
confirmed then it will get fixed.....eventually.

 

[Adam Albright]

Absolutely! What I failed to clarify was that MS has specifically stated,
no new functionality for Vista SP1. There biggest concern right now are the
~500 bugs that where left in Vista at the time of launch and compatibility.

You mean the 500 known bugs, what about the bugs real world users are
finding now that so-called beta testers DIDN'T find?

 

[Adam Albright]

Hi,

SP's can put back the functionality or they can be made available as
downloads. The registry is still there with the same structure. It is a
simple problem of adding the tab. I am sure it is just hidden rather than
being removed. I know I can view the Fonts Security using XCacls so they
have just removed the security tab from view as well as the columns. The
File Types still exist in the registry the same way so the tab to view-edit
them can't be that difficult. It may just be a simple registry hack that
someone figures out. I guess I will have to spend some time exploring it -
Like adding to the context menus.

You can still access the Master File Association List from Control
Panel, Default Programs. However if there is a way to delete or add a
new file type I haven't found it. You still can associate a
application of your choice to a certain file type.

 

[Adam Albright]

What about them? If you find something then send it to MS. If it can be
confirmed then it will get fixed.....eventually.

Just wondering Justin, you get paid to be a Microsoft apologist?

 

[Justin]

Just wondering Justin, you get paid to be a Microsoft apologist?

Is there ever a time you act like a normal human being?

 

[Zim Babwe]

So Justin, you state that

Beta testers asked for a LOT. We (yes we) got some things and where
denied others.

Are you saying you are a current beta tester at Microsoft? If so then you
should know that Adam is right. Microsoft usually doesn't listen to the
requests of beta testers, they just want them running the applications and
trying to break and report on what they find. Microsoft does have the
agenda and they have a release date for their product. If a product has
500+ or 300+ bugs, they will release (unless the bugs are total
show-stoppers), knowing that when they get one of those "ROUND TO-IT'S" most
of the bugs will be fixed (SP1, SP2).

I use to work at Microsoft years ago, beta testing products and also writing
code on other projects.

 

[Justin]

Are you saying you are a current beta tester at Microsoft? If so then you
should know that Adam is right. Microsoft usually doesn't listen to the
requests of beta testers, they just want them running the applications and
trying to break and report on what they find. Microsoft does have the
agenda and they have a release date for their product. If a product has
500+ or 300+ bugs, they will release (unless the bugs are total
show-stoppers), knowing that when they get one of those "ROUND TO-IT'S"
most of the bugs will be fixed (SP1, SP2).

You have no clue as to what you are talking about. We have access to a site
that lets us submit bug/feature requests. We then get to VOTE on these
requests as a community. That helps MS to qualify the bugs and to see what
the average wants changed in features.

So when we see these items being fulfilled, how is that MS "not listening"?

 

[Adam Albright]

You have no clue as to what you are talking about.

Oh the irony...

 

[Justin]

Oh the irony...

If you're so damn "all knowing" then answer the question!

So when we see these items being fulfilled, how is that MS "not listening"?

 

[Adam Albright]

If you're so damn "all knowing" then answer the question!

So when we see these items being fulfilled, how is that MS "not listening"?

Again somebody from the peanut gallery making demands. You'll never
learn Justin. I never claimed to be all knowing, I'm simply suggesting
YOU don't know what you're talking about and you proved that's true on
a wide variety of topics, yet you chatter on. ;-)

As far as you demanding a answer to your question, I'll humor you. If
Microsoft listened then it would have fixed the bugs found in XP and
earlier versions of Windows and corrected those BEFORE releasing a
newer version which has a new crop of bugs. They have not. Not
totally. With each new version of Windows users find new bugs and many
old bugs get carried forward which of course, compounds the problem.

If you knew half as much as you pretend, you'd know that's poor
business practice...knowingly dumping a flawed product on a
unsuspecting public. You yourself admitted that Microsoft left in 500
KNOWN BUGS in the first retail release of Vista. I view that as
SHAMEFUL and just plain sloppy programming and ever poorer testing.

Knowingly releasing a product with known flaws which surely will cause
many users endless and needless suffering explains why Microsoft is
often on the receiving end of many angry comments, hint, it is often
well deserved, but again, that is the Microsoft way. Release and
patch. Your defense of such a reckless process as always, is for you
to say, so what, they had to release it sometime, again proving you
don't have a clue and often show a callous disregard for customer
problems as is often also exhibited by way too many MVP that have the
same chip on their shoulder and blindly defend Microsoft no matter
what. That begs the quesiton why do they and why do you?

 

[Justin]

Again somebody from the peanut gallery making demands. You'll never
learn Justin. I never claimed to be all knowing, I'm simply suggesting
YOU don't know what you're talking about and you proved that's true on
a wide variety of topics, yet you chatter on. ;-)

Thanks, you just proved with your own words that you are WRONG! Even you do
it to yourself! Hilarious!

adam states that MS DOES NOT listen to it's beta testers.

Then adam states, "Not totally"

DOES NOT and NOT TOTALLY do not equal each other.

End result - adam is full of crap!

So again, MS DOES listen and MS DOES fix issues however not EVERYTHING is
going to get fixed.

Also, a feature issue to one person is NOT an issue to everyone. Just
because YOU think something should get fixed doesn't mean it ever will or
even should be fixed in the first place.


I'll answer my own question since you're too ignorant to do it for me:

So when we see these items being fulfilled, how is that MS "not listening"?
It's NOT! Thus the statement that MS does not listen to it's beta testers
is absurd.

adam, I understand this is very hard for you to understand. But you are
just going to have to work through it. You can it! I have faith in you!!!!

1. Submit bug/issue
2. Others vote on the bug/issue and give possible work arounds.
3. Is this really a bug/issue? Can it be confirmed?
4. The bug/issue is persistent. It's confirmed. Bug/issue fixed.

1-4 is a quick run down of a bug/issue being squashed that was reported by
beta testers or any other CPP user.

Not everything someone "offers" is going to make it.

Here's a quick real world example!

Windows Mail/WLMd

It used to use 10MB transactional log files. Pull up an old beta and check
it out. Now it uses 2MB transactional log files. Yup, you guessed it!
Beta tester recommended, community approved!

Once again, you fail.