Power supply fried, replaced it, computer won't start

[Pennywise]

Actually, I'm sure the power supply he bought from the store is
perfectly fine. Don't forget about "power good"! If the power supply
doesn't see this, it will not stay on. That is how all ATX power
supplies are designed, and it is indeed built-in component protection.
If anything is shorting out (as could very well be the case here, since
his first power supply fried something), it will shut down a working
power supply.

Good link on the Power Good Signal
http://www.pcguide.com/ref/power/sup/funcPowerGood-c.html
and how "Some extremely el-cheapo power supplies may "fake" the Power
Good signal by just tying it to another +5 V line."

 

[Rod Speed]

Actually, I'm sure the power supply he bought from the
store is perfectly fine. Don't forget about "power good"!
If the power supply doesn't see this, it will not stay on.

You've got that backwards, its PROVIDED by the
power supply, not observed by the power supply.

That is how all ATX power supplies are designed,
Nope.

and it is indeed built-in component protection. If anything is shorting
out (as could very well be the case here, since his first power supply
fried something), it will shut down a working power supply.

Different issue entirely to the power good line.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

You've got that backwards, its PROVIDED by the
power supply, not observed by the power supply.

It works both ways. Yes, it is provided by the power supply, and yes,
it is there to prevent the motherboard from starting up before the power
supply stabilizes.

However, on some power supplies, if there is a power surge or any other
issue (which can be caused by a fried component on the motherboard),
"Power Good" will also shut down the power supply if it malfunctions.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

Good link on the Power Good Signal
http://www.pcguide.com/ref/power/sup/funcPowerGood-c.html
and how "Some extremely el-cheapo power supplies may "fake" the Power
Good signal by just tying it to another +5 V line."

Yes, and while it doesn't directly have anything to do with Power Good,
such power supplies don't provide any protection either. If you try to
fire up a GOOD supply and it doesn't observe the correct loads (either
from not being properly connected or from something that is shorting),
it will shut down in order to prevent damage since it is bad for a power
supply to run without a load. Same goes with amps. If you power up an
amp and crank the volume without speakers attached, it will either a, go
into thermal shut down, or b, self-destruct.

 

[Rod Speed]

It works both ways.

Nope, its an output FROM the power supply, not an input TO the power supply.

Yes, it is provided by the power supply, and yes, it is there to prevent
the motherboard from starting up before the power supply stabilizes.

Nothing like what you originally said.

However, on some power supplies, if there is a power
surge or any other issue (which can be caused by a
fried component on the motherboard), "Power Good"
will also shut down the power supply if it malfunctions.

Nope, again, its an output FROM the power supply and the power
supply is supposed to drop the power good signal if something has
gone bad power wise, mainly so the motherboard can restart after
a glitch that has seen the power supply shut down and then start again.

The power supply doesnt even notice a fried component
on the motherboard unless that produces a higher than
allowed current on one of the rails it produces.

 

[Rod Speed]

(e-mail address removed) wrote

Yes, and while it doesn't directly have anything to do with Power
Good, such power supplies don't provide any protection either.

You dont know that on that ANY claim.

If you try to fire up a GOOD supply and it doesn't observe the correct
loads (either from not being properly connected or from something that
is shorting), it will shut down in order to prevent damage

Yes. But that is true even with cheap power supplys too.

Where they mostly fail is shutting down properly when the power supply fails.

since it is bad for a power supply to run without a load.

Oh bullshit.

Same goes with amps.

Nope, completely different.

If you power up an amp and crank the volume without speakers attached,
it will either a, go into thermal shut down, or b, self-destruct.

Utterly mangled all over again.

 

[DaveW]

When you use a "cheap" power supply unit ($35 for PSU & case) you run into
the problem that if the PSU fails it usually burns out the motherboard too.
High end PSU's usually do NOT do that; they include built in protection
circuits.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

You dont know that on that ANY claim.

What, that cheap POS power supplies don't shut down right away if
something is shorting? Well lets see. I have some sitting around that
will not power up at all because something in the machine shorted them
out. I have others sitting around that still power up and work just
fine after being shorted out, because they shut down right away before
damage was done.

Yes. But that is true even with cheap power supplys too.

Where they mostly fail is shutting down properly when the power supply fails.

Shutting down before damage is done you mean. I've witnessed both.

A, something will short out and PS will smoke.
or
B, something will short out and PS will turn off. In which case, after
dealing with whatever caused the short, the power supply will come to
life and work just fine.

Oh bullshit.

Oh really? Why don't you try it then. Force a cheap power supply on
and let it run for a while without a load. See what happens.

Nope, completely different.


Utterly mangled all over again.

Again...oh really? Take a high current amplifier, give it an audio
feed, disconnect anything that will create a load on the outputs, crank
the levels, and see what happens.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

Nope, its an output FROM the power supply, not an input TO the power supply.

It doesn't matter. Some supplies monitor that load. I have quite a few
that will shut down if load on PG does not exist.

Nothing like what you originally said.

No, I'm half agreeing with you about what power good is there for.

Nope, again, its an output FROM the power supply and the power
supply is supposed to drop the power good signal if something has
gone bad power wise, mainly so the motherboard can restart after
a glitch that has seen the power supply shut down and then start again.

And some supplies shut down completely. I have a few sitting right here
that will do that.

The power supply doesnt even notice a fried component
on the motherboard unless that produces a higher than
allowed current on one of the rails it produces.

And now we go back to the original post where the OP said that his new
power supply would not stay on - not because it was bad, but because
there was an issue with something it was powering up. As it turned out,
once he cleared up that issue, all was well.

 

[Rod Speed]

What, that cheap POS power supplies don't
shut down right away if something is shorting?

Nope, that they dont have ANY protection.

Well lets see. I have some sitting around that will not power
up at all because something in the machine shorted them out.

You dont know that that is the reason why they died.

I have others sitting around that still power up and
work just fine after being shorted out, because they
shut down right away before damage was done.

Plenty of cheap power supplys do that fine.

Shutting down before damage is done you mean.
Yep.

I've witnessed both.

Yes, so you claim that they dont have ANY protection is just plain wrong.

A, something will short out and PS will smoke.
or
B, something will short out and PS will turn off. In which
case, after dealing with whatever caused the short, the
power supply will come to life and work just fine.

Yep, and when that last is seen with a cheap power
supply, they must have had SOME protection.

Oh really? Why don't you try it then.

Done that plenty of times thanks.

Force a cheap power supply on and let it run
for a while without a load. See what happens.

Nothing, thats what. It works fine when its used with a load.

Again...oh really?

Fraid so.

Take a high current amplifier, give it an audio feed,
disconnect anything that will create a load on the
outputs, crank the levels, and see what happens.

Nothing special with a properly designed amp.

Because it isnt hard to accidentially disconnect a speaker.

 

[Rod Speed]

It doesn't matter.

Corse it does.

Some supplies monitor that load.

The power good line isnt even a load.

I have quite a few that will shut down if load on PG does not exist.

Fantasy. There are quite a few that will shut down if the
OUTPUT RAILS arent loaded, a different matter entirely.

No, I'm half agreeing with you about what power good is there for.

No you arent, you just said that some power
supplys monitor if that line is loaded. No they dont.

And some supplies shut down completely.

Different matter entirely.

Yes, some do need to be unplugged from the mains to reset themselves.

I have a few sitting right here that will do that.

And now we go back to the original post where the OP said that his
new power supply would not stay on - not because it was bad, but
because there was an issue with something it was powering up.

Yes, but that had nothing to do with the power good line.

As it turned out, once he cleared up that issue, all was well.

Yes, but thats irrelevant to YOUR claims about the power good line.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

Well lets see. I have some sitting around that will not power
up at all because something in the machine shorted them out.

You dont know that that is the reason why they died.[/QUOTE]

And do you know this exactly? I've seen it happen firsthand.

Plenty of cheap power supplys do that fine.

Maybe, but not as likely as it would be if it weren't a power supply
where corners were cut in making it.

Yes, so you claim that they dont have ANY protection is just plain wrong.

I was replying to an article that mentioned how some skimp on PG and
just supply a normal 5v lead instead. If a power supply is built like
that, then it's very likely corners were cut in other areas too,
including the protection circuitry.

Done that plenty of times thanks.

Consider yourself lucky then.

Fraid so.


Nothing special with a properly designed amp.

All amps come with manuals that say to NEVER operate them without a
proper load. There are reasons for this.

Because it isnt hard to accidentially disconnect a speaker.

Again, consider yourself lucky. Either you weren't running much power
through this thing, or you caught it in a short time - or you weren't
running the amp much beyond 20% of its capacity with a constant signal
running through it.

 

[Rod Speed]

And do you know this exactly?

I know that you cant be sure why they have failed.

I've seen it happen firsthand.

Or assumed that they got killed by the machine shorting them out
when they may have died and killed what is powered from them.
That last isnt that uncommon with cheap power supplys.

Maybe,

No maybe about it.

but not as likely as it would be if it weren't a power
supply where corners were cut in making it.

Wrong, there arent many so badly designed that they
dont shut down when one of the rails is shorted.

Plenty more fail and kill what is powered by the power supply.

I was replying to an article that mentioned how some
skimp on PG and just supply a normal 5v lead instead.

Yes, but that isnt necessarily the end of the world
if the design ensures that that comes up last.

If a power supply is built like that, then it's very likely corners
were cut in other areas too, including the protection circuitry.

Not necessarily if the supply ensures that that 5V rail comes up last.

And you claimed that they dont have ANY protection. Even
the cheapest power supply have SOME protection even if
they dont necessarily adequately protect against the power
supply over voltaging some of the rails as it dies.

Essentially because that sort of independant protection against
any output rail going out of spec costs more to provide.

Consider yourself lucky then.

Nope, I know that wont kill a power supply.

All amps come with manuals that say to NEVER operate
them without a proper load. There are reasons for this.

Doesnt mean they will be killed by the accidental disconnection of a speaker.

Again, consider yourself lucky.

No thanks, I know that wont kill a properly designed amp.

Either you weren't running much power through this thing,
or you caught it in a short time - or you weren't running the
amp much beyond 20% of its capacity with a constant signal
running through it.

Easy to claim. I manage to fry the speakers
by over driving them and the amp was fine.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

I know that you cant be sure why they have failed.


Or assumed that they got killed by the machine shorting them out
when they may have died and killed what is powered from them.
That last isnt that uncommon with cheap power supplys.

Um.... no. Many years ago, I overestimated the space between the bottom
of a hard drive and the metal frame of the case. Turned machine on,
drive control board shorted and smoked. Because of this short, power
supply also smoked. How is that an assumption exactly?
And again later, I unknowingly had a bad power connector which turned
out to be shorted. Fired up the supply, it came on for not even half a
second, and turned itself off again. Short was cleared, power was fired
up again, and all was well.

No maybe about it.

Plenty maybe about it, it all depends on design.

Wrong, there arent many so badly designed that they
dont shut down when one of the rails is shorted.

I had one smoke due to this.

Plenty more fail and kill what is powered by the power supply.

Yes, and the better designed supplies shut down before this happens -
just as the better designs shut off in time to save themselves if they
are shorted.

Yes, but that isnt necessarily the end of the world
if the design ensures that that comes up last.


Not necessarily if the supply ensures that that 5V rail comes up last.

And not all of them do.

And you claimed that they dont have ANY protection. Even
the cheapest power supply have SOME protection even if
they dont necessarily adequately protect against the power
supply over voltaging some of the rails as it dies.

-sigh- protection as in protecting the power supply itself, which is
what I meant. In other words, its ability to shut itself down BEFORE
damage is done to the supply, which was the original case of this
thread. The OP's power supply died. He went to the store and bought
another one, and put it in his machine. He went to fire it up, it shut
down right afterwards. The OP then corrected a wiring problem, fired it
up again without changing any components, and all was good.
If I had wanted to go any further than that, I could have just said that
the fuse in your mains fuse box IS the protection - not against
equipment, but against fire... but perhaps I should have stated this
anyway.

Essentially because that sort of independant protection against
any output rail going out of spec costs more to provide.
yes..



Nope, I know that wont kill a power supply.

Then why do the manufacturers of these very supplies advise against this?

Doesnt mean they will be killed by the accidental disconnection of a speaker.

Accidental disconnection of a speaker, which is usually caught shortly
afterwards since you're now not hearing sound out of this speaker. If
this condition were allowed to continue and you ran the amp at constant
high power, it will eventually kill the amp - if it doesn't trip the
protection circuits first!

No thanks, I know that wont kill a properly designed amp.

Well since you seem to know more than the people who made these amps,
all of whom say NEVER run an amp without a load...

Easy to claim. I manage to fry the speakers
by over driving them and the amp was fine.

And while these speakers are being over driven, you are still driving
them and thus the amp is seeing a load! How long after completely
melting the speaker coils, have you run this amp exactly? How long have
you let it run under constant high power without a load? Do you
actually test this by turning the volume up higher and higher AFTER you
manage to blow the speakers?

 

[Rod Speed]

Um.... no.

We'll see...

Many years ago, I overestimated the space between the
bottom of a hard drive and the metal frame of the case.
Turned machine on, drive control board shorted and
smoked. Because of this short, power supply also
smoked. How is that an assumption exactly?

That is just one example, you butcher.

And again later, I unknowingly had a bad power
connector which turned out to be shorted.
Fired up the supply, it came on for not even half
a second, and turned itself off again. Short was
cleared, power was fired up again, and all was well.

Nothing at all unusual about, thats the way its sposed to work.

Plenty maybe about it, it all depends on design.

Nope, most cheap supplys handle that fine.

YOU claimed that they didnt have ANY protection.

That is clearly just plain wrong when they handle a shorted output fine.

I had one smoke due to this.

The technical term for that is 'pathetically inadequate sample'

No one ever claimed that no power supplys have ever failed
like that, what was being discussed was your stupid pig ignorant
claim that some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

Yes, and the better designed supplies shut down
before this happens - just as the better designs shut
off in time to save themselves if they are shorted.

Irrelevant to your stupid pig ignorant claim that
some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

And not all of them do.

Bet you've never measure that.

-sigh-

Heavy breathing aint gunna save your bacon.

protection as in protecting the power
supply itself, which is what I meant.

Still completely silly. If that was actually the case they wouldnt
last long as there are always some spikes on the mains.

In other words, its ability to shut itself down BEFORE damage
is done to the supply, which was the original case of this thread.

You made a general claim about el cheapo power supplys.

The OP's power supply died. He went to the store and bought
another one, and put it in his machine. He went to fire it up, it
shut down right afterwards. The OP then corrected a wiring problem,
fired it up again without changing any components, and all was good.
If I had wanted to go any further than that, I could have just said that
the fuse in your mains fuse box IS the protection - not against equipment,
but against fire... but perhaps I should have stated this anyway.

Irrelevant to your stupid pig ignorant claim that
some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

Then why do the manufacturers of these
very supplies advise against this?

They dont.

Accidental disconnection of a speaker, which is usually caught shortly
afterwards since you're now not hearing sound out of this speaker.

Irrelevant to that stupid pig ignorant claim of yours.

If this condition were allowed to continue and you ran the
amp at constant high power, it will eventually kill the amp

Not a ****ing clue, as always.

- if it doesn't trip the protection circuits first!

Funny that. They're there for a reason.

Well since you seem to know more than the people who made
these amps, all of whom say NEVER run an amp without a load...

Another pig ignorant lie.

And while these speakers are being over driven, you
are still driving them and thus the amp is seeing a load!

Pity about after they had died!!!

How long after completely melting the speaker
coils, have you run this amp exactly?

Took a while to notice that one side had died.

How long have you let it run under constant high power without
a load? Do you actually test this by turning the volume up higher
and higher AFTER you manage to blow the speakers?

Didnt need to, your claim is pig ignorant drivel. The reason the
speakers got fried was because the volume was WAY up.

 

[John Doe]

Troll


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From: "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa gmail.com>
Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,24hoursupport.helpdesk
Subject: Re: Power supply fried, replaced it, computer won't start
Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 20:23:59 +1000
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David Matthew Wood <nodmwood78 verizonspam.net> wrote

Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa gmail.com> wrote

Um.... no.

We'll see...

Many years ago, I overestimated the space between the
bottom of a hard drive and the metal frame of the case.
Turned machine on, drive control board shorted and
smoked. Because of this short, power supply also
smoked. How is that an assumption exactly?

That is just one example, you butcher.

And again later, I unknowingly had a bad power
connector which turned out to be shorted.
Fired up the supply, it came on for not even half
a second, and turned itself off again. Short was
cleared, power was fired up again, and all was well.

Nothing at all unusual about, thats the way its sposed to work.

Plenty maybe about it, it all depends on design.

Nope, most cheap supplys handle that fine.

YOU claimed that they didnt have ANY protection.

That is clearly just plain wrong when they handle a shorted output fine.

I had one smoke due to this.

The technical term for that is 'pathetically inadequate sample'

No one ever claimed that no power supplys have ever failed
like that, what was being discussed was your stupid pig ignorant
claim that some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

Yes, and the better designed supplies shut down
before this happens - just as the better designs shut
off in time to save themselves if they are shorted.

Irrelevant to your stupid pig ignorant claim that
some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

And not all of them do.

Bet you've never measure that.

-sigh-

Heavy breathing aint gunna save your bacon.

protection as in protecting the power
supply itself, which is what I meant.

Still completely silly. If that was actually the case they wouldnt
last long as there are always some spikes on the mains.

In other words, its ability to shut itself down BEFORE damage
is done to the supply, which was the original case of this thread.

You made a general claim about el cheapo power supplys.

The OP's power supply died. He went to the store and bought
another one, and put it in his machine. He went to fire it up, it
shut down right afterwards. The OP then corrected a wiring problem,
fired it up again without changing any components, and all was good.
If I had wanted to go any further than that, I could have just said that
the fuse in your mains fuse box IS the protection - not against equipment,
but against fire... but perhaps I should have stated this anyway.

Irrelevant to your stupid pig ignorant claim that
some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

Then why do the manufacturers of these
very supplies advise against this?

They dont.

Accidental disconnection of a speaker, which is usually caught shortly
afterwards since you're now not hearing sound out of this speaker.

Irrelevant to that stupid pig ignorant claim of yours.

If this condition were allowed to continue and you ran the
amp at constant high power, it will eventually kill the amp

Not a ****ing clue, as always.

- if it doesn't trip the protection circuits first!

Funny that. They're there for a reason.

Well since you seem to know more than the people who made
these amps, all of whom say NEVER run an amp without a load...

Another pig ignorant lie.

And while these speakers are being over driven, you
are still driving them and thus the amp is seeing a load!

Pity about after they had died!!!

How long after completely melting the speaker
coils, have you run this amp exactly?

Took a while to notice that one side had died.

How long have you let it run under constant high power without
a load? Do you actually test this by turning the volume up higher
and higher AFTER you manage to blow the speakers?

Didnt need to, your claim is pig ignorant drivel. The reason the
speakers got fried was because the volume was WAY up.

 

[Rod Speed]

****wit

 

[David Matthew Wood]

We'll see...


That is just one example, you butcher.

An example, nonetheless. I can give you a few more if need be.

Nothing at all unusual about, thats the way its sposed to work.

And yet it isn't as reliable on poor cheap designs - some of which will
just blow.

Nope, most cheap supplys handle that fine.

YOU claimed that they didnt have ANY protection.

That is clearly just plain wrong when they handle a shorted output fine.

The ones that handled shorted outputs were not the cheapest power
supplies either...

The technical term for that is 'pathetically inadequate sample'
Whatever.


No one ever claimed that no power supplys have ever failed
like that, what was being discussed was your stupid pig ignorant
claim that some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

And some don't, unless you count the protection that only serves to
prevent fires and does nothing to save the equipment.

Irrelevant to your stupid pig ignorant claim that
some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

Protection against equipment damage is what I meant. I'm sorry I didn't
state that correctly.

Still completely silly. If that was actually the case they wouldnt
last long as there are always some spikes on the mains.

No, because the spike on the mains is within tolerance.

Saying it's not, is like saying a fuse that is properly rated will blow
right away on an initial normal start up surge caused by heavy equipment
- which it should not.

You made a general claim about el cheapo power supplys.

Ok, I shall reword it next time.

Irrelevant to your stupid pig ignorant claim that
some cheap supplys dont have ANY protection.

More childish insults ignored.

They dont.

Some do. It depends on the design. That is why in general (and for the
purpose of 24hoursupport.helpdesk), I say don't attempt it for a long
period of time without knowing the design.

Irrelevant to that stupid pig ignorant claim of yours.

How is it irrelevant when the change of damage occurring is minimized if
this situation is caught early enough?

Not a ****ing clue, as always.

Even more childish insults ignored.

Funny that. They're there for a reason.

Yes, to prevent damage to the output transformers from attempting to run
it without a load - or in the case of a short!

Took a while to notice that one side had died.

Lucky you didn't blow the output transformer.

Didnt need to, your claim is pig ignorant drivel. The reason the
speakers got fried was because the volume was WAY up.

And once the speakers got fried, you continued to run it in this
condition for several minutes afterwards, running the amp at capacity?
Most people don't..

 

[Rod Speed]

An example, nonetheless. I can give you a few more if need be.

Pity that that proves nothing about your stupid claim that
some cheap power supplys dont have ANY protection.

And yet it isn't as reliable on poor cheap
designs - some of which will just blow.

**** all in fact.

And that that proves nothing about your stupid claim that
some cheap power supplys dont have ANY protection.

The ones that handled shorted outputs were
not the cheapest power supplies either...

Plenty of the cheapest ones handle that fine.

And some don't, unless you count the protection that only
serves to prevent fires and does nothing to save the equipment.

Pity that that proves nothing about your stupid claim that
some cheap power supplys dont have ANY protection.

Protection against equipment damage is what I meant.

Pity that claim is STILL just plain wrong.

I'm sorry I didn't state that correctly.

No, because the spike on the mains is within tolerance.

Mindlessly silly.

Saying it's not, is like saying a fuse that is properly
rated will blow right away on an initial normal start up
surge caused by heavy equipment - which it should not.

Nothing like in fact. To survive normal mains spikes,
THE SUPPLY MUST HAVE SOME PROTECTION.

Ok, I shall reword it next time.

Still just plain wrong in the latest version.

More childish insults ignored.

You didnt ignore than, you commented on them, childishly.

Some do.

No they dont.

It depends on the design.

No it doesnt.

That is why in general (and for the purpose of 24hoursupport.helpdesk),
I say don't attempt it for a long period of time without knowing the design.

You have always been, and always will be completely and utterly irrelevant.

What you might or might not say in spades.

How is it irrelevant when the change of damage occurring
is minimized if this situation is caught early enough?

You never said anything about how long in the original.

You are now desperately attempting to bullshit your way out
of your predicament and are fooling absolutely no one at all.

Even more childish insults ignored.

You didnt ignore than, you commented on them, childishly.

Yes, to prevent damage to the output transformers from
attempting to run it without a load - or in the case of a short!

There are no 'output transformers'

And any decent designed amp has that protection to prevent any
damage when the inevitable happens, the speakers get disconnected.

Lucky you didn't blow the output transformer.

There are no 'output transformers'

And once the speakers got fried, you continued to run it in this
condition for several minutes afterwards, running the amp at capacity?
Yep.

Most people don't..

Irrelevant to what proves your claim is just plain wrong.

 

[David Matthew Wood]

An example, nonetheless. I can give you a few more if need be.

Pity that that proves nothing about your stupid claim that
some cheap power supplys dont have ANY protection.[/QUOTE]

Not against equipment damage, no. Or else this one would not have
sparked and let out smoke and would have continued to run after the
short was removed.

Here, I'll rephrase it, because this is what I meant in the first place:

Some cheap power supplies don't have adequate protection against damage
from shorts.

There. Done.

**** all in fact.

And that that proves nothing about your stupid claim that
some cheap power supplys dont have ANY protection.

No, but a couple of blowed cheap power supplies does.

Pity that that proves nothing about your stupid claim that
some cheap power supplys dont have ANY protection.

Ok, then I rephrase it. See above.

Pity that claim is STILL just plain wrong.

A couple cheap blown power supplies later....

Mindlessly silly.


Nothing like in fact. To survive normal mains spikes,
THE SUPPLY MUST HAVE SOME PROTECTION.

The spikes are within tolerance. Does a power supply always get
constant stable power? No, it does not. Does it always give constant
stable power? No, it does not. Voltage always fluctuates, and so
therefore, the protection circuitry has to be designed so that it does
not trip under these conditions provided that they are within tolerance.

But what does this have to do with a short circuit killing a power
supply, or tripping protection circuitry? Absolutely nothing.

Still just plain wrong in the latest version.

Ok, then I'll re-reword it. SOME cheap power supplies don't have
adequate protection against damage from shorts.

DONE!

No they dont.


No it doesnt.

Ok, so now you're saying is OK for ALL power supplies to run WITHOUT a
load - and yet, some won't even power up without a load. Why is that?

You never said anything about how long in the original.

Well I don't know about you, but if a speaker isn't working, I tend to
notice it right away and correct the problem long before it has any
chance to do any damage.

There are no 'output transformers'

Then you're not using tube amps. Ok then.

And any decent designed amp has that protection to prevent any
damage when the inevitable happens, the speakers get disconnected.

And in better designs, the amp is shut down so that the amp is now NOT
running without a proper load, which is the exact opposite of your claim
that you've been running your amps on high power with no speaker
attached.

Yep.

You just said the amp had protection circuitry. Had this been working
properly, the amp would have gotten shut down anyway. How is this
running an amp without a load?